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SOOPOO
SOOPOO
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January 7th, 2020 at 10:13:27 AM permalink
Quote: Zcore13



Some of the newer Ultimate X machines clear the multipliers by themselves. I'm pretty sure they came out with an "upgrade" that allowed casinos to have this feature.

ZCore13



Can you offer an explanation why any casino would NOT want to have this 'upgrade' if legal and made available to them?
Zcore13
Zcore13
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Mintybobbartop
January 7th, 2020 at 10:28:57 AM permalink
Quote: SOOPOO

Can you offer an explanation why any casino would NOT want to have this 'upgrade' if legal and made available to them?



I can only answer for myself and my non-Las Vegas experience. I try and keep games as fair as possible. My goal is not to take everyone's money as fast as possible. I want to give people time on a game and entertainment. I know they are coming back and sending someone home to their wife down $500 in 90 minutes is not good for business. This applies to slots and table games.

I usually go with the lowest or closest to the lowest house edge pay tables for Carnival Games. I also usually add an additional payment to any progressive to reduce the house edge and add entertainment value. This is a payment not available on the felt payouts. For example, on High Card Flush, I invented a pay table that included a $1,000 pay for 4 of a Kind. I don't believe any other casino has ever used it.

95% of casinos in the U.S. are not Las Vegas. Not every casino wants to fleece you for every dime with fees, extra charges, the worst odds, sketchy rules or procedures, etc.


ZCore13
I am an employee of a Casino. Former Table Games Director,, current Pit Supervisor. All the personal opinions I post are my own and do not represent the opinions of the Casino or Tribe that I work for.
DRich
DRich
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January 7th, 2020 at 11:42:24 AM permalink
Quote: SOOPOO

Can you offer an explanation why any casino would NOT want to have this 'upgrade' if legal and made available to them?



Generally it costs thousands of dollars to upgrade a machine. It may be that they just don't want to spend the money.
Living longer does not always infer +EV
DRich
DRich
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January 7th, 2020 at 11:45:58 AM permalink
If Gaming knew a casino was going out and clearling multipliers on a regular basis they would not allow it. Most likely the casino is saying that they need to do maintenance on the machine which requires a reset.

The difference between this and a progressive is that the progressive machine has a mechanism to reset the progressive to any level. These non progressive machines do not offer a way to reset the multipliers or bonuses.
Living longer does not always infer +EV
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
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January 7th, 2020 at 12:05:35 PM permalink
Quote: DRich

If Gaming knew a casino was going out and clearling multipliers on a regular basis they would not allow it. Most likely the casino is saying that they need to do maintenance on the machine which requires a reset.

In my OP: "She also mentioned that the gaming agent had some other interesting things to say about Advantage players related to this situation, but I don't want to sidetrack this particular situation."

I think you'll find it very interesting what they told her because it's in direct contrast to what you just said. I want to talk with her again to make sure it's okay to discuss that aspect publicly.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
jjjoooggg
jjjoooggg
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January 7th, 2020 at 12:56:37 PM permalink
Once, i saw a bucket of coins next to a slot machine in vegas. Now I'm thinking someone ran to the restroom and was coming back to continue play.
I belong to an elite group called the "Zombie Outbreak Response Team."
DRich
DRich
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January 7th, 2020 at 1:04:02 PM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

In my OP: "She also mentioned that the gaming agent had some other interesting things to say about Advantage players related to this situation, but I don't want to sidetrack this particular situation."

I think you'll find it very interesting what they told her because it's in direct contrast to what you just said. I want to talk with her again to make sure it's okay to discuss that aspect publicly.



Trusting a Gaming agent may be as bad advice as asking a slot mechanic how a slot machine works. Many are inexperienced and most of them really don't understand the intricacies of slot machines. It might be similar to expecting a police officer to fully understand all of the laws, and I think we all know that many police are naive to many laws.
Living longer does not always infer +EV
jjjoooggg
jjjoooggg
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January 7th, 2020 at 1:46:59 PM permalink
Quote: DRich

Trusting a Gaming agent may be as bad advice as asking a slot mechanic how a slot machine works. Many are inexperienced and most of them really don't understand the intricacies of slot machines. It might be similar to expecting a police officer to fully understand all of the laws, and I think we all know that many police are naive to many laws.



When i took an electrician certification. The teacher said that when he was a journeyman. He complained to the inspector that he was within code. He failed the inspection for the whole subdivision. The journeyman was correct. Later in his career he saw an ad: Electrical inspector wanted, no electrical license required. Inspectors are sometimes more of a witness than expertise.

Weve noticed other code inspectors are uninformed.
I belong to an elite group called the "Zombie Outbreak Response Team."
Zcore13
Zcore13
Joined: Nov 30, 2009
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January 7th, 2020 at 1:51:40 PM permalink
Quote: jjjoooggg

When i took an electrician certification. The teacher said that when he was a journeyman. He complained to the inspector that he was within code. He failed the inspection for the whole subdivision. The journeyman was correct. Later in his career he saw an ad: Electrical inspector wanted, no electrical license required. Inspectors are sometimes more of a witness than expertise.

Weve noticed other code inspectors are uninformed.



That is how most if not almost all State Inspector and Surveillance jobs are in Az. No experience needed. No knowledge of table games needed. No game protection training. Barely any game rules and play training. Yest, they oversee everything.


ZCore13
I am an employee of a Casino. Former Table Games Director,, current Pit Supervisor. All the personal opinions I post are my own and do not represent the opinions of the Casino or Tribe that I work for.
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
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January 7th, 2020 at 4:51:45 PM permalink
Quote: DRich

Trusting a Gaming agent may be as bad advice as asking a slot mechanic how a slot machine works. Many are inexperienced and most of them really don't understand the intricacies of slot machines. It might be similar to expecting a police officer to fully understand all of the laws, and I think we all know that many police are naive to many laws.

This really had nothing to do with how the games work, I'll post it up later. I want to reconfirm for accuracy. The gist of it is... The gaming agent said they were doing this because of Advantage Players and that seemed to be his justification for defending the casinos actions(deleting multipliers).
This guy(the gaming agent) seemed very anti AP according to my source.

He had some other lame argument I'll get into later.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪

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