Should High Rollers Feel Obligated to Tip More?

If a man walks up to a blackjack table, buys in for $100 and tips $20 over the next hour he is a great tipper.

If a man walks up to a blackjack table, buys in for $500 and tips $20 over the next hour he is okay.

If a man walks up to a blackjack table, buys in for $2000 and tips $20 over the next hour he is flea.

If a man walks up to a blackjack table, buys in for $10,000 and tips $20 over the next hour he is a cheap ****** ******.

But why is this? The same level of service is being provided by the dealer regardless of if the man's average bet is $5 or $500 per hand. Okay, you can argue that additional paperwork might be needed for the pit staff for the high roller buy ins/markers etc.

I remember the Wizard had an interview with a cocktail waitress who felt that high rollers should tip her $5 to $10 per drink, while normal patrons should give her $1 to $2 per drink. Same drink, same service, unless the high roller is asking for something special that takes her a while to make.

Any high rollers/mid rollers out there want to comment? Should high rollers feel obligated to tip more?

Ok so if you go into a restaurant with your family and order 5 hamburgers and sodas and the kids are a hassle and you get a lot of soda refills and your bill comes to 35 dollars and you leave 7 you feel fine. If you went to the same restaurant with 5 adults each order a steak and a mixed drink and the bill comes to 100 dollars, and you left 7 you would be a jerk. Now those two scenerios took about the same amount of effort from the waitress but the tip varies. Tips are a percentage, while not as set in stone in a casino setting as in other forums thats the way the world works. While your at it you could say that since almost all dealers pool tips why bother tipping at all since the person its intended for will get little benifit out of it. But you just have to trust that the majority of people will do the right thing.

I probably fall on the cheap side of dealer tipping, most of the time, at the casino, which is odd, since for restaurant service I generally leave 25% to 40%.
I play strictly craps, and I will put $5 to $30 in play for the dealers, when I shoot, depending on how the session has been going. If I am up the $30 will go into play. I make a bet that I control, so the dealers get to take the winnings, every time it hits, but the casino will get the $30 when the 7 out comes.
I like this bet as the dealers can get a high amount if the roll is good, but my outlay is capped.
If I make a huge amount right at the end, I will tip 10% of the win amount, IF I AM UP.

I suppose this could be considered cheap, but I am already fighting a HA of 2% to 5%, and if the dealers expected 10% up front, I would be in a hole that you cannot escape from. I feel it is unreasonable to expect a player who just lost $2,000 to tip the dealer a set %. I agree with a comment here about "being a polite winner, and a gracious loser", and if I have just busted out I usually have <$10 in riff-raff chips that I will give to the dealer, but it is more a token than any real value.

I know there are a few dealers on here. I would be interested to see your comments about me only tipping when I win. Am I being cheap ?

In the restaurant, tips are based upon a percentage of the total. But is that really the only factor?

If you're going to a restaurant, and are bringing several rug rats with you, would you go to a place where the bill will probably be $100, or more like $35? Isn't part of that decision influenced by the patrons ability to pay? I mean, if your financial situation enables you to take the kids to an expensive restaurant, you should be prepared to tip accordingly as well.

Similarly, if your financial situation enables you to play in the high-roller pit, you sould tip more than the low-rollers.

Ditto if you're somewhere inbetween.

Quote: RaleighCraps

for restaurant service I generally leave 25% to 40%.

40% ? wow!

Quote: RaleighCraps

If I make a huge amount right at the end, I will tip 10% of the win amount, IF I AM UP...I know there are a few dealers on here. I would be interested to see your comments about me only tipping when I win. Am I being cheap ?

I can't see how you can be faulted, I'm betting they wish most would follow your lead.

Myself, I make a gesture of making some cheap 2-way prop bets, and tip at the end if I am winning or about even about $10 only. Unless I am really flush with a great day then it is more, but not necessarily a percentage.

