vegas
vegas
Joined: Apr 27, 2012
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April 17th, 2021 at 4:49:11 AM permalink
Canada is battling a stubborn 3rd wave. The biggest province Ontario is completely shut down for at least another month. We have a stay at home order and police have authority to ticket anyone who is out and about unless for essential reasons.

No schools open and only essential workers allowed to work. Our hospitals are almost full and intensive care is at critical levels never seen before. We can't even travel to other provinces. Golf courses and parks are also closed. Even though we have the strictest guidelines in North America covid is beating us. We are vaccinating but often face shortages of vaccine.
50-50-90 Rule: Anytime you have a 50-50 chance of getting something right, there is a 90% probability you'll get it wrong
ChumpChange
ChumpChange
Joined: Jun 15, 2018
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April 17th, 2021 at 5:39:04 AM permalink
Ontario considering even tighter restrictions as cases skyrocket - CBC
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jlN0W9E5zkg
OnceDear
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OnceDear
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April 17th, 2021 at 7:55:47 AM permalink
Quote: vegas

Canada is battling a stubborn 3rd wave. The biggest province Ontario is completely shut down for at least another month. We have a stay at home order and police have authority to ticket anyone who is out and about unless for essential reasons.

No schools open and only essential workers allowed to work. Our hospitals are almost full and intensive care is at critical levels never seen before. We can't even travel to other provinces. Golf courses and parks are also closed. Even though we have the strictest guidelines in North America covid is beating us. We are vaccinating but often face shortages of vaccine.

I don't know, and would love to be informed by our Canadian members, what's gone so wrong in Canada?
What is the general level of compliance with existing mandates?
Do States act as independently and in the same partisan way as the US?
Here in the UK, we have only just started lifting restriction in place since December, and i must say that we have had great success at crushing down death and infection rates. No real State-to state or partisan differences here. The vaccination program here is well underway and we hope it serves mostly as a substitute to the whole lock down situation. We are looking good for summer, though the S will HTF in late summer.

I observe that what has probably had most effect for us has been a ban on house to house mixing. Socially painful, but hellishly effective. Does Canada, or any of the US have that type of restriction?
I wish Canada every success in whatever measures they take.!
I'm not hopeful for the US or much of the rest of the world, though.
Wow. The charts look really bad for Canada
The charts look better for the USA but trending up.
Better at the moment in the UK.
Beware. The earth is NOT flat. Hit and run is not a winning strategy: Pressing into trends IS not a winning strategy: Progressives are not a winning strategy: Don't Buy It! .Don't even take it for free.
coilman
coilman
Joined: Jan 29, 2012
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April 17th, 2021 at 9:26:23 AM permalink
This is part of the problem

https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/flights-in-and-out-of-ontario-resulting-in-dozens-of-covid-19-flight-exposures-1.5390026

Another is the government slow slow slow roll out of shots. The mayor from my city was on the news yesterday after the new rules came out. When asked if we needed The Red Cross be sent here to help administer shots he replied.... we need the vaccines they cut our supply from 14500 a week to 10000... we shut down sites two days a week because none are available.
vegas
vegas
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April 17th, 2021 at 9:39:03 AM permalink
We have stricter guidelines than the USA does. In Michigan just picking an average day last week:

Michigan has a population of 10 million and had 7278 new daily cases and 47 deaths

Ontario has a population of 15 million and had 4,362 new daily cases and 34 deaths.

We are shut down completely and Michigan has some restrictions but not a complete shutdown.

Our problem is the new variants that are highly contagious and seem to be the problem for us. Also most of our outbreaks have been due to groups of people ignoring the rules and spreading the virus. Now the younger crowd are the ones contacting the virus and filling the hospitals while the elderly are doing ok. we are not allowed to visit with neighbors or relatives and are restricted to those in your house only.

