Patriots opt to kick in overtime.

Yesterday the Jets/Patriots game went into overtime, the Patriots win the flip, and choose to kick. The Jets score a touchdown on their first possession and I hear the Patriots fans are vilifying Bill Bilichick's decision to kick the ball.

Here is more information about it: Patriots insist no confusion on decision to kick off after winning coin flip.

The question for the poll is what do you think of the decision to kick?

"The version I heard was," Belichick wanted the Patriots to go a particular direction, but at the toss, Slater said, "We'll kick, going that way," and the referee interpreted this as the Patriots choosing to kick, which meant the Jets got the choice of direction.

I genuinely think this game was blown on purpose. 1 minute and 30 seconds with 2 timeouts left in the end of the first half... Brady comes out, runs twice, then walks off the field without using any timeouts, WHEN THEY WERE LOSING.

I flip to another channel and see Seatle with 1 minute 10 seconds left and 2 timeouts, running plays, spiking the ball, calling timeouts, and taking shots down the field. They were also losing. I've never seen Brady, when losing, just give up on a half/etc when they have some time AND timeouts.

I didn't watch the end of the game, but this sounds about right for someone 'trying to lose' the game.

I think that there are some factors that need to be considered and can't be quantified with stats.The patriots have so many injuries that have depleted their offense.So I believe the thought process was to make the stop on defense and then they would only need to get in field goal range. They did the same thing against Denver and that time it worked out.

Quote: ThatDonGuy

"The version I heard was," Belichick wanted the Patriots to go a particular direction, but at the toss, Slater said, "We'll kick, going that way," and the referee interpreted this as the Patriots choosing to kick, which meant the Jets got the choice of direction.

No, that's not what happened.

Quote: ThatDonGuy

"The version I heard was," Belichick wanted the Patriots to go a particular direction, but at the toss, Slater said, "We'll kick, going that way," and the referee interpreted this as the Patriots choosing to kick, which meant the Jets got the choice of direction.

What was the speed and direction of the wind?

Quote: Romes

I genuinely think this game was blown on purpose....

Why would they do that?

Quote: Wizard

...Why would they do that?

Oh, someone somewhere can think of a few million reasons...

Or, it's a conspiracy to make me lose in my Fantasy Superbowl and again in the Handicapping Contest! (maybe I'm a bit spiteful lol)

Here are my opinions. BB wants the Jets to win the game and make the playoffs. He would rather play the Jets in the playoffs than the steelers. The play calling and game plan was completely dumbed down because he doesn't want to show the Jets anything prior to the playoffs. When it came to overtime he already knew the steelers lost and again figured he could basically throw the game in overtime to get the Jets into the playoffs.

Coingate conspiracy

The article that the Wizard linked to only suggests the confusion that ThatDonGuy's post implies.

I'm not a big football guy, but the article, WITH ThatDonGuy's clarification makes it seem like the poll is missing an option or two.

The Patriots wanted a specific side of the field, with the assumption that the Jets would then chose to receive. Unfortunately, they phrased their decision badly, giving the Jets the ball AND the choice of sides.

No conspiracy involved.

Obviously under normal circumstances it is advantageous to receive. In the Denver game a few years ago, it was not normal circumstances with the snow and blustery wind. Belichick gambled and it paid off.

In this game I don't know exactly what he was thinking but he obviously thought something along the lines of with their depleted Offense and limited offensive weapons, if his defense stops the Jets, Brady only need get in field goal range for one of the best kickers. Doesn't speak volume of Coach's confidence in his future HoF QB.

It doesn't seem like wind was a factor but Belichick must have wanted whatever wind there was at his kickers back, which would also mean Jets were throwing into it. It was the player on the field that screwed that up and the Patriots ended up not getting that as well. That was the mistake. The player should have chosen the end of the field and then the choice of kicking/receiving would have been the Jets and they likely would have received, just going the other way. Probably wouldn't have made a difference, but it is just funny that the Patriots won the toss and ended up not getting what they really wanted....direction of play.

I did find the situation at the end of the first half more unusual. Down 10-3 with better than a minute left, a couple time outs and the ball in decent field position (I think like their own 30-35 yard line) The Patriots just ran out the clock. What made that even stranger is that they weren't getting the second half kickoff. This decision, much life the overtime kick off decision, doesn't show a lot of confidence in his offense and super star QB.

Quote: GWAE

Here are my opinions. BB wants the Jets to win the game and make the playoffs. He would rather play the Jets in the playoffs than the steelers. The play calling and game plan was completely dumbed down because he doesn't want to show the Jets anything prior to the playoffs. When it came to overtime he already knew the steelers lost and again figured he could basically throw the game in overtime to get the Jets into the playoffs.

This makes... entirely too much sense.

Quote: Wizard

Why would they do that?

One of the conspiracies is that they did not want to play Pittsburgh in the playoffs. I am not buying it.

BB is not telling the truth. Okay, he could be...but he usually doesn't do that, so why would he give us his real reasons for doing this?

Okay, conspiracy theories aside, I think the depleted offensive line and other issues led him to take a chance that has worked for him before. The player muffed part of the call; it had little impact but could have had it come down to a final field goal attempt.

