Bob used the term, "Chinaman" in the show

See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinaman_(term)

"the term Chinaman is noted as offensive by modern dictionaries. Its derogatory connotations evolved from its use in pejorative contexts regarding the Chinese and other Asians. While usage of the term Chinaman is nowadays strongly discouraged by Asian American organizations,[5][6][7][8] the term has been used by English speakers of Chinese descent and others, without offensive intent,[5][8] and has also been used as a self-referential archetype by authors and artists of Asian descent."

Bros, update your vocabulary.

I received an email on Tuesday that my use of "Chinaman" was offensive. I didn't remember saying it. I went back and listened to the tape and I indeed said "Would a wealthy Chinaman from Beijing find it easier to fly to Japan or Macau?"

I was absolutely not intending to be derogatory. I had no idea the term was offensive. Reading this thread, I'm not the only one who didn't know the term was considered racist or otherwise objectionable. Tomorrow's show, an interview with Australian advantage slot player Peter Liston, begins with an apology. I didn't mean to offend anybody.

I'm hope the apology will be accepted at face value and the matter will be dropped. I will attempt to never use that word again.

Quote: BobDancer

"Would a wealthy Chinaman from Beijing find it easier to fly to Japan or Macau?"

In the context of that sentence, meaning even to say Chinese man might come out Chinaman just by not saying what you meant to say. Anyone who jokes about people confusing Pacific for specific has found out the hard way, when you don't mean to say Pacific, you do, as if you don't know any better. Someone pointed out me saying I hated bad Chinese, to make it seem like I was talking about the ethnicity when all I meant to express was disliking the food. Their complaint was only a zinger, it was a good one, and I never thought I wasn't being clear. It's so easy to not even consciously say words.

If anything ever happens like this again, use the senior moment card. You're too smart to use offensive words on purpose, but words are buried deep in the brain never forgotten, and sometimes they're misfiled, coming out completely innocently.

Quote: BobDancer

I didn't mean to offend anybody.

Geez, Bob, settle down. If you go thru life
worrying about who you're offending,
those people are living your life instead
of you. The more you give them power over
you, the more they'll take. People can
insult me all day long, I can take care
of myself. Why can't the sacred 'offended'
do the same.

I do understand that it can be a mistake. I just want to raise people's awareness about this term. I once sent a group text message to my friends saying "Let's go to Jap restaurant". By being lazy, I actually kind of insulted my Japanese friend. The word, jap has a special meaning during World War II. He corrected me and I apologized. Life moves on.

Quote: Kickass

He corrected me and I apologized. Life moves on.

And this is what most people do when they have unintentionally offended someone.

But EvenBob is insinuating that BobDancer is overreacting by being apologetic over this. But EvenBob obviously won't apologize for his racially stereotypical comments toward terapined that multiple other members have said are offensive. "Eyes squeezed shut"? I mean, come on! But I'm sure EvenBob will skate away from a suspension for the umpteenth time.

Quote: EvenBob

Geez, Bob, settle down. If you go thru life
worrying about who you're offending,
those people are living your life instead
of you. The more you give them power over
you, the more they'll take. People can
insult me all day long, I can take care
of myself. Why can't the sacred 'offended'
do the same.

Your comments won't affect you financially so you can say anything you want with no real consequences. Your dog will probably still love you. When you are selling books, teaching classes, doing a show etc etc it's better to apologize.

I'm not suggesting that's the reason he apologized, but it's certainly something one might consider.
------------------------------------------

Djatc is the only Asian American on our team full of white-boys(affirmative action). We go the EXTRA MILE to make sure he feels just like one of us.

Quote: EvenBob

Geez, Bob, settle down. If you go thru life
worrying about who you're offending,
those people are living your life instead
of you. The more you give them power over
you, the more they'll take. People can
insult me all day long, I can take care
of myself. Why can't the sacred 'offended'
do the same.

I agree, we live in a society where everyone is expected to tread on eggshells, even when having a private conversation. Just say what you think, if people go out of their way to construct offense, that says more about them.

