Misdeals and other casino faux pas
Come on everyone - give us your best and worst stories
When the House Money 21 bet was new at Pala, there was ambiguous behavior as to if dealer BJ was checked before, or after HM21 was rendered which lead to some tremendously frustrating bets. The casino answer was that dealer BJ is checked after HM21 is rendered. The player answer was to migrate to tables that checked it before.
Pechanga:
During the first few days (haven't tried it since) Card Derby was installed, the 'catch' that prevented you from endlessly grinding both Red/Black was ignored, mostly because the dealer had no idea what was going on. (Even bets paid only half if the 2 of Spades showed up before it finished.)
In Ace's situation we would have handled it exactly the way the Revel did, except without his "happy ending". For anyone that's never had an opportunity to use a peeker on a bj table it can be extremely difficult to see if there's anything showing. Our High Limit room is the worst of all our pits due to the lighting causing a glare.
Blue Heron: Let it Ride: dealer turns over wrong card. 2nd card turns out to complete a two pair. Cost $20. Pit is apologetic, offers nothing.
Quote: MonkeyMonkeyIt depends on the situation but where I work we typically either offer the players the chance to take their bets back and not be in the hand, or play it out and any losing hand is a push. I find the first one to be completely fair and the second to be extremely generous. But that's just how things work at the evil ol' casino.
In Ace's situation we would have handled it exactly the way the Revel did, except without his "happy ending". For anyone that's never had an opportunity to use a peeker on a bj table it can be extremely difficult to see if there's anything showing. Our High Limit room is the worst of all our pits due to the lighting causing a glare.
Nice to know not every casino feels compelled to reward petulant behavior.
" tries to tell me that a dealer mistake cannot benefit me and goes on to state that if the
dealer had accidentally hit a soft 17 and noticed her mistake, they would roll the tape back and repay
everyone's money if nobody notice - I was ready to shout B***S***!!!"
My line on the casino doing repaying everybody is the first real 1-100 price since Man O War.
As for Aces asinine argument the BY should count as 21, had he had 20, the line on him letting the house
keep his $200 10,000 to -1.
Dealer shows Ace, asks "Inshurenn?"
Nobody takes it, she looks and says "Nobahdy ho" Hand continues.
Every one has to hit their hand and each of us make a point total of 18 or better on our hands but no 21s.
Dealer turns over a 5 and pulls an Ace! Yippee we all think, until she points and says "Dealuh hit sof Sebenteen" Catches a 9, then an Ace.
We all breathe a sigh of relief until, she counts it a few times and then pulls another card and it's a 3!?!?!?
Suddenly an uproar breaks out and we all in unison say "She hit Hard 17!!!" before she can start taking our money.
Pit Boss comes over and says "What happened?"
She goes "I hit sof Sebenteen and get tree, dey get mad!"
We quickly rebuked "No way, she hit her Soft 17 and it became Hard 17, then she hit it again!"
After several minutes of review and the Pit Boss counting the cards in the order they came out, he decides "Because nobody stopped the dealer from taking the card and we can't back the cards up, it's a misdeal! So you can play the hand as it is or take your money back."
Needless to say, a barrage of hands reached for their money simultaneously and left the table muttering various curses as they walked away.
Quote: 1BBThe three should have been burned. This was a pit boss not a floor?
That's what we protested, but he said it's in play because nobody stopped the dealer or informed her she had a "Hard Sebenteen!" and had she busted nobody would complain and they would have to pay us the same way.
Pit boss was probably just a dealer posing as one. Still shake my head at that one.
Quote: BedWetterBetterHad a confusing scenario occur at Ballys AC about 10 months ago.
Dealer shows Ace, asks "Inshurenn?"
Nobody takes it, she looks and says "Nobahdy ho" Hand continues.
Every one has to hit their hand and each of us make a point total of 18 or better on our hands but no 21s.
Dealer turns over a 5 and pulls an Ace! Yippee we all think, until she points and says "Dealuh hit sof Sebenteen" Catches a 9, then an Ace.
We all breathe a sigh of relief until, she counts it a few times and then pulls another card and it's a 3!?!?!?
Suddenly an uproar breaks out and we all in unison say "She hit Hard 17!!!" before she can start taking our money.
