Revel promotion sounds too good to be true
Quote: BuzzardAce of Spades
Quote: 1BB
Yes, the one and only.
Quote: 1BBYes, the one and only.
Now he is in serious trouble. And his law degree will not save him.
WHERE THE HELL IS OUR REPORT FROM HIM ! ! !
Shoot, even if I did and my wife wanted a divorce, I'd still be in the right place! j/k on both counts
Quote: aceofspadesHow come nobody says hello to me? It is only the lurkers with no screen names that whisper my screen name as they pass by - very strange lol
I wasn't 100% sure that it was you. You were talking with two others at the bar and I am too polite to interrupt. I certainly didn't whisper your screen name nor would I ever.
Quote: PokeraddictIt was reported by @BergenBrennan that Revel laid off 75 people today.
Wait...really? 75 of the temporary staff that they hired in order to help with this promotion? Or 75 full-time permanent employees in the middle of the busy season? Or something in-between?
Quote: rdw4potusWait...really? 75 of the temporary staff that they hired in order to help with this promotion? Or 75 full-time permanent employees in the middle of the busy season? Or something in-between?
http://www.northjersey.com/news/Revel_announces_75_layoffs.html
Quote: 1BBI wasn't 100% sure that it was you. You were talking with two others at the bar and I am too polite to interrupt. I certainly didn't whisper your screen name nor would I ever.
That's a good thing 1BB...feel free to interrupt and say hello next time.
Quote: aceofspadesThat's a good thing 1BB...feel free to interrupt and say hello next time.
Quote: aceofspadesThat's a good thing 1BB...feel free to interrupt and say hello next time.
Thanks. My wife was the one who spotted you. She and her friend were playing the slots to the left of the bar and I was sitting with them. She said I should say hello. We'd be happy to meet you next time.
Quote: Pokeraddicthttp://www.northjersey.com/news/Revel_announces_75_layoffs.html
He said the first week of July was the first time in the property's history that it had a profitable week. - See more at: http://www.northjersey.com/news/Revel_announces_75_layoffs.html#sthash.WsTZMRjY.dpuf
they'll lay off 750 on September 3rd.
Quote: dipceHe said the first week of July was the first time in the property's history that it had a profitable week. - See more at: http://www.northjersey.com/news/Revel_announces_75_layoffs.html#sthash.WsTZMRjY.dpuf
they'll lay off 750 on September 3rd.
I would hope that each week in July is a profitable week for Revel. The trick will be staying above the line from August to December when they're bleeding back the loss rebates.
Quote: rdw4potusI would hope that each week in July is a profitable week for Revel. The trick will be staying above the line from August to December when they're bleeding back the loss rebates.
We need a Revel July rev pool. Everyone chips in $x and tries to guess the Revel July revenue. Can they even make the top 50%?
Quote: 1BBThanks. My wife was the one who spotted you. She and her friend were playing the slots to the left of the bar and I was sitting with them. She said I should say hello. We'd be happy to meet you next time.
Likewise - don't be shy!
Quote: BuzzardI love my wife and vice versa. But I don't go out of my way to introduce her to a sharp divorce lawyer. NO WAY
LOL
http://www.digitaljournal.com/pr/1363999
Surely that is a misprint ? ? ?
As always, I welcome comments, corrections, and questions.
One nitpick: I would say "Success Probability" or "Probability of Success" in the tables.
Quote: tringlomaneLooks pretty good overall with a quick glance, but are you assuming 100% return on the freeplay when you are forced to play through it in the overall result?
No, I'm assuming a full 100% rebate. To appease those who say I ruined the Revel promotion, I never mention Revel in that page. The purpose is more for future 100% slot rebate promotions than this one.
Quote: WizardNo, I'm assuming a full 100% rebate. To appease those who say I ruined the Revel promotion, I never mention Revel in that page. The purpose is more for future 100% slot rebate promotions than this one.
Fair enough. But I think adding a blurb that if you are reimbursed in free slot play (like every 100% slot rebate I have seen to date), a comment that you should try to play through the free play with as high of a return as feasible is most optimal. For example, if you choose to play the 85% slot for your freeplay as well as accumulating your losses (stupid move, obv), you'll end up taking a net loss of 13.6 units. Fortunately, I think all the free slot rebates I have been clearly aware of the rules/participated in: Revel, Palms, Cosmo, River City (STL), most video poker was valid.
Quote: tringlomaneFair enough. But I think adding a blurb that if you are reimbursed in free slot play (like every 100% slot rebate I have seen to date), a comment that you should try to play through the free play with as high of a return as feasible is most optimal.
I think that is obvious and would insult my readers.
Quote: WizardI think that is obvious and would insult my readers.