Quote: RaleighCraps

I probably fall on the cheap side of dealer tipping, most of the time, at the casino, which is odd, since for restaurant service I generally leave 25% to 40%.
I play strictly craps, and I will put $5 to $30 in play for the dealers, when I shoot, depending on how the session has been going. If I am up the $30 will go into play. I make a bet that I control, so the dealers get to take the winnings, every time it hits, but the casino will get the $30 when the 7 out comes.
I like this bet as the dealers can get a high amount if the roll is good, but my outlay is capped.
If I make a huge amount right at the end, I will tip 10% of the win amount, IF I AM UP.

I suppose this could be considered cheap, but I am already fighting a HA of 2% to 5%, and if the dealers expected 10% up front, I would be in a hole that you cannot escape from. I feel it is unreasonable to expect a player who just lost $2,000 to tip the dealer a set %. I agree with a comment here about "being a polite winner, and a gracious loser", and if I have just busted out I usually have <$10 in riff-raff chips that I will give to the dealer, but it is more a token than any real value.

I know there are a few dealers on here. I would be interested to see your comments about me only tipping when I win. Am I being cheap ?

Not a dealer in a real casino (actually the interview is tomorrow!) but a few comments.

First, I like the idea of putting bets in play and leaving them for the craps dealers. This shows appriciation and also ties your interests to theirs.

But you should not only tip "if you are up." The tip should be based on the service level the dealer gives to you. If s/he was friendly/funny/helpful your winnings and the tip are two independent things.

Put another way, think of it like the "Entertainment" coupon book, or whatever they call the 2:1 book of deals in your city. It says in the book you should tip on the check amount *before* all discounts are applied, not after. In other words, the fact that you are getting a discount has nothing to do with the effort required of the waitress. Same with the dealer. You get good service you should tip, no matter if their 21 beat your 20 5 times in a row.

I find it easiest to tip for a win along the way if you are sitting at the table any legnth of time.

I as a dealer have no problem with only being tipped by winners, and 10% of a win I believe to be very generous. I personally also love it when I get tipped when I leave the table. It makes me feel appreciated, especially if a player has not tipped up to that point.

I believe however that Tips should be proportional to the betting amount of the player, especially when the player is a major player - if the player is winning. I do not expect tips from a losing player, so If I receive them I appreciate it more as I know it is for good service.

Tips should only be given for good service, or for big wins (if the dealer is providing decent service), and personally I feel 1% of the win/buyin is a great tip. Maybe thats because the UK doesnt have the tipping culture, so I'm not used to tips all the time.

I know some people here are not going to like this, but I don't tip dealers. Sorry guys! I only play blackjack (and +EV video poker, but no tips required there) and I simply am not willing to give up my tiny edge over the casino in tips. I don't bet thousands, so even a few bucks here and there will erode my advantage. On the up side, I don't usually play at the same table for too long. Never got any grief from the dealers for not tipping, not that I would care what they think of me anyway.

I do tip cocktail waiters and waitresses $1 for the rare bottle of water I order (the only thing I drink in a casino). And of course, I tip the restaurant servers in (or out of) a casino, even if its a free meal.

Quote: odiousgambit

Quote: RaleighCraps

for restaurant service I generally leave 25% to 40%.

40% ? wow!

Ah, the misleading power of numbers.

If my bill comes to $10, I've been known to leave $14.... ie. 40%

I have tipped $40 on a $100 bill, but you better believe the service was impeccable and had a smile.
Generally speaking when the bill gets up to the point where the server is going to get more than $20 for a 20% tip, I will just go with the 20-25%.
I think the service industry is one of the hardest jobs going. I know I certainly wouldn't want to do it, and if I did do it, I would likely be lousy at it. Bless them all.

Here in Vegas it is indeed proper etiquette to tip dealers and cocktail waitresses in part according to how much you are betting. It may not seem rational, but the same principle applies to lots of areas. Take bottle service in a restaurant. One table orders a $1,000 bottle, and another a $50 bottle. Assuming an 18% tip, that would be $180 for opening the expensive bottle, and $9 for opening the cheap one.