Pit Boss comes over and says "What happened?"
She goes "I hit sof Sebenteen and get tree, dey get mad!"
We quickly rebuked "No way, she hit her Soft 17 and it became Hard 17, then she hit it again!"
After several minutes of review and the Pit Boss counting the cards in the order they came out, he decides "Because nobody stopped the dealer from taking the card and we can't back the cards up, it's a misdeal! So you can play the hand as it is or take your money back."
Needless to say, a barrage of hands reached for their money simultaneously and left the table muttering various curses as they walked away.
Just as in my scenario that was quite controversial here on the boards, no matter what, the casino will always find in its favor.
Quote: aceofspadesJust as in my scenario that was quite controversial here on the boards, no matter what, the casino will always find in its favor.
The difference, of course, being that your scenario didn't do a damn thing to anybody. You lost just like you should have lost. They pushed a hand they should have won.
Quote: bbvk05The difference, of course, being that your scenario didn't do a damn thing to anybody. You lost just like you should have lost. They pushed a hand they should have won.
That was not my point - my point was that the casino will find in favor of the casino!
Quote: aceofspades
That was not my point - my point was that the casino will find in favor of the casino!
Which isn't true either. Tons of casinos make pro-player rulings.
Quote: bbvk05Which isn't true either. Tons of casinos make pro-player rulings.
OK I am editing this:
ATLANTIC CITY casinos will find in favor of ATLANTIC CITY casinos. Anytime there was even a hint of a card falling off the table or anything liek that in VEGAS, they dealer tells floor person and floor person always gives a player option. However, in AC, I have never seen a pro-player ruling.
Quote: aceofspadesOK I am editing this:
ATLANTIC CITY casinos will find in favor of ATLANTIC CITY casinos. Anytime there was even a hint of a card falling off the table or anything liek that in VEGAS, they dealer tells floor person and floor person always gives a player option. However, in AC, I have never seen a pro-player ruling.
I was always treated fairly in AC, and I played there extensively at nearly all properties in the 90s and 00s. My first unfair ruling (in my opinion) was at a CT Casino. First time I ever got mad. That stinks that your experience was different.
Quote: cclub79I was always treated fairly in AC, and I played there extensively at nearly all properties in the 90s and 00s. My first unfair ruling (in my opinion) was at a CT Casino. First time I ever got mad. That stinks that your experience was different.
Yeah I do not think I ever got a favorable ruling on the floor.
Quote: aceofspadesYeah I do not think I ever got a favorable ruling on the floor.
Is that because they are unfair or because you ask for bogus rulings like your most recent? Do you have better examples than your most recent one?
My only unfavorable ruling was once when the dealer pulled a 10 out and flipped it up on my 11 while I was grabbing chips for a double down. The floor wouldn't let me double, even though I'd never asked for a card, motioned or done anything but grab chips. Offered to let me out of the hand. Thanks pal! Let me back out of my 21!
My favorite pro player ruling was at a full table... Dealer has a 10 up and accidentally exposes the ace she had for a second card by losing her grip. We are all staring at her blackjack. I have 250 out. Dealer calls for floor and says. I exposed this ace which was my second card. Floor calls over the table games director. Looks at the large bets. He says ... So the ace was the second card? I know they are about to take the money, as they have the right to.... Then he asks... "Who wants insurance?" Lol, hell yeah. One old lady at the end said "never take insurance," but we cajoled her into using her brain.
Quote: BedWetterBetterHad a confusing scenario occur at Ballys AC about 10 months ago.
Dealer shows Ace, asks "Inshurenn?"
Nobody takes it, she looks and says "Nobahdy ho" Hand continues.
Every one has to hit their hand and each of us make a point total of 18 or better on our hands but no 21s.
Dealer turns over a 5 and pulls an Ace! Yippee we all think, until she points and says "Dealuh hit sof Sebenteen" Catches a 9, then an Ace.
We all breathe a sigh of relief until, she counts it a few times and then pulls another card and it's a 3!?!?!?
Suddenly an uproar breaks out and we all in unison say "She hit Hard 17!!!" before she can start taking our money.
Pit Boss comes over and says "What happened?"
She goes "I hit sof Sebenteen and get tree, dey get mad!"
