Craps Fire Bet - and Don't Players

It seems like whenever i play the Don't side - placing multiple Don't Pass / Don't Come bets - the only way i can get hurt is if the roller goes on a tear and hits point after point.

well - wouldn't the Fire Bet protect the Don't Player in this scenario? If i placed 4 or 5 flats with full odds on the Don't side - and they got picked off one by one as the roller makes point after point - wouldn't i win the Fire Bet as a hedge?

hmm...

are there any craps simulators out there that include the Fire Bet?

Quote: Transender46

It seems like whenever i play the Don't side - placing multiple Don't Pass / Don't Come bets - the only way i can get hurt is if the roller goes on a tear and hits point after point.

well - wouldn't the Fire Bet protect the Don't Player in this scenario? If i placed 4 or 5 flats with full odds on the Don't side - and they got picked off one by one as the roller makes point after point - wouldn't i win the Fire Bet as a hedge?

hmm...

are there any craps simulators out there that include the Fire Bet?

The "fire bet" is supposed to be the worst bet in craps. Better to skip it than hedge against it.

If you want to "protect yourself" in craps the only way is full free odds on pass or don't pass. It doesn't matter, once the point is made free odds play the same. If odds are high enough, say 100xs, you can drop the house edge to virtually nothing. There is no better way to reduce house edge in craps or any other game for that matter.

It isn't fun, but being a grinder rarely is as fun as winning a 30-1 hopping bet.

Quote: Transender46

well - wouldn't the Fire Bet protect the Don't Player in this scenario? If i placed 4 or 5 flats with full odds on the Don't side - and they got picked off one by one as the roller makes point after point - wouldn't i win the Fire Bet as a hedge?

hmm...

are there any craps simulators out there that include the Fire Bet?

Thou shall not hedge your wagers. So sayeth The Wizard (and so say we all).

The problem withthe fire bet is that the shooter has to hit several different points. If someone shoots 4-4-5-4-6-4-5-4-4-7, the Fire Bet(TM) yields exactly nothing. In such a roll you'd lose most of your don't pass/don't come bets and the fire bet as well.

I expect I may lay a few bucks on the fire bet next time I go to Vegas, just for the thrill of it and, frankly, to get it off my system. Then I expect I'll play the lowest possible house edge craps game, meaning don't pass/don't come with odds.

I don't know of any simulators with a fire bet option, sorry.

I don't think you fully understand the FireBet. Or I'm confused with what you're asking.

Let's say the shooter shoots 6, 8, 8, 6. He's made his point. He's also made the 8 for anyone that put a come bet out on that second roll.

The FireBet doesn't care about that come bet.

All the FireBet concerns itself with, is a shooter successfully completing at least four different front line pass bets.

As such, it doesn't hedge against anything specific.

As a don't bettor, you can get killed by a shooter on a hot streak, and still have that shooter miss the FireBet.


I like to talk about the FireBet this way: It's a side bet. And I applaud the guy who figured out how to put a jackpot on a craps table.

You can only place that bet before a new shooters first roll.

But even if you forget to get that bet in, if the shooter hits it, you may feel stupid or cheated, but if you've had your bets spread out at all (right betting), you're making big money anyway.

I have made 5 different points while shooting from the don'ts. If I had put $5 on the fire bet I would have made a profit despite losing 5 times on the don't pass line. It begs the question, after how many different points would you switch to the pass line and go for the six points?

Switching to the pass line in the middle of a Fire Bet run will not help you at all. The Fire Bet must be put up before the shooter's first throw. You can switch to the pass line at any time; there's no best or worst time to do it.

Quote: DeMango

I have made 5 different points while shooting from the don'ts. If I had put $5 on the fire bet I would have made a profit despite losing 5 times on the don't pass line. It begs the question, after how many different points would you switch to the pass line and go for the six points?

I've a little poker game on my cellphone, which I play when I'm stuck waiting somewhere. Often I'll fold before the flop when I hold, say, a 5 and 10 off suit. Then sometimes the flop will be 5,5,10. I did realize I notice such events more often than when the flop is something completely unhelpful for the cards I was dealt.

So, sure, sometimes you'll make the smart move and lose, while the dumb move wins. It happens. That's chance. But it doesn't happen often enough to be worth it.

However, the fire bet may be harmless enough. If you're laying down $100+ per shooter on craps, making the pass/come or don's pass/don't come bets with odds, then throwing away $5 for a side bet won't hurt you too badly.

My take is that it's ok to make sucker bets, so long as you are aware of the risk you're taking and what your chances are.

The very first time I was introduced to craps, a guy told me to put a buck on the fire bet as I was handed the dice, so i did.

