need help huge issue - very complex

So........ long story short I need advice


I had an situation where I was leaned on extremely hard for a favor by a key executive at a casino. the favor involved a decent amount of cash, well above the 4 figure mark. I was not comfortable doing it personally but said I could make a couple of phone calls. Turns out nobody was interested because they all felt the story was a little fishy on his end. I explained that to this person and they essentially asked me to call a few other people and said they would help me out and add some freeplay on my account. Keep in mind I am already heavily compensated for my play here and easily get over 1k a week in incentives. I made the phone calls and set it up and in the end when it came down to it the person who was going to lend the money backed out again because the story sounded fishy. Low and behold I call today to get my normal freeplay and am told I am overcompensated already and cannot get anything due to what was added onto my account. So know im screwed and cannot get anyhting for months. What would you do?
If anybody really has experiance with this please pm me and I will give more details- just dont want to disclose anything super sensitive on here

Cut & run. You don't want to get you or your associates stuck for thousands+ in case this turns out to be a bad deal. Unless you know a tough loan shark who can handle himself...

You can cultivate new relationships at new casinos with your level of play.

Never dealt with this before. But it strikes me as extremely inappropriate for a casino executive to ask a customer for money. Be it a loan, investment, or otherwise. It just crosses a line, especially if it's affecting their treatment of you as a customer(which it sounds like it is). I'd say it demands to be reported to the casino control commission or whatever it's called where you play. However if you want/need to keep a low profile letting it go might be your next best option.

Quote: vendman1

Never dealt with this before. But it strikes me as extremely inappropriate for a casino executive to ask a customer for money. Be it a loan, investment, or otherwise. It just crosses a line, especially if it's affecting their treatment of you as a customer(which it sounds like it is). I'd say it demands to be reported to the casino control commission or whatever it's called where you play. However if you want/need to keep a low profile letting it go might be your next best option.

Unfortunately, "Casino Executive or Host" is just a title, freely given to people, and (apparently) does not require background checks. You'd be surprised at what I dig up when I Dox some of the hosts around this town.

>I was not comfortable doing it personally ..........
That is the key right there.
>Turns out nobody was interested because they all felt the story was a little fishy on his end.
Then you shouldn't have even been willing to make the phone calls.

Sounds like it was an expensive reminder.

I would report the guy to the appropriate people. Based on your play you probably have other friends in just as high if not higher places.

just for clarification this is not a host, this is clearly upper level management not ceo level obviously but well into the 6 figure range of income and authority level

Before determining how to otherwise respond, you could approach the "key executive" about the elimination of your comps and enquire as to why it happened; don't accuse, do strongly imply.

Let him know that you tried to hook him up for a loan, but that you failed due to no fault of your own, and that that if the comps are not promptly restored to their former level, you will have no choice but to bring your tale of woe to the attention of his boss.

That should get his attention.

ok sorry guys more qualification, i normally get through my host 750-1500 a week- its not the host fault, but he cannot comp me now because I am wayyyyyyyyyyyyyy overcompensation based on play now, its just a bad situation overall, im sure some of the people invlved probably read this board- my main issue is I could push the person for more free play based on the situation but im worried that I get a phone call from gaming, in otherwords at what point is what he gives me a problem on me, or is it strictly a problem on him?

Quote: GH

Unfortunately, "Casino Executive or Host" is just a title, freely given to people, and (apparently) does not require background checks. You'd be surprised at what I dig up when I Dox some of the hosts around this town.

HUGE background checks are required for an executive of a casino operator. Hosts are hired guns. ALL are human, and some develop money problems or habits of various natures.

Reportable with substantiation, your call. All very sad to hear.

yes its a total

Quote: strictlyAP

ok sorry guys more qualification, i normally get through my host 750-1500 a week- its not the host fault, but he cannot comp me now because I am wayyyyyyyyyyyyyy overcompensation based on play now, its just a bad situation overall, im sure some of the people invlved probably read this board- my main issue is I could push the person for more free play based on the situation but im worried that I get a phone call from gaming, in otherwords at what point is what he gives me a problem on me, or is it strictly a problem on him?

He retaliated by putting the kibosh on your freeplay, but you did not really have it coming? I would definitely be concerned that you would be seen to be 'in cahoots'. In fact the question indeed becomes,

Just why were you getting this excess freeplay if it was not tit for tat?

Something does not compute.

my concern is not the he retaliate, long story short he is now the only one that can add anything on my account because of the ratio- but at what point does it become a problem, ie if an executive that you are friends with add 10k is it your fault or his?

Quote: strictlyAP

my concern is not the he retaliate, long story short he is now the only one that can add anything on my account because of the ratio- but at what point does it become a problem, ie if an executive that you are friends with add 10k is it your fault or his?

Um, its not just an executive you are 'friends' with. It is an executive that you are arranging a 'loan' to that is giving you unearned money from his employer. Do you need Perry Mason to tell you the rest? I would move on to another casino, and NEVER have any more contact with that 'friend'.

