Steve Wynn Resigns RNC Chair for Allegations

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2018/01/27/politics/wynn-rnc-finance-chair-resigns/index.html

The RNC finance chairman no more

It's funny. It all started with Harvey Weinstein and it's exploded. Anyone remember the McMartin pre school sexual allegations from 1983? After those allegations, arrests and the pretrial investigation ran from 1984 to 1987, and the trial ran from 1987 until 1990. After six years of criminal trials, no convictions were obtained, and all charges were dropped in 1990. Turns out that there was a lot of coaching of children which guided their responses. When the trial ended in 1990, it had been the longest and most expensive criminal trial in American history up until that time.

After the charges involving the McMartin case were made there were allegations coming in from all around the country of child molestation at other pre schools.

I'm not suggesting that the sexual misconduct that is occuring now is not legitimate. In fact, I believe the accusers. I'm just drawring a parallel to past instances of jumping on the bandwagon.

Quote: Greasyjohn

It's funny. It all started with Harvey Weinstein and it's exploded. Anyone remember the McMartin pre school sexual allegations from 1983? After those allegations, arrests and the pretrial investigation ran from 1984 to 1987, and the trial ran from 1987 until 1990. After six years of criminal trials, no convictions were obtained, and all charges were dropped in 1990. Turns out that there was a lot of coaching of children which guided their responses. When the trial ended in 1990, it had been the longest and most expensive criminal trial in American history up until that time.

After the charges involving the McMartin case were made there were allegations coming in from all around the country of child molestation at other pre schools.

I'm not suggesting that the sexual misconduct that is occuring now is not legitimate. In fact, I believe the accusers. I'm just drawring a parallel to past instances of jumping on the bandwagon.

I also saw the comparison. But these are not children coached but adults so this seems a different situation imo

Quote: darkoz

I also saw the comparison. But these are not children coached but adults so this seems a different situation imo

Yes, these are adults who will be trying to cash in. You don't see any poor people being accused, because there is no money in that. Most allegations are probably true, but certainly not all.

The subject of this thread is incorrect. He did not resign for sexual misconduct. He has not admitted to anything, nor has he been convicted. He's actually denied the allegations.

He resigned due to the controversy and publicity of allegations. There is a huge difference.


ZCore13

Quote: Zcore13

The subject of this thread is incorrect. He did not resign for sexual misconduct. He has not admitted to anything, nor has he been convicted. He's actually denied the allegations.

He resigned due to the controversy and publicity of allegations. There is a huge difference.


ZCore13

Valid point. I retitled it.

Hes guilty!

Like all republican holier than thou billionaires who grab women by their pussycats

CRAGA!
Commie Republicans Against Greater America

Quote: Greasyjohn

It's funny. It all started with Harvey Weinstein and it's exploded. Anyone remember the McMartin pre school sexual allegations from 1983? After those allegations, arrests and the pretrial investigation ran from 1984 to 1987, and the trial ran from 1987 until 1990. After six years of criminal trials, no convictions were obtained, and all charges were dropped in 1990. Turns out that there was a lot of coaching of children which guided their responses. When the trial ended in 1990, it had been the longest and most expensive criminal trial in American history up until that time.

After the charges involving the McMartin case were made there were allegations coming in from all around the country of child molestation at other pre schools.

I'm not suggesting that the sexual misconduct that is occuring now is not legitimate. In fact, I believe the accusers. I'm just drawring a parallel to past instances of jumping on the bandwagon.

My theory. This didn't start with Harvey Weinstein. This is backlash to Trump being elected. Stuff that would have, before this election, taken him out of the running simply got ignored.

Look at Gary Hart(bimbo eruption ) John Edwards (unfaithful and impregnated her), John McCain (rumored to have an illegitimate black child), Michael Dukakis (Kitty alcoholic), Thomas Eagleton (wife mentally ill), a dozen others along the way.

Trump was at least in part revenge for Bill Clinton, as well as making Hillary out to be the villain somehow in his philandering.

But the stuff out there is so nasty, and so far beneath what we expect of our leaders, it beggars belief. Nobody needs a score card (pun intended ) at this point. But the serial adultery, impregnating other women while married, going with porn stars and prostitutes, popping into pageant dressing rooms, p###y grabbing bragging, etc, all adds up to a nightmare guy. One who's rich and famous and uses all of that to hurt other people. One who every woman I know would avoid at all costs, as a lover, a boyfriend, a customer, a co-worker, or a boss.

And he got elected anyway. Spent over a year doing one outrageous, unacceptable thing after the next during the campaign. People (mostly men) just made excuses or said it was somehow equivalent to Clinton getting elected and ignored it that way.

Women looked around and said, well, if this is the world we're living in, let's change that world. And started looking at everything they'd previously been less than strident about objecting to.