In the casino, I think one could argue that the big bettor is probably getting better service. In the high-limit areas they have the best dealers, a higher staff to player ratio, and prettier cocktail waitresses. So it doesn't seem unreasonable to tip more for the better service. Much like nobody argues tipping more for an $80 steak than an $8 hamburger.

Quote: cardshark

Never got any grief from the dealers for not tipping....

Once at BJ, a couple beginners stepped up, so I started helping them. After a while of my advice, and the dealer confirming everything I was saying, the dealer made a comment "You're forgetting the most important lesson." I looked at him a little confused, then he rapped the tip bucket. He did that because I had been tipping before I got distracted by helping these guys, and he therefore knew I wouldn't be offended.


Then there was the time at a poker table. (FYI: In most casinos, floor dealers pool tips, but poker dealers keep them.) It's quite common for poker players to tip on every hand that they win, unless it was a really skimpy pot. ME? I tip $1 for pots of $10 to $50, $2 for $50 to $100, above that it really depends on how big the pot is, and how the hand played out, etc.

I know one poker dealer where, if he doesn't get a tip for a reasonable pot, before dealing the next hand, he will rap the table in front of the winner and say "Nice hand." It's subtle in a not-at-all-subtle sort of way. And he gets his tip.

I always feel terrible when I actually "forget" to tip. This happens at a crowded craps table with a lot of action... and I'm thinking about 30 different things, and unfortunately, tipping isn't one of them. :(

I've actually gone back to the table after and threw a tip down and said sorry and thanks.

Quote: Wizard

Here in Vegas it is indeed proper etiquette to tip dealers and cocktail waitresses in part according to how much you are betting. It may not seem rational, but the same principle applies to lots of areas. Take bottle service in a restaurant. One table orders a $1,000 bottle, and another a $50 bottle. Assuming an 18% tip, that would be $180 for opening the expensive bottle, and $9 for opening the cheap one.

There is a secondary reason this is "normal." Wait staff are taxed as if they were tipped based on a % of the place's sales. So if you tip that $1,000 bottle server $50 they still get taxed ong the $180. Or paying tax on $130 they never earned.

Also, aren't the wait staff promoted accordingly? Such as finding the hottest waitresses and most experienced bartenders at the high limit tables. Thus, they feel obligated to make more.

I feel I tip everyone at the casino/hotel pretty generously except the dealers. Valet, restaurant staff, housekeeping all get tipped win or lose. But I only tip dealers when I win. Last time playing craps I lost $1,000 fairly quickly. Took a break and bought in for $1,500 more and turned it into $4,300. Tipped $100 which I thought was fairly generous.

Quote: Headlock

I feel I tip everyone at the casino/hotel pretty generously except the dealers.

Why? They're not responsible for your luck, good or bad. But you redeemed yourself with that $100 tip.

I tip if the dealers make it enjoyable.

I was once at a craps table about 15 minutes, when I said "I ain't 'feeling it'. I'm moving on. But I'm up $2." And with that, I threw in $2. Without skipping a beat, the boxman said, "Are you sure you're not up $7?" It was such a good laugh, that I threw in a $5."

I don't know, because I always feel bad about it when I'm not at the table.

Quote: DJTeddyBear

Quote: Headlock

I feel I tip everyone at the casino/hotel pretty generously except the dealers.

Why? They're not responsible for your luck, good or bad. But you redeemed yourself with that $100 tip.

I tip if the dealers make it enjoyable.