The players are deep into a long season. All of them are hurting. You know you are going to the playoffs. Why not take a chance on shortening the game?

Quote: RonC

BB is not telling the truth. Okay, he could be...but he usually doesn't do that, so why would he give us his real reasons for doing this?

Okay, conspiracy theories aside, I think the depleted offensive line and other issues led him to take a chance that has worked for him before. The player muffed part of the call; it had little impact but could have had it come down to a final field goal attempt.

The players are deep into a long season. All of them are hurting. You know you are going to the playoffs. Why not take a chance on shortening the game?

Yeah, why not use 1 min 30 seconds and 2 timeouts to just get down the feel and score at all, resulting in no overtime at all? I mean, even if you burn the clock then they just won't even get the ball back, so it's 'almost' like a free shot when you're losing.

When the Patriots scored at the end of regulation to make it 20-19 with the extra point pending, I honestly though Belichick might go for 2 points and the win rather than kicking the extra point and tying the score. For a second he just looked like he was considering that. I wonder if he really was or that was just my perception.

Me neither. Not when you risk the 1 seed by losing.

Quote: kewlj

When the Patriots scored at the end of regulation to make it 20-19 with the extra point pending, I honestly though Belichick might go for 2 points and the win rather than kicking the extra point and tying the score. For a second he just looked like he was considering that. I wonder if he really was or that was just my perception.

That would have been a far superior option to deferring in OT imho.

Quote: ThatDonGuy

"The version I heard was," Belichick wanted the Patriots to go a particular direction, but at the toss, Slater said, "We'll kick, going that way," and the referee interpreted this as the Patriots choosing to kick, which meant the Jets got the choice of direction.

BB reportedly wanted to kick, but in order to kick AND get any wind advantage, the Patriot captain, upon winning the toss, should have elected to defend the end of the field that they wished. Then, the Jets would have elected to receive (although they could have elected to kick, but then they would have given up the ball and the preferred end to defend, so not likely), and then the Patriots would have kicked.

As I learned later, the officials actually check with the coaches about their preference if their team wins the toss, although it's not official until after the coin toss and the captains make their choices. So, when the referee asked the Patriot captain, "You want to kick?" he was asking knowing that is what he heard from the Patriot bench. What the response should have been was "We went to defend this end" while pointing one way or the other. But when he said, "We want to kick", then the choice to defend goes to the other team.

Regardless, the conditions didn't seem to dictate kicking first, the wind wasn't really a factor, so I find it curious, but not buying into the Steeler conspiracy theory.

If the Patriots truly wanted to throw the game, then why didn't they rest all the good players they had left and give the field to the bench warmers?

Quote: Wizard

If the Patriots truly wanted to throw the game, then why didn't they rest all the good players they had left and give the field to the bench warmers?

Wouldn't that be a little "too" on the nose? Fans could be upset or something? This does kind of support my crazy conspiracy that someone had to of bet big on the game =D.

Come on people, stop with the conspiracy theories. Seems anything that happens anymore....someone has a conspiracy theory. Patriots are still trying to lock up #1 seed and home field advantage. Both Cincinnati and Denver are still in the hunt for the number 1 seed. (Denver holds the tie breaker because they beat the Patriots).

Hell, New England hasn't even locked up a first round bye yet as they could drop to #3 seed behind Denver and Cincinnati. Fast forward to the AFC championship game in late January and the difference between a home game against either of those two teams vs traveling to Denver or Cincinnati, could very well be the difference between going to the Superbowl and watching from home. No way Bilichick was not trying to win that game.

Quote: kewlj

...No way Bilichick was not trying to win that game.

THEN IT WAS TOM BRADY WHO MUST HAVE HAD SOME KIND OF MONEY ON THE GAME! I've figured it out!!

lol I hate the conspiracy crap too. I don't really believe in any conspiracies, but dammit if it didn't look like they blew that game intentionally. I mean, the end of the first half is all I really should have to point to. NO good/strategic reason for having arguably the best quarterback in the league not try to get down field with 1:30 and 2 timeouts on the 35.

Quote: Romes

but dammit if it didn't look like they blew that game intentionally. I mean, the end of the first half is all I really should have to point to. NO good/strategic reason for having arguably the best quarterback in the league not try to get down field with 1:30 and 2 timeouts on the 35.

Didn't look like they were intentionally not trying to me. They just aren't that good right now. Brady has no receivers to throw to and the Offensive line can't protect him. Has anybody watched them in the last month. Yeah, Patroits beat up a couple of weak AFC south teams in Tennesse and Houston, BUT patriots blew a 14 point lead and lost to a back-up QB in Denver and they blew a 14 point lead AT HOME and lost to a really bad Philadelphia Eagles team. Remember the Eagles scoring 35 straight points?? And that bad Eagles team was coming off back to back games where they gave up 45 points to two bad teams Tampa Bay and Detroit.

The Patriots are just not that good right now and Terrific Tom (like most qb's) become a little more mortal when 330 lb guys are smacking him around a bit.

