PaiGowDan's Predictament: Retire or call dice at this point...

Oh, Boy, what to do....this is kind of funny, because it reflects some old school "Man-to-man" Vegas advice and thinking....loved "Floorman Louie's" comments, who just announced his retirement, (and I an envious) - just a priceless story, as it really gives an old school Vegas flavor. But I really need Geoff Hall, or Dave "DJTB," or Mike to chime in, as these men were also once in a similar situation on a career move while married....not easy!

This really requires someone like Charles Mousseau, Cindy Liu, Stacy Freidman, or Mike or give me the real "EV" (Valuation) and "EOR" (element of Risk) on this life situation, which is actually a gambling situation...

I'm pretty much at the point where I CAN retire from being a dice dealer in Vegas (not an easy job, though it does has its fun moments...)

...but I CANNOT do so without my wife saying, "Oh REALLY now, Dan...YOU can retire, with me still working at xxx's-Town...sound like Bullsh]t to me!" (...more like "Oh! Learry now Mr. Dan...you too FUNNY man...." ...so cute, makes me melt...but the same marital rejection of THIS concept.) But she is serious. If I retire, we're minus $1,700 a month, but up $4,000 a month...but if we BOTH retire, we down $3,400 a month and NO health insurance, for a net loss. No can do that....hmmm...

Dealing dice at a gambling hall five days a week until 3AM is NO easy task for an old man (51) like me. And some of the shameless shots I see taken at a crap game REALLY wants me to say something that is less than "customer-service friendly-face..." The whole Stations' approach is "We LOVE LOCALS," but none of the mad men marketing men ever worked an overnight crap crew five days a week....Plus the "vampire" shift after six years is really getting to me. I used to have an office an a secretary and out at 5PM...now I have a TABLE and a happy-face name tag....and burnt out at 3AM....

So I cannot get out of this until I'm pulling in money from 200+ EZ Pai Gow installs, not 70 or so...but close, and closing in...

I presented this to "Louie," who is a veteran floorman and dice dealer from the Sands, Stardust, downtown Vegas, 38 years experience from the mob days of Vegas etc., in its heyday, now retiring BEFORE me....so I asks him his advice....

I tell him my situation, and He says, "Danny, get OVAH here, Stunad...listen up, son..."

This is a question for "ask Carmine," kinda like the man's answer to "Dear Abby." Hard to explain, but you can imagine.

So Louie says, kidding around, he says: "Danny, this is what you do..."
1. Retire, but tell NO ONE. No party, no nothing....Tell the crew at Fxxxa you're going to deal at some proprety not affiliated with Boyd or Stations(where we ALL work at) - "Who's gonna check for you if you say you're now at "Frankie's State-Line Casino??" - and because you need to work part time now. No retirement party, and tell no one, just take vacation and then be a no-show after announcing a move to another joint...
2. KEEP TWO sets of your dealer's uniform. PAY Human resources the $150 for it, and Tell 'em " you lost two sets." Pay the loss fee, pay 'em off. Okay. Then...you got two sets of dealer's uniforms...So...
3. Every work day, Bang! - dress up in your dealer's uniform, and jump in your car, waving to your wife saying "Honey, I love you, see you in eight hours when I come home from a hard day's work!! Kisses [heart, heart]" and...
- then go throw some dice...
- eat at a steak house
- see a show
- go dancing with your girlfriend (- I do NOT have one!! Never think like this, but hearing this...)
- hit a poker room
- etc, WTF, Danny...
And come home exhausted, saying "Oh, those cheap bastard crap players are SO RUDE, work is so hard...." (The wife says "Oh, my husband works so hard...")
"You work different shifts, - do you know how many men would KILL for that??" - another apt old school comment....Just so as long as you keep the money comin' in, and stay out of Chinatown (Spring mountain Road between the Strip and Rainbow), "who da f*ck is gonna know, unless you go there and get busted by her cousin or something...??")

Seriously, I found this fascinating...the voice of old school Vegas speaking to me...all a joke along the lines of: "y'know, you CAN consider this...")

I can't imagine the divorce settlement....

On a serious note, can't you partly retire and stay on an extra-board; temp agency or some other plan? Drive a cab? Work as a courrier? Anything that is not a life of lumps'n'fleas?

Come to the dark side dan. I see part time counter in your future lol. Don't bust my balls too hard for saying that.I already feel like Ijust swore in church.

Quote: AZDuffman

On a serious note, can't you partly retire and stay on an extra-board; temp agency or some other plan? Drive a cab? Work as a courrier? Anything that is not a life of lumps'n'fleas?

No really, for a couple of reasons.
1. No health insurance, unless my distributor provides "Health Plan of Nevada" as part of a table gaming license contract/agreement - an unheard of thing here-to-fore in signing up a table game for ANY Table Games Distributor, be it Shufflemaster, DEQ, or Galaxy Gaming.

