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EvenBob
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January 19th, 2024 at 12:18:34 PM permalink
Quote: Brickapotamus

Quote: EvenBob

Quote: Brickapotamus

Quote: EvenBob

Quote: Brickapotamus



I understand that a highly advanced civilization would probably be able to do things that are inconceivable to us now, but again what would be the point?
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What's the point of life as you understand it. What's the point of this reality as you understand it. We have no idea what the point is so how could we have any idea what the point would be of a simulation to some advanced society.
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True, but when as far as we know we are the only advanced society around (and our prospects for lasting into the distant future donít look great currently) making the leap that the odds are that we live in a simulation because presumably in the future there will be a lot of advanced societies that would be both capable & interested in simulating what we are doing right now is quite a stretch donít you think?

Possible? Sure anythingís possible.

Probable? Doubtful. Iíll take the under on that bet.
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You assume that if this is a simulation whatever is causing it is in the same time constraints we are in. They could possibly exist outside of time and there woild far more to this than we could possibly imagine.
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But how does that make it likely?

You may be missing my point. Iím not saying it is not possible. It is an interesting theory.

My argument is with the idea that we are almost certainly living in one. There is no evidence that we ďare almost certainly living in one.Ē
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All the evidence would be circumstantial and anecdotal. For me there's certainly more evidence of a simulation than there is for any of the ideas that religion has come up with. It answers far more questions than any other theory I've ever heard. Right now I'm beguiled by how fascinated we are with being entertained by simulations. Why is that, many people spend much of their waking hours watching simulations of life on their TVs and streaming on their computers. I find that very odd. There are some soap operas that have been on TV continuously since the 1950s. Don't you find this fascinating? Wouldn't a simulation almost certainly be intrigued with creating other simulations.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
Brickapotamus
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January 19th, 2024 at 12:26:25 PM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

Quote: Brickapotamus

Quote: EvenBob

Quote: Brickapotamus

Quote: EvenBob

Quote: Brickapotamus



I understand that a highly advanced civilization would probably be able to do things that are inconceivable to us now, but again what would be the point?
link to original post



What's the point of life as you understand it. What's the point of this reality as you understand it. We have no idea what the point is so how could we have any idea what the point would be of a simulation to some advanced society.
link to original post



True, but when as far as we know we are the only advanced society around (and our prospects for lasting into the distant future donít look great currently) making the leap that the odds are that we live in a simulation because presumably in the future there will be a lot of advanced societies that would be both capable & interested in simulating what we are doing right now is quite a stretch donít you think?

Possible? Sure anythingís possible.

Probable? Doubtful. Iíll take the under on that bet.
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You assume that if this is a simulation whatever is causing it is in the same time constraints we are in. They could possibly exist outside of time and there woild far more to this than we could possibly imagine.
link to original post



But how does that make it likely?

You may be missing my point. Iím not saying it is not possible. It is an interesting theory.

My argument is with the idea that we are almost certainly living in one. There is no evidence that we ďare almost certainly living in one.Ē
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All the evidence would be circumstantial and anecdotal. For me there's certainly more evidence of a simulation than there is for any of the ideas that religion has come up with. It answers far more questions than any other theory I've ever heard. Right now I'm beguiled by how fascinated we are with being entertained by simulations. Why is that, many people spend much of their waking hours watching simulations of life on their TVs and streaming on their computers. I find that very odd. There are some soap operas that have been on TV continuously since the 1950s. Don't you find this fascinating? Wouldn't a simulation almost certainly be intrigued with creating other simulations.
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Iíll agree with that.
EvenBob
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January 19th, 2024 at 12:59:24 PM permalink
Quote: Brickapotamus



All the evidence would be circumstantial and anecdotal. For me there's certainly more evidence of a simulation than there is for any of the ideas that religion has come up with. It answers far more questions than any other theory I've ever heard. Right now I'm beguiled by how fascinated we are with being entertained by simulations. Why is that, many people spend much of their waking hours watching simulations of life on their TVs and streaming on their computers. I find that very odd. There are some soap operas that have been on TV continuously since the 1950s. Don't you find this fascinating? Wouldn't a simulation almost certainly be intrigued with creating other simulations.
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Look at the new product just introduced, an even more realistic virtual reality device. We seem obsessed with creating better and better simulations. There is no evidence that this is ever going away. All the evidence points to the more technologically we get advanced the better our simulations will be. Just more circumstantial evidence that we're actually living in a simulation. Look at the invention of the Greek and Roman gods. People got sick of how boring life was so they invented these gods and then they believed they were real and they lived in that simulation that they created. For centuries.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
TigerWu
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January 19th, 2024 at 2:59:49 PM permalink
Quote: EvenBob


Look at the new product just introduced, an even more realistic virtual reality device. We seem obsessed with creating better and better simulations. There is no evidence that this is ever going away. All the evidence points to the more technologically we get advanced the better our simulations will be. Just more circumstantial evidence that we're actually living in a simulation. Look at the invention of the Greek and Roman gods. People got sick of how boring life was so they invented these gods and then they believed they were real and they lived in that simulation that they created. For centuries.
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Your posts are a lot more interesting when you're not talking about gambling.
EvenBob
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January 19th, 2024 at 3:32:14 PM permalink
Quote: TigerWu

Quote: EvenBob


Look at the new product just introduced, an even more realistic virtual reality device. We seem obsessed with creating better and better simulations. There is no evidence that this is ever going away. All the evidence points to the more technologically we get advanced the better our simulations will be. Just more circumstantial evidence that we're actually living in a simulation. Look at the invention of the Greek and Roman gods. People got sick of how boring life was so they invented these gods and then they believed they were real and they lived in that simulation that they created. For centuries.
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Your posts are a lot more interesting when you're not talking about gambling.
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Not really, that's just your perception of reality. Because I'm doing things you haven't done as far as gambling goes my reality is different than yours.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
Brickapotamus
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January 19th, 2024 at 8:24:26 PM permalink
I will say this though. If we are living in a simulation, the most likely beings to be running it would be ourselves.