Several million women marched against his inauguration world-wide. Millions more are networked into telling their stories, both good and bad. And all of this is a ramp-up, taking no prisoners along the way, attack on Trump and the culture that allowed such a f#/^ing moron to be president. (Epithet courtesy Rex T.)

So Harvey Weinstein and everybody else, even Al Franken, have Trump to blame for the disruption of business as usual when it comes to abuse of women, abuse of power, abuse of liberty.

More millions of us marched this past week (not.suggesting as many as last year, but a very significant number - I haven't heard comparisons yet), if nothing else, proving this isn't going away. Thousands of women are running for office, any office. They all have to be filled.

So, there's some perspective from a woman. Most of us don't like having to do it any more than you men who are suffering through it. But I doubt it will die down until Trump is gone,.preferably quickly.

Quote: beachbumbabs

My theory. This didn't start with Harvey Weinstein. This is backlash to Trump being elected. Stuff that would have, before this election, taken him out of the running simply got ignored.

Look at Gary Hart(bimbo eruption ) John Edwards (unfaithful and impregnated her), John McCain (rumored to have an illegitimate black child), Michael Dukakis (Kitty alcoholic), Thomas Eagleton (wife mentally ill), a dozen others along the way.

Trump was at least in part revenge for Bill Clinton, as well as making Hillary out to be the villain somehow in his philandering.

But the stuff out there is so nasty, and so far beneath what we expect of our leaders, it beggars belief. Nobody needs a score card (pun intended ) at this point. But the serial adultery, impregnating other women while married, going with porn stars and prostitutes, popping into pageant dressing rooms, p###y grabbing bragging, etc, all adds up to a nightmare guy. One who's rich and famous and uses all of that to hurt other people. One who every woman I know would avoid at all costs, as a lover, a boyfriend, a customer, a co-worker, or a boss.

And he got elected anyway. Spent over a year doing one outrageous, unacceptable thing after the next during the campaign. People (mostly men) just made excuses or said it was somehow equivalent to Clinton getting elected and ignored it that way.

Women looked around and said, well, if this is the world we're living in, let's change that world. And started looking at everything they'd previously been less than strident about objecting to.

Several million women marched against his inauguration world-wide. Millions more are networked into telling their stories, both good and bad. And all of this is a ramp-up, taking no prisoners along the way, attack on Trump and the culture that allowed such a f#/^ing moron to be president. (Epithet courtesy Rex T.)

So Harvey Weinstein and everybody else, even Al Franken, have Trump to blame for the disruption of business as usual when it comes to abuse of women, abuse of power, abuse of liberty.

More millions of us marched this past week (not.suggesting as many as last year, but a very significant number - I haven't heard comparisons yet), if nothing else, proving this isn't going away. Thousands of women are running for office, any office. They all have to be filled.

So, there's some perspective from a woman. Most of us don't like having to do it any more than you men who are suffering through it. But I doubt it will die down until Trump is gone,.preferably quickly.

Totally agree

At least trump will have accomplished one thing as president

Nonetheless those men who didnt abuse women will not have to worry. Only those that deserve it

Quote: darkoz

Totally agree

At least trump will have accomplished one thing as president

Nonetheless those men who didnt abuse women will not have to worry. Only those that deserve it

I'd like to believe that. I really would.

I'm reminded when of John Edwards stated in an interview that he didn't cheat on his wife while she was battling cancer--only afterwards when she was in remission. Just making a statement like that is incredible.

Powerful men, like Steve Wynn should have hundreds of harassment claims against them. Hundreds of women are constantly trying for a bigger piece of that pie. Just like Trump. The reason is because women use their bodies and sexuality as a weapon and tool to get ahead in the movies, strip clubs, and the business world. If the right woman wants to get ahead all she needs to do is flash her assets and turn on the gas. If she's rebuffed, then she can claim harassment and sue. If she's not then she can advance her career and then play that card at a later date if she needs more money or attention.

Quote: Keyser

Powerful men, like Steve Wynn should have hundreds of harassment claims against them. Hundreds of women are constantly trying for a bigger piece of that pie. Just like Trump. The reason is because women use their bodies and sexuality as a weapon and tool to get ahead in the movies, strip clubs, and the business world. If the right woman wants to get ahead all she needs to do is flash her assets and turn on the gas. If she's rebuffed, then she can claim harassment and sue. If she's not then she can advance her career and then play that card at a later date if she needs more money or attention.

