AxelWolf
AxelWolf
Joined: Oct 10, 2012
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August 10th, 2013 at 1:33:57 AM permalink
Off the top of my head...... DJ I know you like to eat so you will appreciate this. In the Early 90's some places comped you on your buy-ins win lose or recycle a total of $500 -$700 got you dinner for 2 depending on the place. They did this for Rooms and other things as well.

As mentioned before Flush Attack along with House a Rockin ,Max Attack Were the most fun and lasted for years. Well Worth over 50k a year.

Sigma $ slot BONUS RUN, day one tons of fun and worth $800 a day or more. Day 60 violent Asians, Physical fighting, death threats and new gun owners.

Frontier had $1 FPDW, tons of good progressives including a hand feed with credits(you better be a fast player) .25 6 coin progressive the 6th coin went to the 3 progressive meters 4oak, STFL, RF (9/6 JOB) (talk about variance) 4oak would reach over $150 often, STFL would get to over $1500 ,RF would be seen at 10k. They had a 125 coin bonus for paycheck cashing along with mailed bonuses for different hands.

Laughlin had some Sigma 9/6 bingo poker, Sigma .25 Deuces wild Bonus progressives that reached 7k $1 got to 20k
They had fun books with 125 bonuses on 4oak , given out at the mall to anyone. you could play a few each day at the beginning
They had Double on straight flushes Wild cards included.

Rio had a Cash is king month long promotion for a few years in a row where every time you hit for $25 on any machine you revived a scratch card half of them were cash winners $5 to $100 non winning scratch cards became drawing ticket top prize was 20k and multiple 1k winners. Change people were camped out near certain machines. I didn't hear of anyone losing.

Texas Station had double 4 of a kinds 125 coins max for a few days $5 denomination .

Ellis island had Double 4 of a kinds no max but limited to $1 machines. Bonus poker deluxe was descent

Sahara throughout the years ran Double on Royals , Double on Hand pays they had Full pay machines like FPDW., 2 to 1 on blackjacks table max.
They had $50 bonuses on specific 4oak with a easy to get coupon (trade Mexican day laborers a beer coupon) no limit to how many you could play. They paid it with all wild cards on 5 cents. $10 Aces free $50 to their famous steak house.

Hard Rock had Double on Hand pays, 2 to 1 on blackjacks

Gold Coast had a week of hit a top hand pay jackpot and receive double on your next hand-pay JP and a jacket or 40 bucks worth of gifts. Fiesta did this as well but lasted only till the morning ....I wonder why?

Fiesta had $1 10/7 with progressive meters.

MOST INTERESTING was a STRIP CLUB, 4-7 % on a month long dollar VP ,KENO, SLOT Play. Try playing VP with multiple grinding strippers on each side of you, NO JOKE. Then try to explain to your GF how your not having fun. Then bring your GF in to play and ward them away. Me, "I'm sory im with my GF."
Stripper, "That's ok its 2 for 1"
Manager "Your GF should give stripping a try she would make a lot of money" Me she doesn't do drugs, have a child or daddy issues and already finished college. Manager You just described my last 3 GF's
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
teddys
teddys
Joined: Nov 14, 2009
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August 10th, 2013 at 5:23:15 AM permalink
LOL, dude, that was pretty awesome! Would love to read more.
"Dice, verily, are armed with goads and driving-hooks, deceiving and tormenting, causing grievous woe." -Rig Veda 10.34.4
gpac1377
gpac1377
Joined: Apr 7, 2013
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August 10th, 2013 at 7:35:26 AM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

Off the top of my head...... Early 90's some places comped you on your buy-ins win lose or recycle a total of $500 -$700 got you dinner for 2 depending on the place. They did this for Rooms and other things as well.


I remember reading about that sort of thing. Basically the idea was to never play the same money more than once. You would receive credit for buying rolls of coins, feed them through once and cash out (assuming the machine held credits). Then repeat. Not very glamorous, but convenient if you needed a room or food.

Quote: AxelWolf

Texas Station had double 4 of a kinds 125 coins max for a few days $5 denomination.


Wow. I refuse to calculate the hourly on that. I don't want to know.

Beyond everything that's been mentioned, I would guess "mistakes" were more common, such as non-resetting progressives and slot club points set for the wrong denomination.

