Poker Tourney Director - Opinion poll - Part Two
Poll
 | 2 votes (10.52%) | ||
| | 7 votes (36.84%) | ||
| | 8 votes (42.1%) | ||
| | 2 votes (10.52%) |
19 members have voted
I reach for my chips and the Big Blind announces "If you raise I will go all in".
I raise.
He folds.
Should he be forced to go all in since he verbally declared he would if I raised?
How would you rule?
Quote: WizardofEnglandIn a tournament it’s folded to me on the small blind.
I reach for my chips and the Big Blind announces "If you raise I will go all in".
I raise.
He folds.
Should he be forced to go all in since he verbally declared he would if I raised?
How would you rule?
In many poker rooms this would be considered angling and the player could face some kind of penalty or expulsion.
If the other player does it once, Id let it slide. If the player is consitantly known for such bad etiquette speech plays, he would be warned, then punished if it happens again.
The other consideration is action out of turn. If it was his turn to speak, verbal declarations would be binding. However verbal declarations out of turn are a difficult one to call. Most of the time in these situations you have to use your knowledge of the players to aid in your decisions.
Quote: CroupierI sometimes supervise the card room where I work. I have voted for option 3 but need to qualify my answer.
If the other player does it once, Id let it slide. If the player is consitantly known for such bad etiquette speech plays, he would be warned, then punished if it happens again.
The other consideration is action out of turn. If it was his turn to speak, verbal declarations would be binding. However verbal declarations out of turn are a difficult one to call. Most of the time in these situations you have to use your knowledge of the players to aid in your decisions.
I think that is the right answer. I've played a fair bit of pub poker, and things like that are said all the time, but in a casino I would say its actually a bit out of order when real sums of money are at stake.
In some rooms, if you put out chips to call a bet, without realizing that there was a raise, you can fold, but the chips stay out.
Once again, consult Robert's Rules, or the poker room's own rule set.
Note that again, the rule may be different in a cash game vs a tourney.
Quote: WizardofEnglandIn a tournament it’s folded to me on the small blind.
I reach for my chips and the Big Blind announces "If you raise I will go all in".
I raise.
He folds.
Should he be forced to go all in since he verbally declared he would if I raised?
How would you rule?
Quote: CroupierThe other consideration is action out of turn. If it was his turn to speak, verbal declarations would be binding. However verbal declarations out of turn are a difficult one to call. Most of the time in these situations you have to use your knowledge of the players to aid in your decisions.
Technically, it was his turn to act next. He was shooting an angle. I would hold him to the verbal contract.
Quote: AyecarumbaTechnically, it was his turn to act next. He was shooting an angle. I would hold him to the verbal contract.
It was his turn to act NEXT, but it was not his turn to act. Most poker room rule sets say that only actions/declarations in turn are binding.
Quote: CroupierEven 6 renowned Poker Figures can not agree on the correct ruling.
I knew you would reveal my source!! Damn you!! ;-)
Quote: CroupierSorry. I just remembered reading something similar in the back of a poker magazine at work, so thought I would hunt it out. Although maybe we could come up with some more interesting scenarios of our own.
I have four more of my own, I just that one was quite interesting.
Quote: WizardofEnglandI have four more of my own, I just that one was quite interesting.
THen get posting. Im curious now.
Quote: WizardofEnglandIn a tournament it’s folded to me on the small blind.
I reach for my chips and the Big Blind announces "If you raise I will go all in".
I raise.
He folds.
Should he be forced to go all in since he verbally declared he would if I raised?
How would you rule?
Verbal declarations are not binding. It comes across as more of a threat/taunt than anything else. I think its poor etiquette. You should chide him and ask "what happened about going all in on my raise? your hand looking a little cold?"
What if he said "If player 4 raises less than 4BB, I raise 165% of his raise, else 100% up to $12, if flop is dry I call up to $22, except if player 2 raises call up to $45 or if player 5 raises call up to $10, if flop is 2 face cards or more I raise 8%+14% for each face card+random value 0% to 17%, up to $96, except if player 5 raises more than $50 or more than 75% of the pot but no less than $30, then call up to 18% of my stack unless player 2 folded, then up to 22%" ?
Quote: P90What if he said "If player 4 raises less than 4BB, I raise 165% of his raise, else 100% up to $12, if flop is dry I call up to $22, except if player 2 raises call up to $45 or if player 5 raises call up to $10, if flop is 2 face cards or more I raise 8%+14% for each face card+random value 0% to 17%, up to $96, except if player 5 raises more than $50 or more than 75% of the pot but no less than $30, then call up to 18% of my stack unless player 2 folded, then up to 22%" ?
If he said all that, he would scare the living daylights out of me.
I have been known to come out with some funny phrases when heads-up.
"If I were you, I would want me to fold. But you want me to raise. So I check" They nearly always just check after that...
Quote: AZDuffmanI would warn him, explaining this is a poker room an not a home game. While out-of-turn declarations are not binding they are also not allowed. If he wants to calim that is table-talk he can talk like that only between hands.
This is close to my opinion. I think truthful out-of-turn declarations should be allowed. Untruthful ones should be punished as ungentlemanly behavior, a warning the first time, and suspension the next time. The other players would do well to spread the story, so that the offender would become known as a dirty player.
Quote: WizardThe other players would do well to spread the story, so that the offender would become known as a dirty player.
The poker room is question is a close knit group already. Average entries to the saturday night tournament are 40-80 players (nothing compared to Vegas I guess) but I would say only 15 are real regulars. The person in question was just another unknown.