I remember recently when the UK was having numbers soaring while over here things were trending down. It is like the virus moves around the globe and now we are hard hit. Really glad to hear the UK is doing so much better as hopefully that will trend over here.
50-50-90 Rule: Anytime you have a 50-50 chance of getting something right, there is a 90% probability you'll get it wrong
OnceDear
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OnceDear
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April 17th, 2021 at 10:10:45 AM permalink
Quote: vegas

We have stricter guidelines than the USA does. In Michigan just picking an average day last week:
...
Our problem is the new variants that are highly contagious and seem to be the problem for us. Also most of our outbreaks have been due to groups of people ignoring the rules and spreading the virus. Now the younger crowd are the ones contacting the virus and filling the hospitals while the elderly are doing ok.
...
I remember recently when the UK was having numbers soaring while over here things were trending down. It is like the virus moves around the globe and now we are hard hit. Really glad to hear the UK is doing so much better as hopefully that will trend over here.

After my post, I went and googled it.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/coronavirus-canada-surge-second-wave-1.5793753
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-56779428

Michegan's charts look almost identical to Canada.

The 'UK variant' seems to be suppressed fairly well by our Pfizer and AZ vaccines, while it is running rampant in Canada. Maybe a vaccine effectiveness difference.
It seems that you are vaccinating at quite a slow pace (less than half as fast) and that somehow covid is still getting easily into care-homes. Our elderly care-homes are VERY rigidly isolated and pretty much all the elderly and front line carers are fully vaccinated. that is what has crushed our curve.
I fear that our under 40s, who are generally not vaccinated, will be the new pandemic within a pandemic. The under 40s tend not to 'just' die, though they are pretty good at superspreading and THEY are relaxing, possibly too much.
I have younger friends with 'long covid' and they just cannot recover properly.

... Moving this thread hijack.
Beware. The earth is NOT flat. Hit and run is not a winning strategy: Pressing into trends IS not a winning strategy: Progressives are not a winning strategy: Don't Buy It! .Don't even take it for free.
rsactuary
rsactuary
Joined: Sep 6, 2014
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April 17th, 2021 at 10:21:58 AM permalink
I think part of the problem is that Canada didn't have a manufacturer in the game. And so when it came time to buy vaccines, they had to wait in line behind countries like the US and the UK who bought up the vaccines being manufactured in their own country.
OnceDear
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OnceDear
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April 17th, 2021 at 10:36:41 AM permalink
Quote: rsactuary

I think part of the problem is that Canada didn't have a manufacturer in the game. And so when it came time to buy vaccines, they had to wait in line behind countries like the US and the UK who bought up the vaccines being manufactured in their own country.

The UK also went its own way in ordering outside of what the rest of Europe did collectively. That and having our own lead with the AZ vaccine puts us ahead of the rest of Europe.

Though there's debate about the efficacy of different vaccines, there's massive cost difference.

Approx cost to the government
AZ = $3 per dose
Pfizer = $20 per dose and needs special lower temperature handling.
Moderna = $15 per dose.
Beware. The earth is NOT flat. Hit and run is not a winning strategy: Pressing into trends IS not a winning strategy: Progressives are not a winning strategy: Don't Buy It! .Don't even take it for free.
jjjoooggg
jjjoooggg
Joined: Jul 13, 2012
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April 17th, 2021 at 10:52:45 AM permalink
Quote: coilman

This is part of the problem

https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/flights-in-and-out-of-ontario-resulting-in-dozens-of-covid-19-flight-exposures-1.5390026

Another is the government slow slow slow roll out of shots. The mayor from my city was on the news yesterday after the new rules came out. When asked if we needed The Red Cross be sent here to help administer shots he replied.... we need the vaccines they cut our supply from 14500 a week to 10000... we shut down sites two days a week because none are available.



It only took 6 months to administer the vaccine for the 2009 swine flu. crony capitalism?
Last edited by: jjjoooggg on Apr 17, 2021
Born in Texas and lived in Texas my whole life.
mcallister3200
mcallister3200
Joined: Dec 29, 2013
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April 17th, 2021 at 11:09:53 AM permalink
Quote: jjjoooggg

It only took 6 months to administer the vaccine for the 2009 swine flu. crony capitalism?

https://www.nature.com/news/2009/090429/full/news.2009.416.html



In the US, there has already been a larger percentage of the population to receive at least first dose than ever took the H1N1 vaccine.

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