Santa Ana Star trip report

This is a trip report with pictures. Although my thread count is low, I am not a new member, I am actually a very long time reader and member. I have been out of the AP scene for a while, as my current advantage play is to run my business, which has made me very comfortable. My thanks to Professor Shackleford, from whom I gained inspiration and the information that currently shapes my way of thinking and my way of running my business.

I am, unfortunately, also a gambling addict. Gambling addicts never fully recover, we just continually recover. In order to control my gambling impulse, I have two rules when it comes to gambling: 1. I gamble on the cheap (meaning I only gamble if there is a "deal", cheap does not mean low roller, as my bankroll is 25k annually), and 2. I only go on gambling trips once a year, and I have to drive there no matter where it is (flying would be too easy). I have followed these two rules for the last 8 years, and I have been ok.

My friends and I were deciding where to go for our next gambling trip, and I came across the Santa Ana Star Casino (hereinafter the "star") on the WoO website. The Star has a free buy on the 4 and 10 and a free field. After lots of research, it came down to a vote between going to New Mexico and Shreveport, LA, where I play craps.

This was my calculation. Remember rule 1. My total expenses in Shreveport would be $650 if I played in Shrevport. This is how it breaks down. My total expected loss would be $300 at $100 expected loss a day (I play $5 pass with $500 odds and two come bets and mas odds, and at my calculations, this comes out to an expected loss of about $100 per day, considering that each $5 pass/come bet carries an expected loss of about 7.5pennies). Cost of transportation divided by 3, and my share is $150. Room and Food is always comped totally, so room and food is zero. Dealer tips is zero, as I do not tip Shreveport dealers. Miscellaneous expenditures is $200.

To play at the Star, I figured that expected loss be minimal (less than $5 over 3 days). Room would be $300 (100 per day), food $150 total (I didn't think they would comp the room and food). Transportation would be $150. Dealer tips would be $30 (Wizard of Vegas research suggests that if a player plays the 4,10 and field exclusively, the floor will back off the player unless the player tips, so a $10 a day tip is necessary). and Miscellaneous expenditures would be 200. So total cost is $830 to play at the Star over 3 days.

The novelty of the Free 4,10 and field necessitated a trip to the Star. So off we went!

After a 12 hour drive we finally arrived.



This is a pic of the Star's board. the Star is north of Albuquerque NM.

We arrived!!! wohoo!!!



here is the outside of the Star



the inside of the Star once you step inside



the ugly ass carpeting inside the Star



lol. I know, I'm being mean.



Finally, I am at the Craps table. This is the only table that was open the entire trip. I approached the table and bought in for $10,000. That immediately brought over a host with an offer of a free room and anything else I needed. I had them comp my entire stay, so now the cost of room and food was removed from my calculations!



This is a pic of the craps layout. Notice the Free 4,10 and triple/triple field. I am betting, as the pic shows $250 on 4, and $250 on the 10, and $5 on the pass line. I was the only person at table at this point, so I was obligated to bet on pass, or else no one else would shoot. btw, max odds is 10x. Later during the trip, I would increase my bets to the table maximum, betting $500 on 4, $500 on 10. There is no requirement to bet on pass line (unless, like in this situation, where I am the only player at the table).



take a look that this pic again..notice the players are all playing the center bets, the hardways, the 8,6 place, etc. Despite a free 4,10, people still play the stupid bets! There are no bets on the 4,10!

At the end of the first night of gambling, I was up $8,000. The dealers liked me because I was tipping (and I doled out the entire $10 tipping budget for the day).

The next two days were choppy and I ended up winning a total of $11,000 by the end of the trip. I made a total of about 100 pass bets, over 3 days, for an expected loss of $7.50.

They were very generous with their comps. This is a redacted screen shot of my comp dollars. I have taken out my name. It shows over $101.69 comp dollars available, even though I had spent about $100 in comps already!



Comp dollars!



with all those comp dollars, I ate like a wasteful king. This was my breakfast, for me only. one of my friends was even more wasteful, in ordering literally everything off the menu using his comp dollars. Comps!!!!



