British English vs American English
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 | 5 votes (27.77%) | ||
| | 5 votes (27.77%) | ||
| | 8 votes (44.44%) |
18 members have voted
May 15th, 2011 at 11:49:53 AM
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Quote: WizardInteresting. I'm surprised I lived in Baltimore for ten years without knowing about the place. I vaguely recall a controversy about ferry service to one of the Chesapeake islands, maybe that one. It was over the usual split between those who wanted to bring in tourism and those who wanted to keep it out.
Googlemap.
Yes that is the place a small group of Islands in the Bay called The Smith Islands. Ewell is the larger and has a few cars (no car ferry these cars don't leave). The smaller island is Tylerton. A friend and I stayed in Tylerton about a decade ago. You take a converted fishing boat which does 2 trips a day to the island. On Tylerton there are no cars. 1 small store/lunch counter, 1 Church and 1 BnB (Inn of Silent Music). Aside from that you have a few dozen homes. Just about all of the men on the Island are Watermen (Crabers). In the evening the women of the island gather at the co-op and shell the catch that the men brought in that day. While they work they sing traditional songs. Things you just don't see in The USA. It was a snapshot of a different time. The broage is derived from the original settlers from Cornwall and Wales.
Tourism or not I fear that life is slipping away. With crab levels in the bay getting lower and lower many of the younger people have little option other than leave. But if anyone is in the area I can not say enough good about the place. Very open and friendly. It was quite odd for me. It was the first vacation where I had no option than relax. No casino, no shows, no bar(dry town). Just a hammock, kayak and bikes.
I have a bewitched egg that I use to play VP with and I have net over 900k with it.
May 15th, 2011 at 12:09:03 PM
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Quote: WizardInteresting. I'm surprised I lived in Baltimore for ten years without knowing about the place.
It's a pretty small place. The claim of speaking Shakespearian English has been made by a number of tourist businessmen and politicians about several places in America since the 19th century. It doesn't have much basis in linguistics, but it does help with regard to the attitude of outsiders.
Discussion of gullah on NPR primarily spoken on the islands of South Carolina.
May 15th, 2011 at 12:21:06 PM
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Quote: pacomartinIt's a pretty small place. The claim of speaking Shakespearian English has been made by a number of tourist businessmen and politicians about several places in America since the 19th century. It doesn't have much basis in linguistics, but it does help with regard to the attitude of outsiders.
Discussion of gullah on NPR primarily spoken on the islands of South Carolina.
I did misstate originally when I used the Shakespearean analogy. On further looking it is the Cornwall/Welsh accent coming through.
They also are known for a rather tasty 10 layer cake. "Smith Island Cake"
I have a bewitched egg that I use to play VP with and I have net over 900k with it.
May 15th, 2011 at 2:22:24 PM
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Quote: WizardofEnglandWe dont really say saloon, simply just car.
I say a saloon if I'm trying to make clear it's not a hatchback (a four door, not a five door, for example). It's probably a little under used these days though, and really comes from the description the police would use in their databases.
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
May 15th, 2011 at 2:57:49 PM
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Or estate car, whats the US equivalent?
http://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/general/10042-woes-black-sheep-game-ii/#post151727
May 15th, 2011 at 3:47:32 PM
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Quote: WizardofEnglandOr estate car, whats the US equivalent?
AmE equivalent to saloon is sedan. The AmE equivalent to Estate car is Stationwagon. Stationwagons are pretty much taken over by minivans for less money, and SUV's if you have more money.
Common words
"four-wheel drive"
Convertible
Coupé
Station Wagon AmE (Estate car in BrE)
Hatchback
Minivan
MPV Multi-purpose vehicle
Pickup truck a.k.a pickup
Roadster
Sedan
Sport utility vehicle (SUV)
Less Common words
Crossover
Fastback
Hardtop
Liftback
Microvan
Town car
Notchback
May 15th, 2011 at 4:11:50 PM
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Quote: pacomartinAmE equivalent to saloon is sedan. The AmE equivalent to Estate car is Stationwagon. Stationwagons are pretty much taken over by minivans for less money, and SUV's if you have more money.
