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Wizard
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Roberto21
March 8th, 2022 at 8:07:26 PM permalink
Let's talk about another slot machine that is sometimes positive EV -- Golden Jungle Grand.

The thrust of this one is that every tenth spin the game the game will usually have some all wild reels. The way it works is if the player gets a Golden Buddha symbol at any time, it will illuminate a marker above the reel it appeared on, up to two of them per reel. If on the tenth spin in a cycle a reel has two Golden Buddha markers, then that reel will be entirely wild.

We could probably use an example about now, so I made this video just for you!


Direct: https://youtu.be/my2Jeg_w_JU

Note the "game" screen in the lower right, how it counts up from 1 to 10. This represents where in the cycle the last spin was. So, it's best when the counter is at 9, because the next spin will invoke the wild reels feature, said conditions above being met.

Note, at the 0:51 point, I'm on the 10th spin in a cycle and accumulated two Golden Buddhas in the previous spins on reel 1.

The big question is when is this game positive EV? It is obviously good to be late in a ten-spin cycle with many reels with two Golden Buddhas, preferably on the left side.

I've only started to think about this game, so welcome all thoughts.

The question for the poll is what do you think of adding this game to your bag of AP tricks?
Last edited by: Wizard on Mar 9, 2022
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
McSweeney
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March 8th, 2022 at 8:40:10 PM permalink
A good place to be in the spin cycle is relative. yes, if you're on spin 9, you have the advantage of only needing to invest into one bet to harvest the wild reels. But if a lot of buddha statues have already been collected and you're only on spin 4, even if you have to invest more money to get to spin 10, you have 6 more chances to collect even more buddha statues and get a massive win.

And technically, this game is Golden Jungle GRAND. The original Golden Jungle is also an advantage game but plays completely differently.
Wizard
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March 9th, 2022 at 6:31:52 AM permalink
Quote: McSweeney

And technically, this game is Golden Jungle GRAND. The original Golden Jungle is also an advantage game but plays completely differently.
link to original post



Thank you. I'll change the name of the thread.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
Wizard
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March 9th, 2022 at 3:56:52 PM permalink
I think I'll run some simulations to determine a strategy for this game.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
Wizard
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Roberto21Goodboy21
March 10th, 2022 at 9:29:37 AM permalink
Lacking any friendly input, I reverse engineered this game and put in some various states the game might be left in. So far, I have only looked at situations where the game is left on spin 9. Remember, the spin number if for the last completed game. That means if the game is left in spin 9, the next spin will be eligible for the feature.

I would also like to make a disclaimer that I didn't go to a great deal of effort in my program of this game, so please take anything I say based on my program with a tablespoon of salt.

That said, here is my strategy for when to play when the game is left in spin 9. Play if any of these conditions are true, otherwise don't.

  • Two Buddhas in reel 1, 2, or 3. Example -- 0,2,0,0,0
  • Two Buddhas in reel 4 and a single buddha in at least two of reels 1 to 3. Example -- 1,0,1,2,0
  • One Buddha in reels 1, 2, 3 and 4. Example -- 1,1,1,1,0


I welcome all comments, although I suspect many are just lurking this thread. To them, I would say help our your fellow AP's.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
darkoz
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March 10th, 2022 at 9:42:58 AM permalink
Quote: Wizard

Lacking any friendly input, I reverse engineered this game and put in some various states the game might be left in. So far, I have only looked at situations where the game is left on spin 9. Remember, the spin number if for the last completed game. That means if the game is left in spin 9, the next spin will be eligible for the feature.

I would also like to make a disclaimer that I didn't go to a great deal of effort in my program of this game, so please take anything I say based on my program with a tablespoon of salt.

That said, here is my strategy for when to play when the game is left in spin 9. Play if any of these conditions are true, otherwise don't.

  • Two Buddhas in reel 1, 2, or 3. Example -- 0,2,0,0,0
  • Two Buddhas in reel 4 and a single buddha in at least two of reels 1 to 3. Example -- 1,0,1,2,0
  • One Buddha in reels 1, 2, 3 and 4. Example -- 1,1,1,1,0


I welcome all comments, although I suspect many are just lurking this thread. To them, I would say help our your fellow AP's.
link to original post



Finding a machine on the 9th spin in those states without a butt already parked in the seat is AP fantasy.

You would have as much chance of finding a $10,000 must hit at $9,999!
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Wizard
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March 10th, 2022 at 2:19:58 PM permalink
Moving onto games left in spin 8.

I find the player should play if any other following conditions are true, otherwise don't.