There is virtually nothing anyone can say to or about me that will cause offense, as long as you do not threaten somebody, people need to just get over it.

If somebody is being intentionally racist, then yes criticize them. But, if people pick apart every little sentence looking for an antiquated word, that was used offhand, to be outraged by, then there is no pleasing them, they will always be upset about something.

A month or 2 ago, there was a serious group that started a Twitter tag, to ban the term "Black Friday" since they thought it was originally reffering to selling slaves (which is not slightly true), and not long before that some people where I live were protesting Columbus Day since he was a colonizer or whatever, so there is always people looking for obscure ancient references to be upset about in 2016..... Point is you cannot feel bad about offending people, because some people live for finding offense.

There's an unfair double standard here.

Blacks can call each other "nigger" or "niggah" with impunity, but if a white uses the term the PC police will pull their hair out and piss themselves in righteous indignation.

Why should blacks get a bye on this, but not whites?

Weren't all men created equal?

So, if a Chinese man calls another Chinese man a "Chinaman," does he get a bye also?

If so, why?

@ Mr. V I can't tell if that was serious. Though, even if not, it's not so simple anymore with young people. e.g. two young Asians might call each other "nigga," depending on where they live and so forth. Blacks might even use the term for whites. But, applying it to blacks is still best avoided.

When I was a sub, I was at one school where the term was used liberally, and a Latino kid said it to a black kid and it obviously hurt his feelings. The Latino kid said, "I'm sorry, I didn't mean it that way," and they happily resumed being pains in my ass.

Anyway, back to the original discussion, it breaks down like this, I think.

If you're cool, you will try not to be insensitive and make a reasonable effort to avoid saying anything hurtful.

That might vary from one situation to the next. Joking around with your friends, vs. what you say to strangers, e.g.

ALSO, if you're cool, you will not try to invent the worst possible intentions for people and create mortal offense where it doesn't need to exist.

So, there are jerks on both sides.

I would do the same thing If I were Bob.

Quote: Rigondeaux

@ Mr. V I can't tell if that was serious.

Yes, it was.

Moral relativism.

Quote: MrV

Yes, it was.

Moral relativism.

Moral relativism means something like, basic morality can change depending on who is acting. There are a lot of variations.

That's different from appreciating nuance and context.

The standard account in this case, as with some other terms, like queer, would be that you have a derogatory term, particularly one used by a group that is more powerful, applied to one that is less powerful.

The less powerful group decides to start using the term for themselves, as a way of taking control of it, and the way they are regarded and regard themselves.

So, one obvious distinction: a black person can be reasonably sure that another black person is not saying "nigga" as a way to express the idea that blacks are genetically inferior, or something of that nature. When a non-black uses the term, it's harder to know what they mean. They might even be pretending to use it affectionately, but really be using it with malice.

Maybe something kind of like that has happened in your community or family. Saying, someone is white trash. Saying your family is a bunch of drunks, or failures, or not very smart, or whatever. Or, if you go to a mediocre school and you say, "how smart can I be, I go to Sonoma State?" vs someone who goes to Stanford saying, "how smart can you be you go to Sonoma State?" Someone from the south slyly saying, "what do I know, I'm just a Southern boy," vs. someone from NYC saying something similar.

In certain areas, white ethnic groups do the same thing. "I'm just an old Pollock."

It seems like a pretty common situation to me, though this one is more intense than usual.

Quote: MrV

Why should blacks get a bye on this, but not whites?
]

I can call my brother an idiot in front
of you, but you can't do it in front of
me. Same thing.

MrV, I know a guy that can sell you a permit. It's not cheap.

Quote: beachbumbabs

EB. Stop it. Drop it. Right now. You've made your factual point such as it is. Your PM was offensive to terapined. If he's made a complaint over on DT, you may face a suspension there. I don't know.

terapined, I don't have a choice. 3 day suspension for publishing a PM without the concurrence of the author.

There is a one-way application in effect for DT vs WoV. The PM was from there, but made public here, breaking both forum rules. The contents of the PM, if they offended you enough to do so, should be brought to the DT moderators' attention.