I was once at a craps table about 15 minutes, when I said "I ain't 'feeling it'. I'm moving on. But I'm up $2." And with that, I threw in $2. Without skipping a beat, the boxman said, "Are you sure you're not up $7?" It was such a good laugh, that I threw in a $5."

i'll do that too. if after a few minutes i know that i don't 'feel it', but up a couple bucks, i'll leave the couple bucks and return another time.

on the topic of tips, after winning at bingo i wasn't sure how to tip for something like that, so i just asked a person who was helping to run the tournament and happen to be congratulating me. she said most people leave $100 for the staff to divide. percentage wise this wasn't much of a tip but this gave me an idea where to start so i left $200. basically if not sure just ask. this should put you in the ball park.

as for dining and similar services i leave roughly 15% and round it off up or down depending on level of service. if the bill is small i round off dollars. i don't like leaving change for tip.

the first night we got in at the venetian i got in late so we ate at the grand lux cafe. i was very hungry and ms nap didn't know what to order. as i like what i call 'cowboy food', i was surprised to find a 'barbque rib sloppy joe's' on the menu. the waiter was very friendly and recommended that and a soup for ms nap. both was very good. i left him $8 on a $22 bill, (an even $30). he started off a great trip for us and it was more than worth it. sometimes you don't know how far a tip will take you, as in that $20 trick.

the funny thing is, if you're not sure what to tip you'll usually know afterwards if you over tipped or under tipped.

Quote: inap

the funny thing is, if you're not sure what to tip you'll usually know afterwards if you over tipped or under tipped.

You may not realize it if you over-tip. The first time I hit a W2-G win in video poker I had no idea what to tip. The win was $8,000, and I tipped $300 (which was much too much). They attendant took it with just a perfunctory "thank you."

Later, when I asked Jean Scott what would have been an appropriate tip, I think she said $5. She then asked what I did tip. When I told her she sprang backwards and shrieked, "Oh my God!"

Man, I just got into trouble at another forum discussing tips (on food).

I believe in feeling good. I feel good when I help others, and tipping is one way to do that. I tip the dealer, win or lose, if he/she makes the game fun. I tip a good dealer more. I don't tip a bad dealer, unless I'm winning decently.

One thing to note; I've never seen good tipping turn a dealer's attitude. In my experience, a surly dealer stays surly regardless. I'm a good player; I know this. I don't get PO'd when I lose, I don't blame the dealer. But I'll be damned if I'm going to sit there and lose, and then tip a guy who makes me feel like a sucker, a guy who just moves the cards and smirks or shrug, a guy who never smiles.

Karma comes back to you. Not as money, but as feeling. You make others feel good, then you get to feel good. Then the money follows, if you work hard. The world runs on attitude; keep yours positive.

Quote: Wizard

Quote: inap

the funny thing is, if you're not sure what to tip you'll usually know afterwards if you over tipped or under tipped.

You may not realize it if you over-tip. The first time I hit a W2-G win in video poker I had no idea what to tip. The win was $8,000, and I tipped $300 (which was much too much). They attendant took it with just a perfunctory "thank you."

Later, when I asked Jean Scott what would have been an appropriate tip, I think she said $5. She then asked what I did tip. When I told her she sprang backwards and shrieked, "Oh my God!"

I hit a slot win for $4000, tipped $100. I think 10% is considered customary.

Quote: Mosca

I hit a slot win for $4000, tipped $100. I think 10% is considered customary.

Hell no! I'll grant you there is not a firm policy, but 10% is way more than most players tip on $1200+ wins.

Hmmm.....

On my first trip to Vegas, back around 2003, I was a relatively new poker player. I got into a tournament at O'Sheas. Tourneys typically pay 10% of participants. There were only 10 players, so there was only one prize. A whopping $300.

I won. When it was over, I was asked to wait at the table a minute. They did a little paperwork. Then there were two envelopes. One envelope was marked "First Place 300" and had the cash in it. The other was an empty envelope marked "Dealers". It was obvious that meant 'tips'. While one person was counting out the $300, the other was tapping the dealer envelope.

It was a very uncomfortable moment. But I did some quick mental math. 300 less the 35 buy-in. The tourney lasted almost 2 hours. Poker dealers often get a buck or two per pot at cash games. A little deduction due to the bad attitude one of the dealers gave me.

$25.

