Question about Norm (qfit)

Quote: Wizard

Quote: aceside

I told you before. Casinos cheat often. One2Six is the main cheating device.
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I'm all ears to evidence.
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I just believe a casino can instal a remotely controlled device inside of a One2Six machine to change the shuffle algorithm toward its own favor anytime, since the shuffler can read the cards and record their order instantaneously. I heard some people mentioned the term, beast mode. That might be it.

That's so stupid I can't even tell if you're serious and genuine aboit that. But I suspect that you are.

A bunch of paranoid losing players believing "beast mode" switch is roughly the equivalent of insisting that the earth is flat.

Regardless, even if some dude could flip a switch somewhere else then that would be the guy who knows about it. Plus the people at one2six who supposedly incorporated that feature on their machines in the first place (which somehow passed inspections and are approved for play in the various places in the U.S. or whatever country). So that would be multiple people who know about this.... Even in the bizarre and pointless hypothetical that nobody on the actual property knew their own machines were cheating. But,.overall, It is impossible to rig or cheat without SOMEBODY knowing about it somewhere.

Quote: Sidecount

That's so stupid I can't even tell if you're serious and genuine aboit that. But I suspect that you are.

A bunch of paranoid losing players believing "beast mode" switch is roughly the equivalent of insisting that the earth is flat.

Regardless, even if some dude could flip a switch somewhere else then that would be the guy who knows about it. Plus the people at one2six who supposedly incorporated that feature on their machines in the first place (which somehow passed inspections and are approved for play in the various places in the U.S. or whatever country). So that would be multiple people who know about this.... Even in the bizarre and pointless hypothetical that nobody on the actual property knew their own machines were cheating. But,.overall, It is impossible to rig or cheat without SOMEBODY knowing about it somewhere.
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The shufflers are very vulnerable and as of this point. A video I posted showed proof that the shuffler could be hacked very easily by the usb port attached to the machines. These people didn’t exploit anything but they showed it was very very easy to essentially reprogram and gain access to internal components. Once again they didn’t do what they could have done, they just showed how easy it was.

Perhaps you should report this to the various gaming agencies of the different states. Seems you know more about such machines and how they work than they do.

Here's a simple solution. If you think something is vulnerable to cheating and you think it's happening.

DON"T PLAY IT. If you don’t think it's happening then by all means have at it.

Yes but that isn't the point Axel, if they are cheating the world needs to know about it.

Hey, I love crusaders who are keeping people and businesses in check. I can only imagine how bad things would be without them.

If that's your thing. great! Present your evidence.

Quote: AxelWolf

If that's your thing. great! Present your evidence.

Evidence, "I don't have any evidence but I know they are cheating". lol

Quote: DRich

Quote: AxelWolf

If that's your thing. great! Present your evidence.

Evidence, "I don't have any evidence but I know they are cheating". lol
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STOP, HANDPALM!!! I don't always have 100% Evidence but I'm very certain I'm being cheated.

Quote: Sidecount

That's so stupid I can't even tell if you're serious and genuine aboit that. But I suspect that you are.

A bunch of paranoid losing players believing "beast mode" switch is roughly the equivalent of insisting that the earth is flat.

Regardless, even if some dude could flip a switch somewhere else then that would be the guy who knows about it. Plus the people at one2six who supposedly incorporated that feature on their machines in the first place (which somehow passed inspections and are approved for play in the various places in the U.S. or whatever country). So that would be multiple people who know about this.... Even in the bizarre and pointless hypothetical that nobody on the actual property knew their own machines were cheating. But,.overall, It is impossible to rig or cheat without SOMEBODY knowing about it somewhere.
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You are doing that thing establishment types love to do and concocting a ridiculous and far-fetched conspiracy theory so it sounds absurd. A lot of conspiracy theories are far-fetched and absurd: some are not and have happened with verification. Ask Enron, Madoff or Nikola investors.

Scientifically speaking the correct approach is simply to say "we do not have evidence of that". Scoffing at people and trying to humiliate them isn't scientific and is only likely to entrench people's belief something is going on and is being covered up.

Any cheating likely wouldn't work the way you describe in practice if such a thing did in fact exist. It would be something like an engineer decided to make it so that the nth sequence isn't shuffled properly - something exploitable that would be used for cheating or advantage play that could be passed on subtly with a great deal of plausible deniability. It would be an alignment of interests rather than a formal conspiracy with a paper trail.

That said there's not much to discuss here till someone presents some kind of evidence.

Quote: Sidecount

Perhaps you should report this to the various gaming agencies of the different states. Seems you know more about such machines and how they work than they do.
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and reference which statute? tell me where it defines an entire casino cheating... in any jurisdiction

This is a bit off-topic, but we WoO recently got a one-star review on Trust Pilot over our allegedly cheating blackjack and baccarat games. Here is the review.