2. Fiesta Henderson is a GREAT place to work at, as is some of the Stations properties, and an absolutely rarity in an otherwise horrendously rude industry.

Most of the veteran local players don't take shots, - and the floormen and shift managers are shockingly respectful and courteous to hard-working dealers - just absolutely unheard of in the gaming industry. Basically, Station's position is "If you cannot work well for us if we treat you respectfully as team members, then being hostile and abusive won't make you performance any better anyway, so you may leave us..." Just an intelligent and logical way to treat workers: "If you can do your jobs reliably if we treat you with respect and keeping you on the payroll, then we will politely dismiss you and wish you good luck, - as committing the kinds of labor relation abuses that the Gaming industry was formerly know for will not make you better workers for us anyway, and just cause problems, - by our calculations." [Which are quite novel and very intelligent.] To work with floormen and Shift managers/TGD's who are 100% courteous to employees, who are in term both reliable and courteous back to management, is something I had only previously seen working as an editor in a publishing company, or as a computer programmer for a University. But NEVER as a freaking dice dealer before Fiesta Henderson - and this is truly a remarkable industry first! In fact, one very fine crap dealer left F.H. to work for a downtown Casino because it was closer to home, giving up full time dealer status at Stations, only to make the SAME tokes in a "rude" environment more typical and daming of the gaming industry. [You can ask Nick here at this board, he is trying to get in here!] This dealer left me a voice mail basically saying, "what the fuck was I thinking, Dan, Jesus, If I had only known.....!!"

3. I've worked numerous menial jobs between my data processing career and the more serious gaming work that later got me respect, but I am still missing the benefits package and I am short a couple of grand a month, in order to cover the whole family. Can't retire without being dishonest to myself or my bride, won't do it, but funny advice from Louie and Carmine, some old school Vegas male-shit. I will say this: The few fleas I do see the floor and have to deal with, I will say I am backed up, especially by Hector and Bill.

Quote:

Come to the dark side dan. I see part time counter in your future lol. Don't bust my balls too hard for saying that.I already feel like I just swore in church.

You did swear. And to this I say, "If you do what you know is decent, no matter how it seems - you will always feeling and ending up feeling and being decent - even in the gaming industry." The gaming industry IS A White Shade of pale over here.

Edit: I have worked for years for casinos operators, and I can tell you I have never seen a stacked deck, or loaded dice, or any sort of advantage play shenanigams EVER being endorsed or condoned ANY operator, (aside from a single one-off instance in Laughlin where changing dealers to a find a "cooler dealer" was in effect), but while on MANY occasions seeing outright cheating by customers being dealt with a polite dismissal instead of a back-rooming or a detention for an arrest on a fifth-level felony, just a "you're done for the night, please go home." There were formerly times when even Mike and I bickered about this issue, but with Mike now at LVSC at the Venetian, I think he can see this side now as the ex-AP that I think he now is, (and which I never was, as aggressive as a gambler I otherwise was on dice, Pai Gow Poker, and at the Sports book, never counting at BJ.) The ONLY "dark side" is the very side of deceit in all its forms versus clean play, and there is such a thing.

Quote: Paigowdan

But I really need Geoff Hall, or Dave "DJTB," or Mike to chime in, as these men were also once in a similar situation on a career move while married....not easy!

I'm not sure who you're confusing me with. For the record, the only career moves I've made in my married life have been to find a new job when the company I was working for folded, and again when the new employer consolidated 8 months after I started. Fortunately, both times I found a new job very quickly.


But, Louie's advice aside, I'll be happy to throw my three cents in...



There are a number of points you've made, all of which indicate that you need to suck it up and keep working that grind for a year or two more.


First and most important: If you don't want your [random body part] cut off, you can't retire if your wife is still working. Particularly when considering that you've got a much more glamorous job than she has. Frankly, if anything, you're going to have to let her quit before you can.

When you retire, you need to make sure you have enough other income not just to cover the lost income, but also to cover all the new expenses you're gonna have.

30 years ago, I had what I thought was a great job. I was working 12.5 hours a day, three days a week, making considerably more than I had at my prior 8-5 M-F job. Except having 4 days to spend the money left me broke. Whe you retire, you're either going to sit at home waiting to die, or go out and spend money. I assume it's the latter, so you better have the income to do so.


When you get to the point where you both can quit, you gotta find out if there is any way to work part time, and retain full health benefits. Like maybe working just during the busy season, but keeping the insurance year round. You may have to pay for the insurance yourself during the off-season, but this may be a good option since the employer's group rate is probably better than you can do on your own.

Quote: AZDuffman

On a serious note, can't you partly retire and stay on an extra-board; temp agency or some other plan? Drive a cab? Work as a courrier? Anything that is not a life of lumps'n'fleas?

Now is your time for an Obamacare comment! This post actually has something to do with health insurance!

Dan, you can't completely retire if your wife is still working full-time. I agree with AZ, I think you've earned the right to drop down to part-time something.

you are 51 and thinking of retiring? what are you, french? :)
what if you live to be 90 but run out of money when you are 80?
wait till you are at least 55, plan it out so you can make the jump then.