I have had a chance to talk to the Wizard about this suspension. It was not his intention, when linking the sites after the sale of this one, that a cross infraction like this would cause a suspension here. So I am reversing my suspension of Terapined at this time.

Thanks
I was actually going to donate my 10 to the contest due to my suspension
I think I will make some picks
Doesn't really matter because will still lose the 10 either way lol

If anybody is interested, me and EB are going back and forth on this thread
http://diversitytomorrow.com/thread/2021/0/

Quote: beachbumbabs

So I am reversing my suspension of Terapined at this time.

Thank god. It would be cruel to cut
him off from his family during the
holidays.

Quote: EvenBob

Thank god. It would be cruel to cut
him off from his family during the
holidays.

EB goes after Clinton hard
I shrug
I go after Trump hard
EB goes bonkers and makes it personal lol

Quote: MrV

There's an unfair double standard here.

Blacks can call each other "nigger" or "niggah" with impunity, but if a white uses the term the PC police will pull their hair out and piss themselves in righteous indignation.

Why should blacks get a bye on this, but not whites?

Hard to believe you've never noticed people with either a lot of things in common, or just one prominent thing act much more relaxed and even throw insults at each other.

Has less to do with race than you might think. It might be funny for another blind person to ask his blind friend how many fingers he is holding up. Is it going to be funny when you do it? Maybe, but probably not.

Quote: terapined

EB goes after Clinton hard
I shrug
I go after Trump hard
EB goes bonkers and makes it personal lol

This is so true.

After months (years?) of posting pics of Hillary looking old and ugly, EB really can't handle people pointing out the fact that Donald paints his face orange.

Quote: ams288

This is so true.

After months (years?) of posting pics of Hillary looking old and ugly, EB really can't handle people pointing out the fact that Donald paints his face orange.

Yea but he gets to make it up by being able to say "President Trump". And if he still isn't cheered up, he just needs to open the Huffington Post and laugh at the headlines from the sore losers.

Quote: Boz

Yea but he gets to make it up by being able to say "President Trump". And if he still isn't cheered up, he just needs to open the Huffington Post and laugh at the headlines from the sore losers.

You would think that's true, wouldn't you? But based on EB's posts at DT, it seems that that isn't the case. He got very defensive about Donald's orange face. And he constantly goes out of his way to praise Donald's "brilliance."

It's the "sore winners" thing. So many Trumpsters cannot handle criticism of their Orange god. They lash out when you point out what a dumb buffoon he is.

But I fear this is taking this thread off topic. There are plenty of fun active threads about the orange man over at DT...

In this thread EB assumed me and just about all minorities vote lib automatically
For the record I have been voting in this country for 38 years
Its only recently that i have voted Dem
Voted for Obama twice and Hill
But
Never voted for Bill
Voted for Nader twice, Reagan, Jon Anderson, Bush sr, Dole

Quote: terapined

In this thread EB assumed me and just about all minorities vote lib automatically

You can't say that about "minorities" because "minorities" is a pretty big word. If you want to get more specific, you could say that about Blacks and that's not even debatable. But I don't see how you can make a blanket statement like that about other "minorities" in this country.

I can think of two "minorities" that probably vote mostly republican, although I'm just speaking off the top of my head. That would be Cubans and Vietnamese. The young ones may have been in this country for years but they all have relatives who have communism still fresh in their minds, it still hits home. I know many Vietnamese from Orange County, Ca., and the older ones went through hell to get here. They're lucky to have escaped with their lives.

Quote: terapined

In this thread EB assumed me and just about all minorities vote lib automatically
For the record I have been voting in this country for 38 years
Its only recently that i have voted Dem
Voted for Obama twice and Hill
But
Never voted for Bill
Voted for Nader twice, Reagan, Jon Anderson, Bush sr, Dole

What?!?!

But you're a Chinaman!?!?! [/sarcasm]

Quote: Kickass

In the December 15, 2016 show, Bob said "Would it likely be easier for a wealthy Chinaman..." at around "32:45".

