Owning (a) Shackleford
Poll
 | 6 votes (26.08%) | ||
| | 8 votes (34.78%) | ||
| | 2 votes (8.69%) | ||
| | 1 vote (4.34%) | ||
| | 6 votes (26.08%) |
23 members have voted
The filly's name is "Unshackled"
For those on here who are new, or just didn't care, Shackleford was the Preakness winning horse that this forum unofficially adopted during his Triple Crown run.
Now he's having babies and one of them is in a partnership. A share is 2% of the horse and a few are available.
I thought it would be fun if the forum purchased a share. I e-mailed the person in charge, and she said she would get back to me soon with the amount. I'm guessing the share would probably be around $2,000.
We would put the share officially in Mike's name, but whatever it paid out when the horse was done racing and sold could be given back to the contributors or paid to charity or both.
So the poll is asking if you'd be willing to contribute to pooling our money toward a share. I think it'd be fun and funny. Shackleford owning a Shackleford....
Here's the link:
https://www.facebook.com/UnshackledtheHorse?fref=nf
http://www.shackbabyproductions.com/
Who is in?!?!
I'd love to contribute $200 and I would be able to help with some of the monthly as well, but it looks like we are not close to that amount...
Has this horse already been born? How old is it if so?
Quote: onenickelmiracleDoes the horse live if it's not a winner or do we get a can of dog food if it sucks out?
Has this horse already been born? How old is it if so?
The horse is one month old. The owners care only about the horse, not the money.
Ok I get it now I think. The $50 a month pays for living expenses such as food, vet, and stable fees. I voted for $50 but was tempted to do more. Looks like another symbolic gesture since we can never raise a dime when we want.Quote: FinsRuleThe horse is one month old. The owners care only about the horse, not the money.
Quote: onenickelmiraclewe can never raise a dime when we want.
it's a lot to raise some place like this. The $50/mo alone would be quite the ordeal to collect. That's a shame, as to do a joint venture would be the only way I could justify owning a piece of a horse. So, I'm in if it actually is do-able.
The pregnancy of the mother I imagine. It took a while for me to figure out that one.Quote: GWAEHow is there a 14 month overdue on a 1 month old animal?
Quote: GWAEIf this horse would make it to the Kentucky derby, would a 2% owner get to come and sit with all the other owners or come down to the paddock?
One of us (Mike) would probably be allowed in the winners circle at the Derby. But for regular races it's usually a lot more lenient.
Quote: onenickelmiracleThe pregnancy of the mother I imagine. It took a while for me to figure out that one.
I think it was actually more to cover stud fees. Shackleford's semen is not cheap!
That's per share, per month. I would just pay two years of the percentage of ownership, so $50 becomes $60 basically.Quote: GWAENot that this is actually going to happen but I am out. I originally was willing to put up some money but not if it is a monthly fee as well. For some reason I was not thinking about that but I guess it makes sense that if you own him you need to pay for his expenses.
50/1750*50*12*2
Little off if those are the right numbers I used, $50 becomes $84 this way.
It really just a suggestion for simplicity's sake. After then, two more years again. Until it died, don't know. Something fair and straight forward would have to be agreed beforehand. I would never buy in if these fees weren't mandatory and didn't threaten the original investment if not paid.Quote: GWAEWhy 2 years? Is that the expectancy of a racing horse? Wouldn't you have to pay it until he died.
Also curious to know the finanacial ability of the other 98% ownedship of the horse and partnership details with that group. What happens if they don't pay their share of expenses in the future, etc.?
Quote: onenickelmiracleThe pregnancy of the mother I imagine. It took a while for me to figure out that one.
Looks like the equine gestation period is about 11 months. So still off by about 2 months. Probably relating to the semen though, yeah.
ZCore13
We're getting there!
Hopefully I won't get the family of Donald Angellini angry, as I don't want to wake up to any surprises.
Quote: FinsRuleLooks like we are at $1425!
We're getting there!
I voted in the poll but didn't post - I'd be in for $100.
Quote: GWAEso as a 2% owner would there be a chance to make money on this adventure? Say he wins the triple crown and becomes worth 20 million. Would we be entitled to 2% of that. Seems like a silly question but I am serious.
For a money making venture - this is a terrible investment.
This is definitely one of those "For fun only" types of things. Yes, if she became the first filly to win the triple crown and was worth $10-$15 million, we would be entitled for 2% of that plus all the purses she won on the way.
If I had to guess, I'd say the odds are about 50-50 that she wins 1 race in her lifetime. Maybe a little less actually. But she'll probably run in a race which will definitely give everyone here a cool thrill. We could even take a WOV trip out there for the event.
But in summary, I would not recommend this for someone who wants to make a bunch of money.
ZCore13
Quote: FinsRuleFor a money making venture - this is a terrible investment.
This is definitely one of those "For fun only" types of things. Yes, if she became the first filly to win the triple crown and was worth $10-$15 million, we would be entitled for 2% of that plus all the purses she won on the way.
If I had to guess, I'd say the odds are about 50-50 that she wins 1 race in her lifetime. Maybe a little less actually. But she'll probably run in a race which will definitely give everyone here a cool thrill. We could even take a WOV trip out there for the event.
But in summary, I would not recommend this for someone who wants to make a bunch of money.
I was not meaning I would expect it to happen. I was just wondering about the logistics of owning a part of something like this.