Quote: FinsRule

Now is your time for an Obamacare comment! This post actually has something to do with health insurance!

On health insurance I have a suggestion. Call your local chambers of commerce and see if they will let you into the group if you become a member. Membership is usually <$100/yr but ti gets you group pricing. This might be out the window when Obamacare comes in, but back in WNY the chamber offered it. I've given this advice to a handful of people IRL and none ever thought to do it. No idea if they did it or not.

Quote: DJTeddyBear

I'm not sure who you're confusing me with. For the record, the only career moves I've made in my married life have been to find a new job when the company I was working for folded, and again when the new employer consolidated 8 months after I started. Fortunately, both times I found a new job very quickly.

Dave, I only included you in this catagory because at times, the expenses of a game development seems more of a career move to the family you live with than a hobby, and Mrs. Dave may have incidentally commented here and there to you in this vein, that's all...

Quote: DJTeddyBear

But, Louie's advice aside, I'll be happy to throw my three cents in...

He is a great character whom I will always cherish, having worked with him.

Quote: DJTeddyBear

There are a number of points you've made, all of which indicate that you need to suck it up and keep working that grind for a year or two more.


First and most important: If you don't want your [random body part] cut off, you can't retire if your wife is still working. Particularly when considering that you've got a much more glamorous job than she has. Frankly, if anything, you're going to have to let her quit before you can.

True. My wife is Thai, and marital castration is a part of the Thai women's team of the Thai Olympic team, if not a scorned Thai woman's right to her opinion about annoying things involving a male as her undeniable female birthright. Quite true, but I am true to her always, as I was just listening to Louie's amusing counsel, [which was something out of a Richard Pryor routine], and found it interesting to listen to on break after an hour of dealing dice on a Saturday night...thought I would comment here...

Quote: DJTeddyBear

When you retire, you need to make sure you have enough other income not just to cover the lost income, but also to cover all the new expenses you're gonna have.

Which the Mrs. has a lead foot on the accelerator, and it scares me. If you had any idea who is considering signing up the good game,
- you TOO will be perusing: "www.las-vegas-high-rise-condos.com" kind a thing....

Quote: DJTeddyBear

30 years ago, I had what I thought was a great job. I was working 12.5 hours a day, three days a week, making considerably more than I had at my prior 8-5 M-F job. Except having 4 days to spend the money left me broke. Whe you retire, you're either going to sit at home waiting to die, or go out and spend money. I assume it's the latter, so you better have the income to do so.

I know. Most of my vegas habits cost me some no joke money, including prop betting, but I tell you, I would NOT have it any other way. Better to live in a modest mansion with a lot of juice in life, than in a huge mansion and miserable...

Quote: DJTeddyBear

When you get to the point where you both can quit, you gotta find out if there is any way to work part time, and retain full health benefits. Like maybe working just during the busy season, but keeping the insurance year round. You may have to pay for the insurance yourself during the off-season, but this may be a good option since the employer's group rate is probably better than you can do on your own.

I'm actually going to look into the "CostCo/Sam's Club" type Health Plans, with are full coverage health plans for about $300 a month, but only with a $10,000 or so deductable if hospitalization/surgery occurs...this may soon be a month's royalty's; assuming only one heart attack hospitalization a year (five in the past five years), that reduces a $120,000 income to $110,000 a year with three incomes plus a fourth royality income.

Now, a home and two cars, with some gambling and Las Vegas shows at night, is exactly that income.

One car, Netflix, and no shows, is $50,000 a year to live in this town.
Forget about living in New York City or San Fransisco decently....that's $110,000 for a one-bedroom apartment, the subway or bus to get around, and the movies on a date...to live without a roommate.

The wife doesn't want you to retire without her.

Frankly, its seems you enjoy your employer but might want a different shift. I hear "day shift" is almost a vacation since you actually work "normal" hours and sleep "normal" hours.

Or perhaps what you really need is a discount certificate to that new casino-spa that will provide a massage at the end of your shift?

Remember,,, some dice dealers START their career at 51.

I retired at age 53. It wasn't by choice. The company was downsizing and I was "unvolunteeraly terminated." I was going to look for a new job when my unemployment ran out. Two months later, a day after my birthday when I turned 54, my best friend died of a heart attack.

That was an eye opener. I decided that life was too short. I told my wife I decided to retire. I wasn't going to get back into that corporate rat race anymore. It was the best decision I ever made. I had a pension and decided that I would get a part time job to supplement my pension.

Here's one thing that you and everyone should think about.

If you are pension eligible, then how much are you really being paid? If you make $4000 a month and your pension will pay you 40% ($1600), then you are working for $2400 a month. If they will pay you to sit home and collect a pension and you can afford it, take the money and enjoy life!

Whatever you decide - Good Luck.

Quote: FleaStiff

The wife doesn't want you to retire without her.

