JohnnyComet
JohnnyComet
Joined: Feb 16, 2014
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January 28th, 2015 at 8:52:28 AM permalink
Hey there-

I'm definitely a part-time gambler and prefer sitting only for a few hours vs. a longer grind. I like the volatility and win potential of the carny games and play the side bets, even though they are *absolutely* not the best odds :)

Keeping this in mind, if you have 2-3 hours max which game do you prefer- Ultimate Texas Hold 'Em or Four Card Poker? Curious to hear which and what bets (ante vs bonus) configuration you make.

Thanks!
hwccdealer
hwccdealer
Joined: Jun 4, 2013
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January 28th, 2015 at 9:04:08 AM permalink
Ultimate allows for more decision-making, so I would go with that. I don't know the HA of Ultimate, but 4-Card is 2.79%. Both games have elements that look like BS at first (Ultimate's Blind bet, 4-Card with the dealer getting six cards) but the casino has to make money somehow.
Zcore13
Zcore13
Joined: Nov 30, 2009
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January 28th, 2015 at 9:42:24 AM permalink
What State are you going to be playing in? Texas Shootout is a really fun poker based game. There are also some games that have a "pot" feature, that you not only play against the house, but also a side bet that plays against the other players at the table.

Most games that make it to a Casino floor (and many that don't) are fun. Try others you haven't tried. You might find one you like even better.

ZCore13
I am an employee of a Casino. Former Table Games Director,, current Pit Supervisor. All the personal opinions I post are my own and do not represent the opinions of the Casino or Tribe that I work for.
JohnnyComet
JohnnyComet
Joined: Feb 16, 2014
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January 28th, 2015 at 9:43:35 AM permalink
Thanks- the HA on Ultimate somewhere around 2.3 with optimal play. However I always seem to get river-ed with excellent (AA, AK, KQ etc) cards on that game. Also want to consider the bonus bets, both of which I think have HAs in the 2-3% range...
JohnnyComet
JohnnyComet
Joined: Feb 16, 2014
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January 28th, 2015 at 9:44:13 AM permalink
Usually play in NV or WA.
Mosca
Mosca
Joined: Dec 14, 2009
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January 28th, 2015 at 10:29:39 AM permalink
Quote: JohnnyComet

Hey there-

I'm definitely a part-time gambler and prefer sitting only for a few hours vs. a longer grind. I like the volatility and win potential of the carny games and play the side bets, even though they are *absolutely* not the best odds :)

Keeping this in mind, if you have 2-3 hours max which game do you prefer- Ultimate Texas Hold 'Em or Four Card Poker? Curious to hear which and what bets (ante vs bonus) configuration you make.

Thanks!



I like them both.

4 Card will give you more hands per hour. Also worth noting: If you use simple strategy, the house edge is 3.4%. Many casinos will let you play just the Ante Up bet, which has a house edge of 3.9% (on pay table 50-40-8-5-4-3-1, the only one I've ever seen). So, a lot of players will play two spots of just Ante Up. That increases the chance of a big hit while spreading the volatility a bit, and avoids having 4 units bet on two pair or a straight when the dealer turns over a flush. Sure, all the wins of 3 units with J-J-x-x-x will balance those losses, over time, but if we were talking sense we wouldn't be sitting at a 4 Card Poker table, would we?

That being said, I think UTH is more fun. It is a serious blast, there are more decision points and more chances for garbage to turn into gold. Nothing like holding 6-4 off suit and seeing a flop of 2-3-5.
NO KILL I
JohnnyComet
JohnnyComet
Joined: Feb 16, 2014
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January 28th, 2015 at 10:59:09 AM permalink
Thanks- do you generally match the trips with the Ante on UTH or press it up?
Mosca
Mosca
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January 28th, 2015 at 11:00:45 AM permalink
I match. If I'm betting $10 a spot I bet $10 on the trips.
NO KILL I
ahiromu
ahiromu
Joined: Jan 15, 2010
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January 28th, 2015 at 11:23:55 AM permalink
Just wanted to poke my head in here and say that Trump Taj in AC had 3-4 4cp tables open most of the day when I was there last. Never seen it that popular anywhere else.
Its - Possessive; It's - "It is" / "It has"; There - Location; Their - Possessive; They're - "They are"
cmc0605
cmc0605
Joined: Jul 25, 2013
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January 28th, 2015 at 6:14:55 PM permalink
Quote: JohnnyComet

Hey there-

I'm definitely a part-time gambler and prefer sitting only for a few hours vs. a longer grind. I like the volatility and win potential of the carny games and play the side bets, even though they are *absolutely* not the best odds :)

Keeping this in mind, if you have 2-3 hours max which game do you prefer- Ultimate Texas Hold 'Em or Four Card Poker? Curious to hear which and what bets (ante vs bonus) configuration you make.

Thanks!



I think this is a no-brainer.

In the long run, UTH is a much better bet without Trips, using optimal play it is a lower house edge, and the Wizard's "element of risk" is well under 1%, almost blackjack-like, and probably the best poker-based table game around in that category. My experience playing many several-hour sessions in both is that the fluctuations are comparable (you'd have to look up the numbers), but I'd suggest that for both you need at least 80x-100x your ante bet as a bankroll if you're flat-betting to be "comfortable" for the night.

As others have noted, there is much more "thinking" and decision-making involved in UTH, making it a funner and more stimulating game IMO, and you're playing against the same number of dealer cards (you'll hear a lot of people complain about that fact that dealer has one extra card at 4CP tables, and often people only bet Aces Up for that reason, but in fairness the game does make up for that by offering the ability to bet 3x on good hands, no need for dealer to qualify, and some decent Ante bonuses on big hands).

That said, all the perks that I like (fun, fairly low house edge, and ability to win big) is in UTH, even if you elect to not play the Trips bet. In 4CP, a lot of the (short-term) potential to make your money is hitting the straights, flushes, trips, etc...in UTH, the money is in the ability to make 2x-4x raises on even moderately good hands, plus you get the 50x-500x Blind if you're lucky enough to get a straight or royal flush, and still 10x for quads. In my view, there's not much incentive to play Trips for more than a nickle, unlike 3CP or 4CP where no one really sits down unless they are trying to hit those intermediate-to-big hands on the bonuses.

Like any side bet, it stinks when you miss out on that 8x full house or whatever, but you're still getting compensated on the Blind for those hands, and missing out on a 30x-40x hit is not going to haunt you for life if you don't play it.

You should master the optimal strategy for both, but in UTH you don't usually see people sit at the tables and raise 4x on, say, KQ suited or even a pair of 7's in your hand, but you ought to, and these periodic hits will make it easier to stay ahead by quite a good amount even if you're not getting the "big" hands. A lot of people play conservatively on their first two cards, and bet big on Trips, and they will lose a lot more. In 4CP, it's just hard to win anything unless you go on a streak of high pairs or better, or get (extremely) lucky enough to hit a straight flush/quads.

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