Why? Because presumably the final step in either human evolution or the evolution of consciousness would be omnipotence & immortality.

Omnipotence & immortality would be extremely boring so to entertain ourselves we would probably create something like this which also has the ability to temporarily suppress the omnipotence.
EvenBob
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January 19th, 2024 at 11:19:51 PM permalink
Quote: Brickapotamus

I will say this though. If we are living in a simulation, the most likely beings to be running it would be ourselves.

Why? Because presumably the final step in either human evolution or the evolution of consciousness would be omnipotence & immortality.

Omnipotence & immortality would be extremely boring so to entertain ourselves we would probably create something like this which also has the ability to temporarily suppress the omnipotence.
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We would have to be running it because anything else would be pointless. A clue to this is if you concentrate on what you want to accomplish if it's within a reason there's a good chance you will do it. It's a fact that you can attract certain things into your life just by thinking about them. I mentioned before that I read a book 50 years ago written in the 1930s about how you can get anything you want just by writing it down and putting energy into it every day. People who have done this know that it works and it's more circumstantial evidence that we live in a simulation that we are in charge of. I do not think there is a final step in evolution, we've been here forever in one form or another and there is no end to it.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
Brickapotamus
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January 19th, 2024 at 11:45:46 PM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

Quote: Brickapotamus

I will say this though. If we are living in a simulation, the most likely beings to be running it would be ourselves.

Why? Because presumably the final step in either human evolution or the evolution of consciousness would be omnipotence & immortality.

Omnipotence & immortality would be extremely boring so to entertain ourselves we would probably create something like this which also has the ability to temporarily suppress the omnipotence.
link to original post



We would have to be running it because anything else would be pointless. A clue to this is if you concentrate on what you want to accomplish if it's within a reason there's a good chance you will do it. It's a fact that you can attract certain things into your life just by thinking about them. I mentioned before that I read a book 50 years ago written in the 1930s about how you can get anything you want just by writing it down and putting energy into it every day. People who have done this know that it works and it's more circumstantial evidence that we live in a simulation that we are in charge of. I do not think there is a final step in evolution, we've been here forever in one form or another and there is no end to it.
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This is true but it works whether we are in a simulation or reality.

Person A says sure would be nice to be a rockstar & get all that money & women & then does nothing else.

Person B says the same thing but concentrates, writes it down, thinks about it everyday. Reasons that he has to buy a guitar and practice. Buys the guitar & practices 5 hours a day. 10 years later he is a rockstar.

Whether we are in a simulation or reality person A will never have a chance, Person B may succeed or not, but he will always have at least a reasonable chance of success, and an infinitely better chance than person A.
EvenBob
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January 20th, 2024 at 7:49:01 AM permalink
Quote: Brickapotamus



Whether we are in a simulation or reality person A will never have a chance, Person B may succeed or not, but he will always have at least a reasonable chance of success, and an infinitely better chance than person A.
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That's because person A is not expressing a goal, he's simply expressing a wish or a desire. If you write something down and then concentrate on it every day certain things will happen that lead you to your goal. You have to choose to act on those things, you have to be proactive, you have to be a part of the system. If you're just a dreamer you're not part of anything. And you say if we live in a simulation or in reality, a simulation would be our reality. Charles Dickens was a fan of simulation theory and he didn't even know it. His books are full of ridiculous coincidences that could never happen in anything but a simulation. And people ate it up, his books were hugely successful in the 19th century.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
Brickapotamus
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January 20th, 2024 at 9:29:41 AM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

Quote: Brickapotamus



Whether we are in a simulation or reality person A will never have a chance, Person B may succeed or not, but he will always have at least a reasonable chance of success, and an infinitely better chance than person A.
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That's because person A is not expressing a goal, he's simply expressing a wish or a desire. If you write something down and then concentrate on it every day certain things will happen that lead you to your goal. You have to choose to act on those things, you have to be proactive, you have to be a part of the system. If you're just a dreamer you're not part of anything. And you say if we live in a simulation or in reality, a simulation would be our reality. Charles Dickens was a fan of simulation theory and he didn't even know it. His books are full of ridiculous coincidences that could never happen in anything but a simulation. And people ate it up, his books were hugely successful in the 19th century.
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And thatís the whole point. Its not wishing for or desiring something, or writing it down that gets you there.

As you say itís choosing to act on those desires & being proactive. It is not necessary for any magic to happen for a proactive, goal oriented person to reach their goals, even if the goals are lofty.
EvenBob
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January 20th, 2024 at 9:38:04 AM permalink
Quote: Brickapotamus



As you say itís choosing to act on those desires & being proactive. It is not necessary for any magic to happen for a proactive, goal oriented person to reach their goals, even if the goals are lofty.
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But it's not supposed to happen, just because you have a goal and wait for things to happen that point you in that direction, and you're proactive, that's not supposed to work. If we truly live in a random universe, everything happens by accident. You shouldn't be able to make a plan and carry it out and have your plan go pretty much as you envisioned. Many many people do indeed lead lives of pure randomness because they put no effort into anything they just go with the flow. The fact that we can alter circumstances to go in the direction we want them to go points to a simulation. Some people think it points to a higher power, but that kind of talk just means they don't know what's happening and that's the simple explanation. Some of the most successful people in history all had plans and their plans worked and that's just not a coincidence.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
Brickapotamus
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January 20th, 2024 at 9:49:47 AM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