I know u truly believe in thoae convictions

If it is any statement as to how wrong your post is it should be noted that had you made these statements to the lawyers for either team in a harrassment lawsuit you would be quickly dismissed as an unacceptable juror

Quote: Keyser

Powerful men, like Steve Wynn should have hundreds of harassment claims against them. Hundreds of women are constantly trying for a bigger piece of that pie. Just like Trump. The reason is because women use their bodies and sexuality as a weapon and tool to get ahead in the movies, strip clubs, and the business world. If the right woman wants to get ahead all she needs to do is flash her assets and turn on the gas. If she's rebuffed, then she can claim harassment and sue. If she's not then she can advance her career and then play that card at a later date if she needs more money or attention.

The VAST majority of women refuse to prostitute themselves like that. Either to do it, or to lie about what happened.

Unfortunatly it happens far more often than people would like to admit. Movements like the #metoo movement/ witch hunt in Hollywood have given women far too much power.

Quote: Keyser

Unfortunatly it happens far more often than people would like to admit. Movements like the #metoo movement/ witch hunt in Hollywood have given women far too much power.

There is a term in hollywood to describe where women use sex to get a part in a film. Its called the casting couch

If you dont understand why this is a weapon and tool of the men in power and not the women you do not fully understand the history of women in the workplace.

Try to move away from your bias and do some research

The 7.5 Million Dollar payment to the "manicurist" by Mr. Wynn/Wynn Resorts hasn't been denied.

“The majority of women in the workplace are not tender creatures and are largely adept at dealing with all varieties of uncomfortable or hostile situations,” Roiphe wrote in the New York Times in 2011. “Show me a smart, competent young professional woman who is utterly derailed by a verbal unwanted sexual advance or an inappropriate comment about her appearance, and I will show you a rare spotted owl.”


https://jezebel.com/the-backlash-to-metoo-is-second-wave-feminism-1821946939

Much of this absurd movement is the because of absurd platforms like Twitter.

Quote: Keyser

“The majority of women in the workplace are not tender creatures and are largely adept at dealing with all varieties of uncomfortable or hostile situations,” Roiphe wrote in the New York Times in 2011. “Show me a smart, competent young professional woman who is utterly derailed by a verbal unwanted sexual advance or an inappropriate comment about her appearance, and I will show you a rare spotted owl.”


https://jezebel.com/the-backlash-to-metoo-is-second-wave-feminism-1821946939

Much of this absurd movement is the because of absurd platforms like Twitter.

Our President's favorite platform. Coincidence?

Quote: Keyser

Much of this absurd movement is the because of absurd platforms like Twitter.

how real men handle it

There is a whole lot of pussy hat wearing tripe being bantered about in this thread. I blame it all on the great Hugh Hefner departing this world. He was the one keeping it all under control.🤓😜😳🙂

Quote: MaxPen

There is a whole lot of pussy hat wearing tripe being bantered about in this thread. I blame it all on the great Hugh Hefner departing this world. He was the one keeping it all under control.🤓😜😳🙂

Nah trump has stepped in as pornographer in chief. He denigrates women with the same amount of regularity although none of the panache

The issue of sexual harassment and its related themes is nothing new.

Sexual harassment (and worse) has been prevalent in most cultures throughout history, part of a stacked deck to ensure men maintain cultural and social supremacy over women.

Blacks in America were emancipated before women were given the right to vote: think about that.

We men have stacked the deck for far too long: now for whatever reason the playing field is being leveled.

Time to reap the whirlwind: social change is often sudden, dramatic, and rarely pretty.

Quote: Keyser

Powerful men, like Steve Wynn should have hundreds of harassment claims against them. Hundreds of women are constantly trying for a bigger piece of that pie. Just like Trump. The reason is because women use their bodies and sexuality as a weapon and tool to get ahead in the movies, strip clubs, and the business world. If the right woman wants to get ahead all she needs to do is flash her assets and turn on the gas. If she's rebuffed, then she can claim harassment and sue. If she's not then she can advance her career and then play that card at a later date if she needs more money or attention.

They use their sexuality to get ahead in strip clubs, huh? Who would have thought it?

Everything else you said in that post is wrong 99+% of the time, in my opinion. I don't think a woman goes out and gets an advanced degree in Economics, or some other business degree with the long game of just getting in the door so she can, "Use her sexuality," to move up in the ranks.

Maybe they are trying to get one over on Trump, or maybe he just likes grabbing women by the p***y without their consent, or even asking. Considering that Trump openly admitted to grabbing women by the p***y, "I don't even ask," I'm going with the latter.

Not speaking about you, but it always seems like the guys that I have known to sexually harass women are also always the ones complaining about them playing the sexual harassment card. I wonder if they wouldn't, "Play the sexual harassment card," if those guys didn't sexually harass them?

Quote: Mission146

They use their sexuality to get ahead in strip clubs, huh? Who would have thought it?

Everything else you said in that post is wrong 99+% of the time, in my opinion. I don't think a woman goes out and gets an advanced degree in Economics, or some other business degree with the long game of just getting in the door so she can, "Use her sexuality," to move up in the ranks.

