Inside the Edge

Quote: darkoz

Axels belief is that the disguise or mask will bring attention. I wouldn't be card counting so even at a black level I dont know if they would care about a masked guy playing negative.

But they should be all over someone "in disguise" since they would assume something nefarious is going on.

I dont think they would ever know

I took it as a jibe against me because key part of his statement was that people in disguise full face bring attention to themselves and he has stated that about my mask many times. Perhaps I read too much into it

First of all, not every conversation about disguises is related to you. Although you can claim the title as resident expert if it makes you happy. You seem to have a complex regarding this matter. Second, I wouldn't even call your mask a disguise. That thing was more of a hilarity. When you wore that to your first Spring Fling it was obvious from the first minute that it was a mask and totally rediculous looking. If you don't believe me, I pegged it as some weirdo in a mask the minute you walked in. A couple people disagreed or thought it possible that it was not. I think if they had to assign a percentage in retrospect on the not, it would be pretty low. A total oddity if you will.
Whether or not casino personnel stop you wearing it is irrelevant. Who wants to draw attention to themself in that manner ever? Especially an AP in a casino. Maybe at a Halloween costume party but not a casino. What KC did in the movie was a real disguise.

Quote: MaxPen

First of all, not every conversation about disguises is related to you. Although you can claim the title as resident expert if it makes you happy. You seem to have a complex regarding this matter. Second, I wouldn't even call your mask a disguise. That thing was more of a hilarity. When you wore that to your first Spring Fling it was obvious from the first minute that it was a mask and totally rediculous looking. If you don't believe me, I pegged it as some weirdo in a mask the minute you walked in. A couple people disagreed or thought it possible that it was not. I think if they had to assign a percentage in retrospect on the not, it would be pretty low. A total oddity if you will.
Whether or not casino personnel stop you wearing it is irrelevant. Who wants to draw attention to themself in that manner ever? Especially an AP in a casino. Maybe at a Halloween costume party but not a casino. What KC did in the movie was a real disguise.

I got nothing against KC.

But if thats a real disguise its funny how for one hour 12 minutes we basically watch him get kicked out backed off and robbed(chips confiscated) at almost every casino he enters.

No, my friend, what he did was NOT a real disguise.

I thought it was a good movie for a general audience, which includes me when it comes to blackjack.

The graphics they used to explain things like shuffle tracking were cool and they explained these concepts very well. KC was a likeable, interesting guy. I think his dad was a great addition to the story and perhaps even stole the show.

Of course, there is enough content in the subject matter to go in a million directions. You could do a 10 part series just on Bob N and his cases.

The more involved you are with the subject, the less interesting a non-niche doc is going to be. As a poker player, a doc about poker players is about the least interesting thing I can imagine. Sure, if Phil Ivey sat down and explained advanced stuff in detail, I'd want to watch, though only a few thousand others on earth would join me. But watching a movie about people just like me, even if they are more successful or smarter, would be boring. A movie like this is about seeing a life that is very different from your own*.

Probably the best way to deliver the long form content for people who are very into the subject would have been a vlog. Though, you run into the same problem of a limited audience. 100k subs on youtube would be a massive success.

*On that note, I think it might be a poor choice of title. To the average person, skimming through 100s of options, "inside the edge" is probably a meaningless phrase. I'd have called it KC The Wiz Kid and His Million Dollar Blackjack Bus: A Good Movie That You Should Buy.

Quote: darkoz

The Biometrica guy was the biggest piecenof crap in the whole show actually

1) I am in Biometrica and I walk through WITHOUT A MASK many Biometrica casinos on a daily basis. If their software does anything its crapola

2) My mask makes his software crapola as well. Even he admitted that full facial disguises would get around that eye crap. His (and yours) assumptions about becoming obvious to a casino is bullcrap. You dont know what you are talking about. I have worn masks successfully for months at a time inside a casino actively pursuing on a daily basis.

3) Axel why dont you put your money up? I will fly out there and with my mask on and with you (or someone else you choose if you are so scared) will walk around multiple casinos gambling craps, blackjack, slots. One hour apiece. Low limits since my goal is not the gambling aspects. At least 6 different casinos including 2 within the same chain.

If not one security guy or dealer refuses my wagers you lose. If even one dealer refuses my wagers or security surrounds me, I will pay you.

Even money - $5,000 (five grand)

Would have to be sometime after the new year as my schedule is swamped but lets do this. Put up or shut up

EDIT: Even better yet, lets make it part of next years spring fling. And anyone from wov who wants to tag along thats flown in can do so

And obviously the dealer has to refuse my wager for a mask related reason. If i put my wager out at roulette too late and she pushes it back thats not a returned wager that you can claim victory. Lets not setup any stupid default situations here.

Your bet proposal is absurd. Why would anyone care about someone betting low limits... even if they looked like they were fresh off the carnival bus? They need a reason to care and look closer at the situation. So ya, I respectfully decline your one sided bet proposal, nice try tho. Even if you could come up with a better bet proposal I highly doubt it would be an even money proposition. One could get 86ed one day and return the very next day and theres a chance they wouldn't have a problem.