Frankly, its seems you enjoy your employer but might want a different shift. I hear "day shift" is almost a vacation since you actually work "normal" hours and sleep "normal" hours.

Or perhaps what you really need is a discount certificate to that new casino-spa that will provide a massage at the end of your shift?

Know all about that earlier here, and am happily married now here.

Quote: Fleastiff

Remember,,, some dice dealers START their career at 51.

Or other/multiple careers, actually...I started two careers at that time, one as a dealer as a retirement career from a previous life in New York, and one as a game designer shortly afterwards, looking at the games I was now dealing, and had already played for a while.

Actually, no regrets on either one [career choice], but I was also speaking about a couple of things here betweens the lines, one being the mindset of a permanent career Vegas floorman/dealer soon to retire, and one of another casino dealer, me, who just kind of found himself in this environment, as a chapter, without regrets, just watching and listening to the stuff in this business. Occasionally I get home from work, and though I seldom take my dealing job home from work, I had to reflect and say, "lemme think about this day...Louie retires, and what's his advice and opinion on my own retirement plans coming shortly, I mean, how to plan it..."....just kind of had to say wow, just loved this day. A true gambler and pit critter, really....

An Old school Vegas mindset and experience speaking to me a bit, just had to digest it all. Have your action and eat it too, kinda thing. I Like the guy, love the guy, really, worked with him for a while on the floor there. You don't hear this guy in a computer room or office job back home, where I spent a decade plus in data processing back in New York. Not taking his advice here, but wow I had to hear it. Water cooler talk that tells you, "You're living in a casino pit here, buddy. This IS home, the gambling/action-oriented mindset...." Pure entertainment, and from his mind that is mainly gambling-related...had to notice that, as my mind is too. Little different, though. I could both relate to the gambling logic in it, but kind of had to say, "wow..okay...Gambling here." All said in jest to some degree, as in "we know what jesus would do, what would I or Carmine do if I could get away with it...just gambling thinking, here, hear me out..." The Vegas gears of the mind at work...

Actually, I started my dealing career at 45 in 2006, went straight from being outsourced as an old school mainframe Burroughs systems programmer (and one of the youngest) in the computer industry and its upheaval and changes, to dealers' school and promptly starting a life in Las Vegas. In fact, on one occasion I flew back to NY on a computer consulting job after dealer's school and just starting my gaming career, from Vegas. I fit in just fine now in the casino pit now, actually pretty quickly, but had to step back and take a look here on this one. The Vegas sense of humor/mindset, caught me by surprise, but I can relate.

Another post but on the results of the voting:

If there were more real gamblers on this board, Louie and Carmine would have a greater percentage.

The question arises, "How would Stu Unger vote on this one?"

I'm not really qualified to vote, but i'll toss my 2% vigorish in...

So you wanna retire? Your wife still works. You gotta ask yourself this, "If I retire and announce it to the wife, am I sowing seeds of a divorce filing?"
Whats more important, your retirement or your marriage? Can you have both?
I wouldn't run around lying to the wife: thats untrustworthy (ya know what untrustworthy leads to, right?), but thats MHO.

Think about it, discuss it with the wife, openly. Plan jointly. This is a "we" situation: not I or ME (or thats what you'll get!, I or ME with no wife and a lot less retirement savings)

Quote: Paigowdan

Another post but on the results of the voting:

If there were more real gamblers on this board, Louie and Carmine would have a greater percentage.

The question arises, "How would Stu Unger vote on this one?"

Stu would lay his entire bankroll out anywhere, anyplace, anytime, So which ever choice reflects that is where stuey would be.

Quote: Paigowdan

I'm actually going to look into the "CostCo/Sam's Club" type Health Plans, with are full coverage health plans for about $300 a month, but only with a $10,000 or so deductable if hospitalization/surgery occurs...

Not sure what it's like in Nevada, but, in California, a 51-year-old male can get an okay PPO plan for $200-$275 per month, with an annual out-of-pocket/deductible of around $3000 - $5000.

Might be good to shop around.

Keep working. There has to be no question about it, if you are in doubt there is your answer. Largely because of the health insurance. I probably would retire now if it wasn't for that. Those high deductible plans are OK now but as you approach 65 they get really, really expensive.

Your wife might surprise you. Women hate it when their spouses work weird hours.

Dan,

You and I are exactly the same age.

Do not retire.... unless you have an activity aside from gaming that will constructively (i.e. Mentally, physically and financially) benefit you and your family for the next 25 years.

I have had more guys in their 70's tell me two things. Either (1) they are glad they did not retire; or (2) they are sorry they retired so early.

This isn't an EV question, it's a "what do you want to do with your time" question. It sounds like you and your wife would much rather be retired but that you can't afford it. That's okay, neither can most folks. But you don't like dealing anymore, and that's fine too. Have you considered actually climbing the ladder? I'm not aware that any casino operation has ever had a game designer in management. Why couldn't you ultimately rise to something like corporate VP of table games? You know more than most about what makes a game work vs. not work, and you've been on the other side of the table in license/lease negotiations for proprietary games. It sounds like a great fit to me.