Chiles. This is traditional New Mexican food stuff.





goofing around on the penny slots. I inserted $5 and won $21!!! woohoo!!



back to craps table. Boxwoman in bad mood. Notice all the low roller bets at the table. Every player at this casino was very poor. I have never seen so many peole buy in for less than $100. In addition, I could tell they couldn't afford to be gambling because a lot of people would pull out crumpled bills totaling $43, 51, 87, etc. And then they would walk away with a long face if they went broke. Several players asked me for a loan. One player commented if he had my money, all his problems would be solved (to which I thought, "why are you gambling" and "are you going to solve your problems by attempting to mug me in the parking lot?").

again, notice above the place bets and the two hardways bets. OMG people, does anyone see the free 4,10?????



the poker game. I played poker for 10 minutes just to take a pic. 1,2 no limit, lowest rake in NM at $3 + $1 Jackpot.

single zero roulette table, closed.

double zero table, open.



We decided to drive to another NM casino to see what they were like. We went to the Sandia on the advice of one of the locals, who said that the Sandia had a better craps game because they had big odds! I was wondering if he understood that you can't get better than free 4,10 and triple/triple field. Regardless, because everyone said the Sandia was the nicest casino, we went there.



the Sandia from outside.



the Sandia from inside.

more pics of Sandia from inside...





On both of these spins, the ball landed one of the two numbers that were not covered or minimally covered. lol. Notice in the above pic the ball, as marked by the dealer, landed on number 7. The 7 had the small stack. See all the big stacks arond the 7? lol. It'll teach em not to play a game with a 5.25 HE. One lady had multiple greens straight up at a $100 per number. Ouch! This table had about $2000 per spin on it.



At the Sandia, we each received $25 in promotional dead chips for signing up.

drum roll...I played the promo chips and they turned into this...



Yes. All from promo chips! FYI, there is a strat on the WOV website for best use of dead chips, if I recall correctly. I just was "lucky" lol (I don't believe in luck, I only believe in variance).

craps at the Sandia. I am confused!!! why is there nothing saying that the 4,10 are free???? why does the Field say double/triple!???



Where is the Free 4,10???? why only double/triple??!!!??

BTW, the local was wrong. The odds are only 5x. Booooo!!!



This is a blurry pic of the Sandia tables game pit.

The games at the Sandia were terrible. Do not go there for BJ. They have terrible rules. Most games CSM.

If you go to the Sandia, don't forget to sign up for their promo chip giveaway.

This is my ending bankroll. No safety deposit box, and no wires out or in. 36k. You will need security escort if you wanna bring your AP game.



This is the end of my trip report. Any questions about NM gambling...fire them my way.

BTW, this is a pic of my poker set up. As a gambling addict, I like to play poker once a week. I must do a show and tell of my poker set up. Notice the Shufflemaster Deckmate in my table (i have two of em)? I keep em in a very large gun safe that has security, fyi. The chips are Paulson world Top hat and Cane and also some Chipcos. I host poker once a week with my friends and I never take a rake, fyi. We just play small stakes poker for fun, and the extravagant poker set up is just my wasteful spending, as I like to indulge.



Go Bruins!!!!!

On a last point, no alcohol is allowed on the floor of any NM casino!! alcohol must be PURCHASED at the bar, but since I had a ton of comp dollars, it was all free for me. There are persons who walk around with drink carts who will serve nonalcoholic drinks. At first I tipped the person a dollar, but then I noticed that no one was tipping her, so I ceased tipping too. This lowered my miscellaneous expenses by $40, as I wouldn't tip the drink person again. Total cost for trip to the Star was $150 transportation, $30 in dealer tips, $1 in drink tips, zero for room and food and alcohol at the bar.

fun times!!!

Quote: klimate10

I am, unfortunately, also a gambling addict. Gambling addicts never fully recover, we just continually recover. In order to control my gambling impulse, I have two rules when it comes to gambling:

1. I gamble on the cheap (meaning I only gamble if there is a "deal", cheap does not mean low roller, as my bankroll is 25k annually), and
2. I only go on gambling trips once a year, and I have to drive there no matter where it is (flying would be too easy).

I have followed these two rules for the last 8 years, and I have been ok.

I think you are stretching the word addict. You won $11K and tipped $10 per day. You seem very much in control.

