Sharpshooter's Book: Truth or Fiction
Quote: BuzzardI am not going to set up any classes. If I teach any number of students, the end result will be casino's removing crap tables. No oath or signed document will stop at least several students from killing the golden goose.
There's another thread where the scoundrels are doing a doey-don't as a team! Just shows how us DI's are going to have nowhere to play after these guys-who-don't-care screw it all up for us!
Start writing books, Buzzard.
The purpose for GREED, and any actions associated with it, is possibly to deprive others of potential means (perhaps, of basic survival and comfort) or future opportunities.
Quote: BuzzardI am not going to set up any classes. If I teach any number of students, the end result will be casino's removing crap tables. No oath or signed document will stop at least several students from killing the golden goose.
Roll call 8/1/2014
as instructed by adjunct Professor Buzzard, P.h.DI
Dicesetter- "umm, Prof. Buzzard, he went fishin'"
Ahigh- "he's still hiding in the closet" "why?" "Well, I heard some students from WoV were teasing him because of his flip-flops" "the rubber sandals" "no Professor"
Nickolay- "still here, sir"
AlanMendelson- "YO, YO, Yo, yo..." "settle down Alan, I heard you after the first 18"
Quote: AhighNone of these guys who write books or claim to be experts have shown me their shots. The one guy I've seen who won the $31,000 a month or two ago at Bellagio in front of me was working a SUPER WEAK roll and the box just sat and watched like somebody upstairs had pissed him off and he wasn't going to say short roll no matter what. I still think he got lucky and just happened to be betting big. A 10x return is no record and he started with at least $3,000. $700 off and on no pressure from 3 to 31.
*Quote: Ahigh
"I see LOTS of people setting dice, but it only matters what the dice look like as they fly through the air."
*Quote: Ahigh
"Yeah, my house is not available any longer for any such shenanigans."
*Quote: AlanMendelson
Ahigh, God bless him, did not show anything about DI except that he wasn't a controlled shooter himself.
**Quote: Ahigh
"Alan, could be a little bit more condescending, perhaps? In all truthfulness, this doesn't paint you in the best of light to say things like this."
*Quote: Ibeatyouraces
As for "true DI's", they're is no such thing.
**Quote: Ahigh
"Complete and utter confounded hubris!
Let me ask you a question: do you think you know more about the possibility of their being "true DI's" than I do?
Because I'll say this, "I don't."
*Quote: Ahigh
"Nowhere am I identifying a single advantage play craps player that I know. Nowhere am I saying it's possible."
Ladies and Gentleman, I present to you, RUBBER SANDALS...
Quote: AhighNot sure what your suggesting. Conclusions without sufficient evidence is all I'm pointing out.
Precisely. You arrive at conclusions without sufficient evidence; that is what I'm pointing out. I garnished it with quoted examples of double talk for effect.
Quote: MaxSwellePrecisely. You arrive at conclusions without sufficient evidence; that is what I'm pointing out. I garnished it with quoted examples of double talk for effect.
I disagree with that. But just so I have an idea what you're talking about, what conclusion is it that I came to without sufficient evidence?
As a general statement, most people who want to talk about this stuff have faith-based beliefs in their mind about it.
This applies more often to the non-believers of DI than the other way around ironically.
Quote: AhighI disagree with that. But just so I have an idea what you're talking about, what conclusion is it that I came to without sufficient evidence?
As a general statement, most people who want to talk about this stuff have faith-based beliefs in their mind about it.
This applies more often to the non-believers of DI than the other way around ironically.
For a start would you please explain your own change on the subject of DI?
Quote: AhighI disagree with that. But just so I have an idea what you're talking about, what conclusion is it that I came to without sufficient evidence?
As a general statement, most people who want to talk about this stuff have faith-based beliefs in their mind about it.
This applies more often to the non-believers of DI than the other way around ironically.
Which part do you disagree with-the aforementioned examples of your "double talk" or the asserted (soon to be proven) instances of you arriving at conclusions, sans evidence?
The only thing new is just a realization that it's not really practical at all.
I beat the Silverton for about 18 months and they stopped comp'ing me. So I found out some of the side effects of winning too much that they stop treating you as well and they don't comp you the same. For this and other reasons it just appears to me to be impractical to do this. But that's not so much a change of opinion about whether it's possible, I just am not spending my time on it as much as I was before.
I think that there are plenty of people who have never met me who think that I am an advocate of people learning DI and taking classes and stuff.
I have never been that person. I have never encouraged ANYONE to take classes. I have never promoted anyone's books, or sold anything related to "learn to do dice control."
All of my work has been relative to attempting to prove that it's possible.
It may be proven to be possible some day.
It will never be proven to be impossible given the table playing conditions and rules as they are today.
There is a desire to have a small window of hope that you can do this for the casino to encourage people to play whether they realize it or not.