Plus, then the rest of us would know who to call for first dibs on field trials. :)

It doesn't matter if your wife is Thai, or Italian, or Irish or from
Mar's. If you retire before she does you'll never hear the end of it.

I haven't 'worked' in 5 years but last year when I started collecting
social security, it was too much for my wife. She let me know she
was working, about 10 times a day. It got so bad I started spending
more and more time at our unrented rental property, 'fixing' it up.
I spend most of my time here now and its fine with 'she who works'.
Fine with me too. I have everything I need, and see her on weekends.
Every guy I tell this to wants to know how they can get a deal like this.

Don't retire at 51, you have no idea how many ways your wife has
of making you pay, they are very inventive.

Quote: MathExtremist

This isn't an EV question, it's a "what do you want to do with your time" question. It sounds like you and your wife would much rather be retired but that you can't afford it.

We CAN afford it - if one retires, - hence "Louie the gaming guy mind's" humorous take on what to do, knowing that EvenBob's right about the discord of a one-sided retirement.

Quote: MathExtremist

That's okay, neither can most folks [retire]. But you don't like dealing anymore, and that's fine too. Have you considered actually climbing the ladder? I'm not aware that any casino operation has ever had a game designer in management. Why couldn't you ultimately rise to something like corporate VP of table games? You know more than most about what makes a game work vs. not work, and you've been on the other side of the table in license/lease negotiations for proprietary games. It sounds like a great fit to me.

Plus, then the rest of us would know who to call for first dibs on field trials. :)

I do miss the office/decision making end of things, being a dealing robot ain't easy. A position of a trainer for a distributor, or an increase in day time game design work would be better than full shifts of evening work daeling.

I can only offer advice based on UK (i.e. where if you're ill the state does help but does not provide full care homes support). I'm semi-retired but have since found it is important to have (a) something to occupy your time (b) enough money to afford holidays/hobbies without a constant worry of using up capital/income. The other factor (in the UK) is people are living longer and pensions aren't fully protected against inflation, so they eventually become less worth.

Thus you need sufficient backup resources, to perhaps survive until 85 (you can set your own confidence levels) unless you're on a gold-plated pension.

There's a fallacy that you can survive on less income when retired, I found it cost less to work (unless the cost of travel to work was prohibitive) and spent more when out of work.

You can actually do some maths (using actuarial tables and tax rates) to determine the optimal time to take a pension, but if you were allowed to gradually work less days, then this might be the best option at some time.

Dan, I actually worked with a guy in Denver who was a technician. He was originally from Colorado Springs. His wife was a Denver girl and wanted to stay in Denver. He convinced her he had got a promotion in Colorado Springs. He left the house in CS each
morning wearing a suit and tie and carrying a briefcase. Ditched them in his locker each day. LOL When i left for Houston 5 years later, his wife was none the wiser.

I would not suggest trying this on your wife. I mean she was smart enough to marry you, wasn't she ? LOL

Either way I trust you will make the RIGHT decision.

I never lie to my wife about anything. Its just not
worth it.

" I never lie to my wife about anything. Its just not
worth it. " AMEN


I just love these political scumbags who ask me to trust them. Especially with a history of affairs.

If a man will cheat on his wife, who won't he cheat on ??

Dan-

It sounds to me like retiring isn't REALLY an option for you. However, a career switch might be what you need to break the doldrums of your daily grind.

I agree with most of the people who say the third option, where you are essentially lying to your wife, is a bad idea. I know it was kind of a joke option, but all it would take is one emergency where she tries you at work, only to find out that lo and behold, you haven't worked there for X months.

At 51, it would be nice to live the dream and not have to work... but let's face it, the gambling world can turn its ugly head on you. Besides, what will you live on after your patent expires and Shufflemaster, Galaxy and all the wannabes take your idea and turn it into another great game that's cheaper than your offering? What if another PGP variant takes off that pays 6:5 on all wins, provided you have X hand? There are so many variables right now...

But it sounds like you want to do consulting or some other type of work. If you're going to do that, you're really not "retiring;" you're just switching careers. Personally, there is nothing wrong with that, and I encourage you to do it.

Good luck.

YOU'RE IN CHARGE!

That is one of the biggest advantages that you have when you retire from your full time job and get a part time job.

YOU'RE IN CHARGE!

When I retired, I got a part time job. I was working three days a week. One day the manager approached me and said that they wanted me to work four days a week. I told him I wasn't interested. His response was that they were going to make me work four days a week. I said no they're not. I quit and walked out the door.

YOU'RE IN CHARGE!

I did this several times at other part time jobs. Some jobs offered me a raise if I stayed. I refused the offer and quit. The work environment wasn't worth the money.

YOU'RE IN CHARGE!