But despite the favorable conditions, I'm sure a lot of AP's were able to squander their winnings nevertheless.
"Scientists tell us that the fastest animal on earth, with a top speed of 120 feet per second, is a cow that has been dropped out of a helicopter."
mickeycrimm
mickeycrimm
Joined: Jul 13, 2013
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August 10th, 2013 at 1:24:15 PM permalink
Quote: teddys

LOL, dude, that was pretty awesome! Would love to read more.



AxelWolf put so many plays in his post it's hard to cover them all. I didn't learn my first machine play until Oct. 1996. Then, being around the advantage slots all the time, I met a lot of hustler's (sharp machine players). I got told a lot of stories. One of those stories was about a crew out of Las Vegas called the "Change Boys." The story went that they started out in their early twenties pushing change carts in the casinos. But they quickly developed into very strong AP's. And they partnered up and put down some very strong team play on a lot of big time plays. All the hustler's knew about them. And the story went that they had even incorporated.

I think it was in 1997 or 1998, I was working the 18 machine linked bank of Flush Attack in the Riverside in Laughlin. Another hustler told me that the change boys were in the house. "Let me guess" I said "They're in the high roller room working the $5 8/5 Jacks progressive." I went to take a look. I had been told that the change boys came in on that play when the meter hit $42,000. There were only two machines so they locked both of them up until the royal was hit. I went and took a look but didn't recognize the two players. I'm sure the rest of the crew was up in the room getting some sleep. The royal was gone within 24 hours and so were the change boys.

I finally met one of the change boys on the Acres Gaming Double Time play at the Pioneer in Laughlin in April/May 2002. I had a super strong play working, about 180%. He came in, figured it out in about two seconds, and grabbed a seat. He also had his girlfriend playing. We played it until it petered out.

AxelWolf and me know at least a few strong hustlers in common. Danny the Hat, Randy M., and Dan B. I was good friends with all three. AxelWolf hasn't totally confirmed it but I think he was one of the change boys.
"Quit trying your luck and start trying your skill." Mickey Crimm
djatc
djatc
Joined: Jan 15, 2013
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August 10th, 2013 at 5:30:51 PM permalink
I remember seeing the "buyin and cashout" tip from Hard Eight. Crazy how that actually worked back in the day.
"Man Babes" #AxelFabulous
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
Joined: Oct 10, 2012
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August 10th, 2013 at 5:50:18 PM permalink
Quote: gpac1377

I remember reading about that sort of thing. Basically the idea was to never play the same money more than once. You would receive credit for buying rolls of coins, feed them through once and cash out (assuming the machine held credits). Then repeat. Not very glamorous, but convenient if you needed a room or food.
.

Well you really didn't have to PLAY at all. I was not about the the Glamour I only guess it had the same high feeling as a kleptomaniac might get when they are in the act
. However you could impress a date with a nice steak and lobster dinner and hotel suite.

DJ what you seen was this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LgEApN9ap0A&feature=share and it was nothing like this.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
mickeycrimm
mickeycrimm
Joined: Jul 13, 2013
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August 11th, 2013 at 11:38:08 AM permalink
Draw Till U Win was a strong video poker play coming in at 103.2%. It was found on the Bally Gamemakers. The game had come out in 1999 but I didn't learn about it until 2002. By that time the game had been torched out of Las Vegas. I figured the game was probably torched out of the Reno area too but I might find the game along I-80. There were plenty of casinos along I-80 but I also knew that a lot of the bars and truck stops were filled up with Gamemakers. But first I'll explain the game.

Draw Till U Win was 6/5 Double Bonus with a feature called "draw till u win." Anytime your final hand contained four straight flush cards you got to draw one card at a time until you hit a pay. It had to be a non paying hand to trigger the draw till u win feature. If you made a straight that contained 4 straight flush cards it didn't qualify because you already received a pay. Only a non paying hand that contained 4 straight flush cards qualified. It didn't matter if the 4SF was open ended or gutshot. This is how strong the draw was. Say your final hand was 5H-6H-7H-8H-X. You get to throw away the X card and draw one card at a time until you hit a pay. In the example there are only 15 pay cards, 6 straight cards, 7 flush cards, and 2 straight flush cards. So the worst hand you could make was a straight. And the frequency on the straight flush was just 7.5.

And anytime your final hand contained four royal flush cards you got to draw until you hit a pay. Just like in the 4SF example it had to be a non-paying 4RF. If your final hand was As-Ks-Qs-Ts-7d then you got to throw the 7 away and draw until you hit a pay. The pay cards are: 1 RF card, 8 flush cards, 3 Straight cards, 9 HP cards. So the frequency on hitting the royal was just 21 instead of 47 in normal double bonus. And the draw could be even stronger than that as you may have thrown some of those pay cards away on the initial deal.

