patent attorneys

i know a lot of people have recommended some of the top attorneys (rich newman, jon muskin). just wondering if anyone with experience with them could give feedback on how it was working with them, and if they've obtained their patent? how were they at problem solving? (i understand its been a challenge to get casino games patented). communication? etc. plaese PM me, any feedback would be much appreciated.

What is it with you and private messages? When you asked me this same stuff in a PM, I told you to ask publicly, so that everyone could benefit from the answer. Then here you are, requesting a PM response.

Whatever.

I recommend that anyone that has info to supply, to post it here rather than to send a PM. Thanks.


I used Richard Newman for my Poker For Roulette patent. Galaxy Gaming is a client of his, so the conflict of interest prevented him from reviewing my agreement when I signed with Galaxy. I used Jon Muskin for that.

Those guys are the only names mentioned on WoV for gaming patents.

As far as if there were any challenges or problems that they needed to deal with, I had lots of conversations and emails, but it was all years ago, so I don't really remember too many details.

Quote: mountpleasantt

i know a lot of people have recommended some of the top attorneys (rich newman, jon muskin). just wondering if anyone with experience with them could give feedback on how it was working with them, and if they've obtained their patent? how were they at problem solving? (i understand its been a challenge to get casino games patented). communication? etc. plaese PM me, any feedback would be much appreciated.

I've worked with both attorneys, and both are consummate professionals with deep, hands-on experience with gaming industry IP.

None of that matters if your proposed invention is unpatentable, and there is no "problem solving" that can be done to fix that. However, if you do have a gaming invention that's deserving of IP protection, you're far more likely to have a good result working with either Jon or Rich than an IP prosecutor outside the industry. I review a lot of patents written by attorneys or agents (or worse, inventors) who don't have gaming experience. It's one thing to get a patent. It's another to get one that's worth licensing or selling.

Lol. I would love to see how worthless pro se patents are since Alice.

One thing to keep in mind. There's a saying in the industry that attorneys will file anything if you pay them. An attorney would file a patent for a mason jar if you paid him (that he knows won't get protection). So although I wouldn't expect them to lie to you that your invention is patentable, they really don't know until they get that first rejection. They can only guess and don't be surprised if they err on the side of filing rather than abstaining.

If you don't use a special deck or device, it gets much harder.

Quote: ahiromu

Lol. I would love to see how worthless pro se patents are since Alice.

One thing to keep in mind. There's a saying in the industry that attorneys will file anything if you pay them. An attorney would file a patent for a mason jar if you paid him (that he knows won't get protection). So although I wouldn't expect them to lie to you that your invention is patentable, they really don't know until they get that first rejection. They can only guess and don't be surprised if they err on the side of filing rather than abstaining.

If you don't use a special deck or device, it gets much harder.

A lot of inexperienced inventors have inventoritis -- they think their invention is the best thing since sliced cheese. So they won't listen to an attorney who tells them their combination of craps and blackjack is obvious in view of (a) craps, (b) blackjack, and/or (c) the bazillion other combinations of craps and blackjack. If the client says "prior art be damned, file it anyway," I'm pretty sure the attorney is obligated to do so.

But I'm not an attorney, and if one of my clients comes to me with a terrible idea, I'll tell them so. That won't stop me from crunching numbers on a game I know can't be patented. Math is math, and if someone wants to know the house edge on a game that will never see the inside of a casino, who am I to argue? Case in point, I've done numbers for a few cee-lo variants. One for a guy who even claimed to have a patent on it. (For those who are unaware, cee-lo is a variant of a centuries-old Chinese dice game).