It feels good to know that you're in charge of your life and can walk out the door anytime you want with no regrets.

Quote: FatGeezus

YOU'RE IN CHARGE!
...
YOU'RE IN CHARGE!
...
YOU'RE IN CHARGE!
...
YOU'RE IN CHARGE!

I get the feeling you're not married, for if you were, you;d know who was in charge.

Quote: DJTeddyBear

I get the feeling you're not married, for if you were, you;d know who was in charge.

Hey I am married and i always get the last word. .... YES DEAR >>>

Quote: buzzpaff

Hey I am married and i always get the last word. .... YES DEAR >>>

Charlton Heston, the actor, was married for over 50 years.
He said the secret of a happy marriage is learning 5 or 6
different ways of saying I'm Sorry, and use them as many
times during the day as needed. And learn to sound genuine
when you say it.

I'm sorry dear, you're right.

You're right of course, sweetheart.

I'm wrong, I'm sorry.

You're right again, honey, I'm sorry.

He said its the grease that keeps everything running
smoothly. Unless you retire before she does, of course.
There's no amount of apologising that will make her get
over that. Hide the sharp knives..

Dan, you say your wife is Thai. I had a friend in the 70's
who had a knack for launguages and went to work for
the International School. He spent years in Bankok and
married a beautiful Thai girl and brought her back to
the States. They had 3 kids, but he never taught his
wife to speak English. The kids learned, but they only
spoke Thai at home. My friend was 20 years older than
his beautiful wife, he didn't want her making American
friends. And she treated him like a king, she waited on
him all the time. We were all very jealous.

Guys, I gotta say this:
I would never ever screw an angel like my wife, [except of course in the: "It's THURSDAY NIGHT!!!" sense, ahem. (Hey, we're old now....)]

So I did ask her if it would be all right if I could pack in the pit work, with her being willing to continue on at Sam's Town. A total non-starter, but that's okay. She didn't get all teary-eyed and pissed off, she just said "We're in this together, so none of this 'But I'M the bread-winner here" bluster from you, now. You don't get it from me, and I won't get it from you. We're just not ready now, and when we are, it's a together type of thing."

Okay.

So I accepted it, and then had a great night dealing craps at Fiesta. Busy game, the players were great AND fun, with ALL game instructions heard from a normal speaking voice from stick, with no pressure.
* not a SINGLE player took a shot, and
* all the floormen and the shift manager were friendly and professional and curteous.
* wish EVERY night was like this.

If I take this for granted as a "casino pit work environment" - may somebody shoot me. With a 12-gauge. When someone says to me, "Hey, Danny, there's a dice position open at the XXX casino, it pays $25 a day more, but it's extra-board," I am NOT the -F- interested.

At the very least, I have GOT to appreciate a work place like that. An extra $30K plus health insurance for a very fair gig in this industry, just cannot complain. Gotta save for a house after the Real Estate bubble bust anyway.

Sometimes I feel that the "house edge of life" is a bit high, and that many seemingly wise decisions are just tempting sucker bets, considering the way they may work out, so I won't jump the gun. Tonight made it obvious that there was a good red light against a quick move.

House edge to anything is gonna be higher than 1.00%. You've just got to find a way around it. Glad your night at the Fiesta went well.

I did have a question for Paigowdan. I had a bet on you, as Black, in a fight against EvenBob, as Red, here (don't get me wrong; EvenBob is one of my favorite participants here, I just always bet on black). I was curious as to who ended up winning the fight, and whether or not I'm owed money as such. If I recall correctly, most people were betting Red, so I feel like I should have done pretty well if you won. My bet was table max with 100x odds. If I won, I'm willing accept payment in the form of match play coupons, dead chips, or lottery tickets.

Quote: heather

House edge to anything is gonna be higher than 1.00%. You've just got to find a way around it. Glad your night at the Fiesta went well.

I did have a question for Paigowdan. I had a bet on you, as Black, in a fight against EvenBob, as Red, here (don't get me wrong; EvenBob is one of my favorite participants here, I just always bet on black). I was curious as to who ended up winning the fight, and whether or not I'm owed money as such. If I recall correctly, most people were betting Red, so I feel like I should have done pretty well if you won. My bet was table max with 100x odds. If I won, I'm willing accept payment in the form of match play coupons, dead chips, or lottery tickets.

Black already won, big time:
1. Casinos are everywhere; this is totally undeniably, and it just simply would not be this way if casino operators were as you "dark-siders" say..........
.......cruel, theiving, heartless, no good sacks of stinking sh]t, who should be beaten to death, with metal pipes...in a dark alleyway....on a Tuesday night when it is raining, and no one is around.....
The real fact of the matter is that Casino Operators are just like Cinema Operators, or restuarant outlets, or Broadway show operators facing counterfeit printed tickets and scammers, - and are just trying to provide the best customer value and experience as any entertainment outlet would do, that's all, while dealing with customer theft or one sort or another, to include hole-carding with mirrors, obvious card-counting when against the rules, and capping and pinching active bets.

