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Dieter
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February 6th, 2022 at 5:37:20 AM permalink
Quote: darkoz

Quote: Dieter

Quote: darkoz

The really cool feature of this lower Gamma play-field is that it's time based. Remember those Elektra units? Those start counting down and as long as you have some units still left you cannot lose you ball. The ball will be ejected back onto the play-field.
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Does the ball get kicked back to the main playfield or does it stay in the Gamma basement?

All these adventures make me wish my travels crossed paths with some much cooler tables than the usual 87% functional movie themed examples with missing balls and a malfunctioning upper left flipper.
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The lower play-field is AFTER you lose your ball in the main game. Think of it as a bonus round if you have earned it.

So no it doesn't get kicked back onto the main play-field and in fact isn't even the same ball. Physically it's an extra ball laying inert in the enclosed lower play-field while you play your active game above with a different ball.
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OK, so after the end of the main round, IF you have enough Elektra points, a Gamma bonus round begins with a trapped ball on the separate auxiliary playfield.

Terminology is hard.
May the cards fall in your favor.
darkoz
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February 6th, 2022 at 5:51:52 AM permalink
Quote: Dieter

Quote: darkoz

Quote: Dieter

Quote: darkoz

The really cool feature of this lower Gamma play-field is that it's time based. Remember those Elektra units? Those start counting down and as long as you have some units still left you cannot lose you ball. The ball will be ejected back onto the play-field.
link to original post



Does the ball get kicked back to the main playfield or does it stay in the Gamma basement?

All these adventures make me wish my travels crossed paths with some much cooler tables than the usual 87% functional movie themed examples with missing balls and a malfunctioning upper left flipper.
link to original post



The lower play-field is AFTER you lose your ball in the main game. Think of it as a bonus round if you have earned it.

So no it doesn't get kicked back onto the main play-field and in fact isn't even the same ball. Physically it's an extra ball laying inert in the enclosed lower play-field while you play your active game above with a different ball.
link to original post



OK, so after the end of the main round, IF you have enough Elektra points, a Gamma bonus round begins with a trapped ball on the separate auxiliary playfield.

Terminology is hard.
link to original post



Yes, correct
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darkoz
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February 6th, 2022 at 5:58:53 AM permalink
Quote: LoquaciousMoFW

Quote: darkoz

Here is my other acquisition.

Elektra. From 1973.[snip]
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Elecktra debut date is December 1981, according to Internet Pinball Database: https://www.ipdb.org/search.pl?any=electra&search=Search+Database&searchtype=quick#778
Which aligns with my personal recollection that digital (VFD) scoring didn't arrive in appreciable numbers until the late 1970s.
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Yes, I stand corrected.

I should have double checked but I have been under the impression it was from 1973 for so long it seemed like a known fact in my head, like checking for the date of Pearl Harbor would feel stupid

I would fix the original post but my editing privilege is expired.

Good catch.

Now if I can only figure out why I thought it was 1973 all these years
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darkoz
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February 8th, 2022 at 12:01:00 PM permalink
Trip report continued

Thursday, day six.

Nothing of note really happened. I passengered while my driver friend kept us on schedule to arrive in South Carolina to check out the next machine. Since we arrived sort of late, we checked into a motel and would make checking on the pinball our first stop the next morning.

I was hoping to purchase a Hyperball. I had already owned one and wrote it up in a separate thread before creating this overall pinball thread.

The Hyperball had turned into a "used car lemon" experience. It only worked for two weeks. In my original post I pointed out there was some disagreement over calling it a true pinball machine and had a poll asking for forum members opinions.

Well, none of my regular pinball repair contacts wanted to touch it! The inner workings are so different from the norm none felt confident in repairing it. So perhaps we can settle that argument. It looks like a pinball machine on the outside but on the inside it ain't a pinball machine.

I finally convinced one guy to give it the old team spirit go and after paying a number of hours for his services wound up with a machine still unplayable.

I finally sold it on the cheap for parts. Hyperball in particular uses such rare parts that inoperable machines still retain some value.