---

The bad attitude was a dealer yelled at me for slow playing pocket kings.

I played at O'Sheas a few times in 2007 and always found the dealers to be pleasant and entertaining.

I generally tipped whatever was left over a round figure, eg last time there was $335 in the pot and me and another guy split, taking $150 each and tipping the $35. If I had won outright I would have tipped the $35. If it had been say $275 Id take $250 and leave the $25, as the tourneys lasted an hour or so. As I played a couple of tourneys a day the Card Room Supervisor left me logged into the system to get extra comp points between comps, which I thought was a nice touch.

This was all before I worked in the gaming industry, but I dont think my tipping standards have changed. I always considered myself generous for an englishman.

I was playing Casino War (also at O'Sheas) around the same timeand bought in for $20 to pass the time. I ended up on a decent streak and soon had $80 in front of me, so decided to stop after the next loss. I ended up with $90 so I tipped $15 and left with $75 in my pocket because the dealer was helpful and entertaining. I was there about 15 minutes. I think it was a decent tip, but the dealer earned it by explaingin the game (back when I was a gambling newbie and before I worked in a casino) and made great conversation, despite the rowdy Texans at the table.

Lest there be any misunderstanding, my comment that 10% is too much of a tip was meant about slot jackpots only. I have no problem with tipping 10% for small tournament wins or table games.

Actually, I would give a big tip to make that W-2G go away. You can't do that, of course...

I'm not a big tipper, never have been, probably never will be. Yes, I realize it's a tough job. Yes, I realize the casino probably pays them very little, so they need those tips. And helping those less fortunate (though in some cases I'm dubious) does feel good. But every dollar I tip comes out of my bottom line, and the bottom line is important to me and my happiness. For example, my usual tip rate at blackjack costs about .5% of my action, which about doubles the edge on me. I'm sure I would tip more if I bet more - not necessarily as a percentage, but perhaps bigger chips, more chips, or more often.

Quote: fremont4ever

... Yes, I realize it's a tough job. Yes, I realize the casino probably pays them very little, so they need those tips. And helping those less fortunate (though in some cases I'm dubious) does feel good...

Therein lies the problem. How is it we have let a business that has a very very profitable business model, one with a guaranteed profit margin, decide to underpay its Customer facing work force, and expect the Customer to supplement the wages?
This is an issue between the employees, and the business. The Customer should not be involved in this. My tip should be a GRATUITY. The dealer should not be counting on my tip to pay their bills.
So now, since the dealer NEEDS my tip to pay their utility bill, they can feel they are entitled to that money.
I'm not saying all dealers have this attitude. In fact, most of them don't from what I have witnessed. It amazes me that all of them don't though.
Since the dealers do not handle the tip money directly, is the tip money included in their paychecks, and thus an accurate total goes on their W2's? I would suspect that is the case.

Quote: RaleighCraps

How is it we have let a business that has a very very profitable business model, one with a guaranteed profit margin, decide to underpay its Customer facing work force, and expect the Customer to supplement the wages?

You can ask this same question about any industry where the staff gets tipped.

"Guaranteed profit margin" ?

There are no such guarantees. Casinos, like restaurants, will make a profit, but only if the customers show up.

Casino revenue is down all over. Are the casinos still making a profit? If so, it's only because they have also been steadily trimming the workforce. But if they're still making a profit, why are casinos being sold and/or filing for bankcrupcy protection?


Yeah, it sucks that tips have become a necessary / expected part of their income, but it is what it is.

Quote: DJTeddyBear

Casino revenue is down all over. Are the casinos still making a profit? If so, it's only because they have also been steadily trimming the workforce. But if they're still making a profit, why are casinos being sold and/or filing for bankcrupcy protection?
Yeah, it sucks that tips have become a necessary / expected part of their income, but it is what it is.

I do not have access to numbers, but I will bet casino revenue in US total is UP. There are new casinos opening up in more states every day. The individual revenue in a casino may be down, but that is because there is way more competition out there. (The economy has been tough, so it really could be that total revenue is down as well, but my point is still valid. More competition.)

