Questions about Scavenger Blackjack

FYI: Scavenger Blackjack - opting to double down/split/buy a hand, etc. for a player when they have the advantage but are either out of money to do so themselves or too risk averse at the moment.

Chart for positive actions after a dealt hand: https://wizardofodds.com/blackjack/appendix1.html

First, I've done this many times at a local casino, but of course you must hand the player chips and they must put them down and play out the hand. So, at least here (Colorado) I guess it's legal. Frowned upon by the casino? Maybe, but who cares. Note: I've never actually "bought" a hand as I think that would really be frowned upon (probably illegal here anyways), but maybe that is somewhat more common in Vegas??

I'm visiting Vegas in a few days, and my thought would be to hit a couple of the amateur casinos such as Casino Royale where many players are unaware about all aspects of the game and are therefore more likely to allow me to double and split for them.

Here are my main questions?

1) Is this legal in Vegas - to ask a player and then hand him/her my chips and they put it down?
2) Is this side betting? What exactly is side betting and is it legal in Vegas?
3) Assuming everything is legal about asking players to do this & even buying hands, why aren't more pros doing this? Why waste hundreds of hours with count strategies when this could be much more effective (5%+ hands!)

Thanks in advance for any insight!

Quote: playpianoking

1) Is this legal in Vegas - to ask a player and then hand him/her my chips and they put it down?
2) Is this side betting? What exactly is side betting and is it legal in Vegas?
3) Assuming everything is legal about asking players to do this & even buying hands, why aren't more pros doing this? Why waste hundreds of hours with count strategies when this could be much more effective (5%+ hands!)

1. It would definitely be legal. The better question is, would it violate any house rules. Here in Vegas, I don't think so. Once at the Venetian another player was scolding me for surrendering, saying it was a sucker move, so I sold him those hands instead for half of face value. The Venetian didn't mind, but I still had to make the hand signals. I think any casino would be the same, they will have nothing to do with the deal, and you'll have to tell the other player what you want him to do.

2. I wouldn't call that side betting. An example of side betting might be whether the dealer's up card is red or black. I've done that, and the dealer didn't mind. They might not like it if you offered to book a side bet on the table, like Royal Match, to other players. Many times I've wagered on whether the cocktail waitress would know the answer to a trivia question, and the dealer's often enjoyed it.

3. Most recreational players don't seem interested in doing this. They probably think they are being tricked. I have heard of this happening more in video poker, in particular offering to buy somebody's hand if they have four to a royal on the deal.

Thank you for replying Wizard. I think that you are partially right about the amateur - if they are a complete newbie then they might think that they are being tricked because it seems out of the ordinary. However, at my local casino, there are a lot of intermediate players who do know some basic strategy, but not things such as splitting 33 on a 6. Especially if we've been at the table at least ten minutes and we get a 'friendly table atmosphere' going, it's never a problem at least asking about some situations if it looks like they are about to make an unfavorable play.

I could definitely fathom buying somebody's 4 to a big hand in video poker, as they want to take a deal and guaranteed win at that point. But since deals are on the side, I would be more worried in this situation that if it actually did hit then they would argue that it was their win i.e. only complain when it really does hit.

Anyways, thank you for the input. If anyone else has experience with buying hands, etc. I'd love to hear examples.

You're welcome. Not that you asked, but before considering any lower pays, the pair price to pay for a 4 to the royal hand would be 17x the bet amount. With the lower pays it would be about 18.5x, and 19.7x with TJQK (straight flush draw too). I'd offer 10x-15x, depending on how generous you're feeling.

If you do make that deal, I would insist on pressing the draw button. I think the casino will pay whoever hit it, regardless of who made the bet or pressed the deal button. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong.

Anyone else have any good experiences with scavenger blackjack? Seems like a very promising 'system.' I'll be heading to Vegas on January 11th-14th I'll post results when I get back.

I was at Red Rock playing $15 double deck. A guy walked up and just watched the game. When the count was good, he'd ask one of the players if he could bet on his hand, double down etc. No problems from the floor, probably because he lost about $300.

Quote: johann528

I was at Red Rock playing $15 double deck. A guy walked up and just watched the game. When the count was good, he'd ask one of the players if he could bet on his hand, double down etc. No problems from the floor, probably because he lost about $300.

The redrock doesn't seem to care about counting. I once sat down with a piece and paper to play a betting system that required I track the wins and losses. I asked permission before I did so, and explained that I was not going to use it for counting. To this the dealer replied "it's fine; it wouldn't matter if you were counting".

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