The series just before half is indeed a little perplexing. Shows a real lack of confidence in your QB when you decide to just run out the clock like that. But if memory serves me correctly, Brady had just thrown an interception the series before that (Revis, I believe). He also had been hit pretty hard a number of times just before that. Maybe BB thought the best thing was to get back to the locker room, down 7 and regroup and fix some blocking schemes to better protect the QB.

As a NY Jets fan, I was very happy with the outcome. 8-)

My understanding is that the Patriots wanted to kick off. It was never a question of which end they wanted to defend.

Here is the quote from Matthew Slater that made the call during the coin toss:

"I just asked (Belichick) three or four times just to make sure I'm not the guy that goes out there, 'Yeah, we want to kick off.' So I double-checked three or four times. I think he was looking at me like 'Are you concussed?' because I kept asking him. But that's what we wanted to do. You never question a coach's decision-making. He's the best in the business and we trust him fully, so that's what we do."

It turns out there are actually three variables with two options when you win the coin toss. Your first choice is to elect to receive the ball or kick off, and your second choice is which end you want to defend. The Patriots chose to kick off which left the Jets with the option of which end to defend. Ideally, if the Patriots thought there was an advantage to which end was better they would choose the end to defend leaving the Jets to choose if they wanted to kick or receive.

It appears that Bill wanted to kick and so that’s what they got. With the new overtime rules it’s not necessarily a bad thing to kick. I suspect Bill thought his defense played well in that 4th quarter so if they could kick to the Jets, stop them, and end up with better field position since the Jets special teams is no great shakes this year especially punting and punt coverage. Also the Patriots would have been in a position to win it with a field goal under that scenario as the second possessor. It almost worked too in that the Jets converted a 3rd down through a pass interference penalty. If the Patriots stopped them there it would have been decent field position.

--helpmespock

Personally, I don't care for Bill Belichick at all. There is a line between getting every advantage you (legally) can and cheating and I believe he routinely crosses that line.
a few examples:
A.) Obviously deflategate
B.) Spygate
C.) Deceptive substitutions in last years playoff game vs Baltimore. The refs didn't realize what was happing (3 different times) because they had never seen this done before. The league later said it should have been a penalty all 3 times.
D.) Early this season, in a game in New England, the Pittsburgh Steeler head set weren't working properly. Instead of communicating with each other (players/coaches) all they could hear was the Boston radio station's announcers announcing the game. By rule, when this occurs, the other team is not allowed to use their headsets. New England kept using theirs for more than a quarter until finally the refs threatened to penalize them. At that point the Pittsburg headsets miraculously began to work again.

These are just a few of the slick moves that we know about. How many times have they not been caught.

But as much as I dislike Belichick, I give him some credit for thinking outside the box (I just wish he would keep it legal). He was the one who came up with deferring the coin toss win to always receiving the second half kickoff rather than receiving opening kick off. This often allow you to 'steal' a possession, if you have the last possession of first half and then get the ball to start second half. I don't know how many times I have seen New England score at the end of the half and then get the ball and score at the opening of second half to open a big lead in what was a close game. Now almost every team defers when winning the coin flip.

I also give him credit for the two different 4 and 1, 4th and 2 calls of going for it, with the lead, late in the game deep in his own territory (once on his 28 yard line, once on his 12 yard line). Both cases picking up a first down would have ended the game and both times (INDY a few years ago and SF, I think last year) he did not make it and it cost him the game. I don't know how many times I've heard a coach say 'IF we can't pick up a yard, we don't deserve to win". Belichick had the guts to put that into practice. So I give him credit for that.

Quote: kewlj

Personally, I don't care for Bill Belichick at all. There is a line between getting every advantage you (legally) can and cheating and I believe he routinely crosses that line.

After living in Massachusetts for almost 30 years, I'm glad they cheat. Almost as much as the rest of the league: http://yourteamcheats.com/

Kicking to start off overtime was absolutely the wrong call

For the record, going for it on fourth down in Indianapolis a few years ago was the right call, and the Seahawks throwing throwing the ball at the end of the Super Bowl was also right.

Quote: TomG

Kicking to start off overtime was absolutely the wrong call

I don't agree that it is absolutely the wrong call. I think everything that had happened has to figure into the equation and that you can not use statistics from other games to make a determination like this. My first instinct was the player screwed up, but then it was made clear that is what coach wanted. I will defer to Belichick here and assumes he knows a little more than we do.

Quote: kewlj

Personally, I don't care for Bill Belichick at all. ...

Great post!

According to fivethirtyeight.com the receiving team has gone on to win 51.5 % of the time.So it`s a pretty close play and that doesn`t take into account the other intangibles.

does that 51.5% include games under both the old and the new rules: straight sudden death vs and at least one possession for the other team if the first team with the ball scored a field goal on their first possession?

It says since the NFL adopted the current rules in 2012.

Youuuuuu MIGHT be a 'bad man' if your first name is Bill and your last name is Belichick.....
Or you could be a genius, or you could be a really good Coach with a bunch of reallyyyyy good assistants.
I got no money on or off the Patriots.
Still..... I love to see them lose......
But that's just me.
Hey, I'm from the South...