It's an executive that was looking to steal from his employer to secure a personal loan from a customer. Not a situation I'd want to be around any longer.

When in doubt, walk away.

AP I would walk to a different casino. if he was hooking you up with free play over and above what you earned and then later asked for a "favor" it could get sticky. Harrahs AC just got fined by the gaming commission because a Pit Boss gave a celebrity undocumented free play like casino chips that were never paid back and they got in trouble. Look with your level of play I bet you make friends at a new casino really fast.

I'm sure the CEO would be very interested, and might compensate a customer who brought this blot on his institution to his attention. You are probably not the only whale in the pond, so reporting this behavior to the appropriate Exectutives could be a service to many of your fellow high level players. The Casino management has an obligation to report to Gaming, so I don't think you need to worry about going to them... yet.

you are right, im sure he owes other players, or has had this issue in the past, but I dont know whether to go to gaming or his boss, or let t sleep. defintely dont want to let it sleep and then have it come back on me, I mean if a dealer gve an extra 500 chip on every win, you would clearly be arrested, but im not sure if this is or is not the same thing, especially since I do give heavy heavy play there

I'd find it hard to look at it as the same thing, I mean, if you play Blackjack, then you know how much you are supposed to get paid on a winning hand. You'd basically be sitting there and knowingly taking House money from the overpaying dealer.

In your scenario, however, it would be really tough for someone to look at you as complicit in the affair, because who the Hell really knows how much free play they are supposed to be getting? It doesn't seem that you knew you were being overcompensated going in. I suppose it may have been better for you to not have attempted to do anything in regard to trying to get him this loan, or investment, or whatever it was...but the way you present the story (if there was an overabundance of Free Play) it seems like it was just this guy paying it forward in case he needed you for something in the future.

I think that you should consider talking to an attorney if you wish to pursue the matter of reporting him to Gaming or his higher-ups, and the attorney would likely know who you should report it to and exactly what you should say. If not, then just see if the matter goes away on its own by taking your business elsewhere. I imagine that it will because it is doubtful that this guy is going to report himself for trying to get loans from players. I don't personally see how you would be legally required to report this to anyone, but again, only an attorney could answer that question with certainty.

Just pout and tell him it has nothing to do with gambling.

its just a really bad spot for me to be in, i normally got these offeres anyway it just now all in one week instead of over time- i know this cannot only be me that he is doing it with so im leaning towards going to his boss but I dont want it turned around on me, i mean all they have to do is look and see the freeplay issued and they would see the problem but i just dont want to end up getting baneed or somethng

why do i get the feeling this thread will soon be used as evidence

Quote: strictlyAP

you are right, im sure he owes other players, or has had this issue in the past, but I dont know whether to go to gaming or his boss, or let t sleep. defintely dont want to let it sleep and then have it come back on me, I mean if a dealer gve an extra 500 chip on every win, you would clearly be arrested, but im not sure if this is or is not the same thing, especially since I do give heavy heavy play there

I'd go straight to the CEO. You could phrase it as an "FYI" describing your discomfort with the unusual request. I would speak plainly. You were pressured into helping and got frozen out.

I don't understand everyone telling him to report it - seems he is just as complicit in this mess as the casino employee in question.

Cut and run, and be more discriminating in the future.

Quote: AcesAndEights

I don't understand everyone telling him to report it - seems he is just as complicit in this mess as the casino employee in question.

Dunno about that ...

I got the idea he got the comps based primarily on play, and not as a Quid Pro Quo.

Clarification would be welcome.

Quote: Paigowdan

Quote: GH

Unfortunately, "Casino Executive or Host" is just a title, freely given to people, and (apparently) does not require background checks. You'd be surprised at what I dig up when I Dox some of the hosts around this town.

HUGE background checks are required for an executive of a casino operator. Hosts are hired guns. ALL are human, and some develop money problems or habits of various natures.

I always thought when a host had the word "Executive" prepended to their title, it only had an "atta boy" significance.

Quote: strictlyAP

just for clarification this is not a host, this is clearly upper level management...

Thanks for the clarification.

Quote: MrV

Dunno about that ...

I got the idea he got the comps based primarily on play, and not as a Quid Pro Quo.

Clarification would be welcome.

Exactly, at first there was no hint of Quid Pro Quo. But now it seems like maybe the OP thinks that he is being over comped with free play. This is a quagmire for the executive and the customer. So please clarify OP...do you feel like this executive over comped you expecting something in return?...Also do you get the sense that he's done this for other players?...If so you either need to walk or report it. Doing nothing is bound to come back and bite you in the ass.

I still think he should speak to an attorney. I'd change my vote from, "Do nothing," if I could, except, "Talk to an attorney," wasn't an option.

A manuever such as, You didn't scratch my back, is a kind of extortion move. Shakedown.

