Movie 21 myth question

I just watched 21 and something struck me as ridiculous.

After a pretty big night, Kevin Spacey says they have to cash in their chips real fast before they're switched by the casino to keep from paying out their large win.

They then go to this elaborate scheme of having the local strippers cash in the chips for them.

Aside from not trusting my chips with a bunch of the local strip club girls, the whole changing of chips seems ridiculous.

If the casino thought they had been cheated, would they wait for the chips to be cashed in? And if they simply changed chips, voiding all the ones in play, what about the other players at the casino.

I mean, I recently left with $50 buck worth of chips in my back pocket. Two weeks later I went back to play. I would have been pissed if I was told they were no good anymore. That doesn't even sound legal.

So, was that a huge crock of Hollywood Bull. My logic tells me so.

Thanks.

Your logic is right. Casinos do change their chips sometimes, but I believe Gaming regulations state that they have to put an announcement in the newspaper at least so many days (probably 60-120) in advance when they plan to discontinue a chip. When I tried to cash in some discontinued $1,000 chips at the Red Rock main cashier, they refused to take them, saying that I wasn't a big enough player to warrant having them. So I easily passed them off in the sports book.

Casinos may refuse, or even confiscate, their current chips for a variety of reasons. This includes not being a patron of the casino or suspicion of trying to evade CTR regulations.

I remember reading an interview with one of the leaders of the MIT counting team the whole book and movie was based on. He said that the book (and then movie) took some 'creative liberties' to make the story more sexy. Like using strippers to cash out chips. He laughed off the idea of using strippers to move chips as foolish

Spaking of myths involving chips, is there any truth to the chip-changing scam?

I think I saw it on CSI. Anyway, a man stands outside the casino with a stack of fake chips and asks a psser-by to please cash them for him. Naturally he gives some sort of excuse, maybe the casino banned him, maybe he wants to cash them in small batches to avoid taxes, something like that. He will then ask the mark to leave him some good faith money, say a hundred bucks or so. In some versions the con is holding only, say, $500 worth of chips and asks for an outright street-side exchange.

Either way the mark is out some money and the con runs away the minute the mark is out of sight.

Nareed -

I think I heard that story on one of those Travel Channel "Vegas Do's and Don'ts"

As I remember it, the con is in the airport waiting for his homeward flight to board. He discovers some chips in his pocket, and approaches people getting off a flight that had just arrived, and sells the chips for as little as 25% of 'face value'.

Casinos can and often will wonder how you are cashing chips there if you've not gambled there. They will simply offer you an opportunity to make a statement and then give you a receipt for the chips. You then have to take your dispute further. Supposedly their concern would be related to evading the currency reporting requirements.

I believe casinos do have a second set of chips already on hand to switch out in case of a major robbery or something but usually lots of notice will be given before chip sets are retired.

I've seen people buy just regular white chips from a craps dealer as they passed by as a momento. Always seemed strange to me. You want a momento get a book of matches or a pen or a paper clip or something, but bet the darned chip or cash it in.

As for strippers or hookers cashing chips, thats absurd. Pure Hollywood for sure! You give chips to a hooker, you ain't gonna get them back!

Quote: DJTeddyBear

Nareed -

I think I heard that story on one of those Travel Channel "Vegas Do's and Don'ts"

As I remember it, the con is in the airport waiting for his homeward flight to board. He discovers some chips in his pocket, and approaches people getting off a flight that had just arrived, and sells the chips for as little as 25% of 'face value'.

Now that sounds more credible than the scenarios I posed.

But not credible enough,given how close the airport is to most casinos.

Quote: FleaStiff

I've seen people buy just regular white chips from a craps dealer as they passed by as a momento. Always seemed strange to me. You want a momento get a book of matches or a pen or a paper clip or something, but bet the darned chip or cash it in.

Now I feel stupid. Before the Stardust and Frontier closed I purchased 100 $1 chips at each place. I'm also a sucker for $8 Chinese New Year chips.

Regarding not honoring chips from non-players, they do have signs saying the chips are only for gaming and not transferable, so I think they can get away with that. However, I can tell you that high stakes poker and sports bettors use them as currency with each other all the time. My advice if you ever are refused at the cashier, make a bet in the sports book, and ask for the change in cash. You can always bet a game both ways if you don't want to have any risk.

Still, it seems strange that they can refuse to honor their own chips. The chips are proof someone purchased them from their casino and should be honored for what they are worth.

Suppose I found some chips. I could certainly play them at the tables. Why not be able to cash them in?

Quote: darkoz

Still, it seems strange that they can refuse to honor their own chips. The chips are proof someone purchased them from their casino and should be honored for what they are worth.

Suppose I found some chips. I could certainly play them at the tables. Why not be able to cash them in?

To play the devil's advocate, I think the casinos would say they are not a bank, and have to abide by anti-money laundering laws.

what kind of money makes the cashier potentially balk at cashing chips?

I'm thinking a few hundred passes the smell test...

Quote: odiousgambit

what kind of money makes the cashier potentially balk at cashing chips?

I'm thinking a few hundred passes the smell test...

Naturally, the nicer the casino, the more they will take without asking any questions. At a certain point, they will ask to see a player card, to verify you were playing. If you don't produce one, then they will ask what game you were playing, and call the pit to verify. The question is, at what point do they request a player card. At the nicest properties, I think it is at about $2,000. At the worst, about $200.

