Thread Rating:

DRich
DRich
  • Threads: 86
  • Posts: 11878
Joined: Jul 6, 2012
April 11th, 2022 at 3:13:18 PM permalink
Hopefully everyone here has already got all of their information to their accountant as Federal taxes are due one week from today.

I am happy to say that mine were filed today and I will get a small refund. I have noticed a trend, when I am unemployed I get money back and when I am working I owe money. I don't understand why I continue to work.
At my age, a "Life In Prison" sentence is not much of a deterrent.
ThatDonGuy
ThatDonGuy
  • Threads: 118
  • Posts: 6405
Joined: Jun 22, 2011
April 11th, 2022 at 6:56:27 PM permalink
Refund? I wish. Thanks to quite a bit of my money being in mutual funds, which generate quite a bit of capital gain distributions, I'm lucky I don't have to make estimated tax payments every quarter. The same thing happened just before the dotcom bubble burst 20 years ago.
lilredrooster
lilredrooster
  • Threads: 233
  • Posts: 6697
Joined: May 8, 2015
April 12th, 2022 at 2:03:22 AM permalink
______________


I haven't had to take an IRA distribution yet but its going to be necessary soon and its going to have to be pretty big putting me in a whole other bracket

I was trying to find out by googling if you need to make estimated payments before April 15 on that

I couldn't find a good answer - I think I saw something that indicated that the IRS does not require a person to make an advance estimated payment on IRA distributions but I'm not 100% sure

anybody know the answer to this - my IRA is regular - not Roth - I should have done Roth but its too late now_______thanks for any comments or info

I've seen stuff about converting to Roth - but that won't work - that would require me to make a gigantic tax payment all at once -


.
the foolish sayings of a rich man often pass for words of wisdom by the fools around him
TigerWu
TigerWu
  • Threads: 26
  • Posts: 5632
Joined: May 23, 2016
April 12th, 2022 at 9:10:50 AM permalink
We're getting a pretty decent refund this year. Quite a bit higher than the last few years.
tuttigym
tuttigym
  • Threads: 10
  • Posts: 1876
Joined: Feb 12, 2010
April 12th, 2022 at 9:54:09 AM permalink
Quote: lilredrooster

______________


I haven't had to take an IRA distribution yet but its going to be necessary soon and its going to have to be pretty big putting me in a whole other bracket

I was trying to find out by googling if you need to make estimated payments before April 15 on that

I couldn't find a good answer - I think I saw something that indicated that the IRS does not require a person to make an advance estimated payment on IRA distributions but I'm not 100% sure

anybody know the answer to this - my IRA is regular - not Roth - I should have done Roth but its too late now_______thanks for any comments or info

I've seen stuff about converting to Roth - but that won't work - that would require me to make a gigantic tax payment all at once -


.
link to original post


I am retired and have been receiving an IRA distribution for over 10 years. The short answer to your question is no. Those funds are part of the totality of your bottom line taxable income so that the tax generated from the IRA distribution is part of the total amount of taxes due at the time you post your tax return not at the time you receive those $$$.

As an aside, I choose to receive my RMD (required minimum distribution) from my IRA's in September in one lump sum. None of my taxable income (pensions, interest, dividends, and SS) have any funds withheld for state and federal taxes, and I therefore, pay estimated taxes each year. I try to pay an amount that will not generate a huge refund or tax penalty if the amount is short. I use my RMD from my IRA to pay in one lump sum my estimated taxes and use the rest for gifting. That pre-planning allows me to file my taxes in February stress free. This year I got a surprise in that my filing actually generated an unexpected refund that I can bank.

tuttigym
unJon
unJon
  • Threads: 14
  • Posts: 4651
Joined: Jul 1, 2018
April 12th, 2022 at 11:43:33 AM permalink
Quote: TigerWu

We're getting a pretty decent refund this year. Quite a bit higher than the last few years.
link to original post



Congrats on making a larger than expected interest free loan to the government.
The race is not always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong; but that is the way to bet.
billryan
billryan
  • Threads: 240
  • Posts: 16282
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
April 12th, 2022 at 11:53:25 AM permalink
Quote: unJon

Quote: TigerWu

We're getting a pretty decent refund this year. Quite a bit higher than the last few years.
link to original post



Congrats on making a larger than expected interest free loan to the government.
link to original post



It's the patriotic thing to do.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
Ace2
Ace2
  • Threads: 32
  • Posts: 2706
Joined: Oct 2, 2017
April 12th, 2022 at 1:09:24 PM permalink
Quote: ThatDonGuy