Let:
GB = Golden Buddha.
Full reel = Reel with two GB.

  • First three columns have three or more GB.
  • Full reel in first three reels and either 1+ GB in reel 4 or 2 GB in reel 5.
  • Two reels in first 3 with one GB and either 2 GB in reel 4 and both 1 GB in reel 4 and 2 GB in reel 5.
  • One reel in first 3 with one GB and four GB between reels 4 and 5.


I have not checked the following very carefully, but I think the above conditions will hold up well for any spin number of 8 or less. I think the money vested into the additional spins for less than 8 roughly offsets the chance to earn more GB.

This post took hours to research, by the way. Who else does this for you for free?
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
100xOdds
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March 10th, 2022 at 2:46:16 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard

Moving onto games left in spin 8.

I find the player should play if any other following conditions are true, otherwise don't.

Let:
GB = Golden Buddha.
Full reel = Reel with two GB.

  • First three columns have three or more GB.
  • Full reel in first three reels and either 1+ GB in reel 4 or 2 GB in reel 5.
  • Two reels in first 3 with one GB and either 2 GB in reel 4 and both 1 GB in reel 4 and 2 GB in reel 5.
  • One reel in first 3 with one GB and four GB between reels 4 and 5.


I have not checked the following very carefully, but I think the above conditions will hold up well for any spin number of 8 or less. I think the money vested into the additional spins for less than 8 roughly offsets the chance to earn more GB.

This post took hours to research, by the way. Who else does this for you for free?
link to original post


at my casino, noone quits with 2 buddhas on one of the 1st 3 reels.

what more useful info is for: 1 buddha on 2 of the 1st 3 reels
i see that often.

Which spin # is the right time to play, if any?
Craps is paradise (Pair of dice). Lets hear it for the SpeedCount Mathletes :)
darkoz
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March 10th, 2022 at 4:13:33 PM permalink
From what I have observed of the vultures, they don't expect to find those golden opportunities (no pun intended).

They are looking for not so obvious states where the average player doesn't see the likelihood of success to keep playing. They have turned it into a skillset.

For example they may check the fifth spin to see if at least one Buddha is locked on two of the first three reels and take the gamble. Getting to spin ten is at least half the price and they are already halfway to filling the Buddha.

In this manner they do have some losing moments but the winning times outweigh the losers.
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Goodboy21
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March 11th, 2022 at 6:53:30 AM permalink
Hello Michael

I just signed up for the site, motivated mainly to thank you for your free effort on this analysis.

Hats off for you!
Wizard
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March 11th, 2022 at 8:03:16 AM permalink
Quote: Goodboy21

Hello Michael

I just signed up for the site, motivated mainly to thank you for your free effort on this analysis.

Hats off for you!
link to original post



Thank you! Welcome to the forum.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
Wizard
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March 11th, 2022 at 9:31:12 AM permalink
Here is my strategy for a game left on game 6. You may note that my last strategy was for game 8. For game 7, I would use your best judgement on a something between the game 6 and 8 strategy.

Play if any of the following conditions are true, otherwise don't. Again, GB = Golden Buddha.

  • Four or more total GB.
  • Total of three GB with at least two in first three reels.


There are some minor exceptions:

0-0-2-0-1: Don't play
2-0-0-0-1: Don't play
1-0-0-2-0: Do play
0-1-0-2-0: Do play
0-0-1-2-0: Do play
Last edited by: Wizard on Mar 11, 2022
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
Wizard
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March 11th, 2022 at 1:54:01 PM permalink
Here is my strategy for a game left on game 4. You may note that my last strategy was for game 6. For game 5, I would use your best judgement on a something between the game 6 and 8 strategy.

Play if any of the following conditions are true, otherwise don't. Again, GB = Golden Buddha.

  • Three or more total GB.
  • Total of two GB in the first four reels.


Exception: Do no play with only two GB, both in reel 4.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
Wizard
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March 11th, 2022 at 3:33:48 PM permalink
Game 1 Strategy

Play any state except no GB or only one GB on reel 5.



Game 2 Strategy

Play if any of the following conditions are true, otherwise don't. Again, GB = Golden Buddha.

  • At least one GB in first three reels.
  • At least two GB in reels 4 and 5.


In other words, the only time not to play is with zero GB or one only that appears on reel 4 or 5.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
Wizard
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March 11th, 2022 at 4:32:10 PM permalink
I'm starting to write a page on this game and wasn't sure if what I've been calling the Golden Buddha is really Buddha. A Google search of the following image didn't come up with any close matches. Based on the closest suggestions, I'm now leaning it towards it being Vishnu. I welcome all comments, especially from TeddyS.

