Meet our newest "green" admin.

Quote: Buzzard

I can eat 100 McNuggets. ...

Don't tell Mission nuggets are 20 for $5
during the Olympics..

They were before the Olympics, kind of cute that they would have a, "Special promotion," to advertise the friggin' prices that they already had going. It's no wonder why I can't stand McDonald's, that, and their coffee.

I try not to frequent any of the franchise food places. They are just brutal on small business's. Run enough specials that the little guy can not compete.
Franchises were once a way for a guy with a little money to get rich. No more. Need millions to buy franchises that are often sold for multiple units in an area.

Oh, Lord, my name is in green. What was I thinking??? lmao...man, does that jump out at you.

Nice post, Mission. I agree; let's have fun.

Probably means you are Irish. You know that old saying:

" You can always tell an Irish woman, you just can't tell her much ! "

Quote: beachbumbabs

Oh, Lord, my name is in green. What was I thinking??? lmao...man, does that jump out at you.

Nice post, Mission. I agree; let's have fun.

This isn't fair, nobody told me you were going to look better in Green than I do!!!

Over moderation is what usually kills most
forums eventually. It's wrecked four that I
know of, including GG. That place was hot
3-4 years ago, now it's totally dead because
of over moderation. Too many cooks spoil
the soup is a saying that comes to mind.
It comes down to dueling mods, who can
justify their position the most by suspending
people to such a degree for minor offenses,
that members become afraid to post and go
elsewhere.

We'll see.

Quote: EvenBob

Over moderation is what usually kills most
forums eventually. It's wrecked four that I
know of, including GG. That place was hot
3-4 years ago, now it's totally dead because
of over moderation. Too many cooks spoil
the soup is a saying that comes to mind.
It comes down to dueling mods, who can
justify their position the most by suspending
people to such a degree for minor offenses,
that members become afraid to post and go
elsewhere.

We'll see.

It's my goal to have a very light footprint; useful but not oppressive. I'm a free speech advocate, but my overriding guidance is, Mike's house; Mike's rules. That's been Mission's example, and I expect to follow it.

Quote: Mission146

This isn't fair, nobody told me you were going to look better in Green than I do!!!

Get real. She looks better than you do, period.

Quote: EvenBob

Over moderation is what usually kills most
forums eventually. It's wrecked four that I
know of, including GG. That place was hot
3-4 years ago, now it's totally dead because
of over moderation. Too many cooks spoil
the soup is a saying that comes to mind.
It comes down to dueling mods, who can
justify their position the most by suspending
people to such a degree for minor offenses,
that members become afraid to post and go
elsewhere.

We'll see.

BBB and Mission are absolutely not the sort of people to get into something like that. Even though I've never met either one of them, it's completely clear that that's the case. Wizard is smart enough to avoid putting people like that in charge.

Congratulations BBB! You have always been level-headed and I think you will do a wonderful job.

Quote: beachbumbabs

It's my goal to have a very light footprint; useful but not oppressive..

That's fine, doesn't change the fact that
over moderation is what kills most forums.
Everybody wants it run their way, no matter
who the owner is. The only way to successfully
moderate a forum is to have one person with
the power to suspend, the other mods just
bring it to that persons attention. Even with
two mods, the suspensions were very uneven.
Pierce tends to be lenient and Mike tends to
be the king with the guillotene. If Mike and
you and Pierce would decide who gets to do
the suspending, it would run much smoother.
But I'm betting nobody wants to give up that
power, that's the whole point of being a mod,
the power you get that goes with it. I've been
a mod, I know.

Quote: EvenBob

That's fine, doesn't change the fact that
over moderation is what kills most forums.
Everybody wants it run their way, no matter
who the owner is. The only way to successfully
moderate a forum is to have one person with
the power to suspend, the other mods just
bring it to that persons attention. Even with
two mods, the suspensions were very uneven.
Pierce tends to be lenient and Mike tends to
be the king with the guillotene. If Mike and
you and Pierce would decide who gets to do
the suspending, it would run much smoother.
But I'm betting nobody wants to give up that
power, that's the whole point of being a mod,
the power you get that goes with it. I've been
a mod, I know.

Like a mod from the 60's or a moderator hereon?

Levity ladies and gentleman…levity.

Quote: aceofspades

Like a mod from the 60's or a moderator hereon?

I was on the Mod Squad, actually. I was the
faceless cab driver DickyBig who was a police
snitch.

Quote: EvenBob

It comes down to dueling mods, who can
justify their position the most by suspending
people to such a degree for minor offenses,
that members become afraid to post and go
elsewhere.