It probably should be obvious to all those who seriously attempt this (at least I would hope), but in the Revel promo thread, I felt that there were some that seemed to have insufficient math skills to clearly determine the rebate and they were definitely not strong enough to run a random simulation, so they looked at you/the Revel thread for a more concrete answer. If a math idiot blindly follows the advice and plays the promo to the max, but doesn't switch machines when appropriate, then he/she could be losing up to an average of $12,000 more on the freeplay leg (85% slot vs. 97% lower-denomination video poker). Since the Revel management already blown the promo, this magnitude of possible misplay during the freeplay phase is fortunately unlikely.
Nevertheless, if your WOO readers (particularly those who do not read WOV) would be truly insulted by a small clarification reminding those to optimally utilize free play, then I would be somewhat surprised and also think those who are insulted need to be a little less full of themselves. Loss rebates are not terribly commonplace, so assuming the common gambler completely understands them is a bit optimistic, imo. Hell, I failed to convince my g/f to do the Cosmo rebate "optimally" earlier this year. And she was definitely pissed that I initially lost my $100 in about 8 minutes playing dollar video poker.
To sum up, clarity is rarely a bad thing, imo.
Quote: WizardI previously posted tables based on a 400-unit bankroll and the Double Diamond slot machine. I just wrote a page based on the Double Diamond game at 85%, 90%, 95% and 98% returns for bankrolls of 25, 50, 100, 200, 400, and 800. This would be appropriate for those with a bankroll of other than 400 units. Please have a look.
As always, I welcome comments, corrections, and questions.
very helpful, exactly what I was looking for
Quote: WizardI think that is obvious and would insult my readers.
As a "new reader", I wouldn't be insulted if we could clarify optimal play for such a promo is $100 max play on the front end & optimal VP on the freeplay.
correct?
Shackleford or Jim Cramer?Quote: 1BBI was in AC this weekend and went to Revel several times on Friday, Saturday and Sunday and not once did I see anyone playing $100 slots. The Pearl Room where they are located was almost always empty even at night. I did get a card with the promotion rules and can refer to it if there any questions although it's all been covered. The other side of the card has the rules for matching the slot offers.
All was not lost though. I think I had a celebrity sighting in the Ultra Lounge. Anyone want to guess who?
Quote: WizardI previously posted tables based on a 400-unit bankroll and the Double Diamond slot machine. I just wrote a page based on the Double Diamond game at 85%, 90%, 95% and 98% returns for bankrolls of 25, 50, 100, 200, 400, and 800. This would be appropriate for those with a bankroll of other than 400 units. Please have a look.
As always, I welcome comments, corrections, and questions.
Do published slot machine return percentages include video poker? Like if a casino says quarter slots return 95% is that just slots or slots and vp combined?
Quote: randomperson
Do published slot machine return percentages include video poker? Like if a casino says quarter slots return 95% is that just slots or slots and vp combined?
Slots and VP/video keno combined in every state's data I've bothered to look at. There is never a separate section for video poker returns that I've seen.
Quote: tringlomaneSlots and VP/video keno combined in every state's data I've bothered to look at. There is never a separate section for video poker returns that I've seen.
So do we have any independent information about quarter and dollar slot machines that isn't contaminated by vp? Quarter and dollar are clearly the two most popular vp denoms so it would seem like it would bias the results. Even though a lot of people don't play 5 dollar vp, the coin in is probably massively more than 5 dollar slots.
Quote: randompersonSo do we have any independent information about quarter and dollar slot machines that isn't contaminated by vp? Quarter and dollar are clearly the two most popular vp denoms so it would seem like it would bias the results. Even though a lot of people don't play 5 dollar vp, the coin in is probably massively more than 5 dollar slots.
Unfortunately, not really. Your best bet would be to find a casino that mainly shuns video poker in a jurisdiction that breaks down each casino by denomination so the bias is less. Otherwise, you unfortunately need to make a good estimate of the slot/vp breakdown at that level and roughly estimate the VP return. A rule of thumb is about 2% less than optimal return. So for a Vegas strip casino, one might figure that 25c video poker returns somewhere between 94.5 to 95% overall.
Quote: tringlomaneIt probably should be obvious to all those who seriously attempt this (at least I would hope), but in the Revel promo thread, I felt that there were some that seemed to have insufficient math skills to clearly determine the rebate and they were definitely not strong enough to run a random simulation, so they looked at you/the Revel thread for a more concrete answer. If a math idiot blindly follows the advice and plays the promo to the max, but doesn't switch machines when appropriate, then he/she could be losing up to an average of $12,000 more on the freeplay leg (85% slot vs. 97% lower-denomination video poker). Since the Revel management already blown the promo, this magnitude of possible misplay during the freeplay phase is fortunately unlikely.