Maybe they are trying to get one over on Trump, or maybe he just likes grabbing women by the p***y without their consent, or even asking. Considering that Trump openly admitted to grabbing women by the p***y, "I don't even ask," I'm going with the latter.

Not speaking about you, but it always seems like the guys that I have known to sexually harass women are also always the ones complaining about them playing the sexual harassment card. I wonder if they wouldn't, "Play the sexual harassment card," if those guys didn't sexually harass them?

Maxpens comments also imply that all women are sexual sirens. I know quite a few women who by choice dress to downplay their sexuality and play up their intellectual aspects. And i hate to say it but there are some women who couldn't play up their sexuality if they wanted (overweight or whatever)

Conversely that means there are some women who are just so attractive that they have trouble being taken seriously in the workplace

All of this is the problem of men and their inability to separate their lusts from their professionalism (trump perfect example believing when u r famous all women love for you to grab their jingle jangles)

Im betting if maxpen was ever grabbed by another man on his jingle jangles he would understand what sexual harassment really is

Quote: darkoz

Maxpens comments also imply that all women are sexual sirens. I know quite a few women who by choice dress to downplay their sexuality and play up their intellectual aspects. And i hate to say it but there are some women who couldn't play up their sexuality if they wanted (overweight or whatever)

Conversely that means there are some women who are just so attractive that they have trouble being taken seriously in the workplace

All of this is the problem of men and their inability to separate their lusts from their professionalism (trump perfect example believing when u r famous all women love for you to grab their jingle jangles)

Im betting if maxpen was ever grabbed by another man on his jingle jangles he would understand what sexual harassment really is

If you're referring to MaxPen's most recent post, I took that as a joke. I hope it was, because I thought it was pretty funny.

In fairness, there are a non-zero number of women who do exactly what Keyser is suggesting, but I don't think that makes for an educated, informed, or even sane, default position on women in the workplace.

Also forgotten is the fact that, as you mentioned, a man can sexually harass a man and a woman can also sexually harass a man. I believe that both of those things have occurred on more than zero occasions, it's just not as prevalent. When you talk about reporting the issue, I should assume that reporting in both instances is even less likely due to the degree of embarrassment that a man would feel saying he had been sexually harassed.

At the same time, sexual harassment, in the legal sense, comes with a requirement (generally) that the action be both unwanted and repeated. Personally, if any man is accused of sexual harassment, I don't think there should be any adverse consequences whatsoever until it is proven in the court of law that the thing actually happened. Alternatively, he could settle the matter out of court, and people could make whatever inferences they want from there.

Given that sexual harassment is more readily reported now than it once was, which is the only real change, (I don't think it is happening any more or less often, but ultimately, I think it will happen less often in the future) I think the next step on the societal level is to determine what sexual harassment is or is not. From a social standpoint, I believe it's pretty unclear where the line is, which is what makes certain actions borderline and where subjective interpretations of what constitutes sexual harassment, as well as interpretations of the event itself, can come into play.

Hopefully, the lines will become less blurry in the near future. Until then, I would suggest keeping any form of sex out of the workplace entirely.

Quote: NokTang

The 7.5 Million Dollar payment to the "manicurist" by Mr. Wynn/Wynn Resorts hasn't been denied.

That must have been some haircut.

We are living in the rise of the scorned woman error. Until there is legislation which will deter women from false accusations and suffer the ramifications if found guilty , we will continue to see money-grubbing whores throwing wet Rags at the wall and see which ones stick.

All I can say is that I'm glad I'm not a celebrity! ... I feel like my lawyers phones would be ringing.. Haha

Really?

"Scorned?"

Where do you get off making that ridiculous claim?

Your comment implies the women were rejected by the men: in fact, the claimants did not welcome the advances made against them.

The only "scorn" is mine, for your misogynistic post.

Quote: WatchMeWin

We are living in the rise of the scorned woman error. Until there is legislation which will deter women from false accusations and suffer the ramifications if found guilty , we will continue to see money-grubbing whores throwing wet Rags at the wall and see which ones stick.

All I can say is that I'm glad I'm not a celebrity! ... I feel like my lawyers phones would be ringing.. Haha

Wow. Just wow.

If I were you, and thank God I'm not, I'd have a lawyer on speed dial, because you will need one.

If you were me, reporting to my first ATC job, and

1. The Chief held a meeting with the all-male staff and told them he didn't want any cows in his tower and to wash me out.

2. During my 9 month training period, he refused to speak to me except twice. 3 months in, he called me into his office, told me I did not have permission to speak, and lectured me for 2 hours about how women did not belong in ATC and he wasn't pleased I was doing so well because he didn't want me in his building.

