On the fly progressive calculations

I've been using the Wizard's video poker analyzer (https://wizardofodds.com/games/video-poker/analyzer/) but I wanted to find out if there was an easier way to figure out non-royal progressive amounts. I've come across many paytables where the progressive starts as low as 4OAK on Deuces, to 4 aces with a kicker on DDB. Of course as the lower progressive goes up the return of the game gets higher quicker since the frequency is less, so I wanted to find out an easy way such as calculating 1000 credit increase in royals = 0.5% increase. A quick and easy lookover will help me determine whether or not it's worth sitting on a game.

Another rule I've heard is that if you double a 4OAK you are getting a 5% advantage. Basically I want to know how much credits added would equal = 0.5% edge since I can reference that number with the royals.

Quote: djatc

I've been using the Wizard's video poker analyzer (https://wizardofodds.com/games/video-poker/analyzer/) but I wanted to find out if there was an easier way to figure out non-royal progressive amounts. I've come across many paytables where the progressive starts as low as 4OAK on Deuces, to 4 aces with a kicker on DDB. Of course as the lower progressive goes up the return of the game gets higher quicker since the frequency is less, so I wanted to find out an easy way such as calculating 1000 credit increase in royals = 0.5% increase. A quick and easy lookover will help me determine whether or not it's worth sitting on a game.

Another rule I've heard is that if you double a 4OAK you are getting a 5% advantage. Basically I want to know how much credits added would equal = 0.5% edge since I can reference that number with the royals.

No need to look at the analyzer. Just look at the strategy. WoO always gives the return from each type of hand in the strategy.

Assuming that you make no strategy changes, you can just modify this for the progressive. So if a certain hand normally is worth 2%, but it is paying 1.5x because of a meter, you can add 1% to the return of the game.

Again, this assumes that you don't make any strategy changes. If you do (and the changes are correct), your return will be higher.

Edit: I mean the game's return table, not the strategy. Like this: https://wizardofodds.com/games/video-poker/tables/double-double-bonus/

Quote: djatc

I've been using the Wizard's video poker analyzer (https://wizardofodds.com/games/video-poker/analyzer/) but I wanted to find out if there was an easier way to figure out non-royal progressive amounts. I've come across many paytables where the progressive starts as low as 4OAK on Deuces, to 4 aces with a kicker on DDB. Of course as the lower progressive goes up the return of the game gets higher quicker since the frequency is less, so I wanted to find out an easy way such as calculating 1000 credit increase in royals = 0.5% increase. A quick and easy lookover will help me determine whether or not it's worth sitting on a game.

Another rule I've heard is that if you double a 4OAK you are getting a 5% advantage. Basically I want to know how much credits added would equal = 0.5% edge since I can reference that number with the royals.

Theres no substitute for knowledge of game payback and the frequencies involved. If the 4 Queens quarter 10/7 progressive is at $1150 then convert the extra $150 into bets (150/1.25) then divide that number (120) by the royal frequency (48,000) to get the add-on (0.25%).

If its a deuce multiway progressive and there is a meter on the 4K that starts at $5....and u know the frequency (16)....and the meter is at $5.75 then divide the extra 6 tenths of a bet by 16 to get the add-on (3.75%).

If there are 50 extra bets in a straight flush meter and u know the frequency is 9200 then divide 50 by 9200 to get the add-on, etc.

Quote: mickeycrimm

Theres no substitute for knowledge of game payback and the frequencies involved. If the 4 Queens quarter 10/7 progressive is at $1150 then convert the extra $150 into bets (150/1.25) then divide that number (120) by the royal frequency (48,000) to get the add-on (0.25%).

If its a deuce multiway progressive and there is a meter on the 4K that starts at $5....and u know the frequency (16)....and the meter is at $5.75 then divide the extra 6 tenths of a bet by 16 to get the add-on (3.75%).

If there are 50 extra bets in a straight flush meter and u know the frequency is 9200 then divide 50 by 9200 to get the add-on, etc.

P.S. It helps to have a pocket calculator with u at all times so you can make on the fly calculations. I never leave home without one.

Quote: mickeycrimm

P.S. It helps to have a pocket calculator with u at all times so you can make on the fly calculations. I never leave home without one.

Why not just use the calculator app on your phone?

I just figure every 1000 coins adds .50% for the royal. It's a lot easier than going through all the math. On games that I know have a little longer cycle I know that estimate is going to be a little high, and if there's 6000 extra coins on the progressive it's going to be a little low. One could use whatever version of that is easiest for them. i.e. 100 coins = .05%, 500 coins = .25% etc.

If I need to know more precisely than that, I'll just use the Winpoker app on my phone. It's faster than I could do any math on a calculator anyway.

Quote: vetsen

I just figure every 1000 coins adds .50% for the royal.

The question was specifically for non-royal progressives.

I just wander by the machine, note the payouts, wander to the bathroom and use this:

https://wizardofodds.com/games/video-poker/strategy/calculator/

Unlike the analyzer, this still works on your smartphone.

Quote: mickeycrimm

Theres no substitute for knowledge of game payback and the frequencies involved. If the 4 Queens quarter 10/7 progressive is at $1150 then convert the extra $150 into bets (150/1.25) then divide that number (120) by the royal frequency (48,000) to get the add-on (0.25%).

If its a deuce multiway progressive and there is a meter on the 4K that starts at $5....and u know the frequency (16)....and the meter is at $5.75 then divide the extra 6 tenths of a bet by 16 to get the add-on (3.75%).

If there are 50 extra bets in a straight flush meter and u know the frequency is 9200 then divide 50 by 9200 to get the add-on, etc.

Interesting. So by knowing the frequency is the important part, since everything else can be figured out by reading the progressive. I've been seeing a lot of straight flush progressives that always get pretty high since it's pretty hard to hit. I've seen them go over 3 times the reset and wanted to keep that in mind. I also would factor in the drop for the base game, obviously 9/6 jacks or 8/5 bonus would be a lot better then a 8/5 DDB with the same progressive on the SF.

Also I've been seeing this as well. Is it normal to pay an extra unit if the win includes a fractional number, such as $31.26 on a wild royal would pay $31.50? I've been playing hands in a certain way when there are other people on the bank if this is the case, by delaying a hand that has a high probability of converting to a progressive win.

Quote: tringlomane

I just wander by the machine, note the payouts, wander to the bathroom and use this:

https://wizardofodds.com/games/video-poker/strategy/calculator/

Unlike the analyzer, this still works on your smartphone.

I'm assuming the casinos don't like you using the smartphone to look up payouts. I thought there is nothing wrong with this as long as you aren't taking pictures of the screen.

Quote: AxiomOfChoice

Why not just use the calculator app on your phone?

I had to get someone to show me where the calc app was on my phone. It works pretty good. Thanks for the tip.

Quote: RealizeGaming

I'm assuming the casinos don't like you using the smartphone to look up payouts. I thought there is nothing wrong with this as long as you aren't taking pictures of the screen.

Hence why I said go to the bathroom. It's technically illegal. Or at least don't do it in front of the machine. I take pics of my wins all the time though. I have yet to get yelled at for that. They care about that much much less because with the smartphone era it's a lot more common.

i dont think they would mine you checking the odds of a game.
but it is illegal to use the calc to determine what cards to hold.