Quote: Brickapotamus



As you say itís choosing to act on those desires & being proactive. It is not necessary for any magic to happen for a proactive, goal oriented person to reach their goals, even if the goals are lofty.
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But it's not supposed to happen, just because you have a goal and wait for things to happen that point you in that direction, and you're proactive, that's not supposed to work. If we truly live in a random universe, everything happens by accident. You shouldn't be able to make a plan and carry it out and have your plan go pretty much as you envisioned. Many many people do indeed lead lives of pure randomness because they put no effort into anything they just go with the flow. The fact that we can alter circumstances to go in the direction we want them to go points to a simulation. Some people think it points to a higher power, but that kind of talk just means they don't know what's happening and that's the simple explanation. Some of the most successful people in history all had plans and their plans worked and that's just not a coincidence.
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But you are forgetting the people who did everything right & still did not obtain the success they were after.

For example, look at the losing candidates of presidential elections over the past several years. Most of these people had the goal of being president their entire lives.

They were focused, proactive, goal oriented & did what it took to get the right education, and right experience. They were strong enough candidates to win the nomination of their party a major achievement, but then lost the general election.

Survivorship bias. For every person that achieves great success, there will always be others who although they did everything right they ultimately failed due to a lack of skill, talent, or just plain bad luck.
EvenBob
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January 20th, 2024 at 10:32:38 AM permalink
Quote: Brickapotamus



But you are forgetting the people who did everything right & still did not obtain the success they were after.
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How many of those people who failed chose another goal and succeeded. How many people kept going until they found something that worked. How many successful people have said that as they went along it's almost like an outside force was putting things in their path to aid them. Success is not random, nobody is really successful by accident. It's always something they wanted and worked towards. Not everything is a guarantee, but success oriented people are very seldom failures. Look at somebody who's fabulously successful like Elon Musk. He always had plans and goals and he worked diligently to achieve them. He almost worked himself to death a couple times. He says his motto is never ever ever ever give up. The original John D Rockefeller is another example of wild success. Even as a child he knew what he wanted and went after it. One of his sisters said about him that if it was raining oatmeal when everyone else would turn their bowl over and hold it over their head for protection, John would be the one collecting oatmeal in his bowl. The point is none of this should work, because we supposedly live in a completely random universe. Your chance of success should be 50/50 no matter what your education or your intelligence and it's not. It's far far more than 50/50 if you put the power of your will into it. Pick a random graduating class of Harvard Business School and investigate how many of them were failures and how many of them were successes. The vast majority of them will succeed because that's their goal that's what they work towards. That's why an entity like Harvard Business School exists because we slowly came to realize that if we trained people in how to have the right attitude to succeed, and gave them the right tools, they would have a far greater chance. Our ability to shape our reality points to us living in a simulation and not a random universe.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
Brickapotamus
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January 20th, 2024 at 1:13:07 PM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

Quote: Brickapotamus



But you are forgetting the people who did everything right & still did not obtain the success they were after.
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How many of those people who failed chose another goal and succeeded. How many people kept going until they found something that worked. How many successful people have said that as they went along it's almost like an outside force was putting things in their path to aid them. Success is not random, nobody is really successful by accident. It's always something they wanted and worked towards. Not everything is a guarantee, but success oriented people are very seldom failures. Look at somebody who's fabulously successful like Elon Musk. He always had plans and goals and he worked diligently to achieve them. He almost worked himself to death a couple times. He says his motto is never ever ever ever give up. The original John D Rockefeller is another example of wild success. Even as a child he knew what he wanted and went after it. One of his sisters said about him that if it was raining oatmeal when everyone else would turn their bowl over and hold it over their head for protection, John would be the one collecting oatmeal in his bowl. The point is none of this should work, because we supposedly live in a completely random universe. Your chance of success should be 50/50 no matter what your education or your intelligence and it's not. It's far far more than 50/50 if you put the power of your will into it. Pick a random graduating class of Harvard Business School and investigate how many of them were failures and how many of them were successes. The vast majority of them will succeed because that's their goal that's what they work towards. That's why an entity like Harvard Business School exists because we slowly came to realize that if we trained people in how to have the right attitude to succeed, and gave them the right tools, they would have a far greater chance. Our ability to shape our reality points to us living in a simulation and not a random universe.
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Who says we are supposedly living in a completely random universe? Some things are random some are not (physical laws for example)

Picking a random graduating class of Harvard to see who will be successful is cherry picking. The graduates already had to be highly geared towards success & capable to get into Harvard and graduate.

You could cherry pick it in the opposite direction by looking at everyone who graduated from Harvard & then later died with more debts than assets
EvenBob
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January 20th, 2024 at 1:58:54 PM permalink
Quote: Brickapotamus

Quote: EvenBob

Quote: Brickapotamus



But you are forgetting the people who did everything right & still did not obtain the success they were after.
link to original post