We'll see.

The best justification for my position would be never having to suspend anyone. I'd really rather people follow Administration's example on how to post properly and deal respectfully with potential conflict than even have a reason to ban anyone in the first place.

I don't log on to WoV for a couple of hours and this happens!!!! :)

Happy day!!! I'm very proud of you babs and I know you will do a fantastic job! You are intelligent, level headed and non partial.

I think the mods on here just got stronger! If that is even possible :)

Well done again!

Quote: beachbumbabs

It's my goal to have a very light footprint; useful but not oppressive. I'm a free speech advocate, but my overriding guidance is, Mike's house; Mike's rules. That's been Mission's example, and I expect to follow it.

I think that approach is ideal, and is the reason why you were the member best suited for this role.

What are the odds that we would get two new green admins in two days? I don't know, but get ready to welcome Face as another full admin.

Face is not just a great member but a great guy, as far as I can tell. He is a cool-headed guy who knows gambling very well as well as such things as playing hockey and driving in snow without chains.

I also appreciate his participation at DiversityTomorrow. What few active members we have there score a lot of points with me.

This is part of my plan to put more cops on the beat. So welcome Face as agent 005. In case anyone is wondering, here are the other green admins:

000 -- Wizard (always start counting at 0)
001 -- JB
002 -- MichaelBluejay (since demoted to regular member)
003 -- Mission146
004 -- BeachBumBabs
005 -- Face

Yeah, FACE!!!! Good choice, Wizard! Welcome, Face!

Where's DJ? -000?

Way to disregard EB's comments on over moderation, Michael. That's not to say that I don't think Face is worthy, because he definitely is. I'm just agreeing with EB's point of over-moderation is all.

That said, congrats Face! :)

Now if you add JuicieJennie to the list, well, try it and see what happens.

Quote: Mooseton

Where's DJ? -000?

He was a secret admin. Not that I don't appreciate the service of the secret admins, but only the "green" admins get a number.

WTG Face man!!!! :)

The three volunteer admin team has a very well balanced in perspective. I applaud the team and wish them well.

Welcome Face, if you remember that's you still with all the concussions.

Quote: Wizard

(always start counting at 0)

So if I have three cupcakes in my lunchbox, I should start counting at 0 and say I have two cupcakes?

Zero has many very important places in mathematics, but counting is definitely not one of them. I do not understand the debate about whether or not to include zero as the first of the natural numbers. We start counting at 1 because that's what you have if you count one of something.

Quote: sodawater

So if I have three cupcakes in my lunchbox, I should start counting at 0 and say I have two cupcakes?

Zero has many very important places in mathematics, but counting is definitely not one of them. I do not understand the debate about whether or not to include zero as the first of the natural numbers. We start counting at 1 because that's what you have if you count one of something.

Yeah but what if you don't have any? You need a number for that, and that's where you start counting.

Also, three cupcakes? Really? You should consider sharing.

Quote: AxiomOfChoice

Also, three cupcakes? Really? You should consider sharing.

I know, my doctor says the same thing.

Quote: AxiomOfChoice

Yeah but what if you don't have any? You need a number for that, and that's where you start counting.

If I don't have any cupcakes, I don't have any cupcakes to count. I can't start counting all the things I don't have; that would take me a very long time.

If I have no cupcakes, and someone asks me how many cupcakes I have, I can say 0. But then if someone gives me a cupcake, that's Cupcake 1, not Cupcake 0. Cupcake 0 doesn't exist because 0 cupcakes would mean I have no cupcakes.

If a forum had 0 admins, and then an admin joins, he would be admin 1. If you called him admin 0, there would be no differentiation between the time the forum had an admin and didn't have any admins.

Quote: sodawater

If a forum had 0 admins, and then an admin joins, he would be admin 1. If you called him admin 0, there would be no differentiation between the time the forum had an admin and didn't have any admins.

The number of each admin is the number of admins before him or her.

I'm not just being facetious. This is similar to one way that the natural numbers can constructed in set theory (each number is the set of all previous numbers. 0 is the empty set. This has some very nice properties, including |n| = n for all n.)

It's also similar to how the first hour of the day is hour 0, not hour 1. You are counting the total number of full hours to come before the current hour.

Quote: Wizard

000 -- Wizard (always start counting at 0)

Unless you use Red7 or another unbalancd count obviously

:)

Quote: AxiomOfChoice

It's also similar to how the first hour of the day is hour 0, not hour 1. You are counting the total number of full hours to come before the current hour.