I was looking to replace the one I previously had. It was a fun game and I barely had a chance to play it. Upon hearing about my attempt to replace my Hyperball, My regular pinball repairman stated I appear to be a glutton for punishment.

At any rate to make this pinball thread complete, the rest of this post is a repeat of my Hyperball OP.

Quote: darkoz

I just got my newest addition to my collection.

HyperBall. The pinball machine that's not a pinball machine. At least it's generated this argument which is still ongoing.

I will let you guys decide.

It was Williams 100th game release so they decided to go high concept.



GAME CABINET

The game cabinet is certainly a pinball machine.





However there are distinct differences.

Firstly there are no flippers and no flipper buttons on the sides. In fact there are no traditional obstacles or ramps, bumpers dropsdowns, chutes etc. The play field is one great expanse of flatness





What you do have are two gun grips on the corners.



The gun grips control the ball cannon and allow you to shoot directionally left right or center. They work in tandem unlike traditional flippers where each side is independent so technically you could play single handed however double handed allows for quicker shooting once you get into alternate AC DC style trigger pulling. It feels easier to aim double handed as well as the angle of movement isn't comfortable with just one hand. The ease of letting one hand cooperate with the other in aiming the gun seemed intuitive.

It's really hard to see as it's under a plastic shield but here is the gun. Notice the balls above in a loaded position





MULTI-BALL

Just about all pinball machines in the last couple decades have a MULTI-BALL feature. Two seems a bit low, most have three balls in play at once and a few have four.

HyperBall has fifty-five balls in play!

At all times so technically the entire game play is MULTI-BALL mode. The cannon shoots them out as fast as you can depress the trigger Gatling gun style and an Augur invisible in the backboard raises the balls back into a trough as a reloading mechanism.

Here are a few pix in succession as the trough is reloading








GAMEPLAY

Pretty much all pinball is easy and intuitive to understand. A ball is rolling down a ramp while you try to keep it on the ramp by repelling it with flippers.

Targets on the playfield offer challenges(shoot ramp when lit, etc) but an unskilled player can just (and usually just) ignores them as they fight gravity.

HyperBall isn't intuitive and I have read of players unimpressed at first. But once you understand the dynamics it's quite addictive and manic. Hyper!

Obviously keeping balls in play against gravity is NOT the objective. You don't even "lose a ball" since every ball is collected and recycled.

The game has a defensive and an offensive strategy. You can ignore the offense if you wish but you must master the defense or your game will be over quickly. It's the defense that is not intuitive but also which makes the game unique and exciting.

So let's start with the easier to understand offense.



OFFENSE PLAY:

The otherwise barren playfield has targets with corresponding letters. These targets are twenty three in total representing each letter of the alphabet (three letters are not represented-Q, X, and Z)

The targets are arranged in banks or "batteries" of three or four each arranged up the right, left sides and the back top of the game.

Here are the targets so you get an idea

The left side, first battery (bank of four, A, B, C, D)



Left side, second battery (bank of three, E, F, G)



Center left, third battery (bank of three, H, I, J)
Center, fourth battery (bank of three K, L, M)
Center right, fifth battery (bank of three N, O, P)



Right side, sixth battery (bank of three, R, S, T)



Right side, seventh battery (bank of four, U, V, W, Y)




Note the three center batteries are much easier targets while the right and left are harder. The two lower batteries are extreme angles to the gun cannon and the two mid-batteries have difficult tunnels to aim through.

I know I said the offense is intuitive and it may not seem like it yet but just hang on. It is. I just had to explain the layout first.

In the center of the playfield is a digital readout which gives you challenges. Read the challenge and perform it.

It's as simple as that.

Here is an example:



Hit the letter T. Earn 14,000 points.

Here is another.





Spell the word H-Y-P-E-R and yes in that order and get 90000 points.

One more





Note the letter in "A" in Alien looks slightly darker. The letter flashing tells you where in the spelling you have achieved so far


Obviously there are no words with the missing Q, X or Z letters.

As I said the offense is pretty intuitive. Technically not too difficult.