How many of those people who failed chose another goal and succeeded. How many people kept going until they found something that worked. How many successful people have said that as they went along it's almost like an outside force was putting things in their path to aid them. Success is not random, nobody is really successful by accident. It's always something they wanted and worked towards. Not everything is a guarantee, but success oriented people are very seldom failures. Look at somebody who's fabulously successful like Elon Musk. He always had plans and goals and he worked diligently to achieve them. He almost worked himself to death a couple times. He says his motto is never ever ever ever give up. The original John D Rockefeller is another example of wild success. Even as a child he knew what he wanted and went after it. One of his sisters said about him that if it was raining oatmeal when everyone else would turn their bowl over and hold it over their head for protection, John would be the one collecting oatmeal in his bowl. The point is none of this should work, because we supposedly live in a completely random universe. Your chance of success should be 50/50 no matter what your education or your intelligence and it's not. It's far far more than 50/50 if you put the power of your will into it. Pick a random graduating class of Harvard Business School and investigate how many of them were failures and how many of them were successes. The vast majority of them will succeed because that's their goal that's what they work towards. That's why an entity like Harvard Business School exists because we slowly came to realize that if we trained people in how to have the right attitude to succeed, and gave them the right tools, they would have a far greater chance. Our ability to shape our reality points to us living in a simulation and not a random universe.
link to original post



Who says we are supposedly living in a completely random universe? Some things are random some are not (physical laws for example)

Picking a random graduating class of Harvard to see who will be successful is cherry picking. The graduates already had to be highly geared towards success & capable to get into Harvard and graduate.

You could cherry pick it in the opposite direction by looking at everyone who graduated from Harvard & then later died with more debts than assets
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The point is it's either a random universe or it isn't. It's not half random and half not random. To me it's obviously not random at all and that means there's something going on that we don't know about. A simulation explains a lot, more than anything I've ever come across. The fact that I can attract certain things into my life just by willing them into existence is pretty strange. But people talk about this all the time, even unsuccessful people are living the existence they're expecting to happen. I've been around losers before and they talk like losers think like losers and act like losers and that's what they get. So it works in both directions.

The thing about the little girl with the braces in the James Bond movie still bothers me. I saw that movie as I've said, in the theater with a friend and we talked about it. The audience laughed when she opened her mouth and exposed her braces. Where the heck did they go. If you have that video that you've had for 25 years in your collection of videotapes, she's not going to be wearing braces. This kind of thing has probably been going on forever but we've never had communication like we have now. We now have instant worldwide communication with most of the planet so we can compare notes on a scale we've never been able to do before. Parallel universes have been discussed for centuries. Parallel simulations that overlap sometimes maybe.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
Brickapotamus
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January 20th, 2024 at 3:25:50 PM permalink


Well, we may never know for certain.
EvenBob
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January 20th, 2024 at 4:09:05 PM permalink
Quote: Brickapotamus



Well, we may never know for certain.
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That isn't them. Those have been photoshopped in. The ones she had were way larger and way more obvious. She had those kind of braces you saw on kids in the 1950s huge things. Except hers were very bright and shiny just like Jaws was wearing and I think they even had a glint of sunlight come off of them with special effects. And it was so hilarious because it was an obvious reason that Jaws would be attracted to her and even the stupidest person in the audience knew that and that's why everybody laughed. When you see the movie now when she smiles it's a nothing burger, it's just an average looking little girl smiling, it has no meaning. It's really the only memorable thing from that movie and it was the first thing I thought of when I saw Moonraker referenced was the girl with the braces.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
EvenBob
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April 15th, 2024 at 10:59:22 PM permalink
Just when you think I had totally forgotten about this, I never forget about it. For example. I love buying quality China cabinets and curio cabinets from Facebook Marketplace. I've got six of them and I have room for one more and I've been looking for a month, spending at least 2 hours a day on Marketplace. You have to be patient, if you're in a hurry you're screwed. I probably found four or five that I wanted but somebody beat me to them. Day before yesterday exactly what I'm looking for is right in front of me. A solid cherry 50 year old curio cabinet with beveled glass doors. And it's a whopping $40. I send the lady a message and she lives 5 minutes from me and I bought it immediately. She lives in a condo by the airport and it's upstairs. I'm 75, I'm not really good at bringing heavy furniture downstairs by myself. Her husband shows up, mid40s, 6 ft 8 in tall. The cabinet was in two pieces, he grabs the first piece like it weighs nothing and carries it down the stairs to my van. He comes up and gets the second piece and carries it down. I'm observing all of this like it's some kind of a choreographed event that's happening to somebody else. I patiently wait for a month and the simulation places this right in front of me. Exactly what I'm looking for, in my neighborhood, it's $40, and there's a human giant to do all the work. I get get home and even though it's super heavy because it's solid cherry I get it up the stairs on the deck without ever having to lift it and start to finish from the time I left the house to go get it till I'm done took 90 minutes. She tells me she paid $400 for it 30 years ago, these things are going for 1,500 to $2,000 today.

We create our own reality in the simulation. This kind of thing has happened to me way too many times for it to be a coincidence. I remember coming across a book in the 1960s that was written in the 1920s that talked about how you can get anything you want if you're persistent, steadfast, and patient. And you work toward it everyday. What the author was saying a hundred years ago hasn't changed, they're just calling it the simulation now. They're just calling it creating your own reality now.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
heatmap
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April 16th, 2024 at 4:42:40 AM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

Just when you think I had totally forgotten about this, I never forget about it. For example. I love buying quality China cabinets and curio cabinets from Facebook Marketplace. I've got six of them and I have room for one more and I've been looking for a month, spending at least 2 hours a day on Marketplace. You have to be patient, if you're in a hurry you're screwed. I probably found four or five that I wanted but somebody beat me to them. Day before yesterday exactly what I'm looking for is right in front of me. A solid cherry 50 year old curio cabinet with beveled glass doors. And it's a whopping $40. I send the lady a message and she lives 5 minutes from me and I bought it immediately. She lives in a condo by the airport and it's upstairs. I'm 75, I'm not really good at bringing heavy furniture downstairs by myself. Her husband shows up, mid40s, 6 ft 8 in tall. The cabinet was in two pieces, he grabs the first piece like it weighs nothing and carries it down the stairs to my van. He comes up and gets the second piece and carries it down. I'm observing all of this like it's some kind of a choreographed event that's happening to somebody else. I patiently wait for a month and the simulation places this right in front of me. Exactly what I'm looking for, in my neighborhood, it's $40, and there's a human giant to do all the work. I get get home and even though it's super heavy because it's solid cherry I get it up the stairs on the deck without ever having to lift it and start to finish from the time I left the house to go get it till I'm done took 90 minutes. She tells me she paid $400 for it 30 years ago, these things are going for 1,500 to $2,000 today.