"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
billryan
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March 11th, 2022 at 4:54:53 PM permalink
It looks like a Baby Buddha to me but that is more of a WAG than from experience.
I would think they would alter any religious icons so as to not offend somebody.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
Wizard
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March 11th, 2022 at 5:01:20 PM permalink
Quote: billryan

It looks like a Baby Buddha to me but that is more of a WAG than from experience.
I would think they would alter any religious icons so as to not offend somebody.
link to original post



I clearly thought it was Buddha too at first, but based on the style of the artwork of the overall game, I think the symbolism is that of India, where Hinduism is the dominant religion.

By the way, Buddha was not enlightened until he was an adult. I don't think he would be depicted as a deity (why is the E before I?) as a baby. Hopefully nobody presses charges that I'm making religious statements.
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Wizard
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March 11th, 2022 at 5:30:23 PM permalink
Please have a preview of my new page on Golden Jungle Grand. I welcome all comments, questions, and corrections.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
billryan
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March 11th, 2022 at 6:01:43 PM permalink
The Buddha was from northern India. I don't know much about why they have baby statues of him but I've seen some that seem serious and some that are comedic. I've no idea if they are offensive to his followers or not.
The review I read calls them buddhas.
I suspect the creators altered the images so it resembles the historic figures but is different enough to not offend anyone.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
unJon
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March 12th, 2022 at 8:59:50 AM permalink
Quote: Wizard

Quote: billryan

It looks like a Baby Buddha to me but that is more of a WAG than from experience.
I would think they would alter any religious icons so as to not offend somebody.
link to original post



I clearly thought it was Buddha too at first, but based on the style of the artwork of the overall game, I think the symbolism is that of India, where Hinduism is the dominant religion.

By the way, Buddha was not enlightened until he was an adult. I don't think he would be depicted as a deity (why is the E before I?) as a baby. Hopefully nobody presses charges that I'm making religious statements.
link to original post



Unlike most ie or ei words, both vowels in deity are pronounced separately. Its three syllables: dee uh tee.

If English followed German rules there would be a diaeresis (two dots) over the i to indicate the syllable break.
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100xOdds
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March 12th, 2022 at 9:20:43 AM permalink
Quote: Wizard

Please have a preview of my new page on Golden Jungle Grand. I welcome all comments, questions, and corrections.
link to original post

how about a chart or simple graphic because its hard to follow for me? (if it's your link, then i apologize because i'm having problems viewing pics right now.)

ie:
Game 4:
x00x0
x00x0

or

00000
xx0x0

where x = Buddha, and 0 = blank
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Dieter
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March 12th, 2022 at 9:26:18 AM permalink
Quote: unJon


Unlike most ie or ei words, both vowels in deity are pronounced separately. Its three syllables: dee uh tee.

link to original post



Piety, quiet, dais...


Some people eat snails because they don't like fast food.
May the cards fall in your favor.
unJon
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March 12th, 2022 at 10:29:57 AM permalink
Quote: Dieter

Quote: unJon


Unlike most ie or ei words, both vowels in deity are pronounced separately. Its three syllables: dee uh tee.

link to original post



Piety, quiet, dais...


Some people eat snails because they don't like fast food.

link to original post



Those are other words in the distinct minority . . .

When life gives you melons, you might be dyslexic.
The race is not always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong; but that is the way to bet.
Goodboy21
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March 13th, 2022 at 3:21:59 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard

Please have a preview of my new page. I welcome all comments, questions, and corrections.
link to original post



Thanks for the info. 1 correction and 1 question:

Correction:

"Game 6
If the previous game was the fourth game in a cycle..."

It should say sixth, right?

The question: So now the strategy for 9th game is no longer valid or is it complementary with the 8th spin strategy?
Wizard
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March 13th, 2022 at 7:38:54 PM permalink
Quote: Goodboy21

Correction:

"Game 6
If the previous game was the fourth game in a cycle..."

It should say sixth, right?

The question: So now the strategy for 9th game is no longer valid or is it complementary with the 8th spin strategy?
link to original post



Thanks for the correction, just fixed it.

The 9th strategy I posted here was not as scientific as what I posted on WoO. I would go with the 8th spin strategy. As Darkoz mentioned, I doubt many players will abandon a game on spin 9 anyway, unless there are zero GVs.
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ALG
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March 15th, 2022 at 11:22:38 PM permalink
Quote: darkoz

Quote: Wizard

Lacking any friendly input, I reverse engineered this game and put in some various states the game might be left in. So far, I have only looked at situations where the game is left on spin 9. Remember, the spin number if for the last completed game. That means if the game is left in spin 9, the next spin will be eligible for the feature.