The challenge is even paying attention to your offense while dealing with defense. You must pay attention to defense or your game will be maddeningly quick.

Defense not being intuitive will take some explaining so here goes.

DEFENSIVE STRATEGY

Okay, you got the layout of the targets. Beginning randomly from either side light bolts run up the targets one by one.

For example starting on the left, A target, B target, C target, etc. If you can strike the target as the light is progressing up through the alphabet to stop it from progressing further. (Or if it's starting on the right side moving backwards through the alphabet.

Remember those three batteries of center targets that are much easier to hit? Well if the light bolts reach those then they "walk" or progress across until they randomly decide to start coming towards your defensive position on the playfield.

Your position which you are defending is this.



Your energy center is your life or "man". Five light strikes and you lose your life. You have three lives per game.

If this is difficult to understand here is a light strike in motion from the center targets trying to reach my energy center.

Each picture shows the lights progression.

Note the light is progressing from the letter O.

EDIT: (The third pic it's coming from the letter N. This game is fast and it wasn't easy catching the action but the light always comes down straight from the initiating letter)







If you haven't already stopped the light from traveling to the center batteries you must stop them from making it to your energy by shooting the corresponding target.

If you lose control and feel overwhelmed you also have a limited option backup which I left out until now.

Although there are no side buttons for flippers there is a single "Bomb" button in the center between the gun grips.



Anyone familiar with the game "Defender" will understand this button. You have three bombs and they clear all enemies on the playfield at once. It's a nice ex machina but limited to three uses.

The game has levels so after a bit of manic fighting you get a breather (I'm certain it's to allow the ball auger time to catch up too as gameplay resumes once the balls have all been reloaded. Or to allow the auger to cool. It apparently has a fan that is keeping it from overheating which unfortunately makes this game, combined with balls clacking and augers reloading notorious for a very loud game. And that's without all the games actual bells and digital sounds).

Similar to games like Galaga, every fourth level or so you have a "reflex" round where you try to amass points by hitting lit targets and don't have to worry about losing a life.

CONCLUSION

Well, there you have it.

This game is so fast I couldn't even get proper pictures of the balls in play. They just shoot so fast across the screen my camera phone kept coming up near invisible blurs for balls.

But it's really exciting once you get the high concept and I can see this taking months to truly master.

Lucky for me it's set to free play.

HyperBall!

Pinball or not pinball?
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darkoz
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February 26th, 2022 at 4:34:04 PM permalink
Trip report continued:

Thursday, day six (part two)

After not purchasing the Hyperball in South Carolina we trucked up to a location in Virginia. Again the driving was running smoothly now.

It was already evening when we hit our Destination. The eBay seller was a bit nervous about handing out his home address to a stranger so we agreed to meet in the parking lot of a Wendy's.

There we did a transaction for $2,000 cash in return for a pinball machine. Probably if a cop had observed us he would have assumed this was some illicit drug deal going down.

I got to play the pinball machine right in the Wendy parking lot. That's because it doesn't use electricity. It's purely mechanical moving parts.

It may sound like a toy but it's a Whiffle. Whiffle is the very first modern pinball machine (prior to that pinballs were called bagatelles and were more like pool hall games, where you got balls to make your targets and paid the shopkeeper for each game).

Whiffle came out in 1931 so I literally picked up a piece of history 90 years old. There are only five known Whiffles in existence and I now own one of them and supposedly the one in best condition. The seller told me he was desperate for the cash. He has previously sold this same game and brought it back but now had to part with it again.

At any rate the Whiffle is simple. Ten balls - 9 white and one red - red ball counts for double points - you shoot the plunger and hope the ball lands in a pocket with points transcribed on the play-field. Once all balls are gone, you add up your score manually.

It's primitive for today but Whiffle was a massive success when it premiered. So successful that the creators went bankrupt. (No joke). It was the middle of the great depression and they couldn't manufacture the machines fast enough. They ended up with back orders six months behind.