Quote: pacomartin

I think you are stretching the word addict. You won $11K and tipped $10 per day. You seem very much in control.

I respectfully agree with paco, especially after viewing the definition of addiction:

the state of being enslaved to a habit or practice or to something that is psychologically or physically habit-forming, as narcotics, to such an extent that its cessation causes severe trauma.

Great trip report! I remember seeing those notes about the Santa Anna star on the Wiz's craps page back when I was learning about craps. I didn't really understand it then, but later on as I became a more experienced gambler, I realized how crazy it is for a casino to offer a truly 0% HE bet, with no strings attached (i.e. no pass line bet required, not required to play perfect strategy at a 100%+ VP game, etc.).

I am surprised they still offer it, although with all the ploppies routinely playing the inside numbers and the hardways anyway, as evidenced by your picture, I guess it's not too surprising.

I must make a trip here at some point, I've added it to my bucket list. Given the 0% edge bets and how they treated you based on the $10K buy-in, this sounds like a great place to milk comps! I am surprised they didn't back you off for making such large 0% bets and only tipping $10/day.

Although as a dark sider, I would be much more interested if they offered a free lay on the 6 and 8. Heh, "free lay" (insert Beavis and Butthead voice).

Very nice report! Thanks!


I agree with what others have said about the addiction. You seem to have thing VERY much under control.





What's that chip on the line between the 9 and 10?


I find it ironic that they are very player friendly regarding the free 4, 10 and field, and yet, they still have the Big 6/8. Did it get any action?



(Edit: I had a comment about an incorrect photo link. It has since been fixed.)





VERY nice setup.

I was under the impression that ShuffleMaster does not sell their shufflers. How'd you get that Deckmate?

Thanks for the report! I enjoyed it. I note that the craps table at the Star appears shorter than the one at the Sandia. Is it just the camera angle, or was the table actually shorter?

Did you play the 0% HE Field bet too?

Even at 0%, you are not expected to make money, but to break even. How did you manage your bankroll to preserve the win (or was it just good variance for you)?

Are there other things to do besides the casino at the Star? (outlet shopping, sightseeing etc.?)

Did you get any sense they were disappointed they gave you full RFB and you gave them so little action with a HE?

I have my addiction under control for sure. But there was a time it could have destroyed my life, if not for some self reflection and some self control.

Acesand8s, if you are a dark sider, the free 4 and 10 is also applies to the lay against the 4 and 10. So it is free both ways. The only problem I see is that laying against the 4 and 10 is that it reduces variance. I don't know your playing style, but I prefer high variance. When you are buying the 4,10, it is an all or nothing proposition, meaning that 1/2 of the time, you will win, and 1/2 of the time you lose it all (6 ways to win the 4,10 vs. 6 ways to lose; in essence, it is an all or nothing coinflip).

When laying against the 4,10, 1/2 the time you will win half your bet, 1/3 of the time you will lose 1/4 of your total bet, and 1/6 of the time you will lose everything (1/2 +1/3+1/6 = 1). There is less variance when laying against...usually.

That's why I prefer the buy. I like the all or nothing approach.

I did the math on my craps play. I won $11k. At the rate of 3 rolls a minute on average, that means there is one resolution per minute (there is one resolution of the 4,10 v. 7 coinflip every 3 rolls bc there are 12 combinations that result in a resolution, and 24 that do nothing). At my time of play, I probably had 2100 total rolls, meaning that I had 700 coin flip resolutions. At an average of $500 per coin flip ($250 on the 4, $250 on the 10, sometimes I would up the bet to 500/500, but sometimes, I would take a break and bet 100/100, so averaged 250/250), that means that I won 22 more coinflips, on average, that I lost over the course of 700 coinflips.

Another important side note...

