Poll

4 votes (11.11%)
29 votes (80.55%)
4 votes (11.11%)

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AxelWolf
AxelWolf
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October 4th, 2019 at 8:57:40 PM permalink
Quote: SOOPOO

Is what he is doing criminal? Or just bannable from the casino? Seems to me it is some kind of theft, right? Why has he not been arrested?
It seems the evidence exceeds "reasonable doubt"?

Asuming he is doing what we all think he's doing he is using an electronic cheating device. I assume that's illegal in most states. If he has a partner helping I would assume there's even more they could charge him with.

I somehow think if this was in NV he would have been investigated by gaming already.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
Rigondeaux
Rigondeaux
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heatmap
October 5th, 2019 at 12:00:38 AM permalink
What odds would you make it that he does time?

There are a few lawyers at 2+2 and opinions vary.

This guy Matt is both a successful high stakes live cash player, and a legit expert on the technology used for streaming. I think a lot of you, even non poker fans, would enjoy hearing about the tech and possible cheating methods. Bigins around the 20 min mark.

heatmap
heatmap 
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October 5th, 2019 at 6:24:16 AM permalink
from http://www.videopokertable.net/Download.aspx

here is the UI for the software for the RFID tables that they use at stones apparently

and at least from a first look the hands are / can be entered manually but there seems to be an auto mode as well






Im seeing a BIG issue here in the manual. This table can be fully wireless. If you are on the same WiFi as the table, cheating is very possible in this situation. If you have an unlocked phone, and are on the same wifi, AND you can decrypt the streams packets, you may be able to see the "cards" in a way. The manual claims that the communication between the software and the table is fully encrytped. Its most likely pretty difficult depending on the type of encryption but if its a weak encryption, and encrypted with an older encryption that has already been cracked then its possible.

the manual states that the Wifi uses whats called "WPA2" anddd

https://www.fortinet.com/blog/business-and-technology/wpa2-has-been-broken-what-now.html

"

First, an attacker needs to be in reasonably close proximity in order to capture the traffic between an endpoint device and the vulnerable wireless access point. So, until things are fixed, you should be especially careful using public WiFi. Of course, we’ve been saying that for years.

In addition, the attack is unlikely to affect the security of information sent over a connection using additional encrypted methods such as SSL. Every time you access an HTTPS site, for example, your browser creates a separate layer of encryption that will keep you safe when doing things like online banking or making purchases, even in spite of this latest security threat. So keep your eye on that little lock icon in the corner of your browser when you are conducting transactions online over a WiFi connection.

"

there is most likely no browser being used here because it is most likely a custome piece of software in his phone helping him cheat


my next question is ... What incident are they talking about that happened at the "Bike" stream. Apparently these guys were told a similar incident happened so why havent we heard about that? who got cheated? how did they cheat? maybe these are the same people?
Last edited by: heatmap on Oct 5, 2019
sammydv
sammydv
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heatmap
October 5th, 2019 at 8:28:53 PM permalink
Quote: Rigondeaux

What odds would you make it that he does time?

There are a few lawyers at 2+2 and opinions vary.

This guy Matt is both a successful high stakes live cash player, and a legit expert on the technology used for streaming. I think a lot of you, even non poker fans, would enjoy hearing about the tech and possible cheating methods. Bigins around the 20 min mark.


People are asking if the gaming commission should already be investigating. But isn't this entire operation, stream and stone NOT sanctioned by any regulator and is a private operation, in a deal with a casino?
I seem to remember this being mentioned. So, who would they have to be worried about?

Even if the total operation was fake, to drum up interest in this venture for later real venture capital and casinos buying in? How do you litigate a private organization doing this as a advertising stunt?
gordonm888
gordonm888
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October 5th, 2019 at 8:42:11 PM permalink
I am spending about 1-2 hours a day watching videos on this. I need to get a life.

Quote: Rigondeaux

What odds would you make it that he does time?

There are a few lawyers at 2+2 and opinions vary.



I think criminal prosecution is a low probability -there is no smoking gun other than the videos and it would be hard to convince a jury that doesn't understand poker.

Civil litigation - much more likely.

But ultimately, I wonder whether this gets handled the way the mob used to handle cheaters at their casinos -the way cheaters were handled in the wild west.. Maybe a baseball bat to the knees, or more extreme . . . . .
So many better men, a few of them friends, were dead. And a thousand thousand slimy things lived on, and so did I.
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
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October 5th, 2019 at 9:38:38 PM permalink
Quote: gordonm888

I am spending about 1-2 hours a day watching videos on this. I need to get a life.

I was convinced fairly quickly probably halfway through Joe Ingram 2nd video, I just try to follow the latest updates.



Quote: gordonm888

I think criminal prosecution is a low probability -there is no smoking gun other than the videos and it would be hard to convince a jury that doesn't understand poker.


There's no hard evidence yet. I'm not even sure if there will be a real Criminal investigation or not.

I haven't listened to this yet, but apparently Mike the Mouth does a very soft interview with him and It left a lot of people disappointed.
https://themouthpiece.podbean.com/e/episode-21-the-mike-postle-cheating-scandal-with-special-guest-mike-postle/
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
gordonm888
gordonm888
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October 5th, 2019 at 10:36:44 PM permalink
Stones Gambling Hall has announced it is appointing an independent investigation team headed Michael Lipman, a former assistant U.S Attorney. But, now, it has been discovered that Michael Lipman is the personal defense lawyer of the owner of the Stones Gambling Hall.

Is that what the word "independent" means?
So many better men, a few of them friends, were dead. And a thousand thousand slimy things lived on, and so did I.
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
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October 5th, 2019 at 11:32:57 PM permalink
Quote: gordonm888

Stones Gambling Hall has announced it is appointing an independent investigation team headed Michael Lipman, a former assistant U.S Attorney. But, now, it has been discovered that Michael Lipman is the personal defense lawyer of the owner of the Stones Gambling Hall.

Is that what the word "independent" means?

OUTRAGEOUS!!!

You mind if I share this and quote you?
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
Joined: Oct 10, 2012
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October 5th, 2019 at 11:53:48 PM permalink
Friend Dandruff's Pokerfraudalert rebuttal to Mike the mouth's is podcast with Mike Postle. I highly suggest just skipping MM'S podcast and listening to Dan's rebuttal as he plays MM'S podcast with Mike Postle. That's assuming you have a couple hours to spare. Dan can go on forever at times, however, I find him to be a very rational, intelligent and a logical person. He doesn't make any money or have any motivation for doing these podcasts other than he just loves doing it. I think it's an idiot move for not trying to monetize his podcast and site, but whatever.

https://pokerfraudalert.com/radio/radio-2019-10-05-postle.mp3
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
onenickelmiracle
onenickelmiracle
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October 6th, 2019 at 1:08:44 AM permalink
Id say if he was cheating, with suspicions raised, he didn't stop because he wanted or needed the money. You get used to an income no matter what the source. Most people don't save.
In the land of the blind, the man with one eye is the care taker. Hold my beer.

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