Strip Story
The things I had a problem with:
1. Broken escalator's on the overpass. I think some of the same escalators were broken last year, and haven't been fixed. I strongly recommend that Las Vegas allocate some of its tax dollars to remedy this. Especially ones with cones and tape that force all the strip pedestrian traffic into a single file.
2. Tourists out walking the strip at 2 am with their 6 year old kids! I was stunned at how much of this I saw.
Quote: EvenBobEspecially watch the video of Batman getting creamed.
The tourist clearly forgot he was part of street theater, He took an accidental hit too seriously.
Quote: EvenBobIs The Strip Turning Into Tijuana?
No, but Tijuana's last mayor really wanted to turn it into the Strip ....
http://www.sandiegoreader.com/weblogs/news-ticker/2011/jul/18/ex-tijuana-mayor-jorge-hank-rhon-tied-to-149-gambl/
Quote: PapaChubby
Tourists out walking the strip at 2 am with their 6 year old kids! I was stunned at how much of this I saw.
If you are visiting from Europe or Asia, 2am in Vegas is actually not so bad in your "local" time. And even if they were domestic, it may actually be better to tote the kids around when it is a "reasonable" 103F instead of the 110F in the daytime.
Quote: From the article:Somehow and very quickly, not only are costumed characters multiplying, but people peddling bottles of water and in some cases, beer are popping up everywhere, homeless people are hanging out on pedestrian bridges, card slappers are still soliciting customers for nearly naked women and folks are selling trinkets of all sorts, sometimes forcing pedestrians onto the roadway.
"Recently"? I haven't been to Vegas in two years, but this describes my last trip quite well (especially the bottled water peddlers; I got the impression that they tend to congregate around the escalators to the elevated walkways).
Quote: heatherNo, but Tijuana's last mayor really wanted to turn it into the Strip ....
Jorge Hank Rhon
What a thief.
If the Strip dies some day, they can turn it back into public property.
You know you won't see anything on Disney property that Disney doesn't want there. And if you do, the Mouse will go rough em up.
Quote: PapaChubbyThe guys selling water are sometimes a welcome sight.
There was also a story on people selling bottles that vendors had possibly filled themselves.
That's because Disney property isn't public property. From the point you hit the highway exit ramp, a couple miles before your final destination, you're on private property.Quote: rxwineYou know you won't see anything on Disney property that Disney doesn't want there.
Did you know you can't stay at Disney World hotels for more than 180 days in a year? Disney won't allow it, because if they did, such guests would become residents - with voting rights. Can't have that in a corporate town.
Disney World has almost no problem with chewing gum clean-up. Why? Because there is no store in that 47 square mile area that sells gum. That's one way a corporation can fix a problem in the corporate town.
None of that would work on the strip. Not only are the sidewalks and streets public property, they aren'y even in an established city!
Quote: benbakdoffHas anyone noticed the increase in 3 Card Monte and it's cousin the 3 Shell Game which uses bottle caps and a pea?.
I've seen that twice here, I'm pretty sure with cards both times. In Germany I saw it with three matchboxes and a little ball, about the size of a pea, in one of them.
Busking is highly profitable although often fiercely competitive. The band Kelly Family that ended up buying one of the major state owned homes in Germany started out performing when their RV was broken into and their money stolen. They made so much that day as performers that their father announced to the family that instead of just having made "gas money" they had just embarked on a new career.Quote: pacomartinIn London they license the street performers and give them instructions on how to collect gratuities. The result is you will see some of the most talented performers in your life working the streets. I think that most people are pleased.
Musicians, comics, ... whatever. The money on the street is often great.
Quote: DJTeddyBearNone of that would work on the strip. Not only are the sidewalks and streets public property, they aren'y even in an established city!
Well, that's my point too. The ACLU they're complaining about in the article isn't at fault. If people want the sidewalks to function like private property, convert them into private property. Stop trying to make public property function like private property.
About three-card monte, doesn't everyone over the age of ten know it's a scam?
Have Clark county deed to the association title / control to the sidewalks and curtilage between the casinos and the roadway itself: keep the roadway public, but privatize the sidewalks and surrounding areas.