Well, stores don't want to hear the latest fad isn't arriving for six months. Another innovative game designer created a similar game with just enough changes to escape patent protection and because he already had manufacturing in place, he came out with Ballyhoo, to compete with Whiffle. Able to make orders within weeks, he put the Whiffle people out of business.

This innovative company that put the Whiffle guys out of business (with a game called BALLYhoo) naturally was called Bally's and eventually, after becoming a pinball powerhouse, they would go onto the casino market.

At any rate, Whiffle had a bunch of firsts that we still have today in pinball. Enclosed glass so the balls are never touched, a slanted play-field, a plunger, and a coin-op so proprietors didn't have to monitor the game.

WHIFFLE

First you have to insert a nickel.



After you push in the nickel, that releases the balls through slats in the holes. Pull the nickel toggle back out to close the slats.



Turn the crank on the side until a pinball is loaded.





Then pull the plunger and shoot.

There are no Flippers. You just hope the ball bounces off the pins so it lands in the best scoring holes.

Flippers would be added a few years later to avoid issues with anti-gambling laws that claimed pinball was just a game of chance. It took New York forty years of flippers history to be convinced. Go figure.





This game wasn't called pinball when it came out. You can see the game is basically balls striking nails or pins to bounce off, so people who couldn't remember the name Whiffle would just say, "hey you played that new game with the pins and balls" and it eventually became known as the pinball game.
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Johnzimbo
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February 26th, 2022 at 5:14:39 PM permalink
Have to assume no tilt mechanism on that thing right?
darkoz
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February 26th, 2022 at 9:22:34 PM permalink
Quote: Johnzimbo

Have to assume no tilt mechanism on that thing right?
link to original post



Correct.

In fact the term tilting did originate with that game.

When the balls got.lodged between certain pins the only remedy was to "tilt" the game to loosen the ball.

I have had to do it a number of times during my own use of the game. Look at the last photo in the post and you will see an example of a lodged ball that needs tilting.

But no penalty for doing so!
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Dieter
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February 27th, 2022 at 5:47:14 AM permalink
Simply beautiful.
It looks like the 200 point pocket is a real trick.
May the cards fall in your favor.
ChumpChange
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February 27th, 2022 at 3:17:01 PM permalink
I got invited to a pinball tournament to pay a $10 entry fee plus coin drop and the top 2 of my scores would be counted. I don't know what the prize was but it could have been a pinball machine since it was the launch of the Rush pinball machine. I just got a foot of snow so I didn't bother going, plus it's a 100 minute drive that is probably beyond my endurance level this week. I haven't played pinball at an establishment since 2007, so I can't be sure my beginner's luck would kick in. I usually like to have a month of play on a machine before a tournament, but that has been impossible for me.
Last edited by: ChumpChange on Feb 27, 2022
billryan
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February 27th, 2022 at 4:56:29 PM permalink
I'd think a competent carpenter could whip up a custom version of wiffle without much issue.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
darkoz
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February 27th, 2022 at 5:26:49 PM permalink
Quote: billryan

I'd think a competent carpenter could whip up a custom version of wiffle without much issue.
link to original post



If you are suggesting it's easy to make a fraudulent replica, the machine has a serial number and is on record at a number of pinball databases that keep these. Hence how I know only five exist.

I'm certain there are ways to authenticate these things.

Of course, I could have purchased a fake. It's happened before in the history of antiques but the dollar value of a Whiffle isn't such that I see someone being motivated. The cost of the carpenter would probably be close to what I paid for it.
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billryan
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February 27th, 2022 at 6:44:26 PM permalink
I'm suggesting it would be easy to make a replica of it, one that you could play without fear of damage and that you could customize however you want,
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
darkoz
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February 27th, 2022 at 7:17:59 PM permalink
Quote: billryan

I'm suggesting it would be easy to make a replica of it, one that you could play without fear of damage and that you could customize however you want,
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There is actually a whole market for replica pinballs.

Usually they are of popular games on today's market. Attack from Mars is a good example.

They are passed off as replica models. They are usually in much better condition and don't cost as much although not necessarily. It depends on whether modern upgrades are added to make them special.

