Parley the hardway for 2 wins vs. $5.00 firebet hedging.

As most of you know, I am committed to hedging the 5th point on the firebet (Lay$750 to win $500 from both sides of the coin)

I was experimenting this past weekend with the Hard 6 & Hard 8 Bets and discovered the possibilities.

1) If I play $5.00 on hard six as opposed to my usual $5.00 firebet and Parley for 2 wins, pays me $500 Return from my initial $5.00 Hard 6 wager.

2) If I hedge the 5th point to the firebet for $750/lay, wins me $500 if 7 out or $500 if point is made ($1250 - $750/lay)
(But I have to wait for the 5th number opportunity to happen before I can wager)

I do find it a heck of a lot easier to cash in on two hard sixes to win the same amount of money.

I've won only once this past weekend, hitting a hard six parley, but also wagered $5.00 at least 20 times on the firebet with "0" return.

I'm beginning to convince myself that playing the hard 6 along with my regular Place6 bet is a much better way of playing craps.

I've also created a wincraps file to "run sims" I will post later.

So here is my new strategy I put together:

6/hard6
1) Start with $12/Place6 and $5/hard6.
2) a) When 6 gets rolled, Drop $4.00 and tell dealer to press to $30/Place6
b) If hard 6 gets rolled, tell the dealer to parley to $50/Hard6.
3) Same bet any future wins.
a) each Place6 wins $35
b) each Hard6 win pays $450

You can also incorporate the 6/8 together

6/8 & Hard6/Hard8
1) Start with $12each on Place6/Place8 & $1each on Hard6/Hard8
2) a) When 6 or 8 gets rolled, Drop $4.00 and tell dealer to press to $30/Place6 or Place8.
b) If hard 6 or hard 8 gets rolled, tell the dealer to split the winnings and press to $5/Hard6 and $5/Hard8.
3) Same bet any future wins on the place numbers once they are both at $30.
4) Parley each hardway to $50 when they win & same bet thereafter.

(I do understand the house advantage is also high on these bets, but after playing them and winning, I may actually give up on playing the firebet altogether)

All a huge colossal waste of time. You'll never overcome the house edge, hedging or not hedging, doesn't matter

Absolutely brilliant!!

That's funny, so you won't make a hedge bet until you actually have a chance of getting the 5th point and winning 250-1??? lol!

I think there is a case to be made that your "hedging" on the fire bet is acceptable arbitrage, the fault only being that you make the fire bet in the first place. But this last idea is pure hedging and really gets a thumbs down with me.

Genuis - Let me make sure I understand, your primary craps bet strategy is the fire bet with a hedging strategy, but now you are looking at adding a hard way/parley strategy to your betting arsenal? If this is the way you play to have fun, great!

But, if this is something you really think will make you more money than you lose, not a chance! The HE is way to great on both those bets to fall on the positive side of expectation, even for a relatively short term. Even if you had a small edge as a DI (which I'm skeptical about to begin with), you woudn't have enought control to overcome such a big HE. I'm starting to think you are just posting non-sensical strategies to get a rise out of members of this site.

sonic the hedgehog should be your name...

the only hedge i do occasionally (when i shoot as a comeout-- im a DP player) and its just a 1 and done thing per session if at all is:

320 no 10 or 4
48 place 6 working
48 place 8 working

I am low limit though so it hurts when the 10 or 4 (whichever i have) becomes the point lol. i think I am probably + on the play though overall.

Quote: MidwestAP

Genuis - Let me make sure I understand, your primary craps bet strategy is the fire bet with a hedging strategy, but now you are looking at adding a hard way/parley strategy to your betting arsenal? If this is the way you play to have fun, great!

But, if this is something you really think will make you more money than you lose, not a chance! The HE is way to great on both those bets to fall on the positive side of expectation, even for a relatively short term. Even if you had a small edge as a DI (which I'm skeptical about to begin with), you woudn't have enought control to overcome such a big HE. I'm starting to think you are just posting non-sensical strategies to get a rise out of members of this site.

Sorry for misunderstanding. I experiment with strategies but then always look for improvement.

I also did notice that I incorporate my posts as using all these strategies together, but the truth is I steer myself away from previous strategies to the new ones.

If I choose to play 6/8 with Hard6/hard8, thats all I play. I put aside the firebet.

I tend to follow more trends than any other type of betting. I bet trends much more than hedging the fire.
Example: If I notice a shooter rolls many "Yo" elevens every time he shoots the dice, I will bet "Yo" eleven every time on that shooter.
another example: If Bob69.5 is rolling 6's, 9's & 5's then I bet those numbers every time he shoots.

Just recently I've noticed that the Hard 6 comes in streaks of two many times from random shooters. If I parley $5 on a hard 6 for two wins gives me a profit of $500.00 as opposed to hedging a $750/Lay against the 5th number firebet wager. (Very rare maybe 2 times a month to win $500 profit)

My mind constantly looks for the best bet in craps using dice influencing, along with how much can I win with very little on the table at risk and best payoffs.

I blame WinCraps software for this.

The reason why I post is to get feedback from other members but also keeping in mind I've tried all these strategies and came out ahead with 100% of them.
Even though they do work at the live tables, I still hunger for improving and trying other possibilities to satisfy my craps experience.

If you press/parlay bets, you're going to win big on occasion and lose it the rest of the time. I see it firsthand dealing craps - people bet a $5 hard 6/8 and parlay it to $50. Most of the time they end up losing the whole thing. That said, it's a neat way to turn $5 into $500 and it looks cool - when it hits.

As a rule, aggressive players get killed a lot.

Quote: hwccdealer

If you press/parlay bets, you're going to win big on occasion and lose it the rest of the time. I see it firsthand dealing craps - people bet a $5 hard 6/8 and parlay it to $50. Most of the time they end up losing the whole thing. That said, it's a neat way to turn $5 into $500 and it looks cool - when it hits.

As a rule, aggressive players get killed a lot.

I can totally see this because yesterday morning when I went to visit the craps table, I've noticed the hard 6's being rolled but none repeated in that 45 minutes i was there.

I don't take into consideration how many $50/Hard6 parleys actually lose. I only see it as a $5.00 wager in my part when I bet the hard6.

However I did notice the Hard4 came in two times before 7 was rolled and would have made for a good parley but that is another story I do not wish to tell.

Quote: CrapsGenious

I can totally see this because yesterday morning when I went to visit the craps table, I've noticed the hard 6's being rolled but none repeated in that 45 minutes i was there.

I don't take into consideration how many $50/Hard6 parleys actually lose. I only see it as a $5.00 wager in my part when I bet the hard6.

However I did notice the Hard4 came in two times before 7 was rolled and would have made for a good parley but that is another story I do not wish to tell.

how about bet the hard 6/8 for $5, instead of parlaying it for $50 just bet $40. That way you will make up for some of the times when it only hits once.

Quote: GWAE

how about bet the hard 6/8 for $5, instead of parlaying it for $50 just bet $40. That way you will make up for some of the times when it only hits once.

not really worth pulling back some if you're making on the place 6/8 bets also.

But you are correct, it's only a natural play to pull back some after a win if playing just the hard ways.

I saw a guy at Harrington casino in Delaware press Hardways like crazy. He went up over 5k in about 2 hours. He then proceeded to get loud and drunk and was escorted out after giving back all but 500.