3.A month after that, I was training on local and ground (tower )combined, a busy session, one call after another, a half-dozen planes every where, no radar to help see planes
. And he stood close enough parts of his body were touching mine, crowding me, and every pilot call, he whispered the exact wrong response into my ear, most of which would kill someone if I parroted. It was a mockery of how you do busy ojt, where you prompt the student without taking over so they can grow. It went for about 45 minutes, with my instructor on one side and the chief on the other, and me keeping up but really uncomfortable . I finally repeated the chief, the ojti canceled what I said, the chief said, "see"? And left the operation.

4 Chief didn't speak to me for another 4 months, when I finally got certified. I mean, not one word. Had the supervisor relay like a 2nd grader.

5 My secondary instructor, aware like all of them the chief wanted me gone, told me he wouldn't sign off on my certification until I gave him a blow job. Not joking.

6. My primary instructor, after I certified, told me I owed him a night in the sack because I wouldn't have gotten through it without him. Not joking.

7. 8. 9. To about 32 specific instances just in that job over 23 years. Did any of the men have to put up with any of that in that facility? Nope.

I proved them wrong, those who thought my having ovaries meant I was unqualified. To be fair, some of the men gave me a fair shot from the start. And I truly believe the safety of the flying public is more important than anybody's job. If I couldn't do it, I wouldn't have grieved staying.

Did I EVER report anybody? No. Did I EVER cry or use my female wiles to get a job, a promotion, " get " someone else? No.

I got to the top of my profession on merit. I worked to be twice as good as the men, just to be part of the crew, and I accomplished that, and was a part, and then a leader, and then a national leader. And I DESPISED the few women (and there were a few) who gamed the EOE system., because they made it twice as hard for me and the other women.

But times, they are a changing. You, Keyser, whoever, best be careful, go underground, or get woke. I'm retired, and so are women like me who got along to get along. You will have ZERO chances to learn on-site.

You're missing my point.

Social media sites like Twitter have given way toooo much power to people that simply haven't earned or deserve it. Such sites enable them to attack, then act as prosecutor, judge and jury. It's often times a witch hunt. Then others jump on the band wagon, as the facts and truth become irrelevant. Guilty until proven innocent has become the fashionable trend. Not every claim of sexual harassment is rape, just like every parking ticket isn't a homicide. Not every person that hates the witch hunt is a "woman hater." I find it sad that people like you think otherwise.

Sites such as twitter have done a great disservice to real feminism. Just like Black Lives Matter have perverted twitter... setting back black minorities while other minority groups thrive in this country.

Quote: Keyser

You're missing my point.

Social media sites like Twitter have given way toooo much power to people that simply haven't earned or deserve it. Such sites enable them to attack, then act as prosecutor, judge and jury. It's often times a witch hunt. Then others jump on the band wagon, as the facts and truth become irrelevant. Guilty until proven innocent has become the fashionable trend. Not every claim of sexual harassment is rape, just like every parking ticket isn't a homicide. Not every person that hates the witch hunt is a "woman hater." I find it sad that people like you think otherwise.

Sites such as twitter have done a great disservice to real feminism. Just like Black Lives Matter have perverted twitter... setting back black minorities while other minority groups thrive in this country.

You did better in the rewrite (I read it before the edit). I agree with most of what you said here. However, you negated that, or any thought you understood what I said, with your "people like you think". This is where your blindness shows.

I have said from day 1, a year or better ago, this is a difficult, nuanced problem, that there are degrees of offense, that there is context, prevailing culture, time, witnesses, many other considerations that must be discovered through due process, that frivolous or revenge attacks weaken legitimate complaints and delay workable solutions.

I'm sure I contribute to your ignorance by the length of my posts on this, because they attempt to discuss more than a soundbite and acknowledge the complexity. You see my name, your brain goes, "feminazi libtard" and you scroll on down, then respond with inaccurate generalities.

If you made it this far, surprise! We agree! How about that? Maybe we can move on to fixing the problem. Ya think?

Meh....

I know a cocktail waitress at the Wynn. Normally I don't like to be gossipy but I can't help it to get to my point in this case. She said it was common knowledge at the Wynn that Steve Wynn was quite the playboy and events on his private plane could be full of debauchery. I must add she was never a participant and she also tends to easily believe in urban legends (or maybe she's right). My take from it was that all that whatever happened was consentual (why doesn't my spell checker like that spelling?). My interpretation Steve was probably the instigator most of the time but nobody ever said "no."

So, I am trying to get up to date on where consent ends and sexual harassment begins. I hope to get some female opinions on this.

Quote: Wizard

My take from it was that all that whatever happened was consentual (why doesn't my spell checker like that spelling?).