Just to state the obvious. I'm a Chinese American and I found it odd/uncomfortable to hear this term in a public radio show. Do you guys use this term in your daily conversation? If so, do you know the history behind it?

My wife is from Hong Kong... she doesn't even have official citizenship yet and I call her all sorts of offensive names that you wouldn't approve of! I never used Chinaman or Chinawoman. That doesn't seem very offensive. It seems pretty natural. Your from China. Your a man. Your a Chinaman. My father used to use a lot more words that people still find offensive. He fought in Vietnam so I am sure you know the words he called Asians. Don't worry... I got him back for you since I married an Asian Woman!! I use some of these words but more so in a joking manner... who cares? I've been called worse names myself.

I don't care what they say about the LGBT or Rainbow community! I am still going to call them all the offensive, derogatory names they have for that group :) !

Quote: bobbartop

If you want to get more specific, you could say that about Blacks and that's not even debatable.

The black vote is the closest to automatic among all major ethnicities, but not fully. Hillary got 88%, 5% less than Obama did in 2012. If she got 93% like Obama with all others constant, the electoral college might have been hers. Not bothering to do the math though.

Quote: terapined

In this thread EB assumed me and just about all minorities vote lib automatically
For the record I have been voting in this country for 38 years
Its only recently that i have voted Dem
Voted for Obama twice and Hill
But
Never voted for Bill
Voted for Nader twice, Reagan, Jon Anderson, Bush sr, Dole

This just further proves Bob right. You're only half minority so you vote dem about half the time ;)

Quote: bobbartop

You can't say that about "minorities" because "minorities" is a pretty big word. If you want to get more specific, you could say that about Blacks and that's not even debatable. But I don't see how you can make a blanket statement like that about other "minorities" in this country.

I can think of two "minorities" that probably vote mostly republican, although I'm just speaking off the top of my head. That would be Cubans and Vietnamese. The young ones may have been in this country for years but they all have relatives who have communism still fresh in their minds, it still hits home. I know many Vietnamese from Orange County, Ca., and the older ones went through hell to get here. They're lucky to have escaped with their lives.

Here's an interesting one. Muslims used to be among the most loyal Republican voters.

But the broad statement is still accurate. He didn't say, "every single subset of every single minority."

Quote: terapined

EB goes after Clinton hard
I shrug
I go after Trump hard
EB goes bonkers and makes it personal lol

Insert Viagra joke here.

Once again, EB finds a way to be the smartest person in the room. Simply because he uses common sense. And at least in this election and in this debate, common sense won.

Sorry for those chicken littles out there. Things will be fine.

Quote: Boz

Once again, EB finds a way to be the smartest person in the room.

I would agree, for this part in particular...

Quote: EvenBob

I don't care if you're offended, why
should I. I don't live in the same PC
world you do.

And that's why I'm here.

I am one of those anti-PC folks. Forget "anti", I f#$%ing hate it. And if you haven't heard me say it outright, I am one of those fellas that think "PC" is causing a whole heap of problems. And with this thread's appearance and Babs' request for me to opine more, I'm gonna hit on this one.

See, I can imagine some Joesh type fellow to hear my anti-PC stance and immediately assume I'd prefer to be able to "talk down to" some "uppity (insert minority here)". After all, ain't keepin' the lesser breeds in their place the whole / only reason anyone would be anti-PC? I've seen that charge leveled before, and I get mad every time. Like, how can you be so simple to believe something like that? But the more I thought about it, the more I realized that we anti's ain't never really explained it, or given concrete ideas behind our stance, pretty much leaving everyone to guess. Babs' post about thinking of leaving this place and her disgust at seeing some of the things in that thread led me to do some thinking. And so, here's my personal explanation on why guys like EB "got it", and stances like Drawing Dead's are so laughably ridiculous (IMO, of course).