Once you factor in their rejection of being cheated or scammed through nefarious means through any "beat-the-system" schemes, then casino operators do clam down, - just like cinemas rejecting movie patrons who try to sneak in through the fire exit to see movies for free, or stealing food at some Buffet via large Tupperware tubs under a raincoat, or making a quick exit at a steakhouse, for example. Same kind of thing when you don't pay the "enterance fee," which is what the acceptable house edge is on a game or slot machine from the get-go.

Most normal people would never try to cheat like this against the rules there at a movie house or Broadway show, but try all the time at casinos and at slots.But it is the same things that keeps the lights on by paying the operating costs of the electric bill or dealers' salaries. I mean, if you would not run out of a steak house while well-dressed to avoid paying a dinner bill, - as your intentions IS to eat a fine dinner and pay for it in good faith - then why would someone hole-card or cap or pinch bets, or make any actions that is known to be against the ground rules of the experience going in?

A movie go-er never says, "it is US against the evil empire of Hollywood!!" - if he tried to sneak into a movie house for free, via a fire exit, - to see a movie for free!!??

Someone eating at a Buffet would seldom try to shovel free food into a "take-home" tupper basket that they can put under their raincoat.

But all the time we catch casino cheats trying to make claims [such as on a don't pass bet: "I had it out before the point of 4 was rolled!!" No...] "I wasn't hole-carding - my Wedding Ring is a Round and Flat 3" pinky-ring mirror - that I just brought flat with the table surface - to pick up my drink! - And NOT to see the dealer's hole card, to make the game actually ONE-card poker," etc...etc...etc...We See it all the time in a casino.

It is shameless at times. People DO think that cheating a movie house or restaurant would be wrong, - but not a casino business, even though it is the same type of cheating against a licensed business that provides entertainment to people. Especially from what I people openy announce as per their intentions to do, even here at this board. But I am NO longer amazed...as of this point in time, I simply say "Your Hardways are working on the come-out roll, unless called off, that's my job...." while I try to protect a crap game for 40 hours a week on the behalf of my "Entertainment Employer," which is Stations Casinos Inc.

Believe me, I know BOTH the gaming business and the human condition, and I DO feel that being a casino pit crap dealer for six years may skewed my view of the human condition, but in a more accurate way. I cannot imaging what the angels have to witness.

For Twenty years, I was a software engineer and systems programmer, and I dealt with an electrical engineer a couple of times a week as my boss in New York. I also used to think that the Human Condition was fundamentally decent. Now I know better, - we can even read this here at this great board.

Now I am a Las Vegas Crap dealer, - have been for six years - and I now deal with the Human Condition at adult playtime with some serious money on the line. We dealers see almost nothing but steaming the losses, attempted claims, cheating, and dishonest Advantage Play, - and a lot less fun than gambling really should be. I now agree with the Bible, and to paraphrase Christ's statement, that "The path of our descent is wide and easily traveled, but the path to righteousness and decency is narrow and rought with trials" is absolutely true. No much less so than when we let our true colors shine at some sort of adult play! Being a Gambling Hall dice dealer will convince you that planet Earth is the Kindergarten of the universe, occasionally visited by souls like Albert Einstein and Albert Schweitzer and Jesus Christ, but mostly inhabited by pedestrsian work-a-day morons without morals, and managed by corrupt politicians from Jimmy Cater to Pol Pot, Joseph Stalin, Vladimir Putin, [and our current choice of Obama versus Romney], so the honest floormen who try to run honestly clean games and give a fair and patient audience for every time on a player's claim really impress me. Christ knows I see it day in and day out, sometimes I think he put me on a gambling hall's crap game's stickman position to give a reason of lesson for my life.

Believe me, I take the Red side on the casino operator issue. Whatever EvenBob may rant about, actually matters little.

I know what I see, and I look at it, and think about it all, right here and now, before I kick off. Especially if I am going to make it in this God forsaken business before then.

Some rough stuff at times.

"There are seven things that will destroy us: Wealth without work; Pleasure without conscience; Knowledge without character; Religion without sacrifice; Politics without principle; Science without humanity; Business without ethics."

- Mahatma Gandhi

Quote: DJTeddyBear

I get the feeling you're not married, for if you were, you;d know who was in charge.

42 Years!!!!

God Bless you Dan. Great post. I am with you 100%. God bless casinos. I am going to Harrah's Rincon on Wednesday night after work with $350 in my pocket (I have thursdays off). They are gonna give me a free 1000 sq foot suite for the night and $20 in show up cash. I am going to order lobster bisque, truffle lobster macaroni and cheese, and maybe a steak. They are gonna pay for that too. Some of the floormen and dealers will remember my name, and greet me with a big smile and and say "Hey Bigfoot66, great to see you! Are you going to play some baccarat with us tonight?". They will usually offer me a free buffet for lunch Thursday. I am going to have a great time and they are going to be serving me the whole time, I am so excited! Worst case senario, they will win my $350. Much more likely I will win or lose around $100, have a few drinks, and live like a king for a day.