For example, say she won a few races and had 50k in winnings. Does that money automatically get distributed to the owners?
Is a horse set up as an actual business where you would see a P&L exclusively for that horse?
Quote: GWAEI was not meaning I would expect it to happen. I was just wondering about the logistics of owning a part of something like this.
For example, say she won a few races and had 50k in winnings. Does that money automatically get distributed to the owners?
Is a horse set up as an actual business where you would see a P&L exclusively for that horse?
The horse is set up as an LLC.
Typically in these arrangements, if a horse won 25K in a race, they would take about half out to pay for the next 6 months of care so the owners could skip 6 months of $50 payments. The rest would be distributed by check to the owners.
Quote: GWAEI was not meaning I would expect it to happen. I was just wondering about the logistics of owning a part of something like this.
For example, say she won a few races and had 50k in winnings. Does that money automatically get distributed to the owners?
Is a horse set up as an actual business where you would see a P&L exclusively for that horse?
Sorry for the multiple posts. I'm glad you don't expect this to happen. This is definitely a GWAE - Gambling Without An Edge...
Racing horses aren't my field whatsoever, but looking at random discussions about pet ownership, that number seems a little high, particularly for an unproven horse, even allowing a few multiples for a professional racer-to-be.
Quote: FinsRuleSorry for the multiple posts. I'm glad you don't expect this to happen. This is definitely a GWAE - Gambling Without An Edge...
haha that is great.
Another dumb question. What would a horse with a chance of winning go for or is this not a common thing to be done?
Quote: VenthusIs 2500/mo for upkeep typical?
Racing horses aren't my field whatsoever, but looking at random discussions about pet ownership, that number seems a little high, particularly for an unproven horse, even allowing a few multiples for a professional racer-to-be.
Yeah, that's pretty much in the middle of the figures I have read (I have never done this before, but have researched it). There's a lot more costs than simply owning, feeding and stabling the horse. A lot of vet bills, and the trainer doesn't just get a % of purses, they get their daily fee as well.
Quote: GWAEhaha that is great.
Another dumb question. What would a horse with a chance of winning go for or is this not a common thing to be done?
Not sure if I interpreted this right, but horses sell at auction for all sort of amounts. Zenyatta only cost 60K at auction and probably had a total value of 20-25 mil. Then there's the Green Monkey who sold for like 14 million and ended up being pretty much worthless. California Chrome's mom cost 8k through claiming (which was probably high) and the stud fees were 2500. It's really all over the map.
Quote: ParadigmI voted but didn't acknowledge in the thread. I am in for $200, maybe more if I can get a chance to look at the LLC agreement first and we can raise the $3500 so monthly collection issues are taken care of upfront
So there does seem to be a bit of a time sensitivity to this. We will see if we can get to at least $1750 by this weekend. On Saturday I'll post a table with all members and their pledges, so if you voted and did not post your amount, please do so.
I am working now, so it's tough to post during the day.
Also Wizard mentioned getting a comped share. I am all for him getting a $100 share at no cost. Not sure how everyone else feels about that.
So say we get 15 people to buy a share. Since this is a real LLC would we have any other expenses? I assume you or Wizard or the horses company would need our real names? Or would it just be in the Wizards name and he would be responsible for sending me my 133k check when this philly gets sold for 100 million.
They are selling 2% but would they allow a 2% stake to be split between a bunch of people?
Quote: ParadigmMy guess is that Wiz's name is the only one included in the actual horse ownership's LLC and as such Wiz would be allowed all the tax losses and be responsible for taxes on any profits. From a legal and tax standpoint, the rest of us won't really exist unless we have some side written agreement between Wiz and the group. I am good with Wiz having a free 1/36 in a pool comprised of $3500 that the rest of the group puts up.
I'm going to do a big post tonight, but my thought is to plan for 4 years of fees up front. So the total would be $3400. We would sell 50 shares at $68 per share.
The one thing I didn't think about are the tax implications... This is going to be a bit more confusing than I thought.
Quote: FinsRuleI'm going to do a big post tonight, but my thought is to plan for 4 years of fees up front. So the total would be $3400. We would sell 50 shares at $68 per share.
The one thing I didn't think about are the tax implications... This is going to be a bit more confusing than I thought.
Yeah I think Wizard should definitely get a free 1/36 since he may have some work with it in the future.
I think you should PM him to make sure he is ok with this arrangement and when we win it big we can worry about the disbursements then. I am not lawyer or tax person so I am not sure what the implications for that would be.
Why don't we all just go put $100 on roulette and if we win, we all own so much of that horse, we have to pay for it's college.Quote: GWAEYeah I think Wizard should definitely get a free 1/36 since he may have some work with it in the future.
I think you should PM him to make sure he is ok with this arrangement and when we win it big we can worry about the disbursements then. I am not lawyer or tax person so I am not sure what the implications for that would be.
Maybe we can get Brian or Ace in and they can figure something out simple and easy. We'll be smart arse partners(SAPs)
I suggest the name: Ahigh
Quote: HowManyDoes the horse have a name yet?
I suggest the name: Ahigh
Unshackled.
I asked the Wizard about his thoughts on taxes, just waiting for his response.
Quote: HowManyDoes the horse have a name yet?
I suggest the name: Ahigh
HAHAHAHAA. There go our chances of a winner.
ZCore13