Quote: TL

Practice craps and baccarat software is GAFFED. I have had results far beyond any mathematical possibility consistently. The pattern is similar most every time I play long haul. Initial normalcy, then a barrage of losses with a win sprinkled in here and there. 90 percent losses after a while. It takes a while for the software to figure out what you are doing, them BAM, the losses begin. The only reasons that makes sense, is Shakelturd dislikes people who use VPN's, so he can't track them. This is intentional to torture those who do not conform. I have had 2 or 3 wins out of dozens of field bets, and 80 to 90 percent losses playing systems on baccarat. Perhaps he is a shill for the casinos and wants to discourage system players in to believing systems loose? Di-spite what you hear from the suckers, system players are hated by casinos, because the can a do win more than random betting, particularly when implemented by smart savvy gamblers that know how to manage there money. I can only guess as to his disturbed reasoning. but my consistent results like this over many many hours of play on his site cannot be disputed. What Shakelturd doesn't understand, is that he is messing with peoples livelihood, when they get reamed and assume he is on the square. This guy has no integrity, decency or honor. Pure POS. Also, apparently the contact information process is gaffed as well. After several attempts to contact him to give him a piece of my mind, I found this to be impossible. Message repeats to complete security captcha before sending the message, even though it is correct. Likely another brush off because of the VPN, or the fact that he doesn't want any more negative input from those who figured out what he is doing. Personally, I would not have anything to do with anything this guy does or recommends. Now that I think about it, with no VPN he knows who you are, and being in bed with so many online casinos, this is likely how he gets kick backs when you click a link to one and loose money. No VPN? You will likely win. VPN? You get tortured. Screw this guy.

It just goes to show that the general public perceives cheating in fair games often. I have received similar messages many times. We have absolutely nothing to gain by making demo games cheat.

Quote: DRich

Quote: AxelWolf

If that's your thing. great! Present your evidence.

Evidence, "I don't have any evidence but I know they are cheating". lol
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Unfortunately, I have been in situations where I knew I had been cheated, but I only had enough evidence to convince myself and others involved.

The cheating situations I am talking about normally involve promotions, drawings, or offshore online situations.

I have seen multiple (regulated gaming jurisdiction places in Las Vegas)drawing ticket palming/discarding situations that affected me.

I caught a bartender red-handed palming tickets.

It was obvious at a major casino(The Rio) that they tossed my winning ticket back in the drum and claimed it to be illegible. People saw it was mine as I clearly had it stamped. Before they tossed it back in the drum we pleaded for them to show the ticket, but they refused and tossed it back in. That was 20k early in my career, so that hurt.

I have even been the recipient of a biased drawing in my favor. I didn't conspire or ask for it, I just tipped very well, had a good relationship with the girls, and kept on winning when it was obvious I shouldn't have. You know the place.

Besides the insults, is he wrong? I don't think so.

Quote: AxelWolf

The cheating situations I am talking about normally involve promotions, drawings, or offshore online situations.
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A while back, 10-20 years, the Venetian was caught rigging a drawing ticket promotion. As I recall, they palmed a ticket and produced it as a winner. I was told by a director of table games of a major Vegas casino, who shall remain nameless, that "We all do that. It was just the Venetian who got caught."

Quote: AxelWolf

I caught a bartender red-handed palming tickets.

I was once in a drawing for a chain of bars where I was very close with a few of the managers. The top prize was $5000 I think. I mentioned to the managers that if I happen to win it I will take three of them to the Fiesta Bowl. I won. I don't know that it was fixed, but I think it probably was.

Hi,

The issue with all of you is :
1) You have 99% claims of people about cheating which are false cause those peoples are not experimented and they have a lot of stupid theories.
2) you have never seen or collected evidences of cheating cause : you didn’t visit enough casinos in your life, you don’t spend enough time at the table etc …

My friend recorded hundreds of hours of suspicious blackjack tables outside the US.
He has scientific evidences that it exists.

Yes directors where it’s happening know about it and even can tell you in your face for some of them. They will tell you laughing at you “you cannot prove it anyway”

My friend wrote to game commission to try to meet them face to face to provide evidences. They didn’t wish to meet him. Because casino world in a big corrupted world where a lot of time even regulators are on the side of casinos

The only option, I guess, would be to make a long and tiring lawsuit directly against the casino with not 100% chance of success.

I’ve seen casinos cheating with shuffle machine in 2 situations :
- increase profits especially in casinos where they don’t make enough profits
- to make AP leaves their casino

Why one2six and others brand of shufflers are equiped of card reader ? Why would it be necessary ? So why casino like those shufflers so much ? I guess to have 100% control of the situation.

Those shufflers shouldn’t be allowed to be equiped with cards recognition. The excuse that they need that to make sure the number of cards are complete in the csm is not enough.