Actually, I suspect the casinos may already "own" the land the sidewalks are on, but it is subject to an easement to allow sidewalks.
Anyway, once they own the sidewalks, it would seem to be a simple thing to police them, and to enforce whatever policies are agreed upon.
Screw the ACLU!
They are essentially advertising. The ACLU and whichever court
allowed them are crazy.
If the strip sidewalk was clogged with people advertising replace-
ment windows, used cars, etc, etc, wouldn't that be banned ?
Here's a quote from the article referenced in this chain:
"Allen Lichtenstein, ACLU of Nevada general counsel, said plenty
of case law has been created supporting the free-speech rights
of handbillers."
On another note though, I think the County Commissioners
have enough REAL problems to deal with on the Strip to
be concerned about a few people selling water and costumed
characters.
Quote: JohnnyQHow in the world are the porn-slappers engaging in Free Speech ?
How are they not? do they advertise fraudulently?
Quote:They are essentially advertising. The ACLU and whichever court
allowed them are crazy.
So?
Quote:If the strip sidewalk was clogged with people advertising replace-
ment windows, used cars, etc, etc, wouldn't that be banned ?
Who amrkets such things to tourists in Sin City? That would be a very bad use of an advertising budget. but if they advertised shows, gambling opportunities, places to shop or places to eat, I'd take their cards.
Quote: JohnnyQHow in the world are the porn-slappers engaging in Free Speech ?
They are essentially advertising. The ACLU and whichever court
allowed them are crazy.
On another note though, I think the County Commissioners
have enough REAL problems to deal with on the Strip to
be concerned about a few people selling water and costumed
characters.
First off, the water-bottle sellers are probably the best thing to happen to the Strip since the pedestrian overpasses. $1 for a cold bottle of water is a very good deal when you're about to pass out from heatstroke because you're a tourist from a place where it's not 120 degrees during the summer. Though after this year, that might not be the case for most of the country.
Point is, I've often bought water from the street vendors. And they'd make a killing on lip balm too, if they thought about it.
As to advertising by standing on the street and handing out promotional literature, that counts as free speech too. Where I live, we see people standing on the street corner the time waving signs advertising discounted mattresses or store-closing sales. Standing on the street corner handing out flyers for out-call strippers isn't any different from a speech standpoint.
Quote: gofaster87Im surprised by the responses here. As a resident of this town I think the strip is a disgusting mess. It definitely needs cleaning up and the peddlers need to be removed. The pedestrian traffic is too much and all these beggars, slappers and the such make it a congested mess. You dont have to live with it but we do.
That's a different point -- making the Strip a safe, easily-traversed pedestrian walkway is a good goal to have, and it's certainly true that the porn slappers clog traffic, but you can't make a free speech argument against them.
As for living there, I feel your pain, but when I lived in Henderson I went to the strip maybe once every 3 months. And I drove and took Koval or Industrial (now Dean Martin) so I'd almost never have to deal with it.
Quote: NareedAll the Strip hotels ought to get together and buy the freaking Strip already,
That is an interesting idea. Two possibilities: Make it a toll road, reducing traffic and turning a profit in the process, or, alternately, close it off to traffic altogether as a number of Mexican cities (Guanajuato and Queretaro come to mind) have done with major downtown arteries, essentially turning them into large outdoor malls.
Quote: heatherThat is an interesting idea. Two possibilities: Make it a toll road, reducing traffic and turning a profit in the process, or, alternately, close it off to traffic altogether as a number of Mexican cities (Guanajuato and Queretaro come to mind) have done with major downtown arteries, essentially turning them into large outdoor malls.
Seriously? I'd no idea any city in the world had turned a major thoroughfare into a pedestrian area. Into parking lots, sure, that's what major thoroughfares are. Small two ro three block sections, sure, everyone's done that, epsecially Las Vegas, which went as far as to cover it and put up nightly shows.
I was kidding. No way the Strip will be sold, rented, hired, or closed. Maybe the city will turn it to a toll road, maybe. But there's no need to sell it in order to do that.
Quote: AlanCan you access(with your car) all strip casino's/hotel's by some other way, other than the strip? Backstreets? Sidestreets?