I thought estate = luxury sedan (or 'boat' as country folk call em). I'm probably wrong, I just don't recall seeing many UK stationwagons.
I was recently 'on holiday' and watched a lot of Top Gear on BBC. I needed some assistance figuring what the hell they were talking about most of the time.
British term - American term
----------------- -------------
accumulator - battery
actuator - switch or servo
Artic - articulated lorry = "tractor-trailer"
bonnet - hood
boot - trunk
bulkhead - firewall
crosshead - Phillips
cubby box - glove box or glove compartment
damper - shock absorber
drop-head coupe - convertible version of 2 door coupe
dumpy screwdriver - short screwdriver
dynamo - generator
earth - ground
estate - station wagon
fascia - dashboard
fixed-head coupe - 2 door coupe
gearbox - transmission
hood - convertible top
jointing compound - gasket sealant
lorry - truck
mole wrench - Vice grips
monocoque - unibody
nave plate - hubcap
paraffin - kerosene
prop shaft - drive shaft
rev counter - tachometer
ring gear - flywheel gear, or starter gear
saloon - 2 or 4 door sedan
scuttle - cowl
side curtains - removable side windows
silencer - muffler
Shooting Brake - station wagon
spanner - wrench
squab - part of seat
sump - oil pan
tickover - idle
torch - flashlight
Tyre - tire
wheel nut - lug nut
wing - fender
The opinions of this moderator are for entertainment purposes only.
May 15th, 2011 at 5:18:40 PM
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What do they call the mobile baby seats in the UK?
Here is what they call them elsewhere:
US: stroller. They used to be called a "baby carriage," but when they became smaller and more portable I think is when the term "stroller" came along, and it stuck.
Australia: pram.
Mexico: cochecito. (correct me if I'm wrong)
Here is what they call them elsewhere:
US: stroller. They used to be called a "baby carriage," but when they became smaller and more portable I think is when the term "stroller" came along, and it stuck.
Australia: pram.
Mexico: cochecito. (correct me if I'm wrong)
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
May 15th, 2011 at 5:31:55 PM
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Quote: Wizard
Mexico: cochecito. (correct me if I'm wrong)
Carriola.
Cochecito isn't used at all. It means a tiny car or cart.
Donald Trump is a fucking criminal
May 15th, 2011 at 7:49:44 PM
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I used to troubleshoot International troubles for AT&T. Was always amazed at the flawless English spoken by most Asian technicians, especially Korean females. I also would shoot Australian troubles. Love their slang until it was my undoing . I was working with a young lady named Angel who offered to post me a view. Not sure how this was involved in the trouble, I declined. Later, much to my disappointment a fellow male tech told me Angel deserved her name. And I had turned down her offer to mail me a picture.
Me and my lack of knowing Aussie english robbed me of a pix of her in a bathing suit. GRRRRRR Somehow this must be the fault of the Brits, eh Wiz !
Me and my lack of knowing Aussie english robbed me of a pix of her in a bathing suit. GRRRRRR Somehow this must be the fault of the Brits, eh Wiz !
May 15th, 2011 at 9:43:49 PM
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Quote: WizardWhat do they call the mobile baby seats in the UK?
Push-chair or Buggy.
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
May 15th, 2011 at 9:47:28 PM
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TRIVIA QUESTION
There are three to five countries (2 are marginal) in the world with more English Speakers than in the constituent country of England (51.5 million) where the language originated.
What are they?
Antigua and Barbuda | Guyana | New Zealand | Swaziland
Australia | India | Nigeria | Tanzania
Bahamas | Ireland | Pakistan | Tonga
Barbados | Israel | Palau | Trinidad and Tobago
Beliza | Jamaica | Papua New Guinea | Tuvalu
Botswana | Kenya | Philippines | Uganda
Brunei | Kiribati | Russia | United States
Cameroon | Lesotho | Rwanda | Vanuatu
Canada | Liberia | Saint Kitts and Nevis | Zambia
Dominica | Malawi | Saint Lucia | Zimbabwe
Ethiopia | Malta | Saint Vincent and the Grenadines |
Fiji | Marshall Islands | Samoa |
France | Mexico | Seychelles |
Gambia | Mauritius | Sierra Leone |
Germany | Micronesia | Singapore |
Ghana | Namibia | Solomon Islands |
Grenada | Nauru | South Africa |
There are three to five countries (2 are marginal) in the world with more English Speakers than in the constituent country of England (51.5 million) where the language originated.