Refund? I wish. Thanks to quite a bit of my money being in mutual funds, which generate quite a bit of capital gain distributions, I'm lucky I don't have to make estimated tax payments every quarter. The same thing happened just before the dotcom bubble burst 20 years ago.
link to original post

You invest in mutual funds? That's almost like playing 6:5 blackjack when there's a 3:2 table right next to it.
Itís all about making that GTA
TigerWu
TigerWu
  • Threads: 26
  • Posts: 5632
Joined: May 23, 2016
April 12th, 2022 at 1:15:55 PM permalink
Quote: unJon

Quote: TigerWu

We're getting a pretty decent refund this year. Quite a bit higher than the last few years.
link to original post



Congrats on making a larger than expected interest free loan to the government.
link to original post



No, it was pretty expected, just wasn't sure of the exact amount.

Quote: Ace2

You invest in mutual funds? That's almost like playing 6:5 blackjack when there's a 3:2 table right next to it.
link to original post



What is the "3:2 table" in this analogy?
unJon
unJon
  • Threads: 14
  • Posts: 4651
Joined: Jul 1, 2018
April 12th, 2022 at 7:00:31 PM permalink
Quote: Ace2

Quote: ThatDonGuy

Refund? I wish. Thanks to quite a bit of my money being in mutual funds, which generate quite a bit of capital gain distributions, I'm lucky I don't have to make estimated tax payments every quarter. The same thing happened just before the dotcom bubble burst 20 years ago.
link to original post

You invest in mutual funds? That's almost like playing 6:5 blackjack when there's a 3:2 table right next to it.
link to original post



Depends on the fees.

ETA: A better analogy would be dealing a 3:2 table when the plopped would fill up a 6:5 table just the same.
The race is not always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong; but that is the way to bet.
lilredrooster
lilredrooster
  • Threads: 233
  • Posts: 6697
Joined: May 8, 2015
April 13th, 2022 at 7:49:35 AM permalink
Quote: Ace2



You invest in mutual funds? That's almost like playing 6:5 blackjack when there's a 3:2 table right next to it.
link to original post




I believe that is a very wrong and misleading statement

mutual funds can invest in several hundred stocks - the idea is to spread the risk

if you can beat the wiseguys trading stocks - more power to you - I don't even want to try

your capital gains obligations will be much greater - and the tax bill for short term capital gains is much more than for long term capital gains

the capital gains obligations on the funds that I've held have been close to zero


.
the foolish sayings of a rich man often pass for words of wisdom by the fools around him
billryan
billryan
  • Threads: 240
  • Posts: 16282
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
Thanked by
Johnzimbo
April 13th, 2022 at 8:49:29 AM permalink
Quote: lilredrooster

Quote: Ace2



You invest in mutual funds? That's almost like playing 6:5 blackjack when there's a 3:2 table right next to it.
link to original post




I believe that is a very wrong and misleading statement

mutual funds can invest in several hundred stocks - the idea is to spread the risk

if you can beat the wiseguys trading stocks - more power to you - I don't even want to try

your capital gains obligations will be much greater - and the tax bill for short term capital gains is much more than for long term capital gains

the capital gains obligations on the funds that I've held have been close to zero


.
link to original post




I think they are saying mutual funds are bad compared to ETFs. In general, ETFs are more nimble, have fewer fees, and do a better job of avoiding Capital Gains. While investing in mutual funds is certainly better than getting kicked in the head, for most people ETFs are better.
Of cause, many people don't understand the differences between the two and may not be certain what they actually have invested in.
Given a choice between not investing and investing in a mutual fund, the correct choice is clear. When it comes to choosing between mutual funds and ETFs, the choice is less clear to most people, although the ETFs are usually the right answer. The problem is that when something has worked for you in the past and produced decent returns, it is hard to recognize you are losing out on money on an investment you think is doing well.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
ThatDonGuy
ThatDonGuy
  • Threads: 118
  • Posts: 6405
Joined: Jun 22, 2011
April 13th, 2022 at 8:58:25 AM permalink
Quote: billryan

Quote: lilredrooster

Quote: Ace2



You invest in mutual funds? That's almost like playing 6:5 blackjack when there's a 3:2 table right next to it.
link to original post




I believe that is a very wrong and misleading statement

mutual funds can invest in several hundred stocks - the idea is to spread the risk

if you can beat the wiseguys trading stocks - more power to you - I don't even want to try

your capital gains obligations will be much greater - and the tax bill for short term capital gains is much more than for long term capital gains

the capital gains obligations on the funds that I've held have been close to zero