That way of counting only works for hours because hours are broken down into minutes. Thus, from 12:01 thru 12:59 we are still on hour zero because hour 1 has not been completed yet. It doesn't work for counting admins, as admins only come in wholes... We either have 0 admins, or we can have 1 admin. So the first admin should be counted as admin 001 because it's immediately a whole admin.

Quote: AxiomOfChoice

The number of each admin is the number of admins before him or her.

That makes sense, but I have one problem with that definition... if we didn't have any admins ever, the number of admins before him is 0. But if we have 1 admin, the number of admins before him is also 0. That makes logical sense, of course, but it's the only time when we add an admin that the number of admins before him doesn't change. That's why I think it's a mistake to start at 0 when counting discrete data.

Quote: AxiomOfChoice

It's also similar to how the first hour of the day is hour 0, not hour 1. You are counting the total number of full hours to come before the current hour.

It does make a lot of sense to start at 0 for data that is continuous in everyday life, like time. Because before you complete that first hour or day or year or any arbitrary unit of time, there was time before that existing.

You could also argue that cupcakes are continuous, not discrete, because you can have 0.05 of a cupcake if you cut a cupcake into 20 equal pieces. So maybe my cupcake example wasn't very good.

But for discrete things, like people, it makes more sense to start at 1.

Integers themselves are discrete, not continuous! So that's my best argument for starting the counting numbers with 1.

One final thing to consider:

I believe all continuous data are just illusions that appear because we don't have the technology or knowledge to measure or comprehend the discrete data that lies beneath it. Everyone thought distance was continuous, but it turns out it's discrete, because there is such a thing as a shortest distance in quantum physics. Same thing with time. I couldn't come up with any measured data I would be confident to say is always continuous. Everything becomes discrete if you go deep enough.

Now, this makes sense if you believe, like I do, that the Bayesian probability what we experience as reality is actually a computer simulation. (This is based on the idea that artificial realities are possible, and since there would be many, many, many more stacked layers of simulated reality compared to the one level of "true reality" the conditional probability we live in one of the simulations is very high.) Since computer simulations would always drill down to bits of discrete data, we should count things we experience in our physical universe starting with 1.

Greetings!

It seems like I just did this whole, "Welcome to the team," thing...

I don't know that there is anything I can say about Face that I haven't already said, I have a tremendous amount of respect and appreciation for the guy. He's certainly one of the most level-headed and likable people on the Forum, so it'll be great to have him aboard.

He's a genius, though a few more concussions may knock him down to my level, and his patiently Philosophical (Zen, if you will) approach to life will lend itself well to fair, impartial, and even-handed Moderation. Dude's brilliant, enough said.

Congratulations, Face!

My condolences Face :-)

Have always enjoyed your posts, hope this herding cats thing (I can be your first suspension for using the word "cats") doesn't interfere with the quality and/or quantity of your contributions. Mission recently cited 4 hours a day which can certainly be a drag...

Edit: fix fat-fingering

Congratulations Face! Funny thing is, I had no idea you had such aspirations!

Wow! two in a week...

Good folks too!

Nothing wrong with spreading the work around.

SFB

0 vs. 1 ???

I guess if we didn't have any admins/moderators at all, we'd still have the Wizard.

Quote: Doc

0 vs. 1 ???

I guess if we didn't have any admins/moderators at all, we'd still have the Wizard.

Nope, null and zero are not the same.

It's the rise of the greenies! Best wishes, Face. Or should we address you as 005?

Quote: sodawater

But for discrete things, like people, it makes more sense to start at 1.

Integers themselves are discrete, not continuous! So that's my best argument for starting the counting numbers with 1.

Sure, but that's not what he was doing. Wiz is making a computer science/programming reference to storing the administrators in a list or array. In software programming, arrays are ordered lists of things indexed by number, and the first index is always zero. There's a historical reason for this. If you want to store 5 things like numbers in a list, and each number is 4 bytes, you need to allocate 20 bytes of space. Then when you want to access the location for a particular number, you need to know where they are. That's where the index comes in. The array itself is stored at a location or "address" in memory, say 0x10C0. The first 4 bytes at that location are used to store the first number, the second 4 bytes are used to store the second, etc.

But here's the thing: the actual location of the first thing in the array is just the address of the array itself. However, the actual location of the second thing in the array is the address of the array, plus one times the size of each thing in the array. Similarly, the third thing in the array is located at (the address + 2*4 bytes). In fact, that's one way to access any part of an array, at least in a lower-level programming language like C. You always start with a "pointer" to the address of an array:
int *myarray;
so the first thing in the array is just at location *(myarray), or if you prefer *(myarray + 0). You can get access to the 3rd thing in the array by referring to
*(myarray + 2)
-- the computer understands how big each thing in the array is (that's what the "int" tells it), so it knows that +2 means to skip the first two items and point to the third. However, the notation *(myarray+2) is rarely used; instead, most of the time you'll write myarray[2]. That's the typical array index notation. myarray[2] refers to the 3rd element of an array, just like myarray[0] refers to the 1st element of an array.

