NY state lawmakers to allow casino gambling

NY state lawmakers to allow casino gambling

Here is my guess

1) Buffalo - East side so within 50 miles of Rochester,
2) Syracuse - South side so within driving distance of Binghampton
3) Albany - South side within driving distance of Poughkeepsie
4) Long Island
5) Brooklyn expansion of Aqueduct
6) Yonkers expansion of Racino
7) Rockland county (steal from Northern NJ)

None in Manhattan.

There is a racino, Empire City, in Yonkers just north of the Bronx which will likely get table games, they are currently expanding.
Aqueduct is in Queens, and Resorts World (Genting) has built a huge three story casino there that has plenty of room for tables.
The governor and assembly speaker already announced Manhattan would not be in the mix.
They approved seven casinos, and there are currently nine racinos...

Current Racino locations in NYS:

Fairgrounds. South of Buffalo
Batavia Downs. Between Rochester and Buffalo
Finger Lakes. Near Rochester
Vernon Downs. East of Syracuse
Saratoga. Saratoga Springs
Tioga Downs. West of Binghamton
Empire Resorts. South of Catskills
Empire City. Yonkers, north of Bronx, NYC
Aqueduct/Resorts World. Queens, NYC

Quote: WongBo

They approved seven casinos, and there are currently nine racinos...

Why not just approve 9 casinos?

I am assuming it is so they can leverage a higher tax rate by making them compete for the licenses

Aqueduct is accessible via the A train.

They have only ten craps terminals, a few BJ machines, hundreds of video baccarat and the rest is all VLT.
They do have a lot of empty space that could accommodate table games.

I haven't lived in New York since 1979. I grew up in Rockland County. Even when I worked in radio and TV in the 1960s and 1970s in New York (Syracuse and New York City area) there was talk about casino gambling... but mostly race tracks. Back then, horse racing was the #1 spectator sport in America, not NASCAR as it is today.

Well, I remember the fights over whether or not to expand horse racing in upstate -- and the conservative, anti gambling base didn't allow it. Casino gambling was only a dream. Remember, this was before Atlantic City.

But when Atlantic City opened up the Borscht Belt was dyring and they said casino gambling would save them... so did the big hotels on Miami beach... and all that got nowhere.

I think it would be a mistake to limit one casino per any geographic area, since the lack of competition and that local monopoly would not be in the best interests of workers or casino goers. Though a local monopoly woudl certainly raise the bids for the license to operate.

I think a concentration of casinos in the Borscht Belt would be best for the state and would make New York a gaming destination. The Borscht Belt is only a two hour drive from NYC (if I remember correctly) a three hour drive from Syracuse, a 90 minute drive from Albany, a four hour drive from Buffalo.

And don't they have that airport in Newburgh which is about an hour away?

Concentrating casinos in one area is not going to happen in NY.
There is too much political pressure for a distributed model, and the existing racinos are first in line for the licenses.
They are far enough apart to draw customers from a wider population base than if they were all in one area.
They are also, close enough to compete with each other to some extent.
Cuomo said he would expect that the casinos would be spread across the state, saying,
“We want to create destination locations that are not just casinos.”
Cuomo suggested a potential bidding process for the gaming licenses.
The constitutional amendment passed Wednesday is the first step in a lengthy process.
The amendment would have to be approved again next year by the new Legislature.
Then it would have to be approved by voters in November 2013.
So the earliest casinos could be legalized would be January 2014.

Native American casinos in New York Sate are of course opposed to the new legislation....\

1 Seneca Allegany Casino Salamanca
Seneca Gaming and Entertainment Irving
Seneca Gaming and Entertainment Salamanca
2 Seneca Buffalo Creek Casino Buffalo
3 Akwesasne Mohawk Casino Hogansburg
Mohawk Bingo Palace and Casino Akwesasne
Three Feathers Casino Akwesane Reservation
4 Seneca Niagara Casino Niagara Falls
5 Turning Stone Resort & Casino Verona

Quote: WongBo

Concentrating casinos in one area is not going to happen in NY.

Concentration provides competitive business. The concept of casinos as ways to generate money for the government favors distributed gambling with legal guarantees of lack of competition. There is also a strong incentive to try and bring in as much money as possible from people out of state. If that is not possible, then it is to prevent the money from leaving the state.

In this case the government is not trying to protect it's citizens, they are trying to make money from them.

what is #6 and 7 wong bo?



Letters A to I in red are the racinos
Letters I to K in Black are IMHO others.
I) Hamptons
J) Watertown - 1000 Islands
K) Berkshires/Taconics

Quote: WongBo

Native American casinos in New York Sate are of course opposed to the new legislation....

If the Native Americans can't vote, they're most likely SOL in that battle. Any idea of how many recognized Native Americans are in New York State?

Quote: pacomartin

In this case the government is not trying to protect it's citizens, they are trying to make money from them.

The succinct overriding point. Pennsylvania has been showing the way to great effect.

Quote: SanchoPanza

If the Native Americans can't vote, they're most likely SOL in that battle. Any idea of how many recognized Native Americans are in New York State?

About 116K native Americans in the state. But the census is self identifying with regard to race. If you say you are something, that is the final authority. I would think that there are probably only a few thousand directly involved in casinos.