There shouldn't be a, 't.' You're also missing an, 's.' Consensual.

Quote: Mission146

There shouldn't be a, 't.' You're also missing an, 's.' Consensual.

Dictionary.com link for consentual.

Quote: Wizard

Dictionary.com link for consentual.

And consensual:

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/consensual?s=t

My apologies, have never seen it spelled your way.

Quote: Mission146

My apologies, have never seen it spelled your way.

Please inform Bill Gates.

Quote: Wizard

Please inform Bill Gates.

Will he be at the party on Sunday?

Quote: billryan

Will he be at the party on Sunday?

I doubt it. He never has put in an appearance before, at least when I've been there. I have seen him at the Country Club Grill before.

Quote: Wizard

Please inform Bill Gates.

You can do better. He is a college dropout. And from an institution that often flubs standard English.

Quote: Wizard

I know a cocktail waitress at the Wynn. Normally I don't like to be gossipy but I can't help it to get to my point in this case. She said it was common knowledge at the Wynn that Steve Wynn was quite the playboy and events on his private plane could be full of debauchery. I must add she was never a participant and she also tends to easily believe in urban legends (or maybe she's right). My take from it was that all that whatever happened was consentual (why doesn't my spell checker like that spelling?). My interpretation Steve was probably the instigator most of the time but nobody ever said "no."

So, I am trying to get up to date on where consent ends and sexual harassment begins. I hope to get some female opinions on this.

The problem is its your boss and as a generally low level employee a request can have the force of an order.

For example if you were stopped by a highway patrolman and he said "sir step out of the car i intend to search it"

How do you feel? Its a request or an order? If you have to argue later in court you were ordered without a search warrant and the officer says you voluntarily consented?

Some people will have the steel nerves to ask for a search warrant. Many wont. Its the appearance of power

And the same can easily happen in the workplace. Particularly with billionaire bosses and employees who want to keep their jobs

Quote: Keyser

Sites such as twitter have done a great disservice to real feminism. Just like Black Lives Matter have perverted twitter... setting back black minorities while other minority groups thrive in this country.

You forgot to add the US Presidency in here.

Quote: WatchMeWin

We are living in the rise of the scorned woman error. Until there is legislation which will deter women from false accusations and suffer the ramifications if found guilty , we will continue to see money-grubbing whores throwing wet Rags at the wall and see which ones stick.

All I can say is that I'm glad I'm not a celebrity! ... I feel like my lawyers phones would be ringing.. Haha

Why don't we just blindly believe men and accuse women of being witches again?

Quote: Wizard

I know a cocktail waitress at the Wynn. Normally I don't like to be gossipy but I can't help it to get to my point in this case. She said it was common knowledge at the Wynn that Steve Wynn was quite the playboy and events on his private plane could be full of debauchery. I must add she was never a participant and she also tends to easily believe in urban legends (or maybe she's right). My take from it was that all that whatever happened was consentual (why doesn't my spell checker like that spelling?). My interpretation Steve was probably the instigator most of the time but nobody ever said "no."

So, I am trying to get up to date on where consent ends and sexual harassment begins. I hope to get some female opinions on this.

It may have been consensual (generally accepted spelling), but those who "consented" may also have feared their jobs may have been in jeopardy if they refused.

Quote: darkoz

The problem is its your boss and as a generally low level employee a request can have the force of an order.

Good point. In my ten years with the federal government there were a lot of rules against romantic relationships in the same workplace, especially in the same chain of command. It got even worse in that I was forced to stop carpooling with someone who was the equivalent to an uncle in the chain of command. Quite ironic given the government emphasis on conserving energy.

Quote: Greasyjohn

It's funny. It all started with Harvey Weinstein and it's exploded. Anyone remember the McMartin pre school sexual allegations from 1983?

Yeah, I do.
An alcoholic mental patient accused a local school teacher, the Mayor and the Pope of sexually molesting her little brat that she had left alone in a park for two hours.
The cops sent all the kids (half day and full day) to local "shrinks".
ALL the shrinks reported 'Perfectly normal happy kids" except for ONE shrink who reported that 100 percent of the kids sent to her had been sexually abused. (Does it take an actuarial certificate to wonder about the null hypothesis on that?)
That particular therapist saw only patients who had been abused as children. All her patients no matter their complaints were diagnosed as victims of child sexual abuse.
Reporters failed to point out this statistical monstrosity or how anything would have been difficult when late drop offs and early pickups made that front door a virtual turnstile.

I'm still 1 out of 9 on the list for Rose McGowan's account of the Harvey Weinstein debacle at my county library. I believe her statements to be generally true but I would normally have doubts since the story was largely broken by Ronan Farrow and I have a real hard time believing anything published by Ronan Farrow.