The Star does not allow you to wire money to them, so you just have to bring it along (I NEVER play with markers, and I don't know if they offer markers). And they DO NOT have a safety deposit box. I brought 25k in cash and had to walk around with over 20k in chips and 15k cash on my person (I do have a CCL). You just have to carry it all around. I asked for a security escort around, as there were a lot of shady looking people, some with tattoos on their faces, in strategic spots, if you know what I mean. To make matters worse, they have very few purple chips, and no purples on the craps table (remember everyone is a low roller), so I just was walking around with a giant mountain of chips inside the Star. If you bring a big enough bankroll, you will not have any problems making lady friends, just be careful your new friends don't get anywhere close to your bankroll. Overall, everyone is very nice. The dealers are very nice. They are all table for table, as far as keeping their tips. I did tip more than $10 per day, as at the end of the trip, I gave each craps dealer a $20 bill (the $10 was just a general tip so that I wouldn't be backed off the game). We also drained all of our comp dollars at the end of the trip by going to the snack counter and buying all their bottles and chips and snacks. About $500 worth. After buying everything that was nonperishable, that they had in stock, we had about $80 left. We then paid for the people behind us, until our balances were zero. A true AP play.

This is my new favorite casino. Please don't ruin it (I know how APers are with this stuff). Be kind to the staff, be kind to the dealers (tip them), and don't abuse the comp system!!!

I removed this post to prevent player abuse

Oh yeah, the chip in the middle...lol...between the 9 and 10.

That was a tip I threw out for the dealer to ride with the 10. To make my tips last longer, I would throw up a dollar, at timed intervals, and tell them to ride, aka piggyback, my bet. That bet just landed and rolled up there. For a reason, which I will not disclose, the dealer just left it there. If you think about it for a second, you can guess why the dealer left it there the entire roll.

Nice report. Since I gave some earlier advice on posting photos, I'll make a comment about the one error I noticed. You posted your file 20.jpg (the photo of the penny slot) twice and did not post the photo that goes along with "back to craps table. Boxwoman in bad mood." You can edit your post and fix the typo, if you can figure out the correct file name.

Question about the free buy bets - can you make them in any amount? Ordinarily the 5% commission means that buy bets are made in increments of $20 (assuming no chips smaller than $1). With no commission, there would seem to be no minimum bet to ensure a proper payout. Is the minimum bet just the table minimum?

DJ, I meant to post a pic of the box scowling at me. I must have copied the wrong URL.

You CAN buy the Shufflemasters. It's just that they are very expensive. I bought this pair as a reward for myself when I finally realized the American dream...I went from being a broke college student...and the day I hit the big number, income-wise...I rewarded myself by buying something really stupid...twice...just to say that I could do it.

Quote: klimate10

Acesand8s, if you are a dark sider, the free 4 and 10 is also applies to the lay against the 4 and 10. So it is free both ways.

Cool, thanks for letting me know. Weird that they would keep the free lay on the 4 and 10...following the general logic of being looser with the 4 and 8 buy bets (some houses charge commission on win only, the Star as we know charges none at all!) because they are least likely to hit, if I were the star I would give the free lay on the 6 and 8, since they are the least likely lay bet to hit. Of course it's 0 house edge either way, so whatever...

Why do you never tip the dealers in Shreveport?

Quote: waltomeal

Question about the free buy bets - can you make them in any amount? Ordinarily the 5% commission means that buy bets are made in increments of $20 (assuming no chips smaller than $1). With no commission, there would seem to be no minimum bet to ensure a proper payout. Is the minimum bet just the table minimum?

I would presume that the casino wouldn't care if you bet $5. It has no HE so the smaller the better. Just as long as you are in there.

I imagine if you are tipping the team, they will let you sit there all day and play $5 on the 4/10.

Answer to questions, in no order...

...I did play the field the first day, betting $200 per field roll. I did not like the field because you only win 16 and lose 20. The balance comes when the 12 or the 2 rolls, and it can be depressing waiting for the 2,12. I usually don't play the field, unless I am really bored, even with the free Field. To me, it just was not fun.

...the table at the Sandia and the Star are both known as Aircraft carriers, meaning they are the big craps tables. It's just camera angle.

...I saw NO ONE betting on any of the Corner Reds. No one.

...why do I never tip dealers in Shreveport? Because I hate them. lol. I'm half way kidding, halfway. Shreveport used to have the only BJ game in north America that had a player advantage with basic strat (at the 'Shoe, and the game is now gone because f*cking Harrahs took over). The dealers would always back me off that game, and then I would go count the deck games, and they would back me off those too. I have bad memories of Shreveport dealers. And the dealers at the El Dorado are classless tip hustlers (box: "did you pay him his come bet?", dealer: "yeah, I shipped him $605, of course he hasn't shipped me anything yet").