See, check this out... "nigger". I just said nigger. In type, no less, and I ain't no part black. Ain't no urbanite, either. I'm a hillbilly, white trash redneck, and I just said nigger. That's three times now. Who here is already uncomfortable? I'd bet cash money it's well over half, and I'd even openly include myself within that half+ of people who feel awkward. There are a bunch of words like this, words that immediately cast a pall over any environment one could find themselves in. Fag. Chink. Spic. Haole. Han:ji. Gwilo. Redskin. Han:yoh. Name a subsect of people and there's a "bad word" for them. Some of these words are deemed "so bad" that many will not even say nor type them. Instead, we say and type "the 'N' word". Or we pull our eyes tight on the sly and give a head nod in persons' direction.

Now, it's at this point that I should go back, edit, and never let this post see the light of day. But f#$% that. Let's take it further. What if I don't just type the word, but I actually use it. What if i start inquiring what happened to that 'skin from ATL, as I ain't seen 2F in a hot minute? What if I tell terapined I ain't interested in his chink stories? What if I were to inquire what fag stuff KJ has been up to lately? Well, holy s#$%. Now things are really uncomfy. I might have even just lost the green, and maybe even my membership period.

I look at this situation and I'm damn near disgusted. What do you PC folks hope to accomplish? Well, as a sort of compassionate fellow, I reckon I can assume and then empathize and even agree with your goal, which is to ensure no man is left to be the target of discriminate hate. If that's in fact your goal, I have no argument. I'm right there with you. But do you not see that by casting such judgement on these words, that it is YOU who gives them the power they have?

That is my opinion, as a halfbreed. I could point to many pocks and dents in my face as the result of racism, and I've enough stories to fill a book. I'm sure terapined has lived many of my battles, being a halfbreed himself. He said before he's oft mistaken as Hawaiian, just as I've oft been mistaken as Puerto Rican. I'd bet that like me he's had coworkers, peers, even semi-close friends, dog his culture right to his face as they didn't realize he was of the race they were disparaging. Happens to me all the time. But you know what fixed racism for me? Me. That's all. Wasn't no "burying of the bad word" a la that idiot Sharpton, it wasn't about public shaming or cussing out a "bigot", it was the simple understanding that their opinion affects me ZERO, yet affects them to some extent. And this is were I get so pissed off. Used to be that any mention of my race in any form of negativity was gonna lead to some hands being thrown. And someone would call be an "apple", or "not a real Indian", or state I had "just a touch of the tarbrush, and it was on immediately. What did that get me? Pain, some trips to the medic, some disciplinary troubles, couple of permanent head injuries, and not one god damned other thing period. It didn't get me respect, didn't get me understanding, didn't get me conformity. It got me nothing. Not until I took control, until I understood the power behind eliminating these words' effect, that was I released from the hate prison I had constructed.

And that' why I'm so anti-PC and so f#$%ing frustrated with you bleeding hearts. You ENCOURAGE THIS VULNERABILITY. You are telling everyone around you that you SHOULD be terribly upset at someone elses ignorance. THAT IS HORSES#$%! I could, as an identified minority, walk right up in EB's face and call him a honky, whitebread, peckerwood cracker. You can guess, but I already know what his response would be. A laugh and a possible invitation to me to get the f#$% out of here. And 2 seconds later, it is out of EB's life forever. THAT'S what's SUPPOSED TO HAPPEN. If I can come to into your face, or even just place some words here that you might find, and I can completely ruin your day and get into your head and cause you so much grief over a simple word, then you have F#$%ED UP. You are LOSING THE GAME.

And there's another offshoot of the PC garbage I think is doing REAL damage. MEASURABLE damage. See, I remember getting into a big gun debate, and I was rapping with boymimbo over our odd border. It is basically the exact same town, just split by the Niagara River. Same culture, same location, it's like the differences between two sisters; mostly cosmetic. This was in a gun debate discussion and I just could not find a metric to explain the vast differences in crime. And it was either EB or AZD who piped up and said "demographics". My immediate reaction? "S#$%." I was a bit irritated at it. It was "racial". It made me "uncomfortable". But in the interest of learning, I carried on in that vein. And you know what? I saw that there was some certain questionable links. As I went on and on, I saw what in any other case would have been a thread in which to begin to follow, and a long term discussion with which to have, but it painted black folk in a negative light. And that made me REALLY uncomfortable. So uncomfortable, in fact, I sort of half-assed mentioned it and then mostly dropped the subject. I dropped it. I was too scared. So scared I DROPPED A F#$%ING GUN DEBATE O.o

That PISSES ME OFF. Fact is all cultures have a cluttered closet, and I mean clutter SPECIFIC to that culture, but we have been trained, cajoled, or outright threatened to never go in that direction. That is WRONG. Why can't we point out that gun violence is, in majority, a black problem? Or why can we not question why it's always the white folk who end an entire generation in a bathtub, or several generations at a public school?