Medieval Madness replica machines can be more than the original
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darkoz
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March 9th, 2022 at 12:14:02 PM permalink
Trip report continued:

Friday day seven

I now had all the pinball stops completed and only three machines but that was fine. The point of the trip was to inspect potential purchases for possible lemons and I had definitely avoided at least one or two.

We were now only nine hours of driving from my home although with stops for food, gas, toilet, probably about eleven hours.

Last thing I wanted was to arrive exhausted from a long drive and still have to unload the pinballs, reassemble the legs and since I didn't know how many machines I was returning with, moving furniture to accommodate the best configuration. (I used to have a dedicated game room but then my family enlarged and suddenly the game room became a children's room).

So the plan was to drive to Pennsylvania which would leave only two hours to drive the next day. Pennsylvania made sense because that's where my daughter and grandkids live so I planned a family visit.

But with the extra cash on me from only picking up three machines, I suddenly felt "family sick" as opposed to home sick and at the last minute set up a family meet and stay vacation.

So I rented three rooms at Great Wolf Lodge. These aren't cheap rooms. Over $600 per night but they sleep up to eight people and I had a bunch of kids through family extension to accommodate.

If you are unfamiliar with the chain of Great Wolf Lodge they are basically a kids themed hotel paradise with locations across the country. They all have children's themed rooms with bunk beds, water park (admission included so the $600 per night price makes sense) along with all types of kids activities from treasure hunts through the halls of the hotel ("magic wands" that electronically activate icons and statuary) and of course all types of shows with animals and men dressed as animals (bears mostly) and ice cream and candy shops.

Here are a few images from Google.





I arrived first and checked in. By late evening I was with my entire extended family.

I also checked my driver into a different location. She felt uncomfortable as she didn't know anyone from my family and this part of the trip seemed more personal. She also had two kids of her own at home and I think seeing large groups of kids running and laughing was making her "family sick" as well.

I admit there was a bit of an ulterior motive behind this detour to Great Wolf Lodge in Pennsylvania. It's ten minutes from Mount Airy Casino. So naturally, that evening and the next day, while the kids were enjoying the park, my various family members all went and picked up casino cards.

I wasn't currently hitting Mount Airy but hey you never know. And since I was paying for this entire vacation at Great Wolf Lodge, my adult family members understood the "payment" or reimbursement was to head over to Mount Airy and join up for cards.

A small price to pay for an all expenses paid vacation.

To be continued
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ChumpChange
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April 28th, 2022 at 8:29:35 AM permalink
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darkoz
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May 7th, 2022 at 9:22:52 AM permalink
Trip report continued:

Sunday day nine and finish

(For my fan, Bill Ryan)

I left off checking into Great Wolf Lodge for a family get together after spending a week traveling from Mississippi to Texas back to Mississippi and up the East Coast collecting pinballs. I was now just two hours away in the Poconos of Pennsylvania.

I skipped giving a Saturday day eight report. It was just family adventure. The only thing to mention is they have gone 100% cashless. You need a credit card for everything and I mean everything. Soda vending in the hotel, buying dinner at the restaurant, paying for candy at the snacks etc.

This seemed extremely weird because this is a place for kids to roam on their own and not need direct supervision (kids seven and up scream up and down the halls). Having them required to get daddy to make a purchase seemed to defeat the purpose.

However I discovered the charges could be made from the wristbands. Basically everyone including kids gets a wristband which is required for entry to the water park included in the price of the room. Not only that but these wristbands actually are the room keys so kids running around don't have to knock to get in (make sure you aren't doing hanky panky while the kids are out). They just swipe the wristbands same as you would any electronic key. And these same wristbands can be used for cashless purchases billed of course to your room. This gives the kids excitement at being able to make purchases without asking like an adult (you give them an "allowance" at the front desk with a purchase limitation so your kids don't stick you with a crazy bill at the end.)

We had a great time and come Sunday morning we all packed into the cars and took off. I joined up with my driver and she and I went in the Uhaul onto my place in New York.

