Blackjack Rules Posted at Table

I have noticed that most blackjack tables do not have the rules posted at the table. For example, they do not say how many times you can split, or if aces can be resplit, or what cards you can double down on or if you can surrender or not... They do say if the dealer must hit on soft 17 or how much a blackjack pays.

A few casinos have the rules posted on a big board at one side of the pit.

Why is there no rule requirement about this? Can a casino change it's rules in the middle of a game? Player by player? Day by day?

I agree it seems only fair to post the rules.

Why doesn't the Gaming Control Board require that ? ? ?

Here in MN, the rules are posted at every table. It's kind of ironic, since we only have Indian casinos and they're only barely sort of half-assedly regulated. I agree that the lack of posted rules is strange and crappy in other places, especially places that actually do have State regulated gaming.

Quote: rdw4potus

Here in MN, the rules are posted at every table. It's kind of ironic, since we only have Indian casinos and they're only barely sort of half-assedly regulated. I agree that the lack of posted rules is strange and crappy in other places, especially places that actually do have State regulated gaming.

Minnesota has card clubs as well at horse tracks that have blackjack as well as some carnival games. I don't recall ever seeing the rules posted at the table though at Canterbury or Running Aces but it has been a while.

I did a BJ survey in Las Vegas a few months ago. I cannot think of too many standard blackjack games that posted all rules. Some might say "No double after splitting" on DD, or "Blackjack pays 6-5" on single deck on placards, but the only positive rule I ever saw posted was at some CET properties that would say "Surrender allowed" but did not show whether you could RSA or DAS. At 90%+ of the tables, I had to ask the dealer what the rules were.

They like to make you ask, the more you know about the game, the more scrutiny they will focus in your direction.
Figure it out for yourself, but do not go up and say
Hey can I double any two cards, double after split, split to four, resplit aces, and surrender after peek?

Quote: WongBo

Figure it out for yourself, but do not go up and say Hey can I double any two cards, double after split, split to four, resplit aces, and surrender after peek?

Now you tell me. I do that all the time. No longer my card-counting career was so short.

Quote: Pokeraddict

Minnesota has card clubs as well at horse tracks that have blackjack as well as some carnival games. I don't recall ever seeing the rules posted at the table though at Canterbury or Running Aces but it has been a while.

I've never actually played BJ at either of the card clubs. Neither has surrender, but Mystic Lake does. Both hit soft 17, but Prairie's Edge stands. I do play carnival games at both places, especially when the progressive jackpots are +EV.

Next time I go to Mystic, I'll pop in at Canterbury to see if their rules are posted on the tables.

Quote: WongBo

They like to make you ask, the more you know about the game, the more scrutiny they will focus in your direction.
Figure it out for yourself, but do not go up and say
Hey can I double any two cards, double after split, split to four, resplit aces, and surrender after peek?

When I did my survey, the client just wanted the rules. They had no concern about deck penetration, speed, or anything else that would have required me to play. Regardless, that info is useless if there are more than a couple of dealers that work there.

I would find dealers that were idle, ask them a few questions, watch a few other tables, ask another dealer to make sure the first dealer was right, and once I felt like I had the rules correct I would leave. If there was a conflict, I would just ask a suit. I seriously doubt asking a suit "Do any of your tables have surrender?" is going to arouse any suspicion. If it does, then you are playing somewhere that is going to sweat your action anyway.

I feel sure dealers get asked those types of questions all the time. Not every casino player is a drooler.

I was just kidding around but making the point that it's better to fly under the radar.
I agree it's best to just ask a rule here or there from players or dealers.
It doesn't take a genius to figure out who the basic strat and advantage players are anyway.
I agree they should just post the rules, especially since they will often have different rules by minimum or number of decks.

Quote: WongBo

I was just kidding around but making the point that it's better to fly under the radar.
I agree it's best to just ask a rule here or there from players or dealers.
It doesn't take a genius to figure out who the basic strat and advantage players are anyway.
I agree they should just post the rules, especially since they will often have different rules by minimum or number of decks.

I don't know about other cities, but in Las Vegas, two tables next to each other can have different rules, even if they have the same number of decks. Bigger casinos like Aria and Bellagio will have different rules on the floor for their middle limit games (S17), than their lower limits (H17). Some casinos will use CSMs on their lower minimum games with hand shuffle on the higher minimum games. Some will have CSMs and hand shuffle games next to each other with exact same rules, decks and minimums. Then you have CET properties that will have a few 3-2 shoe games scattered among their 6-5 shoe games. I certainly learned a lot.

One of the things I noticed on my trip this past weekend is how difficult it was to read the actual rules that are posted, specifically on BJ paying 3-2 or 6-5. The "World's Most Liberal Blackjack" game at the Plaza was even worse -- I had forgotten the trick I read about elsewhere here (suited BJ 2-1, all others 1-1), and I couldn't read the type on the sign until I was nearly on top of it. There's also no consistency on where the info is displayed -- the felt, the limits sign, another placard to the side, tattooed on the dealer's neck, I saw them all. (OK, maybe not the last one... those were players.)
I guess if it's displayed, no matter where on the table, it's up to the player to figure it out. It just seems kinda shady to make it as difficult as possible, which seemed par for the course everywhere I looked...

'Brian

For what it's worth the jurisdictions I'm familiar with require the casino to provide you a copy of their policies and procedures for any table game on request. Really I just think we're the minority. I doubt the majority of players really care whether DAS and RSA are available. As for surrender, I've seen a lot of players freak out because someone surrendered their hand; they hate it.

Allow me to go off on a tangent about surrender. I think late surrender is one of the best rules a casino can offer from the casino's perspective. It has two massive benefits:

1. Your average player who surrenders will often do so incorrectly. This will either nullify the advantage LS gives or actually make the edge higher depending on how bad the player is.

2. "Hmm, did that guy just surrender a 14 vs 10? He doesn't look stupid...wow, he has a big bet out there compared to earlier...and hey, he's not drinking a cocktail either. Time to call surveillance." Late surrender: Designed to catch card counters.