.
link to original post




I think they are saying mutual funds are bad compared to ETFs. In general, ETFs are more nimble, have fewer fees, and do a better job of avoiding Capital Gains. While investing in mutual funds is certainly better than getting kicked in the head, for most people ETFs are better.
Of cause, many people don't understand the differences between the two and may not be certain what they actually have invested in.
Given a choice between not investing and investing in a mutual fund, the correct choice is clear. When it comes to choosing between mutual funds and ETFs, the choice is less clear to most people, although the ETFs are usually the right answer. The problem is that when something has worked for you in the past and produced decent returns, it is hard to recognize you are losing out on money on an investment you think is doing well.
link to original post


Any ETFs that the market boffins here recommend?
unJon
unJon
  • Threads: 14
  • Posts: 4651
Joined: Jul 1, 2018
April 13th, 2022 at 9:04:59 AM permalink
Quote: ThatDonGuy

Quote: billryan

Quote: lilredrooster

Quote: Ace2



You invest in mutual funds? That's almost like playing 6:5 blackjack when there's a 3:2 table right next to it.
link to original post




I believe that is a very wrong and misleading statement

mutual funds can invest in several hundred stocks - the idea is to spread the risk

if you can beat the wiseguys trading stocks - more power to you - I don't even want to try

your capital gains obligations will be much greater - and the tax bill for short term capital gains is much more than for long term capital gains

the capital gains obligations on the funds that I've held have been close to zero


.
link to original post




I think they are saying mutual funds are bad compared to ETFs. In general, ETFs are more nimble, have fewer fees, and do a better job of avoiding Capital Gains. While investing in mutual funds is certainly better than getting kicked in the head, for most people ETFs are better.
Of cause, many people don't understand the differences between the two and may not be certain what they actually have invested in.
Given a choice between not investing and investing in a mutual fund, the correct choice is clear. When it comes to choosing between mutual funds and ETFs, the choice is less clear to most people, although the ETFs are usually the right answer. The problem is that when something has worked for you in the past and produced decent returns, it is hard to recognize you are losing out on money on an investment you think is doing well.
link to original post


Any ETFs that the market boffins here recommend?
link to original post



VTI
VXUS
VTV
The race is not always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong; but that is the way to bet.
billryan
billryan
  • Threads: 240
  • Posts: 16282
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
April 13th, 2022 at 9:10:29 AM permalink
Quote: ThatDonGuy

Quote: billryan

Quote: lilredrooster

Quote: Ace2



You invest in mutual funds? That's almost like playing 6:5 blackjack when there's a 3:2 table right next to it.
link to original post




I believe that is a very wrong and misleading statement

mutual funds can invest in several hundred stocks - the idea is to spread the risk

if you can beat the wiseguys trading stocks - more power to you - I don't even want to try

your capital gains obligations will be much greater - and the tax bill for short term capital gains is much more than for long term capital gains

the capital gains obligations on the funds that I've held have been close to zero


.
link to original post




I think they are saying mutual funds are bad compared to ETFs. In general, ETFs are more nimble, have fewer fees, and do a better job of avoiding Capital Gains. While investing in mutual funds is certainly better than getting kicked in the head, for most people ETFs are better.
Of cause, many people don't understand the differences between the two and may not be certain what they actually have invested in.
Given a choice between not investing and investing in a mutual fund, the correct choice is clear. When it comes to choosing between mutual funds and ETFs, the choice is less clear to most people, although the ETFs are usually the right answer. The problem is that when something has worked for you in the past and produced decent returns, it is hard to recognize you are losing out on money on an investment you think is doing well.
link to original post


Any ETFs that the market boffins here recommend?
link to original post



I like the ones that do well better than the ones that don't.
A lot of it is circumstantial. For example- I'm 63 and have the money I need to live a nice life. My needs are a steady income and the preservation of my nest egg. Someone else may be forty and invested all their life and is well on their way to financial security, while anothers life savings may be $12,000 in crypto. My recommendation to each would be different.
One person might have $100,000 and only need to make 4% on it to live while another person needs to double that amount quickly.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
TigerWu
TigerWu
  • Threads: 26
  • Posts: 5632
Joined: May 23, 2016
April 13th, 2022 at 9:27:14 AM permalink
Quote: unJon


VTI
VXUS
VTV
link to original post



VTI expense ratio: 0.03%
VXUS expense ratio: 0.07%
VTV expense ratio: 0.04%

Versus similar index/mutual funds:

