Missouri casino robbery

The first appearance of this was six days ago. This is the most detailed article.

http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/crime-and-courts/jefferson-county-couple-stole-after-discovering-river-city-casino-glitch/article_8c162bb5-b128-5c4e-9262-4673cbe7e197.html

I can't figure out what type of system error creates "unearned wins". Perhaps wins from slots are loaded onto the players cards instead of a tito system?

Quote: darkoz

The first appearance of this was six days ago. This is the most detailed article.

http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/crime-and-courts/jefferson-county-couple-stole-after-discovering-river-city-casino-glitch/article_8c162bb5-b128-5c4e-9262-4673cbe7e197.html

I can't figure out what type of system error creates "unearned wins". Perhaps wins from slots are loaded onto the players cards instead of a tito system?

Nice article. I take it to believe that 'unearned wins' is actually just free play but the reporter is just taking the jargon from however the casino released this story out. This seems to be stealing. And I'll be damned (or PaiGowDanned, I kid) if someone compares this to AP.

Quote: Mooseton

Nice article. I take it to believe that 'unearned wins' is actually just free play but the reporter is just taking the jargon from however the casino released this story out. This seems to be stealing. And I'll be damned (or PaiGowDanned, I kid) if someone compares this to AP.

Okay, I visited the website for the casino and I think I have it figured out. It's not exactly free-play.

The players cards earn what they term "MyCash" which are basically comp dollars on your players card.

However, the player has the choice of how to redeem these comp dollars. For purchases at casino outlets, for free-play or even for same day cashback. The value of the comp dollars differ depending on your choice. purchases are 1:2, free-play is 1:1 and cash back is 2:1 (I think I didn't get the ratios there backwards but cashback is fifty cents on the dollar while purchases each dollar is worth double.)

I imagine what they did with the glitch was discover MyCash dollars were being loaded onto their players cards with a certain set of moves and were then doing cashback. They got less than half of the dollar value according to the article so that falls in line with this surmise.

Here is the casino website info https://www.pinnaclemychoice.com/points-and-mycash

The double up Poker bug also had charges pressed and eventually they were dropped as the glitch was part of actual game-play (even though certain parameters had to be met).

Here, however, I think this would be tantamount to stealing. From what I take away, no wagers were being made so cashback was not coming through any type of actual gambling but simply a glitch that downloaded cashback available dollars. That pretty much is no different than discovering your local ATM has a glitch that spits out money and you proceed to take as much as you can.

I think the no-play aspect of this will be the differential factor between them and the poker double up bug and will sink them as guilty as charged.

So you agree with what I wrote?

I have mentioned it before / but in 2008 isle of Capri properties had a glitch that if you withdrew 1000 dollars in points the system only dedecuted 000 in certain video poker machines
I found it by accident and apparently it was rare to find since a) most people didn't save up the amount equal to 1k in points and then add it that it had to be downloaded to 25cent denom vp and it just rarely happens- it went on for about a week but was probably there for years- I'm still not sure it was ever fixed but the issue was with the connection between the I view system and the game and I'm sure the software has been upgraded by now however shortly after it was still working At other isle of Capri properties .

Quote: Mooseton

This seems to be stealing. And I'll be damned if someone compares this to AP.

It may be an AP move. I don't even know you, but by your own words, I guess you're damned.

The players did not cause the error to be made. They discovered it and exploited it. This is not morally different from the guys who figured out how to abuse the double-up feature on IGT machines. In two jurisdictions (Nevada and Pennysylvania) it was determined it was not illegal to do what they did. And whether you think it is stealing or not, if the courts say it's not illegal, then it's not legally stealing.

If they get a good gambling lawyer (Bob Loeb is out of Chicago. It's not next door to St. Louis, but it's not that far either) they may just get to keep the money --- minus the attorney's fees --- and not do any prison time.

If they roll over and play dead (definitely NOT an AP move), they will do prison, pay a fine, and have to give all the money back and forever have felonies on their record.

FWIW, this is on the list of subjects to talk about on this week's radio show. Our guest is Anthony Curtis.

I haven't read anything about this to make me think they were definitely stealing or not stealing. I'm sure there's more info out there that I haven't read, and TBH, I haven't researched into this. But an article or two saying these people were stealing based on charges filed....is like saying James Grosjean is a cheater and should be in prison because of the files brought against him from Caesars (re: TCP).

Not saying the people are innocent or guilty of cheating/stealing/etc., but that it's not known, at least to me, what they did. But I can imagine several scenarios where it'd be illegal as we as legal. Maybe ththey actually thought that's how their freeplay was supposed to work. Or maybe they're hired a hacker or an inside man to do something wonky....or anywhere in between. Maybe they found out some gaff on accident and then always downloaded their FP that way.

I've seen this wayyyyy to much, casino personal doesn't know how the mistakes happen or they would not happen, so they are confused and call the police or gaming- who don't know how it happened so the bring charges. That's how society works with the justice system - it's really not innocent till proven guilty. Michael Milken is a financial genius yet went to jail for things that are now level since no one truly understood a lot of it at the time. Not that he is the example I'm using for this , just saying it happens. Same reason they ran 2-1 on blackack and didn't understand they player had an edge.