I'm mindful of the recent prosecutions in the UK wherein one 'victim' was raped when she was not even in the UK at the time and another victim alleged she was raped at a certain time in a building that was not even built until six years after the rape took place,.



As to resigning from the RNC, of course Wynn resigned. He had to, based on the accusations and would have had to do so even if the accusations had indeed come from fantasists or a vengeful ex-spouse or a wall street cabal that wanted to pick up Wynn stock on the cheap.

Quote: beachbumbabs

Wow. Just wow.... harrowing experiences

And a great deal of women go through that ordeal.

I had a really long conversation with my 20 year daughter who is in the drama program at my alma mater. Last year, a professor had the hall to slap a woman on a student's behind when talking about sexual harassment, using her as an example, without asking the student of whether he had to consent. He lost his job. My kid gets followed by perverts. She gets leered at on the subway. And as much as I love my daughter, she's isn't a knockout and dresses quite conservatively.

Us men have no understanding what most women have gone through if they want to work in their career. BBB's account doesn't surprise me in the least, unfortunately, and any women trying to achieve equality in a male-dominated profession has to go through gauntlets similar to that, and keep quiet. And even in situations where men have power (everywhere) but don't dominate the workplace, examples of this kind of behavior have been everywhere. Why don't women report? Many reasons. One, a long-standing belief of "that's who guys are - to achieve equality I must acquiesce temporarily to get what I want". Second, a fear of reprisal. Third, a fear of not getting believed.

And now, men are feeling uncomfortable about this latest social trend. Good. It's about time men got a bit of taste of being uncomfortable for once and to feel ashamed of their behavior and even be punished unfairly. Because women in the workplace haven't been treated fairly for decades, and women have now become so upset about it, past a tipping point, that if the damages (civil, losing a job, losing one's reputation, being shamed) are over the top, then too bad.

Does anyone have it harder than rich, white college women? I feel terribly for them. Marky mark set a good example by donating the difference in money he made over his female counterpart. Get ready charities because all the porn actresses are going to be doing the same thing any minute now.

Quote: RogerKint

Does anyone have it harder than rich, white college women? I feel terribly for them. Marky mark set a good example by donating the difference in money he made over his female counterpart. Get ready charities because all the porn actresses are going to be doing the same thing any minute now.

Not quite sure how you mean this, Roger. Sincere or sarcastic, either works. So many people have it worse than me, as a rich, white, college woman. I have had a fantastic life, with many opportunities.

I told that 9 month chunk of my work life because one too many of you don't get how seriously YOU are exposed to losing your jobs or careers over this stuff. I thought it might help you to see why women are so angry, and the kind of thing that's been going on so long. I'm pretty sure 2 of the 3 guys are dead, and the other one is doddering. Not that I'd pursue it now anyway.

Right now, and probably for the next couple of years, you probably can't afford to be personal with any woman at work. It's going to suck and be all PC and wtf stupid and destroy a lot of working relationships.

I gotta tell ya, I have half a dozen stories that are worse. I just didn't tell them here, and probably won't, since I've been doxxed and harassed by some guys I've had to nuke from here.

Saw that "new" forum the other day, btw; new to me ( and several of the regulars here, judging by signup dates), the one DanDruff owns. One of the doxxers seems to have named himself "Beached Whales Clitoris", I assume in my honor. Nice moderation there, Dan. Any of our male moderators get Avatars? I know your festering turd crowd has derisive code names for all of us, but I would think the honor should be shared.

Thanks for the harassment for doing my job here, guys. Thanks for all the backstabbing and whining. Hope you can get the Cheetoh stains out of your tighty whiteys before it's Mom's laundry day.

Don't worry. I only went to your previous dox-hole once. Way to kill a forum, guys. I bet the guys who paid to build it really appreciated your participation. And to think you want this one to be like that.

This was my only visit to the new AnusVille. You go right on telling each other what a POS I am, and I'll go on ignoring you.

Since I've said all that, I will acknowledge that more than a few of you from here have also defended me in those threads, one way or another. I appreciate it.

Quote: tringlomane

Why don't we just blindly believe men and accuse women of being witches again?

"We" now blindly believe any women but accuse a man of whatever women accuse him.

Why can't we just figure this out -- sexual harassment exists and so do those who make false accusations of sexual harassment? I'm not saying either are acceptable (for those who want to twist words). You should be innocent until proven guilty, whether that's in a court of law or in the eye of public opinion. Realize there is usually at least some truths and untruths to both sides of a story, rarely is one side 100% accurate.

Quote: boymimbo

And now, men are feeling uncomfortable about this latest social trend. Good. It's about time men got a bit of taste of being uncomfortable for once and to feel ashamed of their behavior and even be punished unfairly. Because women in the workplace haven't been treated fairly for decades, and women have now become so upset about it, past a tipping point, that if the damages (civil, losing a job, losing one's reputation, being shamed) are over the top, then too bad.