VFIAX 0.04%
VTSAX 0.04%
VBTLX 0.05%

Broad market index funds aren't really any more expensive that ETFs from a fee perspective. I'm not a big tax wonk so I don't know about comparing them from that aspect.
Ace2
Ace2
  • Threads: 32
  • Posts: 2706
Joined: Oct 2, 2017
April 13th, 2022 at 10:04:09 AM permalink
SPY

Cost of under 0.1% compared to a managed fund charging 1% that cannot beat the S&P long term

When compounded over the long run, that 1% fee makes a big difference. Youíre paying 1% to a fund that is basically guaranteed not to beat the S&P (which you can get for close to free)

90% of my stock holdings is SPY. The other 10% is a few mutual funds I've owned for many years...they are in a taxable account and would generate large capital gains tax if I sold. Otherwise I would convert them to SPY
Last edited by: Ace2 on Apr 13, 2022
Itís all about making that GTA
billryan
billryan
  • Threads: 240
  • Posts: 16282
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
April 13th, 2022 at 10:48:15 AM permalink
Your portfolio shouldn't be trying to beat the S&P. Depending on your age, part of it should be in bonds and other instruments. The closer you get to retiring, the more you want to reduce your exposure to stocks. Having 100% stocks or funds is cool when you are thirty, but foolish when you are sixty.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
Ace2
Ace2
  • Threads: 32
  • Posts: 2706
Joined: Oct 2, 2017
April 13th, 2022 at 11:27:31 AM permalink
Quote: billryan

Your portfolio shouldn't be trying to beat the S&P. Depending on your age, part of it should be in bonds and other instruments. The closer you get to retiring, the more you want to reduce your exposure to stocks. Having 100% stocks or funds is cool when you are thirty, but foolish when you are sixty.
link to original post

Who recommended 100% stocks or funds (at any age)? However, the portion of your portfolio allocated to stocks should probably be measured against (and invested in) a broad index like the S&P
Itís all about making that GTA
billryan
billryan
  • Threads: 240
  • Posts: 16282
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
April 13th, 2022 at 11:54:12 AM permalink
Quote: Ace2

Quote: billryan

Your portfolio shouldn't be trying to beat the S&P. Depending on your age, part of it should be in bonds and other instruments. The closer you get to retiring, the more you want to reduce your exposure to stocks. Having 100% stocks or funds is cool when you are thirty, but foolish when you are sixty.
link to original post

Who recommended 100% stocks or funds (at any age)? However, the portion of your portfolio allocated to stocks should probably be measured against (and invested in) a broad index like the S&P
link to original post



Why?
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
TigerWu
TigerWu
  • Threads: 26
  • Posts: 5632
Joined: May 23, 2016
April 13th, 2022 at 12:03:39 PM permalink
Quote: billryan

Quote: Ace2

Quote: billryan

Your portfolio shouldn't be trying to beat the S&P. Depending on your age, part of it should be in bonds and other instruments. The closer you get to retiring, the more you want to reduce your exposure to stocks. Having 100% stocks or funds is cool when you are thirty, but foolish when you are sixty.
link to original post

Who recommended 100% stocks or funds (at any age)? However, the portion of your portfolio allocated to stocks should probably be measured against (and invested in) a broad index like the S&P
link to original post



Why?
link to original post



Because that's the most generic, broadest, and "safest" equity benchmark for most people (in the U.S.). You could also do a Total Market fund, but S&P is basic enough for most people.
DRich
DRich
  • Threads: 86
  • Posts: 11878
Joined: Jul 6, 2012
Thanked by
Mukke
April 13th, 2022 at 12:15:16 PM permalink
Quote: TigerWu


Who recommended 100% stocks or funds (at any age)? However, the portion of your portfolio allocated to stocks should probably be measured against (and invested in) a broad index like the S&P



Or, just take the typical American approach and invest it all in Powerball tickets.
At my age, a "Life In Prison" sentence is not much of a deterrent.
MrV
MrV
  • Threads: 364
  • Posts: 8158
Joined: Feb 13, 2010
April 13th, 2022 at 12:25:48 PM permalink
Quote: billryan

Your portfolio shouldn't be trying to beat the S&P. Depending on your age, part of it should be in bonds and other instruments. The closer you get to retiring, the more you want to reduce your exposure to stocks. Having 100% stocks or funds is cool when you are thirty, but foolish when you are sixty



Not sure I agree.