I arranged for two of my bigger crew members to meet me there so I could unload the games. This was also a moving job. I didn't know the final configuration of my furniture because I didn't know how many machines I was going to be returning with. So we had to rearrange the furniture based on three machines returning and then bring in the games, reattach the legs, insert the glass, etc.

When it was finally finished we turned on the games. They looked beautiful and the red Fireball classic matched well with my retro red refrigerator and microwave which was a happy unplanned accident.

But when we hit the start button, neither game worked. We sat there stunned. I tried to figure out why. They were both set to freeplay and should have started up no problems. It would be my luck to travel for a week to avoid lemons and wind up with two lemons anyway (the third machine, if you remember didn't use electricity, the Whiffle and that worked fine).

I didn't want to blow up in anger and defeat so I suggested we go out to lunch as we had put a bunch of work in moving furniture and were hungry. I would ruminate on what I was missing that neither machine worked. It was too much coincidence that both didn't turn on. What was I forgetting?

Well, I had one of those damn I am an idiot moments when I went to lock my door as we left. I felt the pinballs in my pocket.

"Hold on guys, I figured out what's wrong."

Those pinball machines have ball sensors and won't start if no balls are in the loading troughs. Of course you always remove the pinballs in transit. They are loose heavy metal objects that can do serious damage over every pothole. You have to put them back in the machine for the game to start.

And I knew that! I didn't just figure it out. It had just escaped my memory. What we refer to as a brainfart.

So I unlocked the front doors of the games, pulled down the glasstops, inserted the balls, closed everything back up and viola, we were in business.

All the movers and my driver wanted to play the game and then we finally headed back out to lunch.

For me the trip had finally concluded but there was one more thing to take care of. I had to return the Uhaul to the location about ten minutes away and then put my driver from Mississippi back on a flight home.

I booked her a hotel for the evening and a flight for the next afternoon. That gave her some time to drive around and collect casino cards for me (always one to maximize my multicarding).

Yes, my driver had spent a week behind the wheel twelve hours a day but don't fret for my driver. She had a full days rest while I was with the family in Great Wolf Lodge and she needed the extra money from collecting Player cards for me because I considered that a separate aspect of the trip.

Monday morning she picked me up, gave me the cards, and we returned the Uhaul. I called a Lyft to take her to JFK, paid her for all her good work and said goodbye as she got into the Lyft.

I didn't think she needed me to escort her to the airport and we hugged goodbye but then some Spidey sense said I should take that extra time to make certain she made her flight. It just seemed like a job unfinished so just as the Lyft was leaving I stopped it and hopped in

And a good thing too!

I said the letter of the terminal for her flight from JFK and the driver said JFK didn't have letters. They have numbers. Letters were for LaGuardia!

So I double checked the flight booking and he was right. She was booked out of LaGuardia. And we were much closer to JFK than LaGuardia.

I still don't know how I got confused but because I had booked the night before (not knowing what day we would be finished with the trip) I remember having to cycle through the choices due to limited seating so somehow they must have given me an alternate flight out of LaGuardia.

The driver said he could still get us to the airport on time. I was skeptical as it was all the way crosstown.
I hoped the flight would be delayed but the website said it was on time. The driver made it on time and without crazy driving either (none of that typical Hollywood cab driver madness)

But the line was huge and the flight was leaving on time and she missed her flight anyway. They were gracious though and booked her on a later flight at no charge. I saw to the ID check-in and was off.

Of course her new flight was delayed. Isn't that the way life goes? She ended up missing her connection, the last for the evening and ended up staying away from home another night. But since this was the airlines fault they placed her for the evening in a hotel.