Quote: klimate10

At the end of the first night of gambling, I was up $8,000. The dealers liked me because I was tipping (and I doled out the entire $10 tipping budget for the day).

back to craps table. Boxwoman in bad mood.

The next two days were choppy and I ended up winning a total of $11,000 by the end of the trip

Total cost for trip to the Star was $150 transportation, $30 in dealer tips, $1 in drink tips, zero for room and food and alcohol at the bar.

fun times!!!

I would be embarrased to let everyone know that I won $11,000 and only tipped $30. The dealers probably liked you when you were playing because that thought they would get a decent tip when you were done. I can only imagine what they really thought about you after you left the table $8000 up and only $10 in tips..

When you went back to the craps table, the boxwoman was in a bad mood. Yes, she probably heard about this player that won $8000 and only tipped $10.

Yes, the average person would probably be embarrassed. True.

But I am not embarrassed. I don't care. I won $118,324 in Shreveport once, and tipped zero. When they colored me up, I tossed the box a dollar bill to make it green chip even. To each his own. I did tip 33% to the IRS, come tax time.

I just hate the Shreveport dealers.

I think I was fair in tipping...but yeah, I could have given each more than $20 each as an end of trip tip.

And the box was in a bad mood all the time. The dealers were always really nice and cool the next day. That's why at the end of the trip, I gave each craps dealer a $20 bill (4 x 20).

Next time, I do intend to tip the Star dealers $100 each after the trip. I tend to think now that $20 each was a bit low. Dealers going table for table resulted in a much more pleasant and friendly dealer environment.

Well, thanks, just read this and we have been needing a report on this casino! I guess I was expecting a "catch" about the zero HE craps but you are reporting none it seems. Good! The comps thing is even more surprising.

Quote: klimate10

Next time, I do intend to tip the Star dealers $100 each after the trip. I tend to think now that $20 each was a bit low. Dealers going table for table resulted in a much more pleasant and friendly dealer environment.

I don't know if they could have been friendlier, or made the session more enjoyable, but I'd suggest tipping at the beginning, and/or making tip bets while you're playing.

It's become my practice to toke on dealer odds for the 4/10 anyway, so I can only suggest throwing a 4 or 10 free buy for the dealers while you're playing them. In fact, what I'd do with the free buy is press the toke as it hits. So if you have a dealer toke on the free 4, tell them you control it and when it hits, give them half and press half. Hit a few in a row and have very happy dealers.

I'm glad someone else has finally found the Santa Ana Star. My closest to home casino is Sandia, then Route 66, then the Star. The three are on my circuit depending on what I'm in the mood for.

The Santa Ana Star is about 30 minutes north of Albuquerque in the Village of Bernalillo. A Tribal Casino (Santa Ana Pueblo) with great craps and probably the best VP around here, also a second-level bowling alley! Since there is no on site Hotel, I'm guessing they put you up at The Hyatt Regency Tamaya Resort & Spa? That's a really nice place with a heavenly golf course. Frequent shuttle busses to the Casino too.
You're quite right when you say it's low roller heaven. Lot's of $20/40/60 buy-in's. I usually buy-in for $200 and get treated like a king. Max odds are 10X. I'm also a frequent $1 pass line bettor with 2X odds for the dealers too. The dealers are very friendly. They also have 9/6 JOB dollar machines and 9/5 JOB Progressive machines @ $0.25. Food is average, buffet/coffee shop and snack bar. It can also be VERY smokey most of the time.

The Sandia Resort & Casino is about 20 minutes north of Albuquerque on the Sandia Pueblo. It's the largest casino in the Albuquerque metro area with nicest amenities on property (hotel, restaurants, nightclub, spa, pool, golf, outdoor ampitheater). It's close, it's easy. I'm also turning in my player's club points for a new set of adams clubs and nike golf shoes to start playing golf again this year!
I have choppy results at craps here. Mostly $5 PL with $25/30 odds (5X odds Max) and occasional $12/6 or 8. Sometimes come betting when the mood strikes. I'm a frequent $1 PL with 2X odds for the dealers tipper, so they all know me on a first name basis as do most of the box people. Most of the "nicer" people come here when going out for the night. Fair VP with only 8/5 JOB at the $1 and up level. My wife plays plays Bingo here too, it's the nicest with electronic and paper, best payouts with 2X daily sessions 7 days a week. Fortune Pai Gow Poker at $15 a hand. Mini Baccarat in the High Limit room is $25 minimum (99% Asian players!)