What are they?
Antigua and Barbuda | Guyana | New Zealand | Swaziland
Australia | India | Nigeria | Tanzania
Bahamas | Ireland | Pakistan | Tonga
Barbados | Israel | Palau | Trinidad and Tobago
Beliza | Jamaica | Papua New Guinea | Tuvalu
Botswana | Kenya | Philippines | Uganda
Brunei | Kiribati | Russia | United States
Cameroon | Lesotho | Rwanda | Vanuatu
Canada | Liberia | Saint Kitts and Nevis | Zambia
Dominica | Malawi | Saint Lucia | Zimbabwe
Ethiopia | Malta | Saint Vincent and the Grenadines |
Fiji | Marshall Islands | Samoa |
France | Mexico | Seychelles |
Gambia | Mauritius | Sierra Leone |
Germany | Micronesia | Singapore |
Ghana | Namibia | Solomon Islands |
Grenada | Nauru | South Africa |
May 15th, 2011 at 11:24:58 PM
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Quote: thecesspitPush-chair or Buggy.
or the old favourite, a pram.
[This space is intentionally left blank]
May 15th, 2011 at 11:27:30 PM
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Quote: Croupieror the old favourite, a pram.
I always think a pram is the pushable cot type thing wherein the bairn is lying down. Though I guess these modern systems turn from prams into push chairs with three clicks and fiddle with flange-whatsit-doodah.
Which reminds me, dodgy and geezer seem to be two words that I often have to translate to North Americans.
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
May 15th, 2011 at 11:36:42 PM
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Quote: thecesspitI always think a pram is the pushable cot type thing wherein the bairn is lying down. Though I guess these modern systems turn from prams into push chairs with three clicks and fiddle with flange-whatsit-doodah.
Which reminds me, dodgy and geezer seem to be two words that I often have to translate to North Americans.
'Dodgy' it what a man becomes when his girl asks about The Ring. 'Geezer' is a person with many years behind him. Do I win? =)
The opinions of this moderator are for entertainment purposes only.
May 16th, 2011 at 12:32:39 AM
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Quote: thecesspitWhich reminds me, dodgy and geezer seem to be two words that I often have to translate to North Americans.
I like dodgy. I always thought that it was an adjective only used to describe a person, but in the routine, A small rewrite at 1:20 Rowan Atkinson uses it to describe a speech.
"Four weddings and a Funeral" made "crikey" better known in the USA, but "dodgy" hasn't had a breakthrough yet.
"Geezer" seems pretty common.
May 16th, 2011 at 9:52:32 AM
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Quote: Face'Dodgy' it what a man becomes when his girl asks about The Ring. 'Geezer' is a person with many years behind him. Do I win? =)
Nah, you can also be a diamond Geezer, a bit of a flash geezer or just a geezer. It's not necessarily an old dude. Not in the Sarf Lahndan patois I'm used to anyways.
Dodgy can be a person, a thing or a situation. Bit like "sketchy" is used.
Dodgy was also a band who did the very fine "Staying out for the summer" :: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XSUuRZR-9hA
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
May 16th, 2011 at 9:59:57 AM
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Quote: thecesspitNah, you can also be a diamond Geezer, a bit of a flash geezer or just a geezer. It's not necessarily an old dude. Not in the Sarf Lahndan patois I'm used to anyways.
Dodgy can be a person, a thing or a situation. Bit like "sketchy" is used.
Dodgy was also a band who did the very fine "Staying out for the summer" :: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XSUuRZR-9hA
You can also be a Dodgy Geezer.
http://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/general/10042-woes-black-sheep-game-ii/#post151727
May 16th, 2011 at 10:18:47 AM
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Quote: WizardofEnglandYou can also be a Dodgy Geezer.