I don't think I have ever been simply picked out and targeted by surveillance in a casino I guess there could have been a time I dont recall, if so, it was a one off and very rare. Whenever I have had problems in a casino it has always been during something high profile, promotion, progressive or some play that's easily detected because you are required to use a card. No matter how many masks or disguises you use, if you are using a players card they have flagged there is not much you can do. If I have a reason to believe a casino is on to me, or I have been 86'ed from there would just send someone else to play if need be. Or, I wait a a while before I go back and avoid using my own players card. There have only been a few times I got caught returning, and that was only because I hit something that required ID and or a players card. They simply just re 86'ed me. I have returned to casinos after being 86'ed and even got a players card, played hit and hit jackpots without a problem. And there have been times I have been 86'ed from a casino that I had never even been to from shortly after getting a players card.

I only know from what I have heard from others and the mugshots I have seen of you in and out of your masks to go on.

Quote: AxelWolf

Your bet proposal is absurd. Why would anyone care about someone betting low limits... even if they looked like they were fresh off the carnival bus? They need a reason to care and look closer at the situation.

Axel,

This is the entire crux of your own argument (and that of the Biometrica guy in the doc)

That if an AP has been ID'd that even if he disguises his entire face with a mask, while he wont be recognized, he nonetheless will look so ridiculous (like a man in a mask) that security will be all over him.

If the look of the person is as you state ("they need a reason to care and look closer at the situation") not going to get security scrutiny THEN DEFACTO MY MASK WORKS!!!!!!!!!

To suggest that one wear a mask and then do something high limit would actually negate the bet. How would you know if the person was obaerved because he was wearing a mask or because he was observed doing high limit card counting.

I mean seriously. Is the mask I wear making me look like some burn victim thst surveillance will now watch my every move or not (apparently not from your own statement above.)

The mask is not an anti-card counting measure. In a mask, the casino doesnt go (Oh, well lets not bother that card counter cause he is wearing a mask. Duh!)

The purpose of the mask is to go inside a casino which is watching for your face. Period!!!!

Regardless of whether it makes me look like a scarred person (I disagree but everyone has their opinions) that still makes the casino unable to recognize that its me.

Get it!

I.E. it ia an effective tool.

Which contrary to Maxpen makes one hell of a disguise!!!

I do agree if players cards are flagged it is the card itself that will get you caught. The purpose of the mask then is if they have flagged your face and a card or two, to escape detection while using the other unflagged cards you may still have.

Simple!

If you missed Ka-Ching! Pokie Nation, it's free on youtube.



If you just want to see the Wizard parts go to 18:29 and 32:42 (also 1:10).

Quote: Gialmere

If you missed Ka-Ching! Pokie Nation, it's free on youtube.

If you just want to see the Wizard parts go to 18:29 and 32:42 (also 1:10).

I can sense the weakness in the wizards voice when he speaks about what manufacturers ask him to do. That is the true voice of what is really going on. The sense of hopelessness and the "why are these people who make these machines doing this to people?" (not a quote from the wiz just my interpretation of what i think hes saying)

"Inside the Edge" is part of Amazon Prime now, so if you have the delivery subscription service, you can watch it, or re-watch it as many times as you like.

I enjoyed it. The animated explanations of Basic Strategy, and shuffle / ace tracking, made it easier to understand. One question I have for KC is how he determined when it was time to walk away from a losing session.

His RFID spoof at the Hard Rock is classic. I wonder how the casinos responded to that revelation?

Just watched it.

Great movie for a black jack laymen. I can see how making it longer and more complicated would loose a general audience.

I thought it was just right on the technical stuff.

Couple of interesting points.

I enjoyed how the Dad opined that he hoped his son would find something else more meaningful in his life.

I’m surprised how mean casinos are. It seems that they should just ask the person to stop playing blackjack. When Ben Affleck got asked to stop playing BJ, they told him he could enjoy all the other games. That seems a lot more reasonable to me from a Casino perspective. If I was making that documentary, I would have made sure the audience knew the name of the dick casinos.

Did it seem like KC had a girl with him sometimes?

Finally - it highlighted how difficult the life would be.

People always use the argument as proof that someone doesn’t have a winning strategy. “If they did, they would be millionaires. They wouldn’t need to bla bla bla”. That’s not true at all. Casinos are smokey and quite frankly, kind of depressing. They are fun for a few hours, or many hours for a short period of time, but to be in there day after day would totally suck.

I think I can make a consistent ~$100/hr playing Craps, but I almost make that with my job - why would I do it in a crappy casino?

Here is another thing about short sided casinos.

With advantage players, the casino will sometimes loose money, but as the documentary points out - there are soooo few advantage players.

So I would guess that shows like inside the edge would bring traffic.

I think most would get it wrong when trying to count cards. I would think casinos would encourage card counting because it would bring more players, most of them messing up and not getting it right.