Most of them. In fact, if you take a shuttle from the airport, you'll get a chance to see various access points for several casinos, most of which are on side streets. Offhand I'm not sure about Casino Royale and IP.
Quote: MathExtremistFirst off, the water-bottle sellers are probably the best thing to happen to the Strip since the pedestrian overpasses. $1 for a cold bottle of water is a very good deal when you're about to pass out from heatstroke because you're a tourist from a place where it's not 120 degrees during the summer.
Are the bottles clean and discarded after one use? Do they recycle bottles? If so, do they clean them well enough? What source of water do they use?
Granted tap water in the US is safe to drink (it isn't in other countries), but if the bottles aren't clean you can catch something. All the more so if they collect discarded bottles and just rinse, refill them and replace the sealed cap. In that case you can catch any number of bugs previous suers may have had, including some really bad intestinal bugs.
It would be far safer to buy one name-brand bottle, then wash it with soap after using it and refilling it yourself. It might still carry any bugs you have, but you already have them so that shouldn't be a problem.
Quote:As to advertising by standing on the street and handing out promotional literature, that counts as free speech too.
It sure does. Oh, it's disgussting and the card slappers are a nuissance (but not pushy). I'd just as soon see them relocated elsewhere, prefferably somewhere I'm not, but you can just ignore them. As long as they don't block traffic, I see no problem.
Quote: JohnnyQHow in the world are the porn-slappers engaging in Free Speech ?
Free speech includes commercial speech not just speech on great issues of public debate. As much as possible free speech restrictions are supposed to be without regard to content.
Many "faux downtowns" prosper simply because the real estate developments have private sidewalks and don't have to tolerate demonstrators or politicians.
The barriers are more annoying than dangerous and do not really block the sidewalks, its more annoying than dangerous.
Quote: Nareed
About three-card monte, doesn't everyone over the age of ten know it's a scam?
Don't they use a team? And 2 of the team members jobs
is to win a boatload of money in front of people to lure
in the suckers while making it look easy. Its the oldest
scam trick, using a shill, and the most effective.
I think half the success is people know it's a scam but still think they can get one over the scam artists...
Quote: FleaStiffFree speech includes commercial speech not just speech on great issues of public debate. As much as possible free speech restrictions are supposed to be without regard to content
OK. I guess I was thinking more of the Intention, I think, of the founding
founders, rather than the concept of "commercial free speech".
ps: I don't think the founding fathers need to be put on a pedestal.
They were only human, and isn't a lot of the Constitution and
the format of our government a huge compromise to get the
13 original colonies to ratify ?
pss: Nareed: You are ineligible to comment on this last part.
Quote: gofaster87It definitely needs cleaning up and the peddlers need to be removed. The pedestrian traffic is too much.....
I think another decent ordinance would be that any new casino on the strip must have a really wide sidewalk, rather
than a porn slappers narrow gauntlet. The sidewalk in front of Mirage is a good example of how it SHOULD be.
The area by Flamingo is an example of how it should NOT be.
Quote: JohnnyQOK. I guess I was thinking more of the Intention, I think, of the founding
founders, rather than the concept of "commercial free speech".
Speech is speech. That's all there is to it. To brand some of it "commercial" in order to regulate it is well beyond the intent of the Founders.
Quote:ps: I don't think the founding fathers need to be put on a pedestal.
They were only human, and isn't a lot of the Constitution and
the format of our government a huge compromise to get the
13 original colonies to ratify ?
Remarkable then how many countries have copied the idea of separation of powers, for example, which was just a ploy to make 13 states agree to sign.
Just a guess, but maybe the sidewalks originally were wider, and maybe a lane was added to the strip?Quote: JohnnyQI think another decent ordinance would be that any new casino on the strip must have a really wide sidewalk, rather
than a porn slappers narrow gauntlet. The sidewalk in front of Mirage is a good example of how it SHOULD be.
The area by Flamingo is an example of how it should NOT be.
Run! Run! Run for your life to the next casino!
~
The corner of Charleston and Freemont has this horrible cobblestone like sidewalk area that is the most uncomfortable thing I've ever walked on in shoes. Maybe they could pave the most problematic areas of the sidewalk with that stuff. I'm not even kidding about it being uncomfortable to walk across. I doubt standing on it would be much better.