And that's why programmers start counting at zero. They're not referring to the ordinal number of things in the list, they're referring to where they are relative to the beginning of the whole list.

Quote: sodawater

So if I have three cupcakes in my lunchbox, I should start counting at 0 and say I have two cupcakes?

No, but you were to number them they should be cupcakes #0, #1, and #2.

If I were ever on a sports team (what are the odds of that?) I'd ask for jersey number zero.

Thanks all for the surprisingly kind words. I am very appreciative =) I guess I'll give a little speech to help soothe the apprehensive...

First, for those worrying about over moderation, I wouldn't. I personally have already been a secret admin here for over a year. Most of what I did was keeping the place tidy. You mess up a quote tag? I went in and fixed it. You guys in the Stock Pick thread destroy a page with table formatting errors? I went in and fixed it. When's the last time you remember spam or a first time poster's links? I was a ninja on those guys, often whacking them within a handful of views.

The bans on regular members I've dealt were obvious and egregious violations of the rules and regs which, while often against people I very much like and were sometimes as hilarious as a MickeyCrimm Friday Night post, had to be done ;) In almost all cases, my random appearances in heated debates with encouragement to keep it civil were how I moderated, and how I hope to continue.

I've always been highly appreciative for what Wiz has done here as it helped me personally and professionally in more ways than I can convey with words. Assisting him in this way was something I offered as a way to "give back". And with that being said, I'll remember something he said back when I first met him and we were discussing WoV. Wiz said he wanted a place that attracted intelligent people and ideas, and with that, I think he and this site have been an explosive success. That comment of his is the one that stuck with me most, and one which would be fair to say holds the most weight for me, the one I try to uphold the most.

Those with join dates of '09-'11 remember what this place used to be. A ban list never existed. Bannings never existed. To hear a jab or a sarcasm laden post was so foreign is was almost shocking the rare times one surfaced. That's not to say it was sterile, because it certainly wasn't. It was just more civil, more "like a sir". Discussions were just as intense (maybe even more so), debate was as hot as ever, but with the exception of two (famous? infamous?) members, things were, above all, polite and courteous.

I'd like to return to that, and I'd like to do so before "drama" becomes the main reason people tune in. I know Wiz feels similar. I hope you feel the same.

Much like Mission, I feel rules and bans should not be necessary. I hope, by the addition of what appears to be unanimously respected members as admins, that said respect will be the new order of the day. Not "from you to us", but from each member to every other member. That is my hope.

In closing, thanks again for your support, and here's to the WoV!

P.S. - Buzz, you can still call me Sheriff. I suppose it's only fair, now ;)

Quote: Wizard

No, but you were to number them they should be cupcakes #0, #1, and #2.

If I were ever on a sports team (what are the odds of that?) I'd ask for jersey number zero.

As captain of the math team in high school, I commissioned an artistic friend to make us T shirts. I gave our team the name "Bayside Radicals", and I got to wear the coveted number 'pi'.

I'll just repeat what I said when I saw the first announcement.
(And hope that Buzz doesn't think it was meant for him.)

Quote: DJTeddyBear

As a former Blue (Secret) Administrator, all I can say is, you have my sympathy. ;)

Quote: SOOPOO

As captain of the math team in high school, I commissioned an artistic friend to make us T shirts. I gave our team the name "Bayside Radicals", and I got to wear the coveted number 'pi'.

Samuel "Screech" Powers?

Quote: wudged

Samuel "Screech" Powers?

lol! I was going to ask if Valley was their chief rival. Glad I'm not the only one who noticed the name:-)

All I know is that is admin 007 is not from the British Isles, there's gonna be trouble.

Quote: BleedingChipsSlowly

It's the rise of the greenies!

Just an idea: would not the admins (not the Wizard, of course! But then he's #000, so he is entitled to his own preferred treatment) would not the admins like to post in blue when they just participate in a discussion, without admin status, and reserve the green for their official interventions?

I offer the idea to unban Tournamentking or Princeofpawns so the mods can have someone to toy with and practice their skills. He can be like Kenny from South Park. Torturing him seems like it would be fun for the mods like a fox hunt. Even if he behaved, he would still be banned randomly and abruptly.

Congrats Beachbumbabs.