I have money in a variey of stock-based mutual funds, but also an annuity: no bonds to hedge market fluctuations.

Me, I like taking risks: hell, it's gamblin'.

Fortunately I also have sufficient cash reserves, so if the market tanks completely (yeah, right) I won't have to eat Alpo and ramen.

It used to be "Live fast, die young, and leave a good looking corpse;" now I prefer "Live long, die peacefully, and leave a good looking corpus."
"What, me worry?"
DRich
DRich
  • Threads: 86
  • Posts: 11878
Joined: Jul 6, 2012
April 13th, 2022 at 12:49:06 PM permalink
Quote: MrV



It used to be "Live fast, die young, and leave a good looking corpse;" now I prefer "Live long, die peacefully, and leave a good looking corpus."
link to original post



My problem is that I never counted on living this long. I probably would have saved a few more pennies if I knew.
At my age, a "Life In Prison" sentence is not much of a deterrent.
Ace2
Ace2
  • Threads: 32
  • Posts: 2706
Joined: Oct 2, 2017
April 13th, 2022 at 1:09:35 PM permalink
Quote: billryan

Quote: Ace2

Quote: billryan

Your portfolio shouldn't be trying to beat the S&P. Depending on your age, part of it should be in bonds and other instruments. The closer you get to retiring, the more you want to reduce your exposure to stocks. Having 100% stocks or funds is cool when you are thirty, but foolish when you are sixty.
link to original post

Who recommended 100% stocks or funds (at any age)? However, the portion of your portfolio allocated to stocks should probably be measured against (and invested in) a broad index like the S&P
link to original post



Why?
link to original post

Ask Warren Buffett. On page one of the Berkshire's annual letter, the first words are: "Berkshireís Performance vs. the S&P 500". Then the comparative annual returns since 1965 are listed

https://www.berkshirehathaway.com/letters/2021ltr.pdf
Itís all about making that GTA
AlanMendelson
AlanMendelson
  • Threads: 167
  • Posts: 5937
Joined: Oct 5, 2011
April 13th, 2022 at 1:24:16 PM permalink
Berkshire Hathaway is it's own mutual fund.
lilredrooster
lilredrooster
  • Threads: 233
  • Posts: 6697
Joined: May 8, 2015
April 13th, 2022 at 1:40:19 PM permalink
Quote: Ace2

Ask Warren Buffett. On page one of the Berkshire's annual letter, the first words are: "Berkshireís Performance vs. the S&P 500". Then the comparative annual returns since 1965 are listed

https://www.berkshirehathaway.com/letters/2021ltr.pdf
link to original post




again, misleading


Berkshire has been beaten up by the S&P since 2015

2015 - Berkshire - negative 12.5%_____ S&P - positive 1.4%

2019 Berkshire____ 11.9%________S&P__________31.5%

2020_________Berkshire 2.4%____________S&P__________18.4%



Buffett has beaten the S&P during that period a few years


roughly - since 2015_____________Berkshire_____________100%__________________S&P____________118%



Buffett himself during this period has said on occasion that he recommends the S&P index fund to some investors


.
the foolish sayings of a rich man often pass for words of wisdom by the fools around him
Ace2
Ace2
  • Threads: 32
  • Posts: 2706
Joined: Oct 2, 2017
April 13th, 2022 at 1:45:13 PM permalink
What's misleading?
Itís all about making that GTA
lilredrooster
lilredrooster
  • Threads: 233
  • Posts: 6697
Joined: May 8, 2015
April 13th, 2022 at 1:47:38 PM permalink
Quote: Ace2

What's misleading?
link to original post




it seemed to me that you were implying that Berkshire and Buffett can be counted on to beat the S&P

but they have not done that since 2015

if you were not implying that, then I am mistaken, and I apologize


.
the foolish sayings of a rich man often pass for words of wisdom by the fools around him
TigerWu
TigerWu
  • Threads: 26
  • Posts: 5632
Joined: May 23, 2016
April 13th, 2022 at 2:08:01 PM permalink
Quote: lilredrooster




Buffett himself during this period has said on occasion that he recommends the S&P index fund to some investors


.
link to original post



That is precisely what Ace2 was insinuating (to billryan specifically).
lilredrooster
lilredrooster
  • Threads: 233
  • Posts: 6697
Joined: May 8, 2015
April 13th, 2022 at 2:20:17 PM permalink
____________