Those casinos that had poor business controls are not immune. Casinos built in an area where people stop playing, or start going elsewhere, are going to go under. None of this is a reason I should be expected to start paying the wages of the dealer.

Quote: RaleighCraps

None of this is a reason I should be expected to start paying the wages of the dealer.

"Start"? These jobs have ALWAYS been poor paying supplemented by tips.

My point you quoted was to refute your comment about 'guaranteed' profit for casinos, and not about tips.

Quote: DJTeddyBear

Yeah, it sucks that tips have become a necessary / expected part of their income, but it is what it is.

Change that. I meant "are", not "have become".

Quote: Wizard

Quote: Mosca

I hit a slot win for $4000, tipped $100. I think 10% is considered customary.

Hell no! I'll grant you there is not a firm policy, but 10% is way more than most players tip on $1200+ wins.

Quote: Wizard

Lest there be any misunderstanding, my comment that 10% is too much of a tip was meant about slot jackpots only. I have no problem with tipping 10% for small tournament wins or table games.

AAARGH! My mistake; I meant 1%. I should have tipped $40 on $4000. $100 on $10000.

Overall I dislike the idea of tipping. People should earn a salary commeasurate to their work and not depend on the random kndness of strangers. However, tipping is the norm in most or all personal service.

My parents taught me about tipping, sort of. If I had to take a cab alone when I was a child (and I can't imagine aprents letting their children on cabs alone these days!), my mom would give me some money and tell me "the fare will be X, and from the change you give Y to the driver." Likewise when I went for a haircut (the barber shop was a block away from my mom's store). To this day I tip cabbies almost every time. The exceptions are when 1) I know the cabbie owns the cab and 2) when I know the cabbie took a deliberately longer route.

I still don't like tipping, but you really can't escape it. So I tip when necessary, and always according to the quality of service and the amount in the check or fare. In some cases I tip very well on purpose, in order to get better service in the future. But that's another matter.

Vegas is a tip town. Lots of people depend on tips. Bartenders, cocktail waitresses, dealers, cabbies, tour guides, etc etc. And sometimes it's hard to know how much to tip. I mean, what do you tip for a free drink? What do you tip for a complimentary shuttle ride without any bags?

Since I don't drink while I gamble, I haven't had to tip a cocktail waitress yet (really!). The shuttle drivers I've tipped $1, and I don't know whether that was within the average or not. When i took the Hoover Dam tour I tipped the guide/driver $10 because I thought she was very entertaining, informative and really very nice; we also chatted a while over a smoke at one stop. I tipped a craps dealer at the Paris $5 because he explained how the game was played while I and a few others watched, all the while tending his table (I dind't play then).

Now, a dealer follows a set of rules and usually has little or nothing to do with your winnings. I say usually because I've seen BJ dealers give advice from time to time. So in theory you should tip based on service and no other considerations.

However, you wouldn't expect a low-roller, like me, to tip the same as a high-roller. If I play flat $5 per hand on BJ, I won't tip $20 per hour regardless fo how I'm doing. But I do feel generous when I win, so I will tip more if I win.

I used to play lotto every week (not any more). You don't tip the lotto vendor, but once when I won around $3,000 (split with five other people) I did tip her $30 next week (about 5% of my share).

Quote: Nareed

The exceptions are when 1) I know the cabbie owns the cab and 2) when I know the cabbie took a deliberately longer route.

#1 I gotta argue with. Yeah, you don't tip the owner of the bar who happens to be tending the bar. Part of that is because a bar's prices are not set in stone. A cab's price is set by the Taxi Commission. And cabbies, both owners and drivers, complain about it (except briefly after an increase).

#2 - All sorts of Vegas guides tell people to not let the cabbie take the tunnel from the airport. They don't say "unless your hotel is south of ...." But I agree with your point.

cancel my post