. . . about an hour later, I was still rolling and had hit every point, most of them more than once. My friend thought I was some kind of dice god. Unfortunately, the fire bet at that casino paid only 500 to 1, which is horrendous.

But, I just can't get into craps, even after that experience. I think it's the superstition that permeates the game. Very anoying. Now I prefer to play the wrong way and quietly lay the odds. I have a goal of some day convincing every player at a full craps table to bet the don't pass line. I call it my "upside down craps table" goal.

Quote: Jumboshrimps

The very first time I was introduced to craps, a guy told me to put a buck on the fire bet as I was handed the dice, so i did.

. . . about an hour later, I was still rolling and had hit every point, most of them more than once. My friend thought I was some kind of dice god. Unfortunately, the fire bet at that casino paid only 500 to 1, which is horrendous.

But, I just can't get into craps, even after that experience. I think it's the superstition that permeates the game. Very anoying. Now I prefer to play the wrong way and quietly lay the odds. I have a goal of some day convincing every player at a full craps table to bet the don't pass line. I call it my "upside down craps table" goal.

Here is a question. I've never made the fire bet, but can it be taken down if you make 2 or three in a row at the payout they would have for 2 or 3 in a row or must it be pressed until the end?

There is no payout until 4 points in every instance I have seen it. You don't "take it down" because it will pay to the 4 points if it doesn't hit 5, and pay to the 5 if it doesn't pay 6. Once you hit 4, you will be paid. You can only be paid more, with no loss if it doesn't make it to 5.

Quote: cclub79

There is no payout until 4 points in every instance I have seen it. You don't "take it down" because it will pay to the 4 points if it doesn't hit 5, and pay to the 5 if it doesn't pay 6. Once you hit 4, you will be paid. You can only be paid more, with no loss if it doesn't make it to 5.

OK, thanks. I had never seen it in action, just knew not to make it.

I know it is bad, but I play it most of the time for $1. I've hit 4s a few times, and 5 twice. I was shooting at the 6th point when I outed. The table next to me hit 6 once, and my worst story is the day I was playing and wife came by and wanted me to go look at something with her. Came back about an hour later and the crew tells me the table hit all 6 about 15 min after I left. Arrrggg

Quote: RaleighCraps

I know it is bad, but I play it most of the time for $1. I've hit 4s a few times, and 5 twice. I was shooting at the 6th point when I outed. The table next to me hit 6 once, and my worst story is the day I was playing and wife came by and wanted me to go look at something with her. Came back about an hour later and the crew tells me the table hit all 6 about 15 min after I left. Arrrggg

Well, you can probably comfort yourself with this: if you had been there, it would have been different. Your bets on the layout, the amount of time spent paying off your bets, the brief moment you made eye contact with the shooter, all would have caused a miniscule difference in how the dice bounced.

Quote: seattledice

Well, you can probably comfort yourself with this: if you had been there, it would have been different. Your bets on the layout, the amount of time spent paying off your bets, the brief moment you made eye contact with the shooter, all would have caused a miniscule difference in how the dice bounced.

Are you saying I am bad luck, and you wouldn't want to be on the opposite side of the table from me? That's what I read. I assume the same side would be okay, as it would be hard for me to look you in the eye as you were ready to shoot. ;-) Sorry, couldn't resist.

Quote: RaleighCraps

Are you saying I am bad luck...?

No. He's saying that ANY change, any of a million things happening differently, changes everything. That doesn't mean it's necessarily a bad change.

Quote: RaleighCraps

I know it is bad, but I play it most of the time for $1. I've hit 4s a few times, and 5 twice. I was shooting at the 6th point when I outed. The table next to me hit 6 once, and my worst story is the day I was playing and wife came by and wanted me to go look at something with her. Came back about an hour later and the crew tells me the table hit all 6 about 15 min after I left. Arrrggg

First here's Nareed's un-numbered rule of gambling (I'll get around to numbering it later): "It's okay to make sucker bets so long as you know the risk you're taking."

Second, had you been shooting at that table things might have changed, as has been mentioned. You can't know how.

First trip to vgeas, last day, I was just mkaing time before the airport shuttle arrived. I had about40 minutes to kill. I fed a few bucks into a Deuces Wild VP game and started playing at a nickel a hand. Near the end of my money I hit 4 deuces. In that machine I could have played for a quarter rather than a nickel. But if I had, I'd likely run out of money before I'd hit the 4 deuce hand, assuming equal playing speed, the same decisions, no other distractions, etc, etc, etc.

So here's a new un-numbered law "It's no use crying over un-made bets."