I'm much more heavily into stocks than anything else which does not reflect common recommendations - but it reflects my personal risk tolerance

the way I look at it is that I accept the possibility that I could lose 60% of what I now have

everybody has a different personal risk tolerance and that is a main consideration in investing

on August 28, 2008 the S&P was at 1300.68_________it fell 48% to this on March 9, 2009__________676.53


.
the foolish sayings of a rich man often pass for words of wisdom by the fools around him
Ace2
Ace2
  • Threads: 32
  • Posts: 2706
Joined: Oct 2, 2017
April 13th, 2022 at 2:20:43 PM permalink
Quote: lilredrooster

Quote: Ace2

What's misleading?
link to original post




it seemed to me that you were implying that Berkshire and Buffett can be counted on to beat the S&P

but they have not done that since 2015

if you were not implying that, then I am mistaken, and I apologize


.
link to original post

Since 1965, Berkshire's cumulative return (3,641,613%) absolutely crushed S&P's return (30,209%) by a factor of over 100. You can't even compare the two. It's the long-term that matters...no one said BRK or anything else beats the S&P every year or every day
Last edited by: Ace2 on Apr 13, 2022
Itís all about making that GTA
lilredrooster
lilredrooster
  • Threads: 233
  • Posts: 6697
Joined: May 8, 2015
April 13th, 2022 at 2:24:34 PM permalink
Quote: Ace2

Quote: lilredrooster

Quote: Ace2

What's misleading?
link to original post




it seemed to me that you were implying that Berkshire and Buffett can be counted on to beat the S&P

but they have not done that since 2015

if you were not implying that, then I am mistaken, and I apologize


.
link to original post

Since 1965, Berkshire's cumulative return (3,641,613%) absolutely crushed S&P's return (30,209%) by a factor of over 100. It's the long-term that matters...no one said it beats the S&P every year or every day
link to original post




yes, but in my view and in the view of many others the fact that he has gotten beaten by the S&P for the last 7 years is significant

and Buffett himself has acknowledged this - he's 91 now - conditions in the market have changed dramatically over the years and he likely no longer can be counted on to beat the S&P in the future

.
the foolish sayings of a rich man often pass for words of wisdom by the fools around him
Ace2
Ace2
  • Threads: 32
  • Posts: 2706
Joined: Oct 2, 2017
April 13th, 2022 at 2:35:42 PM permalink
Maybe. One of the reasons BRK was able to deliver such spectacular returns in the early years is because, as a much smaller entity, they were able to concentrate their investments in small-cap companies, which typically have lower valuations and obviously more room for growth

But I still don't see how a page that lists the returns for every year is "misleading". It doesn't take much analysis to see that BRK returns were higher in earlier years.
Itís all about making that GTA
billryan
billryan
  • Threads: 240
  • Posts: 16282
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
April 13th, 2022 at 2:38:48 PM permalink
Quote: Ace2

Quote: lilredrooster

Quote: Ace2

What's misleading?
link to original post




it seemed to me that you were implying that Berkshire and Buffett can be counted on to beat the S&P

but they have not done that since 2015

if you were not implying that, then I am mistaken, and I apologize


.
link to original post

Since 1965, Berkshire's cumulative return (3,641,613%) absolutely crushed S&P's return (30,209%) by a factor of over 100. You can't even compare the two. It's the long-term that matters...no one said BRK or anything else beats the S&P every year or every day/hour
link to original post




Barry Bonds has the most home runs since 1900. I'm not sure I want him batting cleanup in 2022. Buffet is a personal hero but he is one voice, not the final word.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
Ace2
Ace2
  • Threads: 32
  • Posts: 2706
Joined: Oct 2, 2017
April 13th, 2022 at 2:45:31 PM permalink
Quote: billryan



Barry Bonds has the most home runs since 1900. I'm not sure I want him batting cleanup in 2022. Buffet is a personal hero but he is one voice, not the final word.
link to original post

Fair enough, and Warren's over 90 now. But who do you listen to then? Warren's advice is straightforward, consistent, and he's usually right. Maturity (up to a point) and experience are good things to have as an investor
Itís all about making that GTA
lilredrooster
lilredrooster
  • Threads: 233
  • Posts: 6697
Joined: May 8, 2015
April 13th, 2022 at 2:51:16 PM permalink
Quote: Ace2



But who do you listen to then?

link to original post




my point of view - I listen to nobody - I go with the indexes - primarily - with smaller amounts specualtion is very tempting - and I've done my share of it