We create our own reality in the simulation. This kind of thing has happened to me way too many times for it to be a coincidence. I remember coming across a book in the 1960s that was written in the 1920s that talked about how you can get anything you want if you're persistent, steadfast, and patient. And you work toward it everyday. What the author was saying a hundred years ago hasn't changed, they're just calling it the simulation now. They're just calling it creating your own reality now.
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We are just a bunch Ö a bunch of electricity that did not have a ground to exit into that turned into different types of waves. When a wave can not travel forward it curls or bunches into an atom.

I have no clue what Iím talking about but this thought for some reason fills my mind when I think about the simulation theory. Simulations do not have to be ďvirtualĒ and can be physical.

Thank you for letting me waste your time with my garbled trash of a sentence.
rxwine
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April 16th, 2024 at 4:54:00 AM permalink
Quote: heatmap



We are just a bunch Ö a bunch of electricity that did not have a ground to exit into that turned into different types of waves. When a wave can not travel forward it curls or bunches into an atom.

I have no clue what Iím talking about but this thought for some reason fills my mind when I think about the simulation theory. Simulations do not have to be ďvirtualĒ and can be physical.

Thank you for letting me waste your time with my garbled trash of a sentence.
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What I'm interested in, is if we are in a simulation, within a simulation, within a simulation, within a simulation, where the last simulation is producing the first simulation, so it's a circular simulation. (I almost said circle jerk)
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EvenBob
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April 16th, 2024 at 6:41:17 AM permalink
Quote: rxwine

Quote: heatmap



We are just a bunch Ö a bunch of electricity that did not have a ground to exit into that turned into different types of waves. When a wave can not travel forward it curls or bunches into an atom.

I have no clue what Iím talking about but this thought for some reason fills my mind when I think about the simulation theory. Simulations do not have to be ďvirtualĒ and can be physical.

Thank you for letting me waste your time with my garbled trash of a sentence.
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What I'm interested in, is if we are in a simulation, within a simulation, within a simulation, within a simulation, where the last simulation is producing the first simulation, so it's a circular simulation. (I almost said circle jerk)
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If you overthink it, it ruins it. All theories about the nature of reality are best thought about as little as possible. Just accept it and pretend you understand.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
DRich
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April 16th, 2024 at 1:17:11 PM permalink
Quote: EvenBob



If you overthink it, it ruins it. All theories about the nature of reality are best thought about as little as possible. Just accept it and pretend you understand.



My thought is just accept that until we know everything, we know nothing. There could be something out there that proves everything we believe to be incorrect.
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EvenBob
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April 17th, 2024 at 11:17:09 AM permalink
Quote: DRich

Quote: EvenBob



If you overthink it, it ruins it. All theories about the nature of reality are best thought about as little as possible. Just accept it and pretend you understand.



My thought is just accept that until we know everything, we know nothing. There could be something out there that proves everything we believe to be incorrect.
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I like the Occam's Razor approach, the most obvious answer is probably the correct one. The simplest answer with the least amount of explanation is probably right. And the obvious answer is we live in a simulation. Before the internet this was pretty easy to hide but now that we can see so many things in real time from everywhere around the world, it's becoming much more obvious. There are just too many details to go into. But the more you look into it the more obvious it becomes.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
TigerWu
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April 17th, 2024 at 1:54:36 PM permalink
Quote: EvenBob


I like the Occam's Razor approach, the most obvious answer is probably the correct one. The simplest answer with the least amount of explanation is probably right. And the obvious answer is we live in a simulation.
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How on earth is "we live in a simulation" the simplest answer with the least amount of explanation? A simulation would be exponentially more complicated than a natural universe.
EvenBob
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April 17th, 2024 at 2:38:04 PM permalink
Quote: TigerWu

Quote: EvenBob


I like the Occam's Razor approach, the most obvious answer is probably the correct one. The simplest answer with the least amount of explanation is probably right. And the obvious answer is we live in a simulation.
link to original post



How on earth is "we live in a simulation" the simplest answer with the least amount of explanation? A simulation would be exponentially more complicated than a natural universe.
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How so. A natural universe would be the absolutely most complicated because all you've got is questions. The second most complicated would be organized religion. And the least complicated is a simulation.
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TigerWu
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April 17th, 2024 at 2:58:52 PM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

How so. A natural universe would be the absolutely most complicated because all you've got is questions. The second most complicated would be organized religion. And the least complicated is a simulation.
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You have FEWER questions with a simulated universe than a natural universe? How is that even possible? Because now you have all the questions involved relating to the simulation, PLUS all the questions regarding the universe that the simulation is in. And who knows how many layers there are, so that adds even MORE questions... it is EXPONENTIALLY more complicated. It's not even up for debate.
EvenBob
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April 17th, 2024 at 4:45:39 PM permalink
"humans only understand 5% of the universe, while the remaining 95% is still a mystery. This includes new particles and forces that are currently invisible to us."