I can but I've tried to stop that since the court order was filed.
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
May 16th, 2011 at 10:22:51 AM
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Quote: pacomartinTRIVIA QUESTION
There are three to five countries (2 are marginal) in the world with more English Speakers than in the constituent country of England (51.5 million) where the language originated. What are they?
The U.S., Canada, and Australia are pretty obvious. For the other two India, Pakistan, and South Africa come to mind. If forced to pick two I'll go with India and South Africa.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
May 16th, 2011 at 10:46:52 AM
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Quote: WizardThe U.S., Canada, and Australia are pretty obvious. For the other two India, Pakistan, and South Africa come to mind. If forced to pick two I'll go with India and South Africa.
Canada(pop 34m), and Australia (pop22.6m) are much smaller than England. South Africa has a population roughly the same as England, but they speak 11 languages in the country. English or at least pidgin is popular, but the total number of English speakers is still well in the minority.
The possibilities are limited to the roughly 2 0 countries with enough population in order to have an English speaking minority of 51.5 million.
India with a total population of over 1 billion and the elite all speak English. They are certainly one of the countries.
May 16th, 2011 at 10:58:45 AM
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Quote: WizardThe U.S., Canada, and Australia are pretty obvious. For the other two India, Pakistan, and South Africa come to mind. If forced to pick two I'll go with India and South Africa.
Is the question about first language or any speaker of the language?
US, India, China, Bangaldesh and Pakistan would be my guesses.... China might be replaceable with one of the larger African countries...
EDIT : Actually, instead of China, how about Malaysia?
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
May 16th, 2011 at 11:28:10 AM
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Quote: thecesspitIs the question about first language or any speaker of the language?
US, India, China, Bangaldesh and Pakistan would be my guesses.... China might be replaceable with one of the larger African countries...
EDIT : Actually, instead of China, how about Malaysia?
Any speaker of the language, and I am trying to be generous and include almost any intelligible version of English.
Malaysia is another country that is just too small. Total population is about 30 million, so even if they were at 100% they wouldn't be one.
US is obviously one, and India based on it's huge size of 1.1 billion people. Most estimates of the English speaking fraction are at least 10%, which is double the population of England.
China is a reasonable guess given Hong Kong and Macau. But the estimated number of English speakers is still below 20 million. Because of the trade figures, gambling numbers, and GDP of the country of China, we often overestimate how educated and advanced the country is in reality. In truth much of the country lives without clean water and sanitation. Education (especially in foreign languages) is relatively rare.
Bangladesh and Pakistan are also reasonable guesses since they are so large and used to be part of the British Empire. But (like India) the English speaking population is still between 10% and 20%.
By percentage, but not by size
Norway, Sweden, Denmark, and the Netherlands for places that were not part of the British Empire. Just based on shared economy. They actually have a higher percentage of English speakers than Canada which still has several roughly 4 million people who speak only French,
So the only two correct ones so far are USA and India .
May 16th, 2011 at 11:31:28 AM
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WAG Russia Left over remnant of the cold war.
May 16th, 2011 at 11:52:30 AM
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Quote: pacomartinCanada(pop 34m), and Australia (pop22.6m) are much smaller than England.
Wow, I would have never have thought that.
It is probably wrong, but I think Singapore is a worthy guess.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
May 16th, 2011 at 12:04:12 PM
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Quote: pacomartinSo the only two correct ones so far are USA and India .
I actually meant Indonesia it seems, checking out a map of the world.... :)
And Nigeria as our representative from Africa.
I notice you mentioned "England" not the "United Kingdom". Any reason?
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
May 16th, 2011 at 12:16:37 PM
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Quote: WizardWow, I would have never have thought that.
It is probably wrong, but I think Singapore is a worthy guess.
Singapore is small. All Singapore is is a big sprawling city of a several million people. :)
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
May 16th, 2011 at 1:23:04 PM
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Quote: thecesspitI actually meant Indonesia it seems, checking out a map of the world.... :)
And Nigeria as our representative from Africa.
I notice you mentioned "England" not the "United Kingdom". Any reason?