We quickly rebuked "No way, she hit her Soft 17 and it became Hard 17, then she hit it again!"
After several minutes of review and the Pit Boss counting the cards in the order they came out, he decides "Because nobody stopped the dealer from taking the card and we can't back the cards up, it's a misdeal! So you can play the hand as it is or take your money back."
Needless to say, a barrage of hands reached for their money simultaneously and left the table muttering various curses as they walked away.
I'm curious... what difference to the story does writing out the dealer dialog phonetically make? I think the subtext may be eluding me, can you explain?
Quote: aceofspadesYeah I do not think I ever got a favorable ruling on the floor.
That has not been my experience. I can only speak to blackjack where I have logged thousands of hours since the 1970s. That includes Atlantic City where I was one of the first through Resorts' doors in 1978. I have seen a lot but one constant has always been casinos bending over backwards to keep players happy even when those players were clearly wrong.
Here's one that happened in Connecticut recently and it's not the first time. There were two of us at a table. Player to my right is dealt 10,5 and I 10,3 against the dealers 6. In a momentary lapse the dealer dropped an 8 on the player's 15 after a clear stay hand signal. Pit boss declares the 8 the next card to be played and explains that if neither of us want it it would go to the dealer and then burned if the dealer can't use it. She then told me I'd be nuts if I didn't double which I did. The dealer had an ace under and had to stay. The guy lost either way but I won because of the dealer's mistake. Guess what? The guy didn't threaten to leave, whine, complain or ask for a push nor should he have.
I'm not promoting casinos just telling it like I've seen it over and over again. My opinion of them closely mirrors that of one James Grosjean. I won't print it here but many of you know what it is. It's easy to look up for those who may be curious.
The dealer then reaches for the shoe and deals 3B a 10, which busted her hand. Just as the dealer was about to take the womans bet, the whole table erupted at the same time at the dealer. We all told the dealer that 3B indicated to stay. The dealer immediately realized his mistake and called the pit boss over. The pit boss asked 3B and every play before her in order if they wanted the card. Everyone indicated no. Turns out the dealer didnt need the card either so it was put to the side. At the beginning of the next hand, the person sitting at 1B got dealt the 10
Quote: MonkeyMonkeyI'm curious... what difference to the story does writing out the dealer dialog phonetically make? I think the subtext may be eluding me, can you explain?
It appears the dealer has english as a second language and is asian, I think.
https://wizardofodds.com/ask-the-wizard/dealers/
Pit boss says bets stand and looks at me as if to say, "you know enough to know this is a correct call."
$5 table so I didn't care.
Quote: 1BBI'm not promoting casinos just telling it like I've seen it over and over again. My opinion of them closely mirrors that of one James Grosjean. I won't print it here but many of you know what it is. It's easy to look up for those who may be curious.
What is Grosjean's opinion?
Quote: aceofspadesWhat is Grosjean's opinion?
From James: "Casinos are vile places, a total scam, a total con."
Quote: BedWetterBetter. . . he decides "Because nobody stopped the dealer from taking the card and we can't back the cards up, it's a misdeal! So you can play the hand as it is or take your money back."
Did you even have a chance to stop her? What a bill shit response!
I would have told them to get a gaming official.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/gamingfloor/6764803679/
" They should have just insisted she now take another card ?
Reading some of these stories makes me want to stay away from AC - every confusing/controversial situation I've ever seen in LV was resolved in favor of the players.
Quote: NostronYeah thats bullshit - its definitely not the players job to tell the dealer when she's done taking cards.
PaigowDan would disagree.
Hard Rock Tampa (I couldn't play 1cent vig Bubble Craps, all seats were full):
New shoe. Dealer takes cards from shuffler, player cuts, and he puts cards in the shoe and starts to deal. First player gets a 10, second a 2, and OOPS, he didn't burn a card. Floor comes over, and says he has to burn the 10, and back up the 2 to player 1. There was little argument and no offers to change bets. Player 1 actually got a 9 with his 2, and the dealer upcard was 6, but didn't want to double because NOW he was pissed about not getting the 10. He hits, gets 21, dealer breaks and everyone wins. We actually all won the first 4 hands of the shoe, but player 1 was grumpy after that for the next 15 minutes!