.
the foolish sayings of a rich man often pass for words of wisdom by the fools around him
billryan
billryan
  • Threads: 240
  • Posts: 16282
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
April 13th, 2022 at 2:56:11 PM permalink
I take a bit of Buffet, a bit of Dave Ramsey( when I was younger and digging out of a hole), a bit of Rick Edelman, throw in some Christian mysticism, a bit of Dale Carnegie, some Vince McMahon, Elon Musk and Hugh Jackman, apply the lessons my family business has experienced and try to make informed decisions. I try to study a situation and ponder what Levi Strauss would do.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
mcallister3200
mcallister3200
  • Threads: 17
  • Posts: 3616
Joined: Dec 29, 2013
April 13th, 2022 at 5:45:28 PM permalink
Something tells me most members wouldnít consider my strategy of buying Ď51 Bowman Willie Mays while heís still alive and any Jackie Robinsonís with decent eye appeal is a good investment strategy.
billryan
billryan
  • Threads: 240
  • Posts: 16282
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
April 13th, 2022 at 7:13:54 PM permalink
Captain America #1 sold for $3,000,000 this week, and even more amazing- a Fantastic Four #1 from 1961 broke the million-dollar barrier. What was surprising was it is nowhere close to being the highest-graded example.
Last year I kept hearing about new crypto millionaires driving the market but that doesn't explain the current price surges.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
AlanMendelson
AlanMendelson
  • Threads: 167
  • Posts: 5937
Joined: Oct 5, 2011
April 13th, 2022 at 8:50:20 PM permalink
There comes a certain point (age) that you no longer want speculation but only guaranteed returns.
billryan
billryan
  • Threads: 240
  • Posts: 16282
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
April 13th, 2022 at 11:10:52 PM permalink
In the late 1970s, a young hippie started advertising in the local Denver Pennysaver that he bought comics. For a few months, things were slow and he was considering not renewing his ads when his nine-month contract expired.
Then he got the call that would change his life and the comic book world.
A family in the suburbs was preparing to sell the family home and wanted to know if he would buy the books in the basement.

The Church collection was some 20,000 comics from the late 30s to the early 50s that were mostly in pristine condition. The legend is that the family sold them at face value- ten cents each.
Today, Action #1 from this collection sold for $5.1 million dollars.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
DRich
DRich
  • Threads: 86
  • Posts: 11878
Joined: Jul 6, 2012
April 14th, 2022 at 6:10:22 AM permalink
Quote: billryan

I take a bit of Buffet, a bit of Dave Ramsey( when I was younger and digging out of a hole), a bit of Rick Edelman, throw in some Christian mysticism, a bit of Dale Carnegie, some Vince McMahon, Elon Musk and Hugh Jackman, apply the lessons my family business has experienced and try to make informed decisions. I try to study a situation and ponder what Levi Strauss would do.
link to original post



Nice assortment. I want to personally follow the Charlie Sheen plan.
At my age, a "Life In Prison" sentence is not much of a deterrent.
billryan
billryan
  • Threads: 240
  • Posts: 16282
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
April 14th, 2022 at 7:14:37 AM permalink
Quote: DRich

Quote: billryan

I take a bit of Buffet, a bit of Dave Ramsey( when I was younger and digging out of a hole), a bit of Rick Edelman, throw in some Christian mysticism, a bit of Dale Carnegie, some Vince McMahon, Elon Musk and Hugh Jackman, apply the lessons my family business has experienced and try to make informed decisions. I try to study a situation and ponder what Levi Strauss would do.
link to original post



Nice assortment. I want to personally follow the Charlie Sheen plan.
link to original post




In my younger days, I used to channel Hunter Thompson but lemonlabob cured me.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
TigerWu
TigerWu
  • Threads: 26
  • Posts: 5632
Joined: May 23, 2016
April 14th, 2022 at 7:40:48 AM permalink
Quote: billryan

Captain America #1 sold for $3,000,000 this week, and even more amazing- a Fantastic Four #1 from 1961 broke the million-dollar barrier. What was surprising was it is nowhere close to being the highest-graded example.
Last year I kept hearing about new crypto millionaires driving the market but that doesn't explain the current price surges.
link to original post



I used to have some video games back in the day that are literally worth a couple thousand today to collectors. Back in the '90s I either gave them away or sold them at a yard sale for pennies on the dollar. Nobody was collecting s*** back then as far as video games, so it was all practically worthless and you could barely give it away. Nowadays video game collecting is huge.
MrV
MrV
  • Threads: 364
  • Posts: 8158
Joined: Feb 13, 2010
April 14th, 2022 at 8:28:40 AM permalink
As a lad I had a couple shoe boxes of baseball cards, many would be very valuable today: who knew?