Anybody want to get rich by selling a new kind of ultra-comfortable shoe known as the Pornslapper's Special?Quote: rxwineThe corner of Charleston and Fremont has this horrible cobblestone like sidewalk area that is the most uncomfortable thing I've ever walked on.
Quote: MrV
Actually, I suspect the casinos may already "own" the land the sidewalks are on, but it is subject to an easement to allow sidewalks.
I'd wager (n pun intended) that the casinos actually "own" Las Vegas Blvd itself. Few people realize it but in many cases the homeowner's property includes the street they live on. Half for each side.
Being in the western US some of the strip may be government property, say the middle two lanes from when it was a dirt road. But not all of it. Reclaiming the land to limit all the "problem" people could be an issue it still being a public sidewalk/easement. In the old days it would just have gotten taken care of. You didn't see porn slappers outside a Frank Rosenthal managed property.............
Quote:Screw the ACLU!
You mean the American Communist Lifestyle Union? YES!
Quote: AZDuffmanI'd wager (n pun intended) that the casinos actually "own" Las Vegas Blvd itself. Few people realize it but in many cases the homeowner's property includes the street they live on. Half for each side.
Looking at Las Vegas property maps (http://major.lasvegasnevada.gov/website/clvcamps/viewer.htm), I'd say they don't own the street.
For example, you cannot walk into a church and go into an atheistic diatribe for twenty minutes without commiting a breach of the peace, and being subject to arrest.
My suggestion of Privatizing the Sidewalks would only succeed if, upon challenge by the ACLU, the courts find that in fact they are private, even though they are open to all.
I suppose it would be better if, instead of open sidewalks, the casinos physically built a wall abutting the roadway, calling it their property, part of the casino itself, and then considered all who used the sidewalk patrons of the casino.
A bit of a stretch, but it is the best argument I've seen advanced yet to defeat the porn slappers, the pan handlers, and the ill-mannered riff-raff who are unfortunate enough to be poor and / or mentally ill in Las Vegas.
Keep up, or get out of the way.
Quote: MrVYou have freedom of speech in public places, but not in private.
true. And casinos can throw out porn slapper, peddlers and others who try to porn slap or peddle inside their premises.
Quote:A bit of a stretch, but it is the best argument I've seen advanced yet to defeat the porn slappers, the pan handlers, and the ill-mannered riff-raff who are unfortunate enough to be poor and / or mentally ill in Las Vegas.
I've seen signs on the pedestrian bridges saying panhandling and peddling is forbidden. One time I saw a runner go to a water bottle peddler to tell him the police were on the way. the peddler gathered his stuff and left, while the runner went in the direction of another water bottle guy.
As far as I know, nobody ever runs the porn slappers off.
Not anymore. Used to. Before the ACLU successfully defended them.Quote: NareedAs far as I know, nobody ever runs the porn slappers off.
Quote: yawetagLooking at Las Vegas property maps (http://major.lasvegasnevada.gov/website/clvcamps/viewer.htm), I'd say they don't own the street.
It would have to be researched at the Clark County Courthouse. I don't know offhand if NV uses metes and bounds; town/range/lot; or something else. But I still think at some point when they widened Las Vegas Blvd it is possible they never changed the legal descriptions. Not that any of it matters other than me proving what a square I am even knowing about this stuff. Heck, for my brother's housewarming I am considering making a deed-chain back to when the state of PA gave some farmer the land his house sits on and showing all owners since. In with it would be current events and cost of everyday items the year the transaction happened. Make it into a nice coffee table book. Surely nobody would duplicate that.
Quote: DJTeddyBearNot anymore. Used to. Before the ACLU successfully defended them.
There's one way to make them go away: put them out of business. Evidently the business model works, or they'd be elsewhere doing something else.
The question is "how?" I admit I've no idea. Maybe large signs by the slappers' alley reading "Prostitution IS illegal in the city of Las Vegas and Clark County"
The same can be said of the Nigerian Princess email spam. Everyone knows that they are scams, right? But if people didn't keep falling for them, the spam would have ended.Quote: NareedThere's one way to make them go away: put them out of business. Evidently the business model works, or they'd be elsewhere doing something else.