This is my anti-PC stance. I don't wish for unshielded hate, or what the anti-Trump folks trumpet, "the emboldening of bigots nationwide". Hell no. But what I wish is for you to stop stripping folks of their power, stop saddling them with vulnerability, and stop putting up roadblocks to topics we absolutely need to delve into. Racism is SERIOUS. Dropping it at every slight is incredibly irresponsible.

In closing, I posted this as more than just a rant. I really would like one of you soft hearted fellas to engage me on this, point out where my thinking is wrong. My journey from my own bleeding heart to where I am now is a dead straight line. There has been no experience of mine to support your side of the argument, and I'm guess I'm looking for exactly that.

And in addition to in closing, I'll admit right now that I am not right in the head. My post looks good to me and I stand by it 100%. But as my judgement is a bit in question, I offer anyone here who has taken legit offense to my post an opportunity to challenge and defeat it, and I hand you the axe. Charge me the infraction and I'll serve whatever punishment you see fit.

Oh, and as my schedule is madness, so... Merry Xmas to y'all.

Quote: Face

In closing, I posted this as more than just a rant. I really would like one of you soft hearted fellas to engage me on this, point out where my thinking is wrong. My journey from my own bleeding heart to where I am now is a dead straight line. There has been no experience of mine to support your side of the argument, and I'm guess I'm looking for exactly that..

The only anti-pc people I respect are the ones willing to be un-pc knowing the person in front of them they are doing it to, could beat their ass into ground and might be likely to do so at any moment. I don't mean with conditions, like standing with your friends, or knowing you got a gun in a holster under your clothes. That's a coward.

If you can make that claim on a regular basis, I can at least respect that. I don't know if I'll like you any better, but I'll respect you.

I'm right in the middle on this issue, fwiw, Face. I grew up calling people by names now considered derogatory in what, to me, seems an overly sensitive need to take umbrage. I miss being able to tell Irish, Italian, Polack, or Little Black Sambo jokes we learned as kids.

Otoh, there is a legitimate argument that casual, widespread use of "terms of otherness" promulgate acceptance and ranking of classes by race, sex, ethnic origin, or orientation, and not to the benefit of those labeled. And all those jokes, as I review them in my head, were funny because they reinforced a negative stereotype in nearly every case.

So, I think intent is an important aspect, as someone said 10 pages ago. And thousands of incidents are happening every day, in our country which supposedly celebrates the lifted lamp.beside the open door, with vile intent from the hater. Queasy as the victims make me, it's not close to the discomfort the perpetrators cause.

Where does that hatred even come from? That's the part I still don't get. It's not the nicknames and jokes. It's the anger and hatred of so many. Maybe it's easier to blame others instead of taking responsibility for one's own failings or difficulty. But in that case, the anger is really at themselves, and is misdirected to exterior targets. So maybe I should feel sorry for the self-delusional rather than their victims?

I go back to that thing Eleanor Roosevelt said, about nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent. And maybe that's where the line should be. Blow off the non-pc stuff. Fight like hell when you're denied an opportunity you've earned on merit by a prejudiced fool. Fight for a better world for your kids. They've already left most of this prejudice behind, so maybe there's hope as those of us raised in privilege die off.

And Happy Hanukkah to you. Festivus. Kwanzaa. Solstice. We celebrate Christmas, so have a Merry one.

Quote: Kickass

In the December 15, 2016 show, Bob said "Would it likely be easier for a wealthy Chinaman..." at around "32:45".

