String bet?

One of the players in my home hold 'em game was grumbling the other night about string bets from another player. We're not very strict about this sort of thing, but I didn't think that what the guy was doing was a violation. The grumbler is kind of an ornery old coot, but he does have more casino poker experience than the rest of us put together.

I'm not sure that I'm gonna be able to describe this adequately. The way the guy was betting was that he'd bring forward a few chips in his hand, like maybe four $5 chips. He'd then lay them down sequentially, side by side, one at a time in a single motion. Effectively spreading them out so we could clearly see how many chips he was betting.

So I'm sure that the argument for a string bet is that he's placing the chips on the table one at a time. But he brought them all out together and set them all down in one motion without returning to get more chips. Is this a string bet, or is it acceptable?

In some casinos that would be acceptable, in other casinos it would not.

Also, the speed in which he laid them out is an additional factor.


Lastly, home games tend to have more relaxed rules. For that reason alone, I voted "no".

Quote: DJTeddyBear

Also, the speed in which he laid them out is an additional factor.

It was pretty quick. He was laying them down side-by-side to display them, but there certainly wasn't any time for decision-making between chips. I've had to issue a warning before to players who clearly hadn't figured out exactly how much they were going to bet before they started placing chips on the table.

Quote: PapaChubby

I'm not sure that I'm gonna be able to describe this adequately. The way the guy was betting was that he'd bring forward a few chips in his hand, like maybe four $5 chips. He'd then lay them down sequentially, side by side, one at a time in a single motion. Effectively spreading them out so we could clearly see how many chips he was betting.

Casinos sometimes have a rule that whatever crosses the line, or whatever is in your hand crossing the line, goes to the pot.
Does he ever bring a handful of chips, then drop less than all of them? That's more common of a string bet.

Generally for a home game, I'd say it's all fine as long as you're consistent.
Simply laying the chips out in one quick motion is certainly not a string bet. However, as long as he doesn't ever bring the chips back. Otherwise, and it doesn't even matter how exactly you drop them, you'll be doing an opposite but similar play to a string bet: pick up more that you want to drop, notice the reaction, drop all or fewer than all.

This illustrates one of the things I hate about poker. It seems to me half the players in Vegas are curmudgeons waiting to jump down another player's throat for the any breach of procedure. At least in the casinos the game isn't fun any more.

Quote: Wizard

This illustrates one of the things I hate about poker. It seems to me half the players in Vegas are curmudgeons waiting to jump down another player's throat for the any breach of procedure. At least in the casinos the game isn't fun any more.

If you think that poker is bad, I recommend staying away from duplicate Bridge. Those biddies will cut you in two!!

Quote: Wizard

This illustrates one of the things I hate about poker. It seems to me half the players in Vegas are curmudgeons waiting to jump down another player's throat for the any breach of procedure. At least in the casinos the game isn't fun any more.

Yeah, those curmudgeons can be a buzz-kill, but they're absolutely right. If you don't know the rules, you'll learn the expensive/hard way.

Around the poker table, you'll often hear the line "There's no friends in poker." It's spoken a'la Tom Hanks' line, "There's no crying in Baseball."

Poker is not really a social game. I saved a mailer from Borgata advertising poker. The outside says "Meet new friends." Inside it says "Take their money!"

By contrast, take any of the casino's table games. They're supposed to be fun, social games. How often is there someone there, moaning about someone's questionable play, or pointing out how the hand you had would have won the side bet?


Give me a poker table full of curmudgeons any day!

Quote: PapaChubby

It was pretty quick. He was laying them down side-by-side to display them, but there certainly wasn't any time for decision-making between chips. I've had to issue a warning before to players who clearly hadn't figured out exactly how much they were going to bet before they started placing chips on the table.

It's not a string bet, but it's getting close to it. Plunk 'em all down at once, then spread them if needed.

I agree that the action should not be considered a string bet, as his hands were still out with chips in them. In most of the places I've played, a string action is only considered to have occurred if the person brings their hands back to their pile of chips and forward again, without stating their intent prior to doing so. But, as another person mentioned, different casinos have different rules.

Without know the accused person in this example, I have seen other people do something similar in casino environments, in an effort to attain information regarding the strength of their opponents' hands. By laying down one set of chips (the call), but not fully completing an action, they can see if other players are going to be calling or folding, and then use that to determine if another set of chips (the raise) would also be dropped. This is one of the reasons why I would not make any action or movement, verbal or physical, until the person was completely done, ie, returned their hands back to their side of the table.

If the person was doing this action as a raise, consistently throughout the night, then I would definitely take that person's side. On the other hand, if the accused person was making the same kind of action, ie hand extending with enough chips to call and raise, but sometimes only calling and other times raising, then I would say the person is angling. In some jurisdictions, that would be ok, but in a friendly home game, it might be cause for someone to say something. I have played in casinos that have dictated that the amount of chips your hand carries forward is considered your bet.

Poker players often come forward with one or two stacks and topple it/them forward so the chips spread out in front of them. Is that what he was doing, or was it more of a deliberate one-at-a-time move so as to gauge opponents' reactions? Did he ever move forward with more chips than he left there -- did he ever pull any money back? Was there a declaration of "call" or "raise" involved? The first betting action is binding -- either verbal or physical -- so if he always left the chips he brought forward, it's not a string bet.

IMHO: Perfectly acceptable, albeit a little strange since it was essentially 4 stacks of 1 chip each. Normally you would see something like that where the player uses 10 or 15 chips and drops them into stacks of 5 for easy counting.

In the example given, I would not allow the player to hold the 4 chips in his hand, lay down 3 stacks of 1 chip each, then put the 4th chip back in his stack.

Thanks for all the replies. This certainly reinforces what I was thinking.

There was no time or attempt to gauge others' reactions while he was placing his chips. The action was about as quick as it could be, considering it was laying out the chips individually side-by-side.

No, he never brought out more chips than he was betting. I do see this behavior frequently as well. Bring out a handful of chips, drop a few of them, and return the rest to the stack. I've seen some places cracking down on this.

I know the "accused" player quite well, and am absolutely certain he was not trying to gain an advantage or get away with something. This is just a procedural matter that I want to make sure we get right. My home game is extremely friendly, but we also try to be fairly professional. I'm particularly concerned about situations like this because I don't want my guys to get into any bad habits that could cause them problems if/when they play at a casino.

Papa...
I'm with everyone else...no string bet. Though the most sensible rule is to require an announcement of the action "Call", "Raise 20", "Raise 1,000", etc. That works well in our games. We offer a one time "free" offense to new players, but after that any chips brought forward ARE the bet.