Or maybe not, but most here seem to think it's fishy at best. And if so, I agree.

for clarification i used to get 750- 1500 a week in offers and free play
after being asked for a favor i was given apprx 4-5 over three days


my normal offer is tues and saturdays

when i called today i was told i am overcompensated andcannot get anything

issue is a I KNOW I WAS OVERCOMPENSATED- but the bigger problem this creates is i use those over to build play and create future offers,without offers I wont play and no there are no offers which equals no offers in the future ruined everyting obviously - im just in a really bad spot with this and this location is a major income source which just got cut at its feet-
do give people a rough idea
at this property mycoin in ytd is 500k for slots and a daily theo in tables of 2k with three trips per week

I could be totally wrong, but I would assume that this may be a "free play loan" in the computer's mind and if you kept your play up to "pay it back", offers would eventually return. I'm not sure if the dude you're dealing with did anything special for you though. :( That's really a guess though, I know very little about the comp game since I am poor/cheap.

he definately gave me extra freeplay for needing a favor, now it totally screwed me up

This is a really simple issue at this point that I think is on the brink of being more complicated.

Here's the short answer: take the high road. Once you are on the high road, go a little bit higher.

There are so many ways to make money in this world. But the path you are shining your flashlight on, if it is to be a long road, is going to go in the downward direction.

Take your eyes off the short term of this path, and take the high road. Stop worrying about the money and start worrying about your reputation, ethics, and morals.

If you get ripped off by someone else who's not ethical, SO WHAT? Do not associate with them. EVER.

The last time I got ripped off, a plumber charged me $250 for 5 minutes of labor. I had to eat it in the end because it wasn't worth worrying about.

But EVEN IF IT WAS $3,000, I have no recourse, in general, but to take my lumps and move on. I don't want my life to be about dealing with unethical people and I do not want to be associated with them at all!!

At a casino, at the level you are playing, relationships between you and the casino's personell are important. Formulas no longer apply. You are given "freeplay", comps, and other clerks not only based on your amount in play, but your character as well.

Inotherwords, your comps are at the discretionary level where a person or group of people give you your comps based on variables that the other ones don't use.

Your executive violated the boundary between casino and player when he hit you up for a favor. He used his power as a casino executive to give you extra comps, then took them away when you couldn't / didn't help him. It's absolutely wrong of him to do that, and if he doing the same things with the other big fish, that's wrong too. Taking personal gains from a relationship with a customer is not only morally wrong, but it's fraudulent.

In my world (software consulting), we take courses on business ethics and learn that it's not okay to offer or take bribes. We're not allowed to entice customers or potential customers with things or services that make us look anti-competitive. If I take a client out for lunch, it can't be extravagant. We're all limited as to what we can offer a customer for compensation for loyalty.

Once that boundary has been crossed, your relationship with the casino has changed. You are now aware that the amount of free play is no longer based on a formula but on an inappropriate relationship with an employee who is embezzling his company for personal gain.

And certainly, all employees, to some extent, embezzle and steal from their company, be it taking office supplies home to taking advantage of a policy to using your work time to perform personal tasks.

However, what this employee is doing is blatantly wrong and he needs to be corrected for his actions.

I would sever my relationship to the casino. Then, many months later, I would write a letter (anomymously if you believe safety would be an issue) to someone at least two levels above him at the casino. Writing to his boss may have no effect as they may be complicit or have a working relationship to allow coverups.
Let the chips fall where they may: you've reported him (as you should).

If the casino's executive is smart they will take corrective action because I would assume that they would want someone with that signing authority to protect the interests of the company before himself and make objective decisions. And if they do nothing, well it's their loss.

thanks for all the input, just got into a really bad situation, hopefully it works out, I have done nothing thus far

You were overcompensated and you used this overcompensation to make money and earn more compensation. If I have that correct, for how long were you being overcompensated before being asked for a favor. If it was for months and months it would be difficult to prove any correlation, but if was only say for a little while and then you got hit up for a favor a correlation might be suspected as a Quid Pro Quo sort of deal and that could look bad. BTW, sorry to break the subject but how do you have an AP Play with 500K in slots? Do you think it would be harmful to you to just move on to another casino?

The thing none of us can answer is what did he need the money for and if you do report this, do you put yourself in any personal danger? You may not know who he is dealing with and what he needed the money for. Like most gambling towns, there is "Street Money" all over Vegas and they are not too picky on who they lend it too, they only expect it back with interest. He could already be on the hook with someone like this and if so, your best bet is to run, not walk, far away and find somewhere else to play. JMO

Quote: hook3670

BTW, sorry to break the subject but how do you have an AP Play with 500K in slots?

When he wrote that, I assumed he meant ~100% video poker. If he really meant slots, I would be interested to know his secret!

mostly slots to be honest, just because its slots doesnt mean that they cannot be ev- or at least they were , most of the ap plays are now gone as of the last two weeks