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11 votes (78.57%)
2 votes (14.28%)
1 vote (7.14%)
1 vote (7.14%)

14 members have voted

onenickelmiracle
onenickelmiracle
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September 2nd, 2016 at 1:12:27 AM permalink
We had this argument 3 years ago btw. I clearly remember me and axiom arguing about this.
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odiousgambit
odiousgambit
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September 2nd, 2016 at 3:33:25 AM permalink
Quote: beachbumbabs

I heard that late-merging thing, too, and I'd have to see the study to believe it. It appears that the clods running to the head past those already formed in the merge is the reason the thru lane is slow/stopped. Logic says to me, that if they weren't impeding the bottleneck, there wouldn't be one, just a single line of cars (assuming 2 lanes merging to 1) going the construction speed limit. So, counterintuitive is the politest way of putting it.

I could be wrong. Which is why I'd like to see the study.



There is a phenomenon you are missing. For some reason, the line can move slow as molasses, but at the point where the line reaches the real merge, unpredictably perhaps, it often opens up at an accessible point right past the merge. The cars accelerate, and due to the nature of acceleration, holes open up that 'the clods' can easily slip into, having no effect whatsoever to the rest of the line.

When I lived in the DC area I would often try to take advantage of this. It was a gamble, the merge are might *not* offer these 'holes', in that case I became a clod or maybe took my lumps and moved on. But not until that moment; I didn't consider myself a clod if I could slip in. If I ran into the merge problem regularly, I needed to find out exactly what would be going on, it tended to always be the same.

There was one such rush hour merge I learned could be slipped into without fail. Since it was so reliable, I had to wonder why I saw so few take advantage. The only thing I could figure was it was a matter of etiquette. The regular commuters did not consider it polite? I dunno.
the next time Dame Fortune toys with your heart, your soul and your wallet, raise your glass and praise her thus: “Thanks for nothing, you cold-hearted, evil, damnable, nefarious, low-life, malicious monster from Hell!” She is, after all, stone deaf. ... Arnold Snyder
RS
RS
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September 2nd, 2016 at 4:33:22 AM permalink
If you're one of those a-holes that takes the shoulder to beat everyone in a merge....I will make sure you do not have a fun time doing it. Yeah there might be a gap between the car in front of me and my car....there's a reason for that, I'm not gonna tail gate someone (without reason). You slip in front of me, I gotta slow down -- the car that's trying to beat the merge and slip in behind me is then gonna hit me.
Joeshlabotnik
Joeshlabotnik
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September 2nd, 2016 at 4:41:33 AM permalink
Quote: RS

If you're one of those a-holes that takes the shoulder to beat everyone in a merge....I will make sure you do not have a fun time doing it. Yeah there might be a gap between the car in front of me and my car....there's a reason for that, I'm not gonna tail gate someone (without reason). You slip in front of me, I gotta slow down -- the car that's trying to beat the merge and slip in behind me is then gonna hit me.



Ah. So you'll create a collision (or risk creating one, at least) because of that other guy's behavior. Yep, that'll show him! If you wreck both cars, you'll have the opportunity to give him a good tongue-lashing while you wait for the tow trucks. It's important to show all those other drivers that you WON'T BE PUSHED AROUND!!!!! TESTOSTERONE!!!!!!!

I wonder if we might have fewer traffic accidents if it weren't for those signs on the freeway that say "Protect Manhood, Next 20 Miles." They're invisible to me, but they must exist--how else would you explain Joe Accountant turning into the Hulk when he's behind the wheel?
beachbumbabs
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beachbumbabs
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September 2nd, 2016 at 7:10:19 AM permalink
Quote: Joeshlabotnik

Quote: RS

If you're one of those a-holes that takes the shoulder to beat everyone in a merge....I will make sure you do not have a fun time doing it. Yeah there might be a gap between the car in front of me and my car....there's a reason for that, I'm not gonna tail gate someone (without reason). You slip in front of me, I gotta slow down -- the car that's trying to beat the merge and slip in behind me is then gonna hit me.



Ah. So you'll create a collision (or risk creating one, at least) because of that other guy's behavior. Yep, that'll show him! If you wreck both cars, you'll have the opportunity to give him a good tongue-lashing while you wait for the tow trucks. It's important to show all those other drivers that you WON'T BE PUSHED AROUND!!!!! TESTOSTERONE!!!!!!!

I wonder if we might have fewer traffic accidents if it weren't for those signs on the freeway that say "Protect Manhood, Next 20 Miles." They're invisible to me, but they must exist--how else would you explain Joe Accountant turning into the Hulk when he's behind the wheel?



IMO, the one creating the hazard is the line-jumper. Why is it the guy in line's fault when the merger, who does not have the right of way, pushes his nose in ahead of your bumper? If it's an equal merge, fine, but if you watched him come past 50 cars in the rear view, just to push in ahead of you, unless he's an emergency vehicle, he has no rights at all if you do. It's aggravating and rude.
Last edited by: beachbumbabs on Sep 2, 2016
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MathExtremist
MathExtremist
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September 2nd, 2016 at 7:15:14 AM permalink
Here's some (counterintuitive) work on late-merging:

http://arstechnica.com/cars/2014/07/the-beauty-of-zipper-merging-or-why-you-should-drive-ruder/

http://ops.fhwa.dot.gov/publications/fhwahop12012/sec2.htm

http://trafficwaves.org/seatraf.html
"In my own case, when it seemed to me after a long illness that death was close at hand, I found no little solace in playing constantly at dice." -- Girolamo Cardano, 1563
odiousgambit
odiousgambit
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September 2nd, 2016 at 7:20:42 AM permalink
Quote: RS

If you're one of those a-holes that takes the shoulder to beat everyone in a merge



just to be clear, not what I was doing, not the shoulder .... no
the next time Dame Fortune toys with your heart, your soul and your wallet, raise your glass and praise her thus: “Thanks for nothing, you cold-hearted, evil, damnable, nefarious, low-life, malicious monster from Hell!” She is, after all, stone deaf. ... Arnold Snyder
MathExtremist
MathExtremist
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September 2nd, 2016 at 7:22:31 AM permalink
Quote: beachbumbabs

IMO, the one creating the hazard is the line-jumper. Why is it the guy in line's fault when the merger, who does not have the right if way, pushes his nose in ahead of your bumper? If it's an equal merge, fine, but if you watched him come past 50 cars in the rear view, just to push in ahead of you, unless he's an emergency vehicle, he has no rights at all if you do. It's aggravating and rude.

That may be true if you're at the merge point, but the highway is no place for you to lose control of your temper. And if you've got 1000 feet of empty highway in front of you because you decided to stop, put on your blinker, and merge into the bumper-to-bumper traffic, that's not the fault of the guy behind you, that's all you. Everyone behind you has to slam on their brakes and *that's* what causes accidents. Don't do this:

Do this instead:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/how-to-zip-through-summertime-road-construction-1.1340869
"In my own case, when it seemed to me after a long illness that death was close at hand, I found no little solace in playing constantly at dice." -- Girolamo Cardano, 1563
RogerKint
RogerKint
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September 2nd, 2016 at 7:24:47 AM permalink
Quote: Joeshlabotnik

They're invisible to me, but they must exist--how else would you explain Joe Accountant turning into the Hulk when he's behind the wheel?



...or a computer/cell phone.
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tringlomane
tringlomane
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September 2nd, 2016 at 7:27:02 AM permalink
Quote: MathExtremist

Here's some (counterintuitive) work on late-merging:



Missouri has also promoted this, but not very heavily. I tend to merge early and let one car zip in. I try to be patient and polite.

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