Do you believe dice setting can be successful?

Do you believe in any of these dice setting claims or if it's actually even possible in real conditions?

Quote: clarkacal

Do you believe in any of these dice setting claims or if it's actually even possible in real conditions?

Here is another thread at WoV on the subject.

HERE

I think most who "feel" they are influencing the dice due to any success at it are just fooling themselves by seeing what randomness is all about.

I think a great test would be to have a dozen "DIs" and a dozen monkees all "doing their best tossing the bones".

I say 50% of the chimps out roll the so called dice setters.

Yes, but most who try dont do it well. A soft delivery from next to the stickman is usually necessary. I set dice, toss 'em pretty soft and get decent results. At best I think you can gain a marginal edge in the long run. Most importantly you have to pay attention to what numbers you are repeating and press those.
I have very little faith in people who set from the far end of the table...

Quote: guido111

I think most who "feel" they are influencing the dice are just fooling themselves
A great test would be to have a dozen "DIs" and a dozen monkeys.
I say 50% of the chimps out roll the so called dice setters.

You see the correct answer is therefore Yes, A Great Deal of Money can be made in this.
Can't you just see how profitable it would be to stage such an event.
Its a low cost event too. A few bananas and you'll get the monkeys. A few hours spent listening to all that talk about grip and set and axis and ratios will only cost you your sanity, not cash. Dice Influencers will talk forever about control over the dice, but all they really do is sell seminars.

Do you think I can bring the winning chimp into a casino to shoot for me for real? Now that would be an event to have shown on the Travel Channel. Chimp breaks the bank at the Monte Carlo. Or perhaps you can find a chimp named Cosmo?

Quote: clarkacal

Do you believe in any of these dice setting claims or if it's actually even possible in real conditions?

The thing is people call it "dice control" when it should be called "dice influence." Yes, if you are right next to the stickman and you throw them just so they can land soft and spin on just one axis. Long-term I would not depend on this for food money, but it can influence a few throws. And if you can take the 7 form 1:6 rolls to 1:7 you have an advantage, that is not disputable.

I believe that it is theoretically possible, and I believe that it can slightly change expectations when done consistently. Consistently is the key word here, though. With so many variables -- bouncy table, wall spikes, etc. that achieving that consistency is a feat in itself.

I have been playing around with setting the dice and the controlled soft throw from next to the Stickman. On rare occasions, I believe it is true that one can have a degree of influence. Enough to alter the probabilities. That said, I am also quite certain the Casino enjoys seeing me at the Table each and every time ... ;-)

I believe dice setters make me lose less money. They take forever to set the dice and therefore less rolls per hour. :)

I believe that there are a few people out there who actually have the ability to influence the dice via their dice control. There is an interesting study which states that in order for someone to have mastered a skill, they must spend over 10,000 hours practicing or doing it. So yes, it is possible that anything could be learned.

I also believe that 99.99% of people who practice dice setting are full of it, and do absolutely nothing but waste time at the table. Since I enjoy the pace of a slow table, I couldn't care less if they take a couple of minutes to set the dice and carefully throw them, but they do not influence the dice and more then a chimp would.

It is complete nonsense, with quasi-religious overtones which are comical.

As always: choose your delusion.

we needed a category of "not sure"

Using a good grip and set and delivery I believe is better than just flinging the dice. The difference may be small, but it is enough to make a profitable session. I wish all dice players would be more thoughtful about throwing dice.

Folks who set should do everyone at the table a favor and learn how to do it quickly.

As far as testing it for statistics I think that would be very challenging. Obviously fatigue would set in from standing, tossing , etc.. It would have to be done over many sessions and would make it very difficult to schedule.

In the WIZARD's and Mr. BLUEJAY's opinion what would you consider statistically significant enough to be convinced that a single person is capable of meaningful influence. Would Mr. Bluejay put up his 30K against one of the headliner dice control coaches or students? I forget his real name but the guy called "sharpshooter" seems like the perfect candidate for the test. He claimed his dice team averaged a 60% return on their bankroll on trips to vegas & AC.

Quote: Scotty71

Folks who set should do everyone at the table a favor and learn how to do it quickly.

As far as testing it for statistics I think that would be very challenging. Obviously fatigue would set in from standing, tossing , etc.. It would have to be done over many sessions and would make it very difficult to schedule.

In the WIZARD's and Mr. BLUEJAY's opinion what would you consider statistically significant enough to be convinced that a single person is capable of meaningful influence. Would Mr. Bluejay put up his 30K against one of the headliner dice control coaches or students? I forget his real name but the guy called "sharpshooter" seems like the perfect candidate for the test. He claimed his dice team averaged a 60% return on their bankroll on trips to vegas & AC.

No dice control charlatan would ever take up the challenge. They would be exposed and thus lose valuable 'students' who pay for 'lessons'. If there were such a person, he would be smart enough to try and draw as little attention to himself, continue to win money from the casinos, and each time walk away professing how lucky he was. I would take up the bet, with the only stipulation being both dice must hit the back wall, which I think is what a casino requires. For those forum members who work in the industry, do you know of any person ever banned from a casino because of successful craps play?

Quote: Scotty71

As far as testing it for statistics I think that would be very challenging. Obviously fatigue would set in from standing, tossing , etc.. It would have to be done over many sessions and would make it very difficult to schedule.

No more challenging than any other test, like practical card-counting. And think of how many trials magicians have to go through before performing a trick on-stage.

Even as few as 10,000 rolls could produce a result that can be statistically analyzed. There is nothing special about dice setting that is any more resistant to practical testing than anything else.

I believe in dice setting as well as the Easter Bunny, Santa Claus and the Tooth Ferry.

Quote: Yoyomama

I believe in dice setting as well as the Easter Bunny, Santa Claus and the Tooth Ferry.

It's also a great way to make money. For those selling the system!!

Quote: Yoyomama

I believe in dice setting as well as the Easter Bunny, Santa Claus and the Tooth Ferry.

Fairy. (Uh,,, that's in relation to Tooth Ferry, not a comment on anyone's "orientation").
Oh, and if this Dice Setting really worked... all them Dice Setters would be shooting dice for high stakes and keeping their yaps shut while they raked in the money. Ain't nobody gonna make running a day long seminar what he could make in one hour if it really worked.

I voted "Yes but it only has a very tiny advantage"

The reality is, I believe that it's possible, after a LOT of practice, to shave a very small slice off the house edge.

Advantage? Positive expectation? No.

No. I imagine it's theoretically possible had you some sort of machinery with tolerances to give a near identical results throw after throw, but for a human to repeat such trials would be near impossible, IMO. Even if you could perhaps gain the muscle memory to consistently throw near identical tosses, there'd be too many variables, not the least of which would be fatigue. It's back to the point of every other system or method ever mentioned...if it's so possible, why the fuss? Either you quit your job and quietly live making bank playing game X, or you win so much you're all over the news and people make a movie out of you. So far I know of neither. And no, no one has ever been backed off of craps at my place for winning any amount, and nearly every one of them, ~70%, perform their own ritual of dice setting before the toss.

I also prefer 'Ferry', as I imagine a cute little tribe of teeth waiting patiently to cross a river, or possibly one epic tooth in which some culture used to transport their wares over water. Both ideas held me for at least 30 minutes, thank you for that =)