All we have about the natural universe is questions with no answers except for 5% and half of those are probably wrong. With a simulation what's there to understand. No matter what we do to try and understand it whoever's running it will prevent that. Kind of like what's going on now. The more we think we understand the more we find that we don't really understand hardly anything.

Here's something nobody ever thinks about. At any given time 33% of the people in the world are asleep. Why is that, why do we need to sleep anyway. It's almost like the simulation can't handle everybody being awake all at once so it sends us into Dreamland whether we like it or not. Rob somebody of sleep and his entire universe changes, why is that.
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EvenBob
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April 19th, 2024 at 8:15:03 AM permalink
One of Einstein's theories that he proposed in 1915 and we have pretty much taken as fact is that the universe is expanding and will expand so much that one day it will burn itself out. Nope nope nope, new proof has come forward that the 95% of the universe that we cannot see, dark matter and dark energy, is in fact not getting weaker it's getting stronger making the expansion of the universe unlimited. This is just the simulation showing us that no matter how much we discover there's always going to be far far more to discover that we don't understand. It would have to be this way for the simulation to make any sense. It's like a video game that never runs out of new adventures or new doors to open. The more you open the more there is to open.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
EvenBob
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April 23rd, 2024 at 11:10:32 PM permalink
Elon Musk on the simulation.

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/etiWMfewLPQ

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/M8hnA3qJzFM
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April 24th, 2024 at 5:45:55 AM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

One of Einstein's theories that he proposed in 1915 and we have pretty much taken as fact is that the universe is expanding and will expand so much that one day it will burn itself out. Nope nope nope, new proof has come forward that the 95% of the universe that we cannot see, dark matter and dark energy, is in fact not getting weaker it's getting stronger making the expansion of the universe unlimited. This is just the simulation showing us that no matter how much we discover there's always going to be far far more to discover that we don't understand. It would have to be this way for the simulation to make any sense. It's like a video game that never runs out of new adventures or new doors to open. The more you open the more there is to open.
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It will depend on gravity vs energy. We know the universe cannot be stagnant as gravity is either pulling it to collapse or energy is still forcing it apart. We have reason to believe the later today. But as expansion slows gravity takes over. It then collapses on itself.

$#%@ the lawn then......
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EvenBob
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April 24th, 2024 at 7:00:01 AM permalink
Quote: AZDuffman



$#%@ the lawn then......
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Not yet, I'm replacing all four tires on my 12-year-old John Deere. Two of them are leaking air and there's no way to fix them, fix a flat doesn't even work.
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unJon
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April 24th, 2024 at 10:14:42 AM permalink
Posted without comment:

https://www.port.ac.uk/news-events-and-blogs/news/could-a-new-law-of-physics-support-the-idea-were-living-in-a-computer-simulation

Quote:

A University of Portsmouth physicist has explored whether a new law of physics could support the much-debated theory that we are simply characters in an advanced virtual world.

The race is not always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong; but that is the way to bet.
TigerWu
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April 24th, 2024 at 12:31:42 PM permalink
Imagine if you "died" and then you just "wake up" to realize you're a highly advanced alien playing a VR game about being a human.
EvenBob
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April 24th, 2024 at 1:18:23 PM permalink
Quote: TigerWu

Imagine if you "died" and then you just "wake up" to realize you're a highly advanced alien playing a VR game about being a human.
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They throw the term base reality around a lot. Is this the base reality that we live in. The number that I keep coming across is that among the smartest people there's only a 50/50 chance that we live in the base reality. In other words there are other realities besides ours and we are not the original. Which means we're a simulation. A very complicated intricate simulation.

I've said this before, it has bothered me for a long time that nobody seems very concerned about people they were close to that are dead now. Nobody seems concerned about what happened to them. It's as if we instinctively know they are just fine, no need to worry. They are just no longer part of this simulation.
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April 24th, 2024 at 2:16:57 PM permalink
Let me re-state the major WTF? issues facing physicists:

1. "The Wilkinson Microwave Anisotropy Probe (WMAP) spacecraft seven-year analysis estimated a universe made up of 72.8% dark energy, 22.7% dark matter, and 4.5% ordinary matter"

Physicists don't know what dark matter is, they just see that dark matter must exist otherwise galaxies would be flying apart.

Physicists don't know what dark energy is, they just see that this energy must exist to explain why the universe is expanding (rather than contracting.)

Physicists do know what ordinary matter is. We're all over that 4.5% of the universe.

2. The Hubble Tension. There are two completely different methods physicists use to measure the expansion of the universe and during the last 20 years they have been shown to disagree. The James Webb Space Telescope has been used to study this issue since it was placed into orbit and it has recently been announced that it has confirmed one of the value of one of the measurement methods and tightened the error bars on that value by >5x Scientists have continued to check and expand the other measurement method (using the background microwave radiation from the original big bang) and the two methods continue to disagree by at least 8 standard deviations. Almost every physicist in the world is trying to imagine some underlying explanation as to why one (or both) of the measurements are wrong or as to why this discrepancy exists.

So cosmological science is an incredibly mature field, but right now it is a hot mess.

The "Do We LIve in a Simulation?" question is regarded as little more than a whimsical thought exercise, except that it raises a question that really has not occurred to most scientists until now: Why does our universe have some ultimate speed beyond which nothing can exceed? The speed of light (in a vacuum), c, is an ultimate limit (even if a space ship traveling at 99% of the speed of light emits light in the forward direction the photons only travel at 100% of the speed of light), but why does such a bounding condition exist, and why does c have the value it has? No theory predicts this.