But the imagination of people to think I "changed my mind" and that I now think that it is absolutely impossible to do dice control is what I am confounded by. I never said I thought it was impossible. I did say I felt like it was impractical. Especially for the DIPs out there who are trying to hard, but don't have a clue or a chance as can be easily seen by the dice as they fly through the air with no evidence of any hope at all; much less the due diligence on tracking your results to see what to expect over a significant number of samples in a compatible environment.
I have all that stuff, and I don't even do it. I really doubt anyone else who takes a class is going to do any better than me. And while it's possible that I put in 100,000 advantage rolls in one casino, I can't be sure that I didn't just get lucky, and I SURELY don't know I can do it in more than just that one casino.
It's really just a big risk and a bigger waste of time if you're able to do something else to make money.
Even playing AP video poker would probably be more profitable in the long run. You'd have a much easier time just cheating at dice, honestly, especially if it involved some help from a dealer. Maybe 1000x easier. I'm constantly telling dealers not to overpay me.
Hypothetically, both dice would have to land absolutely squarely, absolutely perfectly, on what you call "their edges" to remain "on axis."
A deviation of even a tiny fraction of one degree, anything other than true perfection, will cause a problem.
The odds of someone throwing just one die perfectly are long indeed; the odds of throwing both perfectly, so they land smooth, straight and square are insurmountable.
But hey Alan, I understand you saw what you convinced yourself were three true Di's, so you beat this dead DI horse unmercifully to validate your impaired perception.
Yes, I fully understand.
Quote: MrVThe odds of someone throwing just one die perfectly are long indeed; the odds of throwing both perfectly, so they land smooth, straight and square are insurmountable.
If it helps you one way, then think of all the more likely wrong way throws to hurt you.
Quote: MrV... unmercifully to validate your impaired perception.
Gambling, and gambling sites, exactly. The reason that all are now mostly out of fashion. The young people see it from the outside. Willy Loman stuff.
Does this list of names resonate with anybody?:
Dan Quisenberry
Bill CartWright
Jim Furyk
Philip Rivers
Rick Barry
I hope youre not going to tell us that a shot that bounces all over the table is DI ?
Quote: AlanMendelsonMaxswelle I can't imagine what this "other" DI shot looks like. Can you describe?
I hope youre not going to tell us that a shot that bounces all over the table is DI ?
"Any throw that includes the dice spinning,sailing or floating side by side, in close proximity, runs the risk of them bumping eachother and almost immediately sends them in an unpredictable and predictably random manner. I witnessed a fella at the Rampart tossing both dice like darts into the portion of the table where the felt met the rubber. The dice had minimal trajectory with a knuckleball type rotation. He was the lone bettor at the table and I curiously watched him roll several hands. If his intended outcome was to have the dice die within 4inches of the wall and not roll beyond the passline marker near the hook then he was about 30% successful. He threw an inordinate number of aces and boxcars and didn't repeat a single point for a winner. He did however hit a few hopping 12's for himself and the dealers."
Quote: AlanMendelsonMaxswelle I can't imagine what this "other" DI shot looks like. Can you describe?
I hope youre not going to tell us that a shot that bounces all over the table is DI ?
We've all seen the (3) videos posted by yourself- two of which belonged to our hero.
Quote: MaxSwelleWe've all seen the (3) videos posted by yourself- two of which belonged to our hero.
I've never posted any videos with the exception of my demonstration of a slide.
Quote: MaxSwelleAlan, my point is that a side by side GTC/PARR style shot is the Chevy 350 or Levi 501's of dice throws. Thats the style everyone sees, reads about and emulates. Hell, Ahigh began his research with that shot exclusively and both STRONGLY and immediately inferred positive results as that of DI. Well, that and being so antagonistic towards casino personnel that he got banned from several houses. A combination of the two is evidently the secret recipe for DI status, ahem F.S. It's possible that the skill can present itself in styles that are not easily recognized; or in your case, acknowledged. I provided that list of PRO athletes with unique styles, that conveyed their respective abilities, as a point in reference. Btw Ahigh, nothing against you dude-just admit to the flip floppery. My offer is still table top.
The problem with the athlete analogy is that even though they all have very different styles and their respective sports, they don't claim to be doing anything special or something they can't prove. They are pitching or hitting free throws or doing whatever they do with measurable results that can be compared to others.
A better analogy might be a spit ball pitcher or a player using a corked bat, but probably still not quite on the mark.
The most damning thing against add the "dice controllers/influencers" is they can't provide a shred of evidence that it exists.
ZCore13
Quote: AlanMendelsonI've never posted any videos with the exception of my demonstration of a slide.
You are correct, my mistake. The videos were posted by Superrick and your comments, which referenced Ahigh's inability to convey influence over the dice, bothered him
Quote: MaxSwelleAlan, my point is that a side by side GTC/PARR style shot is the Chevy 350 or Levi 501's of dice throws. Thats the style everyone sees, reads about and emulates. Hell, Ahigh began his research with that shot exclusively.
