ChumpChange
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December 22nd, 2023 at 9:22:49 PM permalink
Mikke Mase says a dealer could burn a card on orders from the pit boss during a hot shoe.
heatmap
heatmap
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December 22nd, 2023 at 9:54:40 PM permalink
Thereís really only one way they can do that with confidence that they are correct and that itíll do damage and thatís with access to the shufflers. anything above a deck mate (deck mate 2, md3) has a screen that can be accessed which will tell the casino a general distribution of the deck and what itís going to do

Most of the state laws Iíve seen disallow the connection to the shuffler while itís in play meaning they have to physically connect a wire to the shuffler and assess the distribution like that

I do know that some of the new shufflers have remote access but once again I donít think itís legal to connect to the shuffler while it is in operation

Iím probably wrong but this is what I know as of this point and I donít feel like gathering my sources of information just take it with a grain of salt

Another thing is how the hell do they know itís not going to change the deck for an even better result for the player

Idk about this but I know Iíve seen a pro poker player named Doug Polk who owns his own poker place that he is the one who claims the casinos can and have used this screen for nefarious reasons so you can dig yourself on the exact wording he used
ChumpChange
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December 22nd, 2023 at 10:12:16 PM permalink
Player mistakes could account for a burn card here and there. If playing alone, it's hard to turn a burn card around except by splitting 10's or something.
Dieter
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December 22nd, 2023 at 10:57:14 PM permalink
I was having trouble following Mikki's story.

Can someone restate his claims more plainly?

Does the dealt order differ from the casino's privilege to replace a dealer at any time between hands, and burn a card when the dealer changes?
May the cards fall in your favor.
ChumpChange
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December 22nd, 2023 at 11:09:10 PM permalink
Dealer's are on a scheduled rotation of every 20 minutes or so, so if a shoe gets hot in 10 minutes, this video implies the pit boss can ask the dealer to burn a card or two while scooping up the discards by reaching into the shoe and catching a card or two there too. This will interrupt the "flow" of the cards as any player who had a streak of winning hands will attest when they start suddenly losing and they noticed the burn card switch. Yes, a new dealer will burn a card, and has the same effect.
Some would say it's a countermove against card counters but it's ever so slight as to be meaningless.
heatmap
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December 23rd, 2023 at 9:31:01 AM permalink
Quote: Dieter

I was having trouble following Mikki's story.

Can someone restate his claims more plainly?

Does the dealt order differ from the casino's privilege to replace a dealer at any time between hands, and burn a card when the dealer changes?
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Every BM casino Iíve been to the dealer burns a card at the beginning of the shoe when he goes on break yada yada. Online is no burn at all in PA.

I think itís legal in pa to just shuffle the deck up whenever they please. Hell I would t doubt that it isnít illegal to just burn a card whenever.

If the casino can see the screen I was speaking about they normally just do a shuffle when they know the count will be high. Not burn a card lol because thatís just like all other voodoo imo

And to restate whats happening in the video (i didnt watch the whole thing because it really doesnt make sense to me as anything other than superstition)
Quote: me


Mikki has brought on a dealer who claims that the pit boss came up to him while dealing a 6 deck shoe... the players were winning alot apparently.

The dealer was instructed to "burn a card" without the people seeing him burn a card. He did it while collecting the dead cards at the end of the round.

Last edited by: heatmap on Dec 23, 2023
Dobrij
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December 23rd, 2023 at 5:50:23 PM permalink
I think this is all at the level of superstition. What difference does it make whether the dealer burns a card(if this card is unknown) on a positive count or not?
DogHand
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December 24th, 2023 at 12:20:38 AM permalink
Quote: Dobrij

I think this is all at the level of superstition. What difference does it make whether the dealer burns a card(if this card is unknown) on a positive count or not?
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Dobrij,

Granted, all the "flow of the cards" nonsense is just that: nonsense. However, a casino burning "extra" cards is equivalent to reducing the penetration, which is detrimental to card counters.

Furthermore, if the casino does this only on high counts, the distribution of true counts skews lower, favoring the house, because the card counter will miss out on some highs count rounds due to the "early" appearance of the cut card.

In a way, burning "extra" cards only on high counts is equivalent to having a wonger wong in on your table: you see fewer high-count rounds.

As an extreme example, think of playing a game where, whenever the count is high enough at the end of a round, the casino simply burns ALL the remaining cards in the shoe: in other words, shuffles. You would get killed. This is what the infamous "Mind Play" system allowed the casinos to do.

Hope this helps!

Dog Hand
billryan
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December 24th, 2023 at 4:51:45 AM permalink
Burning a card "when everyone is winning" doesn't indicate it is a high count.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
DogHand
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December 24th, 2023 at 6:29:35 AM permalink
Quote: billryan

Burning a card "when everyone is winning" doesn't indicate it is a high count.
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billryan,

You are correct that "everyone is winning" does not imply that the count is high, but I was responding to Dobrij's question: "What difference does it make whether the dealer burns a card(if this card is unknown) on a positive count or not?"

For a Basic Strategy player, penetration is immaterial, so having the casino burn a card after each round has no effect on his EV. However, if the casino burns a card only on high-count rounds, the BS player's EV will suffer.

Dog Hand
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