Nevertheless, if your WOO readers (particularly those who do not read WOV) would be truly insulted by a small clarification reminding those to optimally utilize free play, then I would be somewhat surprised and also think those who are insulted need to be a little less full of themselves. Loss rebates are not terribly commonplace, so assuming the common gambler completely understands them is a bit optimistic, imo. Hell, I failed to convince my g/f to do the Cosmo rebate "optimally" earlier this year. And she was definitely pissed that I initially lost my $100 in about 8 minutes playing dollar video poker.
To sum up, clarity is rarely a bad thing, imo.
Has Revel guaranteed that freeplay will be eligible for VP?
Quote: Mission146That's what I was told by Revel, so, no.
I may be math challenged, but that's what I'm sayin
Quote: Mission146That's what I was told by Revel, so, no.
LMAO
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9MGTq0QHWCQ
Quote: randompersonSo do we have any independent information about quarter and dollar slot machines that isn't contaminated by vp? Quarter and dollar are clearly the two most popular vp denoms so it would seem like it would bias the results. Even though a lot of people don't play 5 dollar vp, the coin in is probably massively more than 5 dollar slots.
That has always been my beef. Anything from VP to electronic roulette to electronic BJ is labeled as slot machines, the casino benefits from the inflated numbers, then doesn't count them as slot machines for the purposes of the players club. You would see a lot less VP at places if there was ever a distinction because their usefulness would be less advantageous.
Quote: FleaStiffRevel: Promises made, promises broken.
Okay... this is a humungous thread. Its time for a "Story So Far" introduction so here goes:
What was the original offer?
What terms made it particularly attractive rather than the usual hot air from casinos?
Did the posts on this thread confirm or deny the factors that contributed to the offer being particularly attractive?
Just how attractive are we talking about? That is, should those who live in AC be walkin' 'round unashamedly sporting &*%$-eatin' grins or should those in Las Vegas be packin' some bags and bringing some cash what to do some serious gambling?
Did the offer get changed by the casino in the interim, perhaps due to this thread?
Is it still a Paint Your Wagon and Come Along offer or be this the usual hokum and pablum mixture from a casino?
Got it.
The casino made undisclosed and perhaps unforseen changes in the high area game room, though since those changes were the ones identified at this site as the best opportunity it does seem the changes were not pre-planned by the casino.
The casino unwisely backed off only some AP players, not all thus turning the program into some arbitrary and capriciously whimsical experience for the players who had expended funds and allocated time in reliance on the previously disclosed terms of the program.
Quote: FleaStiffEarly discussions of this should have perhaps said East Coast Casino so as to avoid tipping off "the enemy".
Yeah. The folks at Revel would surely still be wondering which casino we were discussing.
I have softened my views a bit since I first read this thread. If Revel had been caught completely off guard, they still could have shut down the $10 and $25 VP in a short time on July 1st when they saw what was happening. Even clueless management would realize that having every $25 VP game being played by people with Nevada addresses was not going to be good for them. By law, they would need to get the players to stop playing before they changed the games. However, revoking the slot cards would get the AP's to stop playing long enough to change the games.
The Revel did not need to figure out the scamming before August 5th. In fact, it would have been better for Revel if they had been clueless about this until the scammers had capped out at $100K losses. If the scammers litigate, the best they might do is to get a loss rebate for the amount of their theoretical loss for their tracked play. This would be a fairly small amount that would not justify return trips from far away. Anyone who thinks they can have someone else collect their rebate is in fantasy land.
I have still had no luck convincing any AC locals that this is a good promo. This includes many slot players and poker players. They just don't get the math and they think free play is worthless. Only the AP's instantly recognized this as a good promo. Some of the people who read this thread seemed to have a hard time understanding it.
Quote: LossRebateYeah. The folks at Revel would surely still be wondering which casino we were discussing.Quote: FleaStiffEarly discussions of this should have perhaps said East Coast Casino so as to avoid tipping off "the enemy".
What I meant was that if early discussions had been less specific about naming the casino involved, there is then at least a hurdle that has to be hopped prior to some suit getting an email, whereas once the name is mentioned its possible someone will send it to an executive as a matter of course even if they don't understand its import at all.
When Biloxi had a misprinted Sic Bo layout there was a fairly early tip-off to the casino also. Word spreads, faces get recognized, etc.
Its a fine line between a thread of general interest and a thread that provides too much information to management too soon.
Well, I hoped that experimented did well.
As always, I welcome comments, questions, and especially corrections.
Revel to Close Poker Room by August 15th
http://www.uspoker.com/blog/revel-to-close-poker-room-by-august-15th/4935/
Quote: 7star4nowGamblers wanted?
Revel to Close Poker Room by August 15th
http://www.uspoker.com/blog/revel-to-close-poker-room-by-august-15th/4935/
What will they put in its place?
Quote: 1BBSoup kitchen?
I don't like soup :(