It's an interesting question because, while English is very important, most people vastly overestimate the number of people in the world who speak English.
While Bangladesh, Pakistan and Nigeria are roughly the same size, only Nigeria has more English speakers than England. As the largest country in Africa, Nigeria has roughly 155 million people and about half of them speak English. With over 500 indigenous languages, the official language has to be English since to pick one would likely cause a civil war. Now admittedly most people speak pidgin English.
So that leaves three created by the British Empire (USA, India, and Nigeria). And it's not Indonesia which was governed by the Dutch.
And I said England, instead of the United Kingdom partly because it was the birthplace of the language, and partly because it was smaller by 10 million people. The smaller population is closer to the English speaking population of the last two countries. It is notoriously difficult to estimate the number of actual English speakers, but these last two are probably closer to 50 million than 60 million. Hint: The last two were not creations of the British Empire, and one is because of the United States.
Many people know a thousand words in English which can get them through many basic pleasantries and simple transactions. This Family Guy routine with Spanish is funny since most Americans know a sentence or two in Spanish.
May 16th, 2011 at 1:54:22 PM
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I'd guess the Phillipines then if we are blaming the US...
The fifth one... hmm, I'm wondering if there's enough speakers in one of the bigger EU countries then?
As long as you weren't conflating the UK and England as a single entity, it's all good. My Scottish ancestors get rather upset about being called "English"...
The fifth one... hmm, I'm wondering if there's enough speakers in one of the bigger EU countries then?
As long as you weren't conflating the UK and England as a single entity, it's all good. My Scottish ancestors get rather upset about being called "English"...
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
May 16th, 2011 at 1:59:29 PM
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Quote: pacomartinand one is because of the United States.
Liberia
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
May 16th, 2011 at 2:37:37 PM
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.....
May 16th, 2011 at 2:51:08 PM
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I refer my honorable colleague to the answer I gave just days ago :
Here...
Yep, packet of fags is still in use.
I wish I could find a clip of Wayne and Waynetta Slobs "I'm having a fag" bit from Harry Enfield and chums...
Here...
Yep, packet of fags is still in use.
I wish I could find a clip of Wayne and Waynetta Slobs "I'm having a fag" bit from Harry Enfield and chums...
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
May 16th, 2011 at 3:40:44 PM
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Quote: gofaster87Do they still use the term "fag" for cigarettes?
Quote: thecesspitYep, packet of fags is still in use.
I wish I could find a clip of Wayne and Waynetta Slobs "I'm having a fag" bit from Harry Enfield and chums...
There were a couple of comedy-action films (1968 & 1970) with Sammy Davis, Jr. and Peter Lawford playing London nightclub owners "Salt" and "Pepper" respectively. In one scene, they visit the campus of Pepper's British prep school (or whatever the proper British English term is). There, the nickname for an underclassman is "fag", and I don't think it related to the derogatory sexual reference. I vaguely remembering that it was suggested this was a common, taunting nickname for a school underling.
Is there any basis to that?
May 16th, 2011 at 4:15:31 PM
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Oh yeah, public school boys had some sort of weird hierrachial system where the younger boys would "fag" for the older ones and do menial tasks.
I don't know if the etymology of "fag" ended up to mean a gay man from that or not.
I wasn't a public school boy so have no idea how it worked except from some works of fiction like Tom Brown's School Days.
I don't know if the etymology of "fag" ended up to mean a gay man from that or not.
I wasn't a public school boy so have no idea how it worked except from some works of fiction like Tom Brown's School Days.
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
May 16th, 2011 at 5:00:13 PM
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Quote: thecesspitI'd guess the Phillipines then if we are blaming the US...
The fifth one... hmm, I'm wondering if there's enough speakers in one of the bigger EU countries then?
As long as you weren't conflating the UK and England as a single entity, it's all good. My Scottish ancestors get rather upset about being called "English"...
I was very careful to call England a "constituent country". I know how upset the British get when Americans refer to the UK as England (as if we had missed the last 4 centuries of history).
Philippines and Germany. Germany has roughly 82 million people. About 25m - 35 m don't speak English. Like I said it's a fuzzy line.