In this case, I don't think it changes anything, the card that was supposed to be burned was burned; the 10 was really never his.
Quote: DJTeddyBearDid you even have a chance to stop her? What a bill shit response!
I would have told them to get a gaming official.
Nah Teddy, we were kind of distracted by the lucky break of a dealer NOT improving their Soft 17 that we didn't have a chance to stop her.
We thought she was messing around by reaching in the shoe and whipped that card down before anybody had a chance to yell "STOP!"
Since it was a $10 table and nobody had more than that bet, we didn't make a big stink and expressed our opinion by walking away with our money.
I left the casino and went elsewhere, don't know about the rest.
But it was clear if they couldn't hire competent dealers, who barely spoke english, then they obviously didn't have competent pit bosses to over rule their mistakes either!
What's funny is, a few times at this same Casino. The dealer made 21, fairly, and thought he/she busted out and paid the table. One time for me on a $50 bet with another $50 double down. So perhaps it was the Cosmos trying to get me back for a HUGE favor done previously!?!?
Quote: IbeatyouracesThe "unseen blackjack" happened yesterday while I was playing. Unlike what happened to AoS, everyone hit and busted against the 10 up card. Noone complained.
Happened to me at Mt. Airy a few weeks ago. Dealer 10, "Nobody Home" or so it would seem.
I hit 12, get a 9!
Dealer flips an Ace???
I knew it was a loss and didn't complain(Sorry Ace!) but I just kept muttering, "Lose money with 21, that's a first and only at Mt. Airy!" to keep needling the dealer.
It was about 1:20 on a Saturday afternoon and I immediately hit the cash out button and ran to the poker room to find out there were only five tables and about five empty seats. I immediately bought in for $120 and thought I was making a brilliant move: fewer than 50 players, a $120 buyin, and a ten grand guarantee.
I took my seat and about a half hour later I had almost doubled up when the tournament director came over to the table and said "we still need twenty more players to meet the guarantee."
"Whoa!!!" I screamed out. "The announcement was a ten thousand dollar guarantee. There was nothing about meeting a minimum!"
"No," the TD said, "we have to reach a minimum of players."
And just then the casino staff announced again over the loudspeaker "just a few seats left in our ten thousand dollar guaranteed...." And I said "did you hear that?"
A few minutes later the TD came back to the table and said "we're sorry for the error, if you would like your money back we'll give you a full refund."
Well, at that point, having doubled up, I couldn't bail out of the tournament. (Had I been losing, I would have!) And I accepted the good will gesture of offering the full refund. But I don't think they will ever make that mistake again.
Quote: BedWetterBetterNah Teddy, we were kind of distracted by the lucky break of a dealer NOT improving their Soft 17 that we didn't have a chance to stop her.
I thought you were distracted by her command of the English language. BTW, are you going to answer my question?
Quote: IbeatyouracesAll of this reminds me of Soaring Eagle in mid Michigan. They would deal a hole card but they did not have the mirrors nor did they manually check for blackjacks. You made all your decisions as normal. If the dealer had a bj, you'd get and doubles or splits back though. Also you would bet insurance, then play out your hand before the dealer flipped over the hole card. The eventually installed the mirrors.
That's exactly what most casinos did before mirrors or lights were installed and it wasn't all that long ago. One of the largest casinos in the world, Foxwoods started out doing that. The current method is a way to speed up the game to increase their profits. That's why I don't know what all the fuss is about when the dealer forgets to check or a light malfunctions.
I just hope it doesn't happen in a positive shoe.
Quote: BuzzardWell, a certain weasel here got them good last weekend. Not naming anybody, but he does rank higher than a King.
Buzz - sometimes you tell me you are just needling me and joking around, then you come in here and call me a weasel. can you at least put a #sarcastic hashtag on it? Although I might believe you are being sarcastic, others who do not know you might interpret your words as mean spirited.
I will also echo what others have said on this board. I mostly play AC and have had a few dealer error issues over the years. Mostly at CET properties or the Taj. With only one exception that I can remember, they have always resolved the dispute fairly for the players. Usually they give the option of continuing in the hand or pulling back your wagers. I've even seen them do this on occasions where the dealer has accidentally exposed her down card or some other situation favorable to the player.