It is tempting to believe that there is something fundamental about the universe that we have completely missed.
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unJon
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April 24th, 2024 at 3:03:56 PM permalink
Quote: gordonm888

Let me re-state the major WTF? issues facing physicists:

1. "The Wilkinson Microwave Anisotropy Probe (WMAP) spacecraft seven-year analysis estimated a universe made up of 72.8% dark energy, 22.7% dark matter, and 4.5% ordinary matter"

Physicists don't know what dark matter is, they just see that dark matter must exist otherwise galaxies would be flying apart.

Physicists don't know what dark energy is, they just see that this energy must exist to explain why the universe is expanding (rather than contracting.)

Physicists do know what ordinary matter is. We're all over that 4.5% of the universe.

2. The Hubble Tension. There are two completely different methods physicists use to measure the expansion of the universe and during the last 20 years they have been shown to disagree. The James Webb Space Telescope has been used to study this issue since it was placed into orbit and it has recently been announced that it has confirmed one of the value of one of the measurement methods and tightened the error bars on that value by >5x Scientists have continued to check and expand the other measurement method (using the background microwave radiation from the original big bang) and the two methods continue to disagree by at least 8 standard deviations. Almost every physicist in the world is trying to imagine some underlying explanation as to why one (or both) of the measurements are wrong or as to why this discrepancy exists.

So cosmological science is an incredibly mature field, but right now it is a hot mess.

The "Do We LIve in a Simulation?" question is regarded as little more than a whimsical thought exercise, except that it raises a question that really has not occurred to most scientists until now: Why does our universe have some ultimate speed beyond which nothing can exceed? The speed of light (in a vacuum), c, is an ultimate limit (even if a space ship traveling at 99% of the speed of light emits light in the forward direction the photons only travel at 100% of the speed of light), but why does such a bounding condition exist, and why does c have the value it has? No theory predicts this.

It is tempting to believe that there is something fundamental about the universe that we have completely missed.
link to original post



Good list. I would add:

1) Harmonizing gravity with the other forces
2) Baryon asymmetry: where is all the antimatter
3) cosmological constant problem: theory calculates it crazy bigger than we observe
4) Hierarchy problem: why is gravity so weak?
5) Muon G2 anomaly
6) How does something come from nothing?

Many others that Iím missing.
The race is not always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong; but that is the way to bet.
EvenBob
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April 24th, 2024 at 5:24:54 PM permalink
Something that comes up a lot in discussions about a simulation are NPCs. None player characters. Some think that if this is a simulation we are all NPCs. Others think that there are main characters here and the rest are NPCs. I tend to agree with that hypothesis. There seem to be players who are major characters and many many who are almost not even here. They never have an original thought, their opinion is whatever they hear on cable news, they never accomplish anything, they never really think about anything, they just kind of go with the flow and disappear eventually. We've all known people who we think are a waste of space, their job seems to be taking up room. They are like the people we see in TV commercials, they don't really exist except on the TV. You have to wonder if you are an NPC. I would guess that if you're thinking about it and aware of it you probably are not.

When I first heard about simulation theory five or six years ago I thought it was a bunch of junk, I thought it was laughable. But the more I read about it the more credibility it has. And then there's this. Me to my wife, remember the movie Moonraker and the character Jaws, great big guy? My wife says yes. I asked her what does she remember about Jaws little girlfriend with the pigtails. My wife immediately says her funny metal braces just like Jaws had.

I just can't let that go, it's too freaking weird.
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EvenBob
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April 25th, 2024 at 11:20:35 AM permalink
A Scientist Says He Has the Evidence That We Live in a Simulation

https://www.popularmechanics.com/science/environment/a60553384/covid-simulation/

This is an article published in Popular Mechanics this week.

ďA super complex universe like ours, if it were a simulation, would require a built-in data optimization and compression in order to reduce the computational power and the data storage requirements to run the simulation, This is exactly what we are observing all around us, including in digital data, biological systems, mathematical symmetries and the entire universe.Ē
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TigerWu
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April 25th, 2024 at 1:49:02 PM permalink
Great, so we live in Tron without the sexy, skintight, light-up bodysuits.

gordonm888
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April 26th, 2024 at 8:27:01 AM permalink
Quote: unJon


Good list. I would add:

1) Harmonizing gravity with the other forces
2) Baryon asymmetry: where is all the antimatter
3) cosmological constant problem: theory calculates it crazy bigger than we observe
4) Hierarchy problem: why is gravity so weak?
5) Muon G2 anomaly
6) How does something come from nothing?

Many others that Iím missing.
link to original post



I was not familiar with the Muon G-2 anomaly. Another unexplainable mystery. Very interesting, thanks for mentioning it.
So many better men, a few of them friends, are dead. And a thousand thousand slimy things live on, and so do I.
EvenBob
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May 11th, 2024 at 5:27:10 PM permalink
My wife is a jigsaw puzzle nut, and there are thousands of them. There are even worldwide jigsaw puzzle tournaments were thousands of people enter and hundreds of people are chosen to see who can put puzzles together the fastest for big prizes. My local library has a jigsaw puzzle section of donated puzzles and they have so many you can go in and just take one as long as once in awhile you'll bring one back for as a swap. I found a really nice Gone With the Wind puzzle and I opened it and it was a handwritten note inside that said does it had a piece missing. Nobody who puts together these puzzles likes to have a piece missing but it was such a nice one that I got it anyway and I didn't tell my wife about the missing piece just to see what she would do.