So these are the countries (total population) with roughly the same or more English speakers than England (51.5m)
India-1,189,172,906
United States-313,232,044
Nigeria-155,215,573
Philippines-101,833,938
Germany-81,471,834
Of the other large countries none of them has close to 50 million English speakers. But there is a widespread impression that English is more widely spoken than it really is.
China-1,336,718,015
Indonesia-245,613,043
Brazil-203,429,773
Pakistan-187,342,721
Bangladesh-158,570,535
Russia-138,739,892
Japan-126,475,664
Mexico-113,724,226
Ethiopia-90,873,739
Vietnam-90,549,390
Egypt-82,079,636
Turkey-78,785,548
Iran-77,891,220
Congo (Kinshasa)-71,712,867
Thailand-66,720,153
France-65,102,719
Italy-61,016,804
Burma-53,999,804
South Africa-49,004,031
Korea, South-48,754,657
However, keep in mind when we say that the growth rate of the world is reducing, that just means that the number of babies has leveled off at roughly 130 million per year. It's been that way for about 15 years , and is predicted to stay at that number for the next 40 years. It is not going to go down for the foreseeable future. It just isn't going to go up.
Most of these new children are going to get at the internet. There is the potential to have a billion students of English (far more than all the teachers out there). I think online teaching of English could become huge.
May 16th, 2011 at 5:02:25 PM
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Everyone understand English. You just speak LOUDLY and SLOOOOWWWWWLY and they get the message (/sarcasm)
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
May 16th, 2011 at 5:19:35 PM
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Quote: pacomartinOf the other large countries none of them has close to 50 million English speakers. But there is a widespread impression that English is more widely spoken than it really is.
Mexico-113,724,226
Since starting work, I've been amazed at how few Mexicans speak or even understand English to any significant degree. In high school and college, most people spoke English or could understand it.
Donald Trump is a fucking criminal
May 16th, 2011 at 5:37:41 PM
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Quote: NareedSince starting work, I've been amazed at how few Mexicans speak or even understand English to any significant degree. In high school and college, most people spoke English or could understand it.
Wikipedia says 5 million (far more than Nahuatl) based on an INEGI report but I have to think that is on the extreme low side. I would have guessed 5 million in the 75 mile zone along the border with the USA alone.
Estimates are often over 50 million Spanish speakers in the USA.
The Voice of America has news in special english which is a very slow, highly enunciated version of American English with a limited vocabulary. It's an aid to people who want to practice hearing English. I have never heard of the equivalent in other languages.
May 16th, 2011 at 6:12:03 PM
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Quote: Doc...the campus of Pepper's British prep school (or whatever the proper British English term is).
Quote: thecesspitI wasn't a public school boy so ...
Ah! There's a reference that seems appropriate for this thread. I think I have heard that the terms "public school" and "private school" have exactly reversed meanings in UK and US. Is that correct?
In the US, a public school is one supported primarily or exclusively by public tax dollars, usually with no charge for the students attending, while a private school is supported by privately-held funds, usually charging tuition payments from the students (or, more likely, their parents).
May 16th, 2011 at 6:13:25 PM
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Quote: pacomartinWikipedia says 5 million (far more than Nahuatl) based on an INEGI report but I have to think that is on the extreme low side. I would have guessed 5 million in the 75 mile zone along the border with the USA alone.
At the department I work for we're 12 people. Three, including myself, speak English. I'm the only one who's fluent. The other two, including the boss, can muddle along if they must, but when there's a work-related document in English it invariably lands on my desk. In fact my level of fluency is rather unusual. My siblings come near, but then we all had the same English teacher. They'd be at my level if they read more, I'm sure.
Anyway, along the border and in tourist areas like Acapulco or Cancun, there are plenty of epople who know a few words and phrases, enough to engage in simple, everyday transactions. If anything Spanish is more prevalent in the US side of the border than English in the Mexican side. In Laredo, TX, I vividly recall, all the personnel in the shops in the big Mall spoke Spanish. Many were Mexicans or of Mexican descent. I don't look Mexican, ask the Wizard, yet in Laredo few people spoke to me in English.