And that pretty much wraps up my pinball cross country adventure.
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camapl
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May 7th, 2022 at 10:14:08 AM permalink
Those pesky balls! Itís funny what the body gets used toÖ You forgetting that weight in your pocket during all the furniture moving reminds me of when someone is looking for their readers or shades which are propped on their head or hanging around their neck! Glad you figured it out and quickly. What a sinking feeling it must have been until you did though! Thanks for the recounting; the pinball machines are really cool, and the Great Wolf Lodge seems like a cool place for the grandkids and the biggest kid of all, me! Do adults get the bracelets, too? lol
Itís a dog eat dog world. ÖOr maybe itís the other way around!
darkoz
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May 7th, 2022 at 12:05:30 PM permalink
Quote: camapl

Those pesky balls! Itís funny what the body gets used toÖ You forgetting that weight in your pocket during all the furniture moving reminds me of when someone is looking for their readers or shades which are propped on their head or hanging around their neck! Glad you figured it out and quickly. What a sinking feeling it must have been until you did though! Thanks for the recounting; the pinball machines are really cool, and the Great Wolf Lodge seems like a cool place for the grandkids and the biggest kid of all, me! Do adults get the bracelets, too? lol
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Yes everyone gets bracelets.

I don't have a wallet so my keys and cards are all in my pocket and cash too so it's not unusual for me to have weighted down pockets
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100xOdds
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June 20th, 2022 at 5:23:48 AM permalink


Dark,
i saw this and thought of you
Craps is paradise (Pair of dice). Lets hear it for the SpeedCount Mathletes :)
darkoz
darkoz 
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June 20th, 2022 at 6:59:27 AM permalink
Quote: 100xOdds



Dark,
i saw this and thought of you
link to original post



Thanks.

It's tempting in one way but it just seems so wrong in another way.

I don't think I would ever get one of those. I'm too old fashioned.

For perspective, while I have a nice home theater, I also maintain an old fashioned super 8mm film setup as well. I just appreciate that visceral feeling of the old ways too much.

A video representation of pinball is practically heresy.
For Whom the bus tolls; The bus tolls for thee
ThatDonGuy
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June 20th, 2022 at 7:15:24 AM permalink
I could live with a "virtual pinball" table, but without the arcade games - those should have their own cabinet. Besides, there's only one joystick; how do you play Crazy Climber or Robotron 2084?
ChumpChange
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June 20th, 2022 at 10:51:03 AM permalink
I think I'd get busy getting high scores on 1107 classic pinball games, but is it a free game state or an add-a-ball state?

Not sure this guy knows how to play this game. Gorgar (MOD) by NitroNimbus 1.0.0 - YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vj0cF_lzaWs

Compare to the real machine. 1979 Williams GORGAR pinball machine - YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ctiLQQTP4tY
ThatDonGuy
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June 20th, 2022 at 10:57:58 AM permalink
Quote: ChumpChange

I think I'd get busy getting high scores on 1107 classic pinball games, but is it a free game state or an add-a-ball state?
link to original post


I wouldn't be surprised if there not only there were some of each, but two versions of the same table, usually under different names (Doodle Bug / Love Bug, Miss-O / Cue-T, Sing Along / Melody)
ChumpChange
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June 20th, 2022 at 11:14:39 AM permalink
I've played the free ball versions of each of those pairs of machines. I wasn't out of state much to play many free game versions of machines in the 1970's.
I hit over 800,000 on Love Bug, once in 1972 and again in 1978, only got 80,000 in 1974.
There's the regular places I played where the machines were changed out every few months, then there were the places I visited and I only had one afternoon to beat the machines. There's also the times the machine was removed from the premises by the vending company in the middle of my game.
ThatDonGuy
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June 20th, 2022 at 4:16:43 PM permalink
Quote: ChumpChange

I've played the free ball versions of each of those pairs of machines. I wasn't out of state much to play many free game versions of machines in the 1970's.


New York?
darkoz
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April 18th, 2023 at 1:58:58 PM permalink
Now that my place is repaired I have been going about acquiring new machines. A lot of stuff on my to get list popped up but once two very rare machines appeared I ran to aquire. One I flew all the way to San Francisco for (I used a free airfare to Vegas to cover most of the trip and then visited a college buddy so not so crazy.

Second machine I traveled 7 hours to upstate NY to collect.

I thought before discussion of the actual machines I would discuss how in pinball collecting rare machines are cheap and plentiful machines are expensive. It's the complete opposite of most collectibles.

The reason why has to do with how they get manufactured.