I got rid of them over time, usually by losing them to a friend by "flipping" them to see who won, or they got destroyed after being clothes pinned to my bike to make clicking noises via the spokes.
Last edited by: MrV on Apr 14, 2022
"What, me worry?"
mcallister3200
mcallister3200
  • Threads: 17
  • Posts: 3616
Joined: Dec 29, 2013
April 14th, 2022 at 9:26:43 AM permalink
Vintage baseball cards, especially anyone but Mantle, are all about condition and centering. Some key cards the difference between being graded authentic (1 on 1-10 scale) and a well centered 8 can literally be the difference between a couple hundred dollars and a six figure card. Some of those valuable cards there were plenty of them produced but they were either poorly kept or poorly cut/manufactured in the first place. If it was kept in a shoebox virtual guaranteed not to grade higher than a 6. First and last number cards in sets very difficult to find in good condition due to generally being kept in front/back of shoebox or rubber bands.

I find the Mantle premium and potential reasons behind why his cards are worth so much more than Aaron and Mays, players from his era who were clearly superior players, to be interesting. Think itís partially because he was a Yankee, partly because heís white in the era he played, and partly because he was like the first guy to start signing autographs at shows so collectors more likely to have had a personal interaction with him.

Aaronís cards are interesting to me from a historical perspective because you see that old Braves logo, very prominently featured on his Ď54 rookie card, that would never fly today along with Aaron probably being the player who had to endure the most racial nonsense of any player since Jackie in his pursuit of the home run record.
Last edited by: mcallister3200 on Apr 14, 2022
lilredrooster
lilredrooster
  • Threads: 233
  • Posts: 6697
Joined: May 8, 2015
April 14th, 2022 at 5:37:25 PM permalink
Quote: mcallister3200



I find the Mantle premium and potential reasons behind why his cards are worth so much more than Aaron and Mays, players from his era who were clearly superior players, to be interesting. Think itís partially because he was a Yankee, partly because heís white in the era he played, and partly because he was like the first guy to start signing autographs at shows so collectors more likely to have had a personal interaction with him.



in 1961 Mantle and Maris captured the interest of the nation as they dueled to best Babe Ruth - Maris did it with 61 homers, Mantle got 54______this was pre steroids and human growth hormones - the homers those 2 were hitting late in that season became front page news and not just in NYC

Maris was a stodgy character,________Mickey was a fun loving playboy - very handsome and everybody liked him - he had serious leg injuries which were widely publicized and got him lots of sympathy

Mickey had a great year in 1956 at age 24 when he hit 52 homers and got 132 RBIs - in 1957 he hit .365

in 1953, at Griffith Stadium in DC he hit a 565 foot homer - one of the farthest in MLB history and the phrase "tape measure home run" was born

in 1957 he also was walked 146 times - he was walked over 100 times in 8 different years - it gives an idea of how much he was feared - it's not really useful to compare this stat to the steroids sluggers

not trying to say he was better than Aaron or Mays but Mays was only walked over 100 times in one year and Aaron was never really close to being walked 100 times

in 1956 Mantle's slugging average was .705. neither Aaron or Mays ever got really close to .700


getting walked during his years was a very underrated stat




Roger Maris and Mickey Mantle








.


.
Last edited by: lilredrooster on Apr 14, 2022
the foolish sayings of a rich man often pass for words of wisdom by the fools around him
billryan
billryan
  • Threads: 240
  • Posts: 16282
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
April 14th, 2022 at 7:42:34 PM permalink
Mickey Mantle was the best player on the best team in the country.
Willie Mays was the best player on the third-best team in his own city when he played in NY.

I think playing in Northern Cali hurt Mays' popularity tremendously. The same with Aaron in Wisconsin and then in the Deep South.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
AlanMendelson
AlanMendelson
  • Threads: 167
  • Posts: 5937
Joined: Oct 5, 2011
Thanked by
camapl
April 14th, 2022 at 7:51:20 PM permalink
Allow me to reminisce...

In 1961 I was 9 years old. My Dad took me to Yankee Stadium and we sat behind third base.

It was the day Mantle and Maris both hit homers breaking the season total of Ruth and Gehrig.

As that record breaking homer went over the wall my father looked at me with the biggest smile I ever saw and said...

"You will never forget this for the rest of your life."

My father died in 1978.

I'll never forget that moment and his smile and how he looked.

He was right.
  • Jump to: