24Bingo
24Bingo
Joined: Jul 4, 2012
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November 2nd, 2013 at 11:22:54 PM permalink
1. It's briefly mentioned on the page that "these bonuses [i.e., the 6-7-8 and 7-7-7 not counting Super Sevens] usually do not pay after doubling or splitting, but some casinos allow it." I know that Foxwoods and Twin River are among these (splitting, that is, not doubling - and the 5+ card bonuses as well), and looking at the rules posted on their page, the Casino de Montréal is as well. I was wondering, does this make a significant difference to the edge?
2. I can't help but notice that the S17 table says to hit 6-8 offsuit with a dealer 5 and 7-8 offsuit with a dealer 3, but not a four-card 14 or 15 with the same. Why? What advantage is there? All I can think is that it's somehow composition-dependent, in which case I can't help but think there's a better rule to follow.
The trick to poker is learning not to beat yourself up for your mistakes too much, and certainly not too little, but just the right amount.
MangoJ
MangoJ
Joined: Mar 12, 2011
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November 3rd, 2013 at 12:52:49 AM permalink
If you look at the payout section, you get a bonus on 6-7-8 even for offsuit.

Hence the potential bonus can shift the favourable option to a hit.
If you have 6-8, you hit the bonus when drawing a 7. You don't do that for any other 14. The additional EV from that may exceed the EV for standing for some hands (like against dealers 5 in your example). Same with 7-8.
24Bingo
24Bingo
Joined: Jul 4, 2012
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November 3rd, 2013 at 1:07:50 AM permalink
You get the same bonus for a five-card 21. That's why so many of the spots on the grid say "hit with x or more cards."
The trick to poker is learning not to beat yourself up for your mistakes too much, and certainly not too little, but just the right amount.
MangoJ
MangoJ
Joined: Mar 12, 2011
  • Threads: 10
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November 3rd, 2013 at 12:17:39 PM permalink
Yes you are right, didn't see the 5-card 21. In an infinite deck you should not expect a different EV for hitting 6-8 and hitting a 4-card 14. So either it's composition dependent, or the strategy guys are using different rulesets.
dwheatley
dwheatley
Joined: Nov 16, 2009
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November 3rd, 2013 at 1:11:59 PM permalink
1. I think many casinos do pay the bonus after splitting, but not doubling. This includes Casino Montreal.

2. I believe this is composition-based. A 6-8 implies a running count that is slightly positive, while a 4 card 14 implies a running count that is more positive. The play is borderline (with a index right at balanced for both plays in Walker's book). I assume this means that you can hit the 6-8 for the 3-2 bonus but not the 4 card 3-2 bonus because of the count. Same applies to 7-8 vs 3.
Wisdom is the quality that keeps you out of situations where you would otherwise need it

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