I would also like to make a disclaimer that I didn't go to a great deal of effort in my program of this game, so please take anything I say based on my program with a tablespoon of salt.

That said, here is my strategy for when to play when the game is left in spin 9. Play if any of these conditions are true, otherwise don't.

  • Two Buddhas in reel 1, 2, or 3. Example -- 0,2,0,0,0
  • Two Buddhas in reel 4 and a single buddha in at least two of reels 1 to 3. Example -- 1,0,1,2,0
  • One Buddha in reels 1, 2, 3 and 4. Example -- 1,1,1,1,0


I welcome all comments, although I suspect many are just lurking this thread. To them, I would say help our your fellow AP's.
link to original post



Finding a machine on the 9th spin in those states without a butt already parked in the seat is AP fantasy.

You would have as much chance of finding a $10,000 must hit at $9,999!
link to original post




Played this last week. Someone left 2,2,2,0,1 on spin 7. Crazy plays still happen occasionally.
teddys
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March 18th, 2022 at 9:27:39 AM permalink
Quote: Wizard

I'm starting to write a page on this game and wasn't sure if what I've been calling the Golden Buddha is really Buddha. A Google search of the following image didn't come up with any close matches. Based on the closest suggestions, I'm now leaning it towards it being Vishnu. I welcome all comments, especially from TeddyS.


link to original post

Looks like a generic Southeast Asian buddha. I'll give them artistic license on this one. By the way, most Buddha statues aren't Shakyamuni (the original "Buddha). A lot are Boddhisatvas or different incarnations of Buddha. An example would be Bodhai who is the "fat buddha" you see in Chinese restaurants or by the Asian games in casinos. Another is the Maitreya Buddha statue in Hong Kong among other places.

I think you're safe calling this one Buddha. No one's gonna rebuke you for it.

Image of another popular slots Buddha:
"Dice, verily, are armed with goads and driving-hooks, deceiving and tormenting, causing grievous woe." -Rig Veda 10.34.4
Wizard
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March 18th, 2022 at 12:43:11 PM permalink
Quote: teddys

By the way, most Buddha statues aren't Shakyamuni (the original "Buddha). A lot are Boddhisatvas or different incarnations of Buddha. An example would be Bodhai who is the "fat buddha" you see in Chinese restaurants or by the Asian games in casinos. Another is the Maitreya Buddha statue in Hong Kong among other places.

I think you're safe calling this one Buddha. No one's gonna rebuke you for it.

Image of another popular slots Buddha:

link to original post



A lot to chew on there. I never did get why Buddha statues show him looking fat and lazy, when I thought he lived a life of poverty and humility. However, let's not get into that, per forum rules.

I would submit for your consideration that the hand positioning and hat look more like those of Vishnu.

"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
teddys
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March 20th, 2022 at 9:19:09 AM permalink
I think it's the Original Recipe Buddha because of the big ears. You'll see those statues have elongated earlobes.

The mudra (hand gesture) shouldn't matter as that could mean a number of other things. Actually, the two hands facing out palms open is not a mudra I've ever seen before. I don't think it exists.

If he's Vishnu why wouldn't he have four arms?

I assure you, you DON'T want to get into this.

Or maybe you do? :)
"Dice, verily, are armed with goads and driving-hooks, deceiving and tormenting, causing grievous woe." -Rig Veda 10.34.4
Dieter
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March 20th, 2022 at 9:36:53 AM permalink
I think this is starting to veer away from the game and into other things...

DT exists
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Wizard
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March 20th, 2022 at 9:52:17 AM permalink
Quote: teddys

If he's Vishnu why wouldn't he have four arms?

I assure you, you DON'T want to get into this.

Or maybe you do? :)
link to original post



Good point about the ears and arms. And, yes, I DO want to get into it, but let's leave that as a topic of discussion when next we see each other.
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Cosmiccow
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August 20th, 2022 at 3:59:05 PM permalink
This is probably a silly question but I am new to machine AP/Vulturing. I would assume the answer to this question is yes, but do you leave the machine if say it meets the criteria for game 4 but then by game 8 it no longer meets criteria? If the answer is play it out till game 10 always then why does the criteria get tighter the more games you have and looser the less games you have? Shouldn't the requirements be looser the more games in you are since its a smaller investment to realize the feature we are shooting for?
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