6 Nations -- League of Haudenosee (Iroquois) Confederacy
1 Tonawanda Band of Senecas
2Cattaraugus Reservation (Seneca)
3Seneca Nation of Indians, Allegany Reservation
4 Oil Springs Reservation (Seneca)
5 Cayuga Nation
6 Onondaga Nation
7Oneida Indian Nation of New York
8 St. Regis Mohawk Tribe (Akwesasne)
9Tuscarora Nation

Other NY Indian Nations -- Long Island Tribes
10. Shinnecock Reservation, state (not federally) recognized
11. Poospatuck Reservation, Unkechauga Nation

Quote: TREATY WITH THE NEW YORK INDIANS, 1838. January 15, 1838

Articles of a treaty made and concluded at Buffalo Creek in the State of New York, the fifteenth day of January in the year of our Lord one thousand eight hundred and thirty-eight, by Ransom H. Gillet, a commissioner on the part of the United States, and the chiefs, head men and warriors of the several tribes of New York Indians assembled in council witnesseth: /A/

WHEREAS, the six nations of New York Indians not long after the close of the war of the Revolution, became convinced from the rapid increase of the white settlements around, that the time was not far distant when their true interest must lead them to seek a new home among /B/ their red brethren in the West: And whereas this subject was agitated in a general council of the Six nations as early as 1810, and resulted in sending a memorial to the President of the United States, inquiring whether the Government would consent to their leaving their habitations and their removing into the neighborhood of their western brethren, and if they could procure a home there, by gift of purchase, whether the Government would acknowledge their title to the lands so obtained in the same manner it had acknowledged it in those from whom they might receive it; and further, whether the existing treaties would, in such a case remain in full force, and their annuities be paid as heretofore: And whereas, with the approbation of the President of the United States, purchases were made by the New York Indians from the Menomonie and Winnebago Indians of certain lands at Green Bay in the Territory of Wisconsin, which after much difficulty and contention with those Indians concerning the extent of that purchase, the whole subject was finally settled by a treaty between the United States and the Menomonie Indians, concluded in February, 1831, to which the New York Indians gave their assent on the seventeenth day of October 1832: And whereas, by the provisions of that treaty, five hundred thousand acres of land are secured to the New York Indians of the Six Nations and the St. Regis tribe, as a future home, on condition that they all remove to the same, within three years, or such reasonable time as the President should prescribe: And whereas, the President is satisfied that various considerations have prevented those still residing in New York from removing to Green Bay, and among other reasons, that many who were in favour of emigration, preferred to remove at once to the Indian territory, which they were fully persuaded was the only permanent and peaceful home for all the Indians. And they therefore applied to the President to take their Green Bay lands, and provide them a new home among their brethren in the Indian territory. And whereas, the President being anxious to promote the peace, prosperity and happiness of his red children, and being determined to carry out the humane policy of the Government in removing the Indians from the east to the west of the Mississippi, within the Indian territory, by bringing them to see and feel, by his justice and liberality, that it is their true policy and for their interest to do so without delay.

Therefore, taking into consideration the foregoing premises, the following articles of a treaty are entered into between the United States of America and the several tribes of the New York Indians, the names of whose chiefs, head men and warriors are hereto subscribed, and those who may hereafter give their assent to this treaty in writing, within such time as the President shall appoint.
...

With 7 casinos serving 30+ million people and the existence of the Senecas and the Turning Stone which satisfy those on I90 between Buffalo and Syracuse, without cannabilizing the natives, I am thinking 4 of the 7 would service New York and Northern NJ. I would expand the casino just opened in Queens, expand Yonkers, expand perhaps Monticello, and open one near Yankee Stadium (perhaps the old Yankee Stadium site, if they haven't rebuilt on it yet). Westchester would never allow a casino -- maybe Long Island definitely would.

For the other three, you're looking at Albany, perhaps Rochester, and definitely Binghampton. This would maximize the cannabilization for Jersey and Pennsylvanian casinos and create new local gamblers in Westchester and Northern NJ (who are looking at 2 hour commutes to Mohegan Sun or AC).

I think that the Binghamton casino you speak of would be an expansion of the current Racino at Tioga Downs as our local papers have been saying they hope to add tables and a hotel. I think some competition on the tables would be good as the table games at Turning Stone (2 hours away) are rather stingy aside from their fairly liberal blackjack tables (.4 edge) and generous 3 card paytable. Turning Stone is very good to me with comps, but their stingy 2x field on the 2 12 and double zero roulette make those games tough. Their slots are very tight but so are the lottery run video games at the state racinos.

I think that even with the casinos opening, you'd be hard pressed to find 3x field on the 2 or 12 or single zero roulette (except in the high limit areas).

very true. would be nice though.

Quote: winmonkeyspit3

I think that the Binghamton casino you speak of would be an expansion of the current Racino at Tioga Downs as our local papers have been saying they hope to add tables and a hotel. I think some competition on the tables would be good as the table games at Turning Stone (2 hours away) are rather stingy aside from their fairly liberal blackjack tables (.4 edge) and generous 3 card paytable. Turning Stone is very good to me with comps, but their stingy 2x field on the 2 12 and double zero roulette make those games tough. Their slots are very tight but so are the lottery run video games at the state racinos.

I assume Turning Stone is a Native American casino. My conversation with a dealer at Seneca Niagara is that there is a compact with all the casinos that they are to offer the same games everywhere. Technically, they aren't competing with each other, and the rules changes are more complicated than some Midwest gaming commissions. I made the comment about the excellent 3-card table, and the dealer said there was no chance of it changing since it takes over a year to get new games on the floor...