The fact that someone thinks casinos could be the great Evil in the world because they will win 8 cents out of every $5 pass line bet I make in the long run is just nuts. It reveals a flawed moral compass.

Hear, hear!

God bless the casino operators. They facilitate the greatest pleasure I get in my life, with exception to my family, of course, which is gambling!

Where else can you get a free cup of coffee these days, anyway? Keeping in mind that my family is all asleep when I get done with work, I can't really do much around the house except enter as quietly as possible and go straight to bed!!! Even if I am not in the mood to actually play (and sometimes I'm not) I can go into the casino and get a cup of coffee...for free...and watch the tables. The employees don't care about it because they see me there all the time and know that the house gets action from me, so if I'm just drinking a few cups of coffee and cheering on BJ players or hot shooters (only if they want a cheering section) nobody cares.

The only thing that occasionally stinks is when I don't feel like playing, but nobody is at the tables. Pretty much have to play a few bucks, then (that's usually when I'l play some silly amoutn like $20) otherwise all I have done is waste gas.

Quote: Paigowdan

Casinos are everywhere; this is totally undeniably, and it just simply would not be this way if casino operators were as you "dark-siders" say..........
.......cruel, theiving, heartless, no good sacks of stinking sh]t, who should be beaten to death, with metal pipes...in a dark alleyway....on a Tuesday night when it is raining, and no one is around.....

You reminded me of a funny experience I had last Winter in AC. I was playing Sic bo and there was this Malaysian guy at the table who kept losing big. He started talking about magnetic dice and electromagnets and started strongly implying that the house was controlling the dice. I pointed out to him that once in a while one die would be on top of another when the dome was lifted, which presumably wouldn't happen if they were being pulled towards the table by an electromagnet. Don't think I convinced him of it, though.

Quote: Paigowdan

I also used to think that the Human Condition was fundamentally decent. Now I know better, -

The human condition is basically self-serving. Anyone who tries to tell you otherwise is either naive or has something for sale.

Quote: Paigowdan

corrupt politicians from Jimmy Cater to Pol Pot,

While I agree with your overall assessment, I am unsure that Pol Pot could be described either as a "politician" or as "corrupt". I mean, even the CIA didn't know he was in charge until after the regime fell, and his motivation seemed to be megalomania and rebuilding the country into his own vision rather than corruption (I doubt that anyone could argue that a guy who dynamited the banks and outlawed currency was in it for the money). Sorry; couldn't help myself there.

Quote: Paigowdan

We dealers see almost nothing but steaming the losses, attempted claims, cheating, and dishonest Advantage Play, - and a lot less fun than gambling really should be.

No big winners at your table, then?

Quote: Paigowdan

sometimes I think he put me on a gambling hall's crap game's stickman position to give a reason of lesson for my life.

Glad to hear that you've found your calling. So would that answer the question that initiated this thread? Not trying to be flippant; just figure that if dealing dice is what the Eternal had planned for you, then maybe you want to keep dealing dice for a while. Probably better tokes than being retired will get you.

Quote: heather

No big winners at your table, then?

Sometimes Yes, - yes, quite often, indeed.
And we never sweat the money we lose, or praise the temporary money we win.
We call it "the quiet turning away" at those times.

Quote: heather

Glad to hear that you've found your calling. So would that answer the question that initiated this thread? Not trying to be flippant; just figure that if dealing dice is what the Eternal had planned for you, then maybe you want to keep dealing dice for a while. Probably better tokes than being retired will get you.

I would not say that it is a calling, or my own calling. It seems to be in my lifetime now, though, fitting like a glove, now.
I will say that it is something that I am apprently quite natural with, until I do find the or "a" final calling.

Quote: Paigowdan

"We're just not ready now, and when we are, it's a together type of thing."
.

Translation: 'Warning Will Robinson! Read between the lines!'

Which you did. If my wife had been so calm about it like
this, I would wonder if she had been abducted by aliens
and replaced by a pod person. I'm at the point in my life
where if my wife left me, I wouldn't like it, but I know I
would move on pretty quickly. But I'm 63. When I was 51
that wasn't the case at all. Things change and people
change, thats a fact.

Quote: Paigowdan

..."But I'M the bread-winner here"...

It's not a question of money, but just who is busting their ass, working for the man.

Dan, One time I asked forum members how much $ (savings) one needs to retire at a particular age (whether 51 like you or 60 like me). I got some replies with numerical answers. On your issues, no one talked about your savings (e.g. tangible assets). It does not sound like a retirement to me. Are we talking about just a career change and marriage concerns? Does your wife read this forum?

Quote: UCivan

Dan, One time I asked forum members how much $ (savings) one needs to retire at a particular age (whether 51 like you or 60 like me).

https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/general/9164-retirement-how-much-is-needed/