She put it together this week and sent me a picture of it and holy crap, there's no missing piece. I told her about it and she said she's never seen that before that if there's a note there's always a piece missing and sometimes more than one. For me, this is another example of the simulation. For somebody in one of our alternate simulations this puzzle had a missing piece just like in another simulation Jaws girlfriend had braces. Everywhere I turn I'm seeing evidence of a simulation. Maybe it's just confirmation bias, but it sure doesn't feel that way. Like in all the research they're doing on reincarnation when they're proving beyond a doubt that thousands of these young kids who claim to have memories of a past life actually do have memories of people who recently died. For me this means the simulation is putting them back in the game as a new character and for some reason some of them have memories of their most recent character. It's certainly makes more sense than any of the stuff I've read about how most religions work. The closest one would be Hinduism which is the oldest religion in the world and they claim that everything we experience is an illusion, it's not real. That comes about as close as saying it's a simulation as you can get.

This is the completed puzzle, no missing piece.

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EvenBob
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May 19th, 2024 at 11:32:53 PM permalink
This just screams we live in a simulation to me. The genius who wrote this in his head, they call this the most magnificent organ piece ever written. And the genius of the organist, almost all the time her left and right hand and her left and right foot are doing totally different things. The amount of training that goes into this has to be mind boggling. I can barely operate a knife and fork at the same time. People who've seen this done in person say it brings down the house every time. Imagine the first time Bach played this in public.

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May 20th, 2024 at 12:26:05 AM permalink
rawtuff
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May 20th, 2024 at 1:14:18 AM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

This just screams we live in a simulation to me. The genius who wrote this in his head, they call this the most magnificent organ piece ever written. And the genius of the organist, almost all the time her left and right hand and her left and right foot are doing totally different things. The amount of training that goes into this has to be mind boggling. I can barely operate a knife and fork at the same time. People who've seen this done in person say it brings down the house every time. Imagine the first time Bach played this in public.


link to original post



That is how most classic musical instruments operate in general like piano, guitar or violin - the left and right hand of the performer are doing totally different things.

The simulation hypothesis is not that different from classical theism, almost the same thing except the divine origin of everything is replaced by a superior technology origin of everything. Potato potato.
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gordonm888
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May 20th, 2024 at 7:41:11 AM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

This just screams we live in a simulation to me. The genius who wrote this in his head, they call this the most magnificent organ piece ever written. And the genius of the organist, almost all the time her left and right hand and her left and right foot are doing totally different things. The amount of training that goes into this has to be mind boggling. I can barely operate a knife and fork at the same time. People who've seen this done in person say it brings down the house every time. Imagine the first time Bach played this in public.


link to original post



Omigod, what an organ! What an instrument.

Only cheap thing about this is the necktie that looks like a keyboard on one of the assistants.
So many better men, a few of them friends, are dead. And a thousand thousand slimy things live on, and so do I.
TigerWu
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May 20th, 2024 at 7:46:59 AM permalink
Quote: EvenBob



This is the completed puzzle, no missing piece.

link to original post



LOL C'mon.... There are number of completely plausible explanations for this, and the solution you arrive at is "it's a simulation?"

Like, the person lost the piece, put the note in the box, but then found the piece at the last minute and just didn't take out the note...

Or they thought the piece was lost, and it was just under the box or something else, so they wrote a note saying it was missing but then when they took the puzzle apart to put it back in the box they unwittingly "found" the lost piece and put back in, too....

Or someone else in the house took out one piece as a prank and never told the person, and then put it back after the person was done with the puzzle....

Or someone wrote the note itself as a prank for the next person....

There is nothing mysterious or supernatural about this.
rainman
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May 20th, 2024 at 8:19:02 AM permalink
Simulation Theory at 39:32. Double slit debunked is before Sim theory.
This whole Episode is informative and entertaining.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOTQLpmyf5w
DWizard7
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May 20th, 2024 at 8:52:22 AM permalink
Time is an illusion that only affects the first three dimensions, according to the most agreed upon physics model, and higher dimensions are not subject to it or causality. That means any intelligent entity residing in a higher dimension could conceivably have control over time and space. So it depends on your definition of "simulation" since, from any higher dimensions' perspective, it's like "hey, look at these dumb 3D being that have sequential time and causality and can't travel faster than light. Wow, talk about living with unusual restrictions, huh?"
lilredrooster
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May 20th, 2024 at 10:05:49 AM permalink
.
if you think we're living in a simulation and that you yourself may be part of that simulation then try this:

stick a knife into your arm - not far enough to cause an injury or cause bleeding but just enough so that you can feel some pain

and then, while you are doing that try to convince yourself that the pain is not real - that it's just a simulation

and see if the pain disappears

Good Luck



humans are very proud beings
they like to think they know a lot
they don't like to admit that there is great deal that they don't know about the universe and its goings on
so they speculate
they speculate that we live in a simulation
they speculate that there is a God or Supreme Being
these speculations only have value to those who believe them
they have no value for those that don't believe them

.
Last edited by: lilredrooster on May 20, 2024
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EvenBob
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May 20th, 2024 at 11:07:28 AM permalink
Quote: gordonm888

Quote: EvenBob

This just screams we live in a simulation to me. The genius who wrote this in his head, they call this the most magnificent organ piece ever written. And the genius of the organist, almost all the time her left and right hand and her left and right foot are doing totally different things. The amount of training that goes into this has to be mind boggling. I can barely operate a knife and fork at the same time. People who've seen this done in person say it brings down the house every time. Imagine the first time Bach played this in public.


link to original post



Omigod, what an organ! What an instrument.

Only cheap thing about this is the necktie that looks like a keyboard on one of the assistants.
link to original post



Bach would certainly be impressed, they had nothing like this when he was alive. He was actually more well known as the best organist in Europe at the time then he was for his compositions. He played them in public but it took a hundred years after he died before he became really well known for his music.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
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