Once they have finished all the design and artwork and production of models they distribute a small number of them for trials. The initial working units. After they get back initial sales if they fall short they don't produce any extra. Instead they move onto the next title.

But more than that they recall the poorly performing games and usually do conversions. That's possible because they create a "series" or "system" which has interchangeable parts, chips, cabinets etc.(for example a Gottlieb System 80 means any game produced under this umbrella of specs by the pinball company Gottlieb. You don't need to find an identical title for parts. Just another Gottlieb System 80) So it's just an issue of swapping out the play field and redoing the artwork.

For example one of the rare games I just purchased had 900+ known units produced but only 500+ known to still survive due to the rest being recalled gutted and reshopped as the next game developed.

Meanwhile, the most popular pinball machine ever had over 20,000+ units produced (Addams Family) and while there are so many units to be found it's also a wildly popular game people are willing to spend good money on.

Finally there's the modern day requirements of servicing the games. These have out of date parts not manufactured anymore so old machines are needed for parts. Well if you have a choice of saving a rare but unpopular game that doesn't sell well or a hugely popular game with many units you are going to pick the latter and gut the rarer unpopular unit to service the popular one.

And so the rare games get rarer and remain cheap generally.

Of course there are a few exceptions (Safe Cracker is one offhand and Pinball Circus with only two units in existence is probably priceless).

Next post I will discuss one of my new machines. It's a real Winner.

And that's a direct hint as to what it is.
For Whom the bus tolls; The bus tolls for thee
ChumpChange
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April 18th, 2023 at 2:25:44 PM permalink
I wasn't hyped over William's Winner from 1972, but I got addicted to William's Post Time from 1969 because backflipping for extra balls was the thing back then. I just watched a YT video of someone playing Post Time before he got rid of it. He said it was "brutal" with excessive ball drains. Since I hadn't seen it since 1972 or so, I'll have to agree with him.

My high score on William's Winner (1972) was 122,210 on July 18, 1974 at the local Hispanic Center.
My high score on Post Time (1969) was 18,010 on April 10, 1971 (the machine was taken out quickly) and 93,400 on Feb. 8, 1973 with the backflipping for the extra balls when the lanes are lit when the the last button on the race track is lit. This was around the time that machines were transitioning from 10 cents a game to 25 cents for 2 games. Getting 10 cents from pennies on the floor was easier than coming up with a quarter.

If DarkOz travelled 7 hours to upstate NYS to pick up Winner, there's a remote chance it's the same machine I played way back when. I'd say it's one of the rarer machines and it was not seen hardly anywhere back in the day. If he picked it up cheap, I don't doubt it. Pinball prices have been all over the place lately, so unpopular machines get sold cheap. New machines were around $900 back then and by the end of the 1970's, the used ones could probably be bought from the vendor for $100-$400. They were usually very used machines though. I don't know how to get new machines except by winning them at a tournament.
Last edited by: ChumpChange on Apr 18, 2023
darkoz
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April 18th, 2023 at 2:42:01 PM permalink
Quote: ChumpChange

I wasn't hyped over William's Winner from 1972, but I got addicted to William's Post Time from 1969 because backflipping for extra balls was the thing back then..
link to original post



Damn my hint was so obvious LoL
For Whom the bus tolls; The bus tolls for thee
belteshazar
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May 8th, 2023 at 7:11:44 PM permalink
Attack from mars was a classic. I saw it at multiple places growing up.
My favorite pinball machine was always the Addam's Family.
Too bad classic pinball machines cost like $5000
ChumpChange
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May 8th, 2023 at 10:08:54 PM permalink
I went to an arcade this weekend and I could only play 10 games or so. I went home with $4 in tokens for the next time, out of a $10 bill. I tried to sync my phone up to the Stern pinball website and couldn't figure it out. There was a leaderboard in the arcade showing nicknames and scores and I wanted to get on that board. But I need to search YouTube to find out how it is done.
I got 855 million on Game of Thrones, and I really don't know what I'm doing on these games. I just keep flipping like crazy until the wrist pain and leg pain set in hard.
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