Surrender ?
June 4th, 2024 at 7:46:04 PM
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I have been curious over the years about an alternate surrnder.
Surrender Hard 16 any # of cards b/4 DD.
Whats this worth 6D H17 DA2 DAS SP4 SPA4 ?
I see here that regular Surr. is worth 0.08%. This one should be at least the same. No?
NSF21
Surrender Hard 16 any # of cards b/4 DD.
Whats this worth 6D H17 DA2 DAS SP4 SPA4 ?
I see here that regular Surr. is worth 0.08%. This one should be at least the same. No?
NSF21
June 5th, 2024 at 3:22:51 AM
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Have you tried calculating the probability of a 2-card hard-16 versus a hard-16 with 3 or more cards? If the probability for 3+ cards is less than for 2 cards, then the EV gain will be less. The tricky part of this calculation is handling aces properly. You will be standing with A8, A9, and AT equivalents, so 26A7 is not a valid sequence but 267A is a reachable hard 16.Quote: NotSoFun21I have been curious over the years about an alternate surrnder.
Surrender Hard 16 any # of cards b/4 DD.
Whats this worth 6D H17 DA2 DAS SP4 SPA4 ?
I see here that regular Surr. is worth 0.08%. This one should be at least the same. No?
NSF21
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The infinite-deck calculation ignoring the order of Aces in the hand should not be that hard.
Gambling is a math contest where the score is tracked in dollars. Try not to get a negative score.
June 5th, 2024 at 8:16:20 AM
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I haven’t understood this question well, but the probabilities of a 2-card 16 and a 3 or more-card 16 are about the same.
June 5th, 2024 at 10:53:57 AM
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I wasn't aware of that fact, but it seems to be pretty accurate. I counted the number of hard 15s and hard 16s dealt from 8 decks with one ten removed. I ignored hands that hit soft totals of 19, 20, or 21 before getting to hard 15 or 16.Quote: acesideI haven’t understood this question well, but the probabilities of a 2-card 16 and a 3 or more-card 16 are about the same.
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For hard 16, about 49% are two card hands.
For hard 15, about 55% are two card hands.
In a billion hands, I did not see a single 9-card hard 15 or 16 total. It is unlikely to see this many cards and not have a soft 19+ to stand on first.
Gambling is a math contest where the score is tracked in dollars. Try not to get a negative score.
June 5th, 2024 at 11:33:04 AM
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But is this rule that you can only surrender a 16 (of any number of cards)? So you lose the ability to surrender a 15 into a dealer T?
The race is not always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong; but that is the way to bet.
June 5th, 2024 at 11:42:39 AM
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I don't know the answer to that, but OP only mentions hard 16. Normally, you surrender 16 to [9, T, J,Q, K, A] and 15 to [T, J, Q, K]. Surrender any hard 16 would only get you roughly 6/10ths of the EV gain that the normal two-card surrender rules gain you.Quote: unJonBut is this rule that you can only surrender a 16 (of any number of cards)? So you lose the ability to surrender a 15 into a dealer T?
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And you seem to raise the possibility that even 2-card hard totals of 15 cannot be surrendered. That would offset most of the EV gain.
What does OP say?
Gambling is a math contest where the score is tracked in dollars. Try not to get a negative score.
June 5th, 2024 at 2:20:37 PM
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The OP says
if it is not hard 16, you cannot surrender... only hard 16, but any number of cards, and before a DD.
so hard 15 = no and 17 vs A = no.
I realize its a bit tricky, but my guess is 1/8% (0.125%), and surrender any hard 16 vs 9 to Ace.
See 1st post for stated conditions.
if it is not hard 16, you cannot surrender... only hard 16, but any number of cards, and before a DD.
so hard 15 = no and 17 vs A = no.
I realize its a bit tricky, but my guess is 1/8% (0.125%), and surrender any hard 16 vs 9 to Ace.
See 1st post for stated conditions.
June 5th, 2024 at 3:58:34 PM
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there is a chart on wizardofodds that tells you the EV of the deviations from basic strategy... eg if you were to surrender a 20 to a 16 obviously would be a blunder so to say
June 5th, 2024 at 4:47:26 PM
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??? explain this reply