Curiously this wasn't the case in McAllen, TX, although if you used Spanish chances were better than 95% you'd be understood.
Donald Trump is a fucking criminal
May 16th, 2011 at 6:20:40 PM
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Quote: pacomartin... But there is a widespread impression that English is more widely spoken than it really is. ...
Quote: NareedSince starting work, I've been amazed at how few Mexicans speak or even understand English to any significant degree. In high school and college, most people spoke English or could understand it.
I posted my limited experience on this topic here a couple of months ago, including viewpoints of a visitor to the US and my own visits to other countries.
May 16th, 2011 at 6:39:00 PM
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Quote: DocI posted my limited experience on this topic here a couple of months ago, including viewpoints of a visitor to the US and my own visits to other countries.
Which countries ahve you visited?
I've been to the US, naturally, Canada, England and Israel. In every case I got along well in English. Most Israelis do speak English, and street names and signage are in Hebrew, Arabic and English (in that order). When I encountered a non-English speaker, what Hebrew I recalled from school and signs usually suficed.
For news, without the internet at the time, I sometimes got a copy of The Jerusalem Post (all English), plus there was an English broadcast on TV every day, plus five or six on the national radio station, Kol Israel. I mention this because I was last in Israel during the 85 quakes that leveled parts of Mexico City. I was at my uncle's place when the news broke, in hebrew. I was reading a book while my aunt and uncle watched the news right after dinner. I did catch "Mexico" but didn't understand what else was happening until they showed video.
The Hebrew phrase for earthquake is something like "raash adama." The latter word, I know, means something like land or earth, but I'd no idea what the first one meant. I thought it meant "noise," which dind't make sense.
We spent the rest of the evening and much of the night trying to cal my parents, my other aunts and uncles, friends of my aunt and uncle in mexico. Of course we couldn't get through for a few days. I suggested calling my grandparents in Monterrey, thinking the lines there would be intact and less saturated, but my uncle dind't want to worry them. we had a nice, long argument about it.
I wasn't worried at all, though, because where all my family lived, worked and studied at the time were all very stable areas. We got through eventually and everyone we knew was ok.
But I digress....
Donald Trump is a fucking criminal
May 16th, 2011 at 6:51:08 PM
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Quote: DocAh! There's a reference that seems appropriate for this thread. I think I have heard that the terms "public school" and "private school" have exactly reversed meanings in UK and US. Is that correct?
Not quite
Quote:In the US, a public school is one supported primarily or exclusively by public tax dollars, usually with no charge for the students attending, while a private school is supported by privately-held funds, usually charging tuition payments from the students (or, more likely, their parents).
Private school and public school's are both outside of the state/government funded school system.
I believe there is some subtle difference between the two, but not sure what it is. Eton is probably the most famous Public School in the UK... David Cameron went there.
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
May 16th, 2011 at 6:56:38 PM
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Not many, and most of those only briefly.Quote: NareedWhich countries ahve you visited?
I live in the US and have visited Canada, Mexico, Costa Rica, Columbia, England, Spain, Greece, Gibraltar, Cyprus, Egypt, Morocco, Canary Islands (a detached part of Spain) Bahamas, Dominican Republic, St. Martin, Ste. Maartin, St. Kitts and Nevis, Dominica, St. Lucia, Barbados, Granada, Curacao, Aruba. Yes, the Carib. islands visits were just for cruise ship stops. The longest single visit to any of these was a month that I worked in Cyprus, with second longest being three weeks working in Egypt.
May 16th, 2011 at 7:15:44 PM
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Quote: DocNot many, and most of those only briefly.
I estimate over 20 without counting. That's a lot.
Quote:The longest single visit to any of these was a month that I worked in Cyprus,
From what I know about it, English might be safer to use than Turkish or Greek. But then I've never been there.
How did you manage in Greece? I assume street signs are in both the Greek and Latin alphabets, but what about everything else?
Donald Trump is a fucking criminal
May 16th, 2011 at 7:33:34 PM
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Quote: DocNot many, and most of those only briefly.