I hope there's a misunderstanding here....but are you saying it's okay for there to be undue damages because of the past? That concept is just.....I can't even find the right word, but somewhere between insane, outrageous, and shallow minded.

Quote: Wizard

I know a cocktail waitress at the Wynn. Normally I don't like to be gossipy but I can't help it to get to my point in this case. She said it was common knowledge at the Wynn that Steve Wynn was quite the playboy and events on his private plane could be full of debauchery. I must add she was never a participant and she also tends to easily believe in urban legends (or maybe she's right). My take from it was that all that whatever happened was consentual (why doesn't my spell checker like that spelling?). My interpretation Steve was probably the instigator most of the time but nobody ever said "no."

So, I am trying to get up to date on where consent ends and sexual harassment begins. I hope to get some female opinions on this.

As I'm sure you know, this is a male dominated board. Aside from BBB, I don't think there are any women here, or at least any that post regarding stuff on politics or "this" sorta stuff.

There's consent, sexual harassment, and rape. There isn't really a fine line separating it all. Men are taught consent is somewhere between "yes" and the woman being willing (ie: woman doing something without being forced). To put it bluntly, if a man requests ______ from a woman and she agrees/complies, is that rape? Well, no, since she consented. Is it sexual harassment? One might say yes because the man is some important figure in the company and the woman may feel pressured into it....but what wrongdoing did the man do? He didn't pressure her into anything, he simply asked or requested....and he knows consent is when she says "yes".

Men are taught they must get consent or else it's considered rape. So they get consent....and now they're being blamed for sexual harassment because the woman "felt pressured" into doing something she later regrets (regretted?) doing. From a man's perspective, what is a man to do? Get consent, have sex, then get accused of sexual harassment even though he got consent!?

I'm not saying all cases are like this. From what I read of the whole Aziz Ansari thing, it seemed to be much more like that. I know there are cases where the boss is like "give me a BJ or else you're fired", where that's certainly at least sexual harassment IMO, but I don't think we need to discuss the obvious.


EDIT: Btw, I'm not lumping BBB's post about her boss at ATC with the kind of thing I'm describing here (as is hopefully obvious).


@BBB -- What forum are you talking about? GF? Or is it that place that rhymes with "penalty box"?

Quote: RogerKint

I respect and admire pretty much everyone here, except Nathan (kidding).

This made me legit laugh and I started coughing. wtf's your problem? #ICan'tBreath

Quote: beachbumbabs

Not quite sure how you mean this, Roger. Sincere or sarcastic, either works. So many people have it worse than me, as a rich, white, college woman. I have had a fantastic life, with many opportunities.

I told that 9 month chunk of my work life because one too many of you don't get how seriously YOU are exposed to losing your jobs or careers over this stuff. I thought it might help you to see why women are so angry, and the kind of thing that's been going on so long. I'm pretty sure 2 of the 3 guys are dead, and the other one is doddering. Not that I'd pursue it now anyway.

Right now, and probably for the next couple of years, you probably can't afford to be personal with any woman at work. It's going to suck and be all PC and wtf stupid and destroy a lot of working relationships.

I gotta tell ya, I have half a dozen stories that are worse. I just didn't tell them here, and probably won't, since I've been doxxed and harassed by some guys I've had to nuke from here.

Saw that "new" forum the other day, btw; new to me ( and several of the regulars here, judging by signup dates), the one DanDruff owns. One of the doxxers seems to have named himself "Beached Whales Clitoris", I assume in my honor. Nice moderation there, Dan. Any of our male moderators get Avatars? I know your festering turd crowd has derisive code names for all of us, but I would think the honor should be shared.

Thanks for the harassment for doing my job here, guys. Thanks for all the backstabbing and whining. Hope you can get the Cheetoh stains out of your tighty whiteys before it's Mom's laundry day.

Don't worry. I only went to your previous dox-hole once. Way to kill a forum, guys. I bet the guys who paid to build it really appreciated your participation. And to think you want this one to be like that.

This was my only visit to the new AnusVille. You go right on telling each other what a POS I am, and I'll go on ignoring you.

Since I've said all that, I will acknowledge that more than a few of you from here have also defended me in those threads, one way or another. I appreciate it.

I'm not sure why this post is directed at me. I have no personal problem with you, or anyone else here. I can honestly say I respect and admire pretty much everyone here, except Nathan (kidding). I've defended your moderating of these forums multiple times. I certainly wouldn't want your job. Where's the upside? Having said that, if people feel they've been wronged by you, it's one thing. If they feel both wronged, and silenced, I could see them going off on some other venue. No, I don't think it's right.