Value of initial player's card in Spanish21 and 6/5 Blackjack

Hi everybody,

I have just joined and have a question:

Sometimes a casino will offer a coupon which can be redeemed for a free card or the dealer accidentally exposes a card. In the Wizard's Blackjack appendix 14 he gives the value of the Blackjack player's first card.

I'm wondering - has anybody calculated these values for Spanish21 and 6/5 Blackjack? Would be curious to know :)

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Could you explain the percentages. I understand the order of the cards, but not what the percentages are supposed to show. Why no percentages for ten and nine?

Thanks gordonm888 :)

I would guess that the tens would then be roughly +11.8% and the 9 around 0%?

Quote: JimmyG

Thanks gordonm888 :)

I would guess that the tens would then be roughly +11.8% and the 9 around 0%?

Yes, those would have been the approximate values.

However, I realized there may be a problem with the calculations in the post (that I don't quite understand) and I have deleted them until I have resolved my uncertainty.

Okay, these are the values that I am now calculating for the initial values of players first card for 6/5 case as defined below. I previously had an error in my initial definition of the shoe composition.

6/5 Blackjack, 8 decks, H17, DAS, Double on any 2, No surrender

EV of the players first card:

Ace: +41.66%
Ten: +11.82
9: -1.265%
8: -8.39%
7: -18.18%
6: -20.79%
5: -19.66%
4: -17.57%
3: -15.30%
2: -13.27%

The EV of -13.27% for the 2 card means that you expect an average loss of 0.1327 of your initial unit bet, as averaged over many many trials.

Thanks so much Gordonm888 :)

Anybody on these values in Spanish21?

Quote: JimmyG

Thanks so much Gordonm888 :)

Anybody on these values in Spanish21?

They will be different for S17 version versus the H17 with Redouble version. Which one are you asking about? (and why? is it just curiosity?)

I do not have a model of Spanish 21, but here is a BJ model calculation with the following rules changes (and with optimized strategy responsive to the rule changes) to make it somewhat similar to Spanish-21

BJ, 8 Spanish Decks (all 10's removed), S17, Late Surrender, Double on any number of cards, DAS, Splits Aces may be Hit, Doubled and Resplit up to 4 hands (like other split pairs),

Initial Value of Player's cards
Ace: +48.19%
Ten: +12.40%
9: -2.768%
8: -9.402%
7: -18.36%
6: -19.93%
5: -18.01%
4: -15.60%
3: -12.80%
2: -10.18%

Spanish 21 rules (and subsequent strategy readjustments) that were not included in the above calculation were:
- Player BJ and 21 always win against Dealer BJ and Dealer 21, respectively.
- Forfeit allowed after doubling
- Late surrender of multi-card hands
- Bonus payouts for multi-card 21s, and various 6-7-8, and 7-7-7 combos (except after doubles and splits)
- Original Bet and Busted Hands Only on No-Peek Tens and Aces

Also, I currently don't have the capability to handle the Redouble rule in the H17 model.

Maybe someone else can provide the completely rigorous calculation for Spanish-21.

Thanks so much gordonm888, appreciate it! :)

Yes, that gives me a good idea.. was curious exactly how the value of these upcards would be affected by having fewer tens around to bust hands and make blackjacks..