I live in the US and have visited Canada, Mexico, Costa Rica, Columbia, England, Spain, Greece, Gibraltar, Cyprus, Egypt, Morocco, Canary Islands (a detached part of Spain) Bahamas, Dominican Republic, St. Martin, Ste. Maartin, St. Kitts and Nevis, Dominica, St. Lucia, Barbados, Granada, Curacao, Aruba. Yes, the Carib. islands visits were just for cruise ship stops. The longest single visit to any of these was a month that I worked in Cyprus, with second longest being three weeks working in Egypt.
Doc, Nothing I am saying is disputing that there are a tremendous number of people who speak English as a second language. It is nearly universal now in Europe for people under a certain age. Millions of people conduct business in English on every continent even if there is not a single native speaker in the room. You cannot go to a big city or a tourist destination and not find people who speak English.
What I am saying is that when they do surveys most American people now believe 1/3 to 1/2 of people in the world now speak at least pidgin English. The most reliable expert guess is about 15% with 20% being a particularly high estimate.
You can tell from the answers given here. While China has 1.34 billion people, they don't have nearly 50 million English speakers, Indonesia has a population of 250M, and not even close to 50M speakers. Pakistan (187M) and Bangaldesh (158M) and probably only 10% speak English and they were part of the British Empire for hundreds of years. Nigeria is probably the exception at roughly 50% because they have so many native languages that people have to learn English to communicate. Russia has maybe 5% English speakers. Even India probably has only 10% English speaker with 15% a high estimate.
May 16th, 2011 at 8:18:58 PM
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Quote: NareedWhich countries ahve you visited?
Not that anyone cares, but:
Mexico, Canada: Too many to count. I lived in Canada for three month stretch.
China: 5 times, including Hong Kong and Macau (which could almost be considered separate countries)
Germany, Poland, France, Italy, Monaco, Panama, Australia, Finland, Iceland, USSR, Netherland Antilles (Curacao), Bahamas: 1 time
Philippines, Denmark, South Korea: Airport only
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
May 16th, 2011 at 8:44:47 PM
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Quote: WizardNot that anyone cares
UK (8 times), Spain (3 times), Italy (twice), Germany, Austria, Portugal, France, Sweden, Finland,Panama, Columbia, Jamaica, British Virgin Islands, Dominican Republic, Bahamas, Canada, and Mexico, Japan, Oman, Bahrain,
[US territories: Guam, Puerto Rico, US Virgin Islands], [airports: Iceland, Norway, Switzerland, Netherlands] .
I have never been on a cruise ship, but I did sail into waters which Iran claimed as territorial.
May 16th, 2011 at 9:39:39 PM
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And many of them were for less than 12 hours, as cruise ship stops -- just tiny tastes of the countries, and exposure only to people who spend their lives dealing with tourists.Quote: NareedI estimate over 20 without counting. That's a lot.
I only visited the southern portion of the island. I met a few refugees who had escaped the invasion of their home areas in the north but no Turkish Cypriots. I met one engineer who had trained in Yugoslavia and had very limited English and a street market vendor who apparently spoke no English. My engineering counterpart's wife-to-be did not speak English, but we enjoyed pantomiming conversations to each other. In the month I was there, I had no occasion to try to converse with anyone else who did not speak English. But I understand Mr. Martin's point -- the fact that I mostly only encountered speakers of English there does not mean that the general population knows my language.Quote: Nareed (in reference to CyprusFrom what I know about it, English might be safer to use than Turkish or Greek. But then I've never been there.
I was only in Athens, three times and about 24 hours each time. Again, I only dealt with people who made their livings dealing with tourists, so I had no difficulties.Quote: NareedHow did you manage in Greece? I assume street signs are in both the Greek and Latin alphabets, but what about everything else?
May 16th, 2011 at 11:28:05 PM
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Quote: WizardNot that anyone cares, but...
The number of countries any one of you (Nareed, paco, Doc, Wiz) visited surpasses the number of times I've so much as left my own state. In this contest of 'whose is bigger', I'm clearly the guy in the corner hoping he doesn't get called. /sigh.
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