The Route 66 Casino Hotel is about 20 minutes west of Albuquerque on the Laguna Pueblo. Since it's an exit off I-40 with a large truck stop, it's frequented by lot's of long haul truckers and locals. They do have an attached hotel with a night club and restaurant.
I seem to have pretty good luck playing craps here since the tables are usually pretty lively most any time and 10X odds. VP is fair with the best JOB 8/6 at the $5 level. They have Bingo here. Also $5 a hand Fortune Pai Gow Poker. The Best Casino Buffet will be found here with Thursday being Seafood night and Friday being Asian night, New Mexican fare most other times.

Last but not least is The Hard Rock Casino Albuquerque about 15 minutes south of Albuquerque. The Isleta Pueblo bought the Hard Rock name to spruce up their crappy casino 2 or 3 years ago. Enough said. If you like dark, smoky with sketchy people...come here.

Overall, it's not bad considering we're in the middle of the desert...WAY different than Las Vegas. And yes, NO Alcohol in the gaming areas. Could you imagine all the locals getting looped up on free liquor?...not a pretty site at all.

Thanks for pointing out the mistake, DJ.

I have fixed the mistake and added some more pics and report lines.

Also, ten2win, I noticed that the Star had a very good selection of video poker. There is a bank of about six machines that have a big ass sign "THESE $1 MACHINES PAY 100%". I am not a AP video poker player, so I did not play it. Also, I am not aware if the 100% was based off the pay tables, or if the 100% was based off the progressive, which was over 7,000 for a Royal, when I was at the Star.

A bit more info about the BJ at the Star, as I am a former card counter (I am a former counter because making $2 an hour isn't a livable wage). The double deck game has 85% penetration, or so it seemed. But upon closer inspection, the penetration was closer to 66-75%. They insert the cut card about 15 cards before the last card, but then I noticed that the BURN is comprised of 10-15 cards. So they take a clump off the top. Effectively, this is the same as about 66-75% penetration. Rules suck. HS17, split one time only, no RSA, No surrender, no DAS.

Six deck has 75% penetration. Dealer hits soft 17, split up to 4 hands, double after split, late surrender.

People howled in protest when I hit soft 18, people became furious when I hit hard 12, people were confused when I surrendered a hard 17 versus an ace. No one knew anything about basic strat. People hate the surrender rule. I surrendered 8,8 versus the dealers Ace, and caused the lady next to me to draw a bust. A few hands later, I split 8,8 against a dealer's 10, and the woman got upset that I didn't play consistently. I laughed at her.

One thing I always hate is when dealers give bad advice. Every dealer (EVERY) kept telling me that hitting any 18 is bad and it fed the fire for the players when a play caused to dealer to draw a strong hand. I found it amusing.

But, I was only betting $5-20 a hand when I was playing BJ, while doing a red seven count (Im too lazy nowadays to convert to a true count). Here's a pic of my buddy playing BJ. Deck was positive, so I had him bet $20. Notice the ridiculous side bet. I was counting for him, as he is not a counter.

Ten2win,

How is craps at the route 66?

Does anyone in the area have 100 times odds? 20 times?

Klimate,

Route 66 craps is played on the regular sized table not the larger one you played on at the Star. Odds are 10X with the usual bets available. Nothing special like at the Star.

10X is the best odds you'll find in the state.

That bank of eight slots with the sign that says "these machines return 100.65%" is figured by adding the progressive jackpot for the 5 dollar maximum on these dollar machines.

Where did you stay during your comped stay at the Star?

We stayed at the Hyatt, a very nice hotel indeed.

I'm still confused as to why a casino, like the Star, with all of its low rollers, would have a hotel like the Hyatt nearby. My guess is that the Star doesn't own the Hyatt, but that the Star contracts for rooms, since the Star doesn't have an attached Hotel. So my next question then is....why does an small city like Bernalillo, with its seemingly poor citizens, have a Hyatt with a high end golf course?