Just to state the obvious. I'm a Chinese American and I found it odd/uncomfortable to hear this term in a public radio show. Do you guys use this term in your daily conversation? If so, do you know the history behind it?

Your website has Asian jokes on it http://kickasshumor.com/c/10/funny-racial-jokes

Quote: AxelWolf

Your website has Asian jokes on it http://kickasshumor.com/c/10/funny-racial-jokes

I read a few. A couple I found funny but I think the best was... I bought a black computer because... lol

I thought about Jimmy the Greek after reading that joke.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WzB7IsmOegE

Never argue with an idiot. They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.
George Carlin.

Merry Christmas. May God bless us, one and all.

Face said:

"But you know what fixed racism for me? Me. That's all. Wasn't no "burying of the bad word" a la that idiot Sharpton, it wasn't about public shaming or cussing out a "bigot", it was the simple understanding that their opinion affects me ZERO"

His entire encyclopedic post boils down to
the above paragraph. If you let other people
run your life for you, they'll be happy to do
it. But shame on you for playing the victim.

Quote: Face

Merry Xmas to y'all.

Happy holidays to you as well.

Quote: EvenBob

What part is untrue? Please point it out.
I don't care if you're offended, why
should I. I don't live in the same PC
world you do. Don't you think it odd
that every 4 years everybody but
everybody correctly assumes that
all minorities are behind the Dem
candidate, it's never even questioned?
Yet we never assume it about whites.
Why is that?

Ummmm..... we do assume it about the whites! You haven't read "If only whites were allowed to vote the Republicans would win every election without having to try?" Look at predominantly white states like Utah, Idaho, etc... Pacomartin can probably show us a map of the US if only the white votes were counted...... I'm not sure there would be a single state that Hillary would have carried. Probably Massachusetts.... NY, Cali

As long as we're reviewing what terms are offensive these days, let me bounce this story off the forum for comment.

I mentioned to my son that I wanted to climb Squaw's Tit Peak in Arizona. He responded with, "The term 'squaw' has gone out of favor and is now considered an offensive." I was surprised that part of the peak's name was the offensive part.



Image source. Some sources have sanitized the name.

Quote: SOOPOO

Ummmm..... we do assume it about the whites! You haven't read "If only whites were allowed to vote the Republicans would win every election without having to try?"

Whoever said that is an idiot. Whites
got Obama elected twice, they voted
for him in droves.

"There are about 40 million Democrats in the US while there are only 30 million Republicans. There are about 38 million independents.'

According to Gallup, 60% of Dems are
white. The odds in any election is always
stacked against the Right. The advantage
is, way more Repubs vote on election
day, percentage wise. If as many Dems
voted, Repubs would never win anything.

Quote: Wizard

I was surprised that part of the peak's name was the offensive part.

If it would cause a class of 7th graders to start giggling there's only so much you can do to avoid the obvious.

Nice! That's even better than Indian D**k in the Grand Canyon.

Quote: terapined

Voted for Obama twice and Hill
But
Never voted for Bill
Voted for Nader twice, Reagan, Jon Anderson, Bush sr, Dole

Wow, now that's consistent. Sounds like you have a firm grasp of the issues.

Quote: Wizard

He responded with "The term 'squaw' has gone out of favor and is now considered an offensive."

Did you respond with pipe down chinaboy? ;)

BTW at least bobdancer said China MAN. I hear people call us whiteboys or peckerwoods all the time like it ain't no thang. Next to those Chinaman is kind of a compliment.

Quote: RogerKint

Did you respond with pipe down chinaboy? ;)

BTW at least bobdancer said China MAN. I hear people call us whiteboys or peckerwoods all the time like it ain't no thang. Next to those Chinaman is kind of a compliment.

I thought of mentioning this earlier but decided against. It may be difficult to believe, but I'm not really the argumentative a-hole that I may seem to be. "Whiteboy" is quite insulting in some circles. It's not the word itself but rather the way in which it is used. Secretly tape a group of blacks in the hood and you will see. They do not use the term endearingly. In some environments, it's not much different than using the N-word, and will get you stabbed.