Quote: FleaStiff

I've seen people buy just regular white chips from a craps dealer as they passed by as a momento. Always seemed strange to me. You want a momento get a book of matches or a pen or a paper clip or something, but bet the darned chip or cash it in.

I like to keep my players' cards and one $1 chip from all of the casinos that I played in. Pens run out of ink. Paper clips get lost. Books of matches get used.

Quote: darkoz

I just watched 21 and something struck me as ridiculous.

After a pretty big night, Kevin Spacey says they have to cash in their chips real fast before they're switched by the casino to keep from paying out their large win.

They then go to this elaborate scheme of having the local strippers cash in the chips for them.

Aside from not trusting my chips with a bunch of the local strip club girls, the whole changing of chips seems ridiculous.

If the casino thought they had been cheated, would they wait for the chips to be cashed in? And if they simply changed chips, voiding all the ones in play, what about the other players at the casino.

I mean, I recently left with $50 buck worth of chips in my back pocket. Two weeks later I went back to play. I would have been pissed if I was told they were no good anymore. That doesn't even sound legal.

So, was that a huge crock of Hollywood Bull. My logic tells me so.

Thanks.

OK, some "real vs Hollywood" is in order:

The strippers were not used, that was Hollywood. When interviewed a team member said, "We didn't have strippers change chips and we didn't keep them in the drop-ceiling to our dorms. We were at MIT for crying out loud." So that is a movie.

However, there were chips called in during thew MIT Team's play. It was at the MGM when there was a riot after Mike Tyson bit Hollyfield's ear. The whole casino had to be cllosed and as high-value chips were compromised they were called in. I forget what happened but I think the team members showed a history of play and thus got them paid for.

Another case of chips being called in was in the book "Supercasino" at Luxor. They had somehting like 10 $1,000 chips stolen, so they changed them out to another style chip they used. When people came to cash them in they were caught. In that case I think they were mostly just 86ed from the place since there was no proof of theft and it would not have been worth it for the casino to show they never played there as it is hard to prove a negative if you can at all.

More CSI myths:

In yesterday's re-run ep, a group of people find a lot, say almost all, the chips from an extinct, bankrupt, casino: the Hux casino (fictional, of course, with Mr. Hux being a thinly veiled version of a Mr. Heffner).

The story is the chips were sent out to be destroyed after the casino closed. Fine. But the chips had some metal inlays and were too hard on the shredding mahcines. So instead of shredding them, they were buried at the grounds of a chip-making company. A group of people including a derelict and the owner of a small restaurant find the mother lode.

Murder ensues, this being CSI after all. But the interesting part of the myth is this: the state gaming commision anounces it will redeem any extant chips at face value.

Now, this seems ridiculous to me. After all chips are issued by casinos, not by the gaming commision. therefore only the casinos would be liable as regards chips. If a casino went broke, the chips in posession of players would be a matter for the bankruptcy court to adjudicate, as I undesrtand the law (so would be any slot tickets and sports book tickets). The casino's owners might still be liable for said chips, depending on lots of factors. But the Nevada gaming comission? I just don't buy it.

Quote: FleaStiff

Casinos can and often will wonder how you are cashing chips there if you've not gambled there. They will simply offer you an opportunity to make a statement and then give you a receipt for the chips. You then have to take your dispute further. Supposedly their concern would be related to evading the currency reporting requirements.

I believe casinos do have a second set of chips already on hand to switch out in case of a major robbery or something but usually lots of notice will be given before chip sets are retired.

I've seen people buy just regular white chips from a craps dealer as they passed by as a momento. Always seemed strange to me. You want a momento get a book of matches or a pen or a paper clip or something, but bet the darned chip or cash it in.

As for strippers or hookers cashing chips, thats absurd. Pure Hollywood for sure! You give chips to a hooker, you ain't gonna get them back!

What are you talking about? If you cash a chip they aren't going to know whether or not you've gambled there.

Quote: playpianoking

What are you talking about? If you cash a chip they aren't going to know whether or not you've gambled there.

They will if you present a player card that you used when you played.

Quote: boymimbo

Quote: FleaStiff

I've seen people buy just regular white chips from a craps dealer as they passed by as a momento. Always seemed strange to me. You want a momento get a book of matches or a pen or a paper clip or something, but bet the darned chip or cash it in.

I like to keep my players' cards and one $1 chip from all of the casinos that I played in. Pens run out of ink. Paper clips get lost. Books of matches get used.

Ditto.

My wife gets pissed every time she sees my stack of souvenir chips.

And I tend to be a sucker for commemorative $5 chips!


It's a trick the casinos have learned from the post office.

Actually there seems to be a market of some sort for chips from defunct casinos. Collectors for everything somewhere.
I'd rather just gamble that one dollar chip and if I win, my memories will come from winning not from hording.

There are hundreds of people who collect antique casino chips. Once a year there is a pretty big convention of casino collectables, mostly chips, at the Riviera. I have a small collection myself. Here is a picture picture of some of my best chips.



Collecting the new editions is for suckers, including me. As a rule of thumb, I'd say a chip has to be at least 25 years old to be worth more than face value. When I did my review of the Four Queens, a guy at the cashier next to me was cashing in hundreds of novelty Four Queens chips, saying he couldn't get more than face value on eBay for them, so was giving up.