The Star us my favorite place for craps, by far. Im so spoiled now by the free 4,10. The only down side to the Star is that the limit is $500. Sometimes I like to bet the table max if Im down or chasing a loss, and 500 is really low. But I guess it will help me when Im on craps tilt. Lol.

Does anyone in town have a BJ somewhere dealer stands on soft 17?

Quote: klimate10

Notice the ridiculous side bet.

The "Tie" bet is not so bad. The Wizard worked out an overall house edge of .24% in his WoO's site BJ Appendix 8 (assuming the rules are similar to the game he analyzed at Caesars.)

Hmm, that's very surprising! That's low for a side bet. Has anyone done an analysis of whether or not the Tie bet is countable?

Quote: ten2win

Klimate,
Route 66 craps is played on the regular sized table not the larger one you played on at the Star. Odds are 10X with the usual bets available. Nothing special like at the Star.

I haven't been to Vegas since becoming a craps player...but all the tables I see in Reno are generally the same size as the photos of Stars...
I imagine 12'-14'...are there 10' tables???

Ten2win,

How is the strip club scene in Albuquerque? Is there a strip club in Bernalillo?

I'm already planning my next trip for next year. The addict in me i trying to convince me to go back for Spring break.

How is the social and singles scene in Albuquerque? I'm thinking of trying to set up a bunch of dates via Match and do a dating/casino/craps trip. I'm outgoing, decent looking, and in good shape, so I don't have too many problems with the ladies.

My next trip, I'll bring back pics of the strip clubs too!! and I'll do a complete report of all the casinos.

Klimate, just out of curiousity, do you let your buy bets work on the come-out? What type of strategy? I expect I will try some progressive on a win strategy.

I am planning to visit that casino in the near future. Not nearly as big a bankroll as you. Yep, I am one of those $5 bettors, but I know a good thing when I see it.

At some point, I will try to give you any info on your requests for Albuquerque, though I do not frequent such places.

Nice report. Nice poker setup. Nice UCLA flag, it's been a long 12 years for us Bruin fans, oh well, new coach new direction. Anyhow, next time i'm in Alberqurque, I'll be all over that 4 & 10th free buy.

Visited this casino last night (my first time.) Normally I play PL and Place 6 and 8 (6/9 if point 8; 5/8 if point 5) and odds. Played PL and Buy the 4 and 10. Never saw so many Sixes and 8s thrown in my life. Grinned and beared it (as it were) as I knew I was playing a no juice game (at least as far as the 4 and 10 were concerned.) It seems that a lot of people who were playing last night knew about the no vig on the 4 and 10 (unlike OP's observation when he played) which was good. Lots of action on the table, though, too. Will continue to look into playing there, but, only the 4 and 10 if I can stay off of the PL.

Great report. I will definitely be trying to plan a trip to this casino. I will certainly be on the 4/10, and since I like playing the field, I will certainly take advantage of the field at 0% HE. However, as an action junkie, I know I won't be able to resist the 5,6,8,9 so my play won't be HE free.

klimate10 just come across this thread, great trip report.

I don't play craps, only ever seen it offered in one casino, nevertheless very enjoyable read. One question, you mention above you were backed off by the dealers in Shreveport? Dealers can actually back you off, as opposed to the suits. Wow

If it's a zero HA game your after, ever considered "casino war" (highest card wins, 'don't laugh', HA is still 0%"), some casinos do offer it, zero HA if you never choose to go to war after a tie.

Quote: egalite

... If it's a zero HA game your after, ever considered "casino war" (highest card wins, 'don't laugh', HA is still 0%"), some casinos do offer it, zero HA if you never choose to go to war after a tie.

Not quite so. If you haven't read it, check out the Wizard's analysis of this game. One rule is:

Quote: Wizard's analysis of Casino War

4. In the event of a tie the player shall have two choices: (1) surrender and forfeit half the bet or (2) go to war (see rule 5)

If you follow your suggestion never to go to war, you forfeit half your bet on each tie, which seems to lead to a house advantage.