I think I saw a comment in this thread where someone said that even if you could prove it they could still say that it was malfunction. That is a very smart comment and I thought about it. I think it’s possible that they could cover themselves this way. And I have an exemple to illustrate that :

In one casino few years ago where my friend and I suspected an obvious cheating one2six, I asked kindly to the manager if I could take a paper from roulette and write for all day long (almost 10h) , every single card coming out of the csm.
The manager accepted cause he is very friendly and we have known each other for long time.
The next day this machine was on the side replaced by a new one on the table. I asked to the dealer why is that, he said the machine doesn’t work and need service. I said the machine was working perfectly when I left the casino last night.

The nice manager admitted to me then that the director freaked out seeing me writing cards the previous night.
The new machine installed seemed much better of course

Quote: Wizard

It just goes to show that the general public perceives cheating in fair games often. I have received similar messages many times. We have absolutely nothing to gain by making demo games cheat.
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Actually you would have considerable incentive to make your demo games cheat, but ironically it would be in the opposite direction to what the complainant is accusing you of.

If you rigged your demo games so that the player had a positive expectation you'd get more people signing up through your affiliate links and losing their shirts, which you'd get a cut of. Everyone testing their trending/progression system would see it winning piles of practice money and want to do it for real.

In fact I wouldn't be surprised if less scrupulous affiliate sites did that. Sometimes I wish I was a committed sociopath so I could get richer doing stuff like that.

Quote: Jean26

Hi,

The issue with all of you is :
1) You have 99% claims of people about cheating which are false cause those peoples are not experimented and they have a lot of stupid theories.
2) you have never seen or collected evidences of cheating cause : you didn’t visit enough casinos in your life, you don’t spend enough time at the table etc …

My friend recorded hundreds of hours of suspicious blackjack tables outside the US.
He has scientific evidences that it exists.

Yes directors where it’s happening know about it and even can tell you in your face for some of them. They will tell you laughing at you “you cannot prove it anyway”

My friend wrote to game commission to try to meet them face to face to provide evidences. They didn’t wish to meet him. Because casino world in a big corrupted world where a lot of time even regulators are on the side of casinos

The only option, I guess, would be to make a long and tiring lawsuit directly against the casino with not 100% chance of success.

I’ve seen casinos cheating with shuffle machine in 2 situations :
- increase profits especially in casinos where they don’t make enough profits
- to make AP leaves their casino

Why one2six and others brand of shufflers are equiped of card reader ? Why would it be necessary ? So why casino like those shufflers so much ? I guess to have 100% control of the situation.

Those shufflers shouldn’t be allowed to be equiped with cards recognition. The excuse that they need that to make sure the number of cards are complete in the csm is not enough.

I think I saw a comment in this thread where someone said that even if you could prove it they could still say that it was malfunction. That is a very smart comment and I thought about it. I think it’s possible that they could cover themselves this way. And I have an exemple to illustrate that :

In one casino few years ago where my friend and I suspected an obvious cheating one2six, I asked kindly to the manager if I could take a paper from roulette and write for all day long (almost 10h) , every single card coming out of the csm.
The manager accepted cause he is very friendly and we have known each other for long time.
The next day this machine was on the side replaced by a new one on the table. I asked to the dealer why is that, he said the machine doesn’t work and need service. I said the machine was working perfectly when I left the casino last night.

The nice manager admitted to me then that the director freaked out seeing me writing cards the previous night.
The new machine installed seemed much better of course
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Casinos are allowed to use shufflers to increase profit that’s not illegal

outside the US - not that all places outside of the us are unfair

And aren’t all the games on this website made in JavaScript?

Quote: AxelWolf

I have even been the recipient of a biased drawing in my favor. I didn't conspire or ask for it, I just tipped very well, had a good relationship with the girls, and kept on winning when it was obvious I shouldn't have. You know the place.

Bunny Ranch?

Quote: Wizard

This is a bit off-topic, but we WoO recently got a one-star review on Trust Pilot over our allegedly cheating blackjack and baccarat games. Here is the review.

Quote: TL

...This guy has no integrity, decency or honor. Pure POS .... Screw this guy.

It just goes to show that the general public perceives cheating in fair games often. I have received similar messages many times. We have absolutely nothing to gain by making demo games cheat.
link to original post

pretty rough and hard to take, but in a way his [not admirable] style of reviewing can be entertaining

Quote: at least he didn't say this to you, from a totally different review, different outfit

Lie straight to my face and bend me over like a jailhouse punk.

https://www.trustpilot.com/users/633f06246c9655001285dcd5

Quote: heatmap

outside the US - not that all places outside of the us are unfair

I've noticed that US gamblers tend to think casinos outside the US are as crooked as people outside the US think US casinos are.

Quote: Archvaldor1

Quote: heatmap

outside the US - not that all places outside of the us are unfair

I've noticed that US gamblers tend to think casinos outside the US are as crooked as people outside the US think US casinos are.
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im all about the regulations. based on your viewpoint and which side your on, casino or player, less or more regulations are either good or bad.

some regulations work against the player, as in when we have bad blackjack rules.

I live in a state where the gaming control apparently is player centric, and allows us to have some of the best blackjack rules, codified in our laws, in the country.