Also, on the initial deal you were allowed to break paying hands. If your initial deal was 5S-6S-7S-8S-9H, you could throw the 9 away. The same was true for a 4RF on the initial deal.

The overall effect of the draw till u win feature was the overall royal frequency was reduced to 9700 and the straight flush frequency was reduced to 1050. The royal represented 8.25% of the payback so you were racing against about a 5% drain on your way to hitting a royal.

I found the game in Fernley, Fallon, Minden, Elko, Yerrington, and Carlin. I had to write the strategy with a calculator and scratch paper. If you put in the hours you literally averaged a royal a day. That was the downfall of the game. It got the attention of slot operations really quick. At Stockmen's in Elko I snapped off three royals in four hours one day. It's just a little sawdust joint and they payed me for the last royal in twenties. I decided I better get out of Elko for awhile. After that I would just hit one or two royals in a place then move on to the next place, just keep circulating around.

When I found the game on 6 machines in the Carson Valley Inn in Minden I sat down and promptly hit a royal. While I was waiting on the hand pay the floor attendent told me I should play the machine beside me. "Why?" I asked. "Some guy hit 6 royals between these two machines last night" she said. I racked my brain trying to figure out who that player might be. I came back the next day and the game was gone.

I worked the game at Stockmen's in Fallon without drawing any heat. Doug Reul showed up and told me he was the player in Minden who hit the 6 royals. He said they called Gaming on him. He had to explain to the dumasses how he hit 6 royals in 4 hours. They let him go but he still got 86'd.

I invited my friend, Al, to come to Fallon and play DTUW. He went off four 4 royals in four hours and that was the end of DTUW in Fallon. In Yerrington they comped Al and me in with RFB while we were pounding away. They finally got tired of us though. It was a fun game while it lasted.
"Quit trying your luck and start trying your skill." Mickey Crimm
mickeycrimm
mickeycrimm
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August 11th, 2013 at 12:08:25 PM permalink
I forgot to mention the DTUW in the truck stop in Wells, Nevada. The game was there but it wasn't. It was a little 30 machine casino with one floor attendant and 4 Gamemakers. You could walk into the casino and some guy would be playing DTUW. You could check the other three Gamemakers and DTUW wasn't on those machines. Then you come back later, the guy is gone, you try to punch up DTUW and the game isn't there. The only way that can happen is the floor attendant is keying the game up for the player....and once the guy is through playing, the game is keyed back off. They were using DTUW to skim that little casino....and they weren't cutting anyone else in on the deal.
"Quit trying your luck and start trying your skill." Mickey Crimm
gpac1377
gpac1377
Joined: Apr 7, 2013
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August 11th, 2013 at 12:24:43 PM permalink
Quote: mickeycrimm

Draw Till U Win was a strong video poker play coming in at 103.2%. It was found on the Bally Gamemakers.


I'm trying to get an idea of the strategy difficulty. Do you have any idea what the game's return would be for a typical player?

As I understand, All American/250 existed at 102.97%, but the strategy was quite challenging. I never saw the game, so I don't know whether it was offered standalone or on Gamemakers.
"Scientists tell us that the fastest animal on earth, with a top speed of 120 feet per second, is a cow that has been dropped out of a helicopter."
mickeycrimm
mickeycrimm
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August 11th, 2013 at 1:49:46 PM permalink
Quote: gpac1377

I'm trying to get an idea of the strategy difficulty. Do you have any idea what the game's return would be for a typical player?

As I understand, All American/250 existed at 102.97%, but the strategy was quite challenging. I never saw the game, so I don't know whether it was offered standalone or on Gamemakers.



I packed the strategy around for a couple of years after the game went extinct but I eventually misplaced it. My guess is if you used regular 6/5 double bonus strategy the game would come in between 98 and 99%. In DTUW all RF3's played over all high pairs, even Aces. An RF2 played over a ST4H3. And all the SF3's, even SF3-2, played over all the low pairs. And some of the SF3's played over high pairs that weren't Aces.

Incidentally, one of the oddities of this game was you could hold a low pair and come up with a straight flush. Say if you held a pair of 7's and caught three straight flush cards to one of the 7's you got to draw until you hit a pay. Which meant that you could hold a pair of Ten's and come up with a royal flush. I never accomplished that feat. Tom Ski is the only player I know of that converted that hand.
"Quit trying your luck and start trying your skill." Mickey Crimm

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