Quote: Puckerbutt

Happy holidays to you as well.

Herzlichen dank, mein fruend.

Quote: beachbumbabs

Where does that hatred even come from? That's the part I still don't get. It's not the nicknames and jokes. It's the anger and hatred of so many. Maybe it's easier to blame others instead of taking responsibility for one's own failings or difficulty. But in that case, the anger is really at themselves, and is misdirected to exterior targets. So maybe I should feel sorry for the self-delusional rather than their victims?

Some could be attributed to experience. I often support or try to champion Indian Country. I know a lot of glorious Natives that deserve celebrating, not even because they did something huge, but because they're doing life right. They live right, act right, and have resisted cultural pressures to hate English ways, or Englishers themselves. But on the inside, where I keep things hidden, I still hold a lot of anger towards my own race. Especially as a child, I was softer than any one of you here. Wide open heart. I remember being on the other rez at a playground when 4 or 5 other yutes headed my way. I was 9 or so. I got excited; someone to play with. And about the time they hit the gravel and that little tickle went off in my head, it was too late. 5 minutes later I had been restrained, strangled, beaten, and repeatedly spit in the face by my own people, for little other reason than I just "wasn't Indian enough".

I still carry that. And I do prejudge and stereotype the hell out of them. Any local event and I see a gaggle of them cuttin' it up and smoke dancin', I do wanna join. But... I just can't. It's a risk, a real risk, and I can no longer afford it. So when young women and/or little ol ladies give me the stink eye or curl a wing around their kid and draw them tight when I come through, it hurts, but I try not to judge. Who knows what terror my image awoke in them? Who knows what experience my presence reminds them off?

The rest? I'd wager more simplistic stupidity. I mean, I go off on anti-gunners all the time, because most of their stance seems to revolve 100% around what they see in the movies (not necessarily speaking of those I've argued with here). I see it plain as day, because I'm familiar with this topic, and what they say has literally no basis in reality, though does fit numerous plot lines we've all seen. And seeing this, and in looking at how much media in all forms shapes our lives, I do think some just go with their "experience", this time in quotes because it's not real "experience". I mean, everyone knows a black man in a hoody and sagging jeans is 100% a gang banger, right? /rolleyes

I can't speak for everyone or yours, but the real racists I know are cripplingly stupid. Like, literally have no ability to think, and can only parrot, or form very rudimentary, simple ideas. I can only feel sorry for these types, and whatever anger I may have is completely assuaged knowing that whatever bad I may want to do to them is completely eclipsed by the position they intentionally put themselves in.

Quote: Wizard

As long as we're reviewing what terms are offensive these days, let me bounce this story off the forum for comment.

I mentioned to my son that I wanted to climb Squaw's Tit Peak in Arizona. He responded with, "The term 'squaw' has gone out of favor and is now considered an offensive." I was surprised that part of the peak's name was the offensive part.

Squaw is a real word from the Natives 'round my parts, and simply means "woman". There is nothing in the language that is offensive or insulting.

Rather, the insult came by way of time and usage. Perhaps a good comparison is the word "mathlete". I've used "mathlete" because I thought it was slick. I know the time, energy, and blood, sweat, and tears I put in to become an athlete, so when I used mathlete, it was in no way a slight and very much my intention to form a bond. A sort of "I see your success and I applaud you". It wasn't until teliot expressed umbrage and explained why he felt the way he did that I saw that side of it. The intention of the word was just as I thought, to convey a sense of respect and acknowledge that you have done something impressive. But the word was sort of co-opted by those seeking to disparage, and the word has been lost to the haters.

Squaw is just like that. It means no more or less than "woman", but after a couple hundred years of using it as a disparaging term, it's now considered a "slight" or "offense".

Face said:

"I can't speak for everyone or yours, but the real racists I know are cripplingly stupid. Like, literally have no ability to think, and can only parrot, or form very rudimentary, simple ideas."

That's why I laugh when the Left calls
Trump a bigot. Do you know how far
you get in life the last 40 years if you're
a true race hating bigot? You might
own a car wash, that's about it.