I'm sorry but Ahigh never showed a GTC or PARR or a "Sharpshooter" shot. His throws were too high and bounced too much and failed to stay close together near the wall. Whatever shot he has is NOT a GTC, PARR or Sharpshooter shot.
Do you consider Ahigh's shot DI? Is that what you are talking about?
Damnt my hands shake from Prograf but I can still come close to a PARR, GTC, Sharpshooter shot.
Quote: AlanMendelsonDamnt my hands shake from Prograf
That's right, you've had a kidney transplant.
My son in law had two lungs transplanted last weekend; surprisingly, he's been released from hospital and is doing well at home.
Have to ask him what anti-rejection meds he's going to be using.
Just curious: must you take anti-rejection meds forever, or does your body finally reach such a point of equilibrium that they are no logner necessary?
Quote: Zcore13The problem with the athlete analogy is that even though they all have very different styles and their respective sports, they don't claim to be doing anything special or something they can't prove. They are pitching or hitting free throws or doing whatever they do with measurable results that can be compared to others.
A better analogy might be a spit ball pitcher or a player using a corked bat, but probably still not quite on the mark.
The most damning thing against add the "dice controllers/influencers" is they can't provide a shred of evidence that it exists.
ZCore13
Good point, and I agree. DI/DC has yet to be, if ever proven. But, IF it is possible-it's likely that alternative styles can achieve similarly desirable results. Look, I realize I'm about to lay witness and sound about as believable as a UFO abductee; but this old fella I saw was shooting an incredible number of 12's and aces. Ordinarily, I'd say bfd and simply curse them as garbage numbers, BUT, he bought in for X amount of dollars, the dealer gave him most of his chips and used the remainder to make bets on 12's and aces for him and themselves (tokes) as if it were old hat and I'll be damned if didn't start hitting those numbers, lights out.
Is correct Ahigh does not throw a good GTC roll, it is way to hard and
bounces all over the table.
But the way the table length, height and bounce change, who in the hell
does throw a good shot anymore.
dicesetter
Dicesetter sometimes I can throw a shot with little bounce to the back wall but I have no "control" of the dice and never claimed to. But its the appearance of my throw that got me in trouble with the MGM properties.
I am at Caesars right now and I have never seen such lax enforcement of rules. Hitting the back wall is no longer required but do make an effort to get dice past the far passline. Today they let a shooter set dice with BOTH hands.
Every shooter I played with today set dice. No one had a disciplined throw but it was interesting how some shooters changed their sets depending on point.
that was the basis of my comment the other day.... I cant tell how much
these forums are viewed by the casino, or what they think about the books that
are written.
However there must be some basis for the way they treat dice setters, and
it sure as hell is not based on winning. Some rich jerk off drunk guy comes to
the table and wins $50,000 and they treat him respectfully, some guy bets a $6 six and eight
and sets the dice and they hassel him.
Since dice setting helps a casino ,then, i have to assume it is the claims on the forums, the books
or the classes that affect a casino.
So as i said, i am not going to be part of that. Iam not saying it works or it does not work, i am
saying i am no longer going to add to the nonsense. I am just going back to playing, I dont
have to prove anything to anyone.
Dicesetter
If you can arrive at the conclusion that the majority of people who take too long to set the dice are accomplishing nothing, it might help you understand how the pit feels on the subject.
Just keep the dice moving and hit the back wall and no problems.
Quote: MrVHypothetically, both dice would have to land absolutely squarely, absolutely perfectly, on what you call "their edges" to remain "on axis."
From my simulations there is a small window in the amount of degrees that you can be off and still see results. For example when the dice hit the table with a forward velocity. If you can't get the dice to land flat then it's better for the dice to be slightly on their heels than any amount on their toes. A visual would be one of an airplane landing.
But as I've always said a true DI can set and throw his dice faster than a random roller shakes them in his hand.
Quote:But as I've always said a true DI can set and throw his dice faster than a random roller shakes them in his hand.
Not just "a true DI."
ANYONE can learn to quickly read, then set the dice very quickly.
That isn't the problem.
Have you seen anyone trying to take advantage of the casino's laxity in repeatedly trying to throw soft and short?
Quote: MrV
Have you seen anyone trying to take advantage of the casino's laxity in repeatedly trying to throw soft and short?
This is an interesting question. First it appears that the definition of "short" has changed. I always thpught the dice must hit the wall. Now several casinos accept a throw that gets to near the wall but doesn't actually have to hit the wall. And I have not played with someone who I would consider to be a DI who took advantage of this.
I still make my dice hit the back wall even with a soft throw.
It would be interesting if the "back wall must be hit rule" would be enforced if a true DI with a controlled throw were winning money. I don't see anyone making significant money at craps lately which is why I don't think the casinos are sweating DI.