Also, psychologically, if a Casino is soooo hard against card counters, I suspect it validates to the rest of us that it is a reliable strategy. But if the Casino said outright- good luck counting your cards! That may make me trust less my ability to make it work.

Quote: slackyhacky

I think I can make a consistent ~$100/hr playing Craps, ...

I should probably know better than ask, but how?

Quote: Wizard

I should probably know better than ask, but how?

Controlled dice throwing....

jk.

If we are ever in the same room - i'll explain it. I'd love your input.
I came to a Wizard of Vegas get together a few years ago - I was late....and couldn't find you guys.

But just so I'm clear - which I haven't yet been clear - I haven't actually done it yet - because it takes a starting bankroll of $16,000 and I'm not yet in a place in life where I am willing to loose that on a theoretical situation.

However - here is my question for you. If I play a game of craps on my phone (and i think the random number generator is true), and I can start with 16,000 and get to 100K over and over - how many times reproducing that result would it take in order to say - "okay, this money management system seems to have an advantage. I'll think i'll risk my 16K"?

By the way, I think the method is similar to the method I think I read about that you used to win a craps tournament. It's better than a martingale of the don't, but uses similar elements.

I paid someone to program wincraps for me to test it on there - but it is a complicated system and we couldn't get it quit right. Also, who is that guy that continued your challenge about beating the casino and offering 10K or something? I asked him to do the challenge - but said - he would have to guarantee the system was played exactly and he responded "I don't have to guarantee shit!"

Anyway regardless any of that - my MAIN point is - being in the casino all day every day does NOT seem like a great way to live out your days - even if you are winning most of those days, and winning a good amount.

Quote: slackyhacky

I think I can make a consistent ~$100/hr playing Craps, but I almost make that with my job - why would I do it in a crappy casino?

At first I was going to say why is it always the guys who don't need money and love their jobs that have all the "winning" gambling systems?

But after reading your other post I'm going to say...

And yet you don't even have a spare $16,000 bankroll to do this.

Haha - touche!

I have no idea if it is a winning system. I'm saying that I "think" it would work based on my simulations. I"ve asked (several times on this forum actually) how many times it would take before you would believe it. Obviously, if i was SO sure it would work, I'd find $16,000.

But I would like a good answer to that question.

Take an assumption (just like we all do when we watch The Expanse, or The Orville, or Star Wars) - and that assumption is that someone defied current understanding of math - and came up with a winning system....how many times staring at 16k and ending at 100k (on a 5 dollar min table, betting a $5 pass with max odds) would you think someone would have to do this before saying....okay...I think this would work. Another question - how many rolls would it take for someone to say - "okay, this is beyond simple chance."

My whole point was not to talk about my craps playing - but to just say - even IF it worked...doing it in the casino is not a great way to make money.

Plumbers make way more than me by the way. Don't they make like $200/hr?

Quote: slackyhacky

Haha - touche!

I have no idea if it is a winning system. I'm saying that I "think" it would work based on my simulations. I"ve asked (several times on this forum actually) how many times it would take before you would believe it. Obviously, if i was SO sure it would work, I'd find $16,000.

Fair enough, I respect the fact that you admit you don't know and you are just asking questions. You seem to understand that there could(IS) be some confirmation bias going on. You're not overly assertive that something is true just based on something you've kinda observed, unlike some people we know(WMW).

As far as the rest of your questions I don't have an answer. Obviously it would take a lot less testing if you could somehow predict what you think is going to happen and that happens more frequently than it should.

I have no idea how much plumbers make, but I can't imagine I would pay him $200 an hour. I'll make my way down the street and get me a certified Home Depot immigrant.

Just saw the movie, I really enjoyed it.
I definitely agree with the above comments that it was short. It felt too short, which is the mark of a good movie, but also a sign it is simply too short.
Thumbs up. I was familiar with most of the concepts described in the movie, but I still learned a lot about how he executed it. The trip planning, the number of casinos where you can do that was surprising. I guess you just have to bet more and most tables will be viable.
I wasn't expecting them to go into hole carding, shuffle tracking and ace sequencing. One thing that left me perplexed is in the part where they explain shuffle tracking and ace sequencing. It is obviously just staged to explain the concept. But that explanation only works for that ridiculously weak shuffle they had in the video. I can't believe there's any place that shuffles like that! what am I missing?

Ok, so I know I am late to the party here, but I wasn't on this forum last year when this was discussed and only fairly recently got around to watching this documentary.

I haven't seen a documentary or movie on blackjack that I liked and thought was realistic until Inside the edge. I call what KC did, the "slash and burn" style of play. It came about in the early.mid 2000;s when new casinos and jurisdiction were exploding's here in the US. The idea was to play super aggressively at higher stakes until you are told "no more". Then just move on to the next place, the idea being there are just too many locations.

KC clearly demonstrated the problem with this approach. Technology and the databases working against you. Your history of heat, backoffs, barrings arrives at the new destination before you do, as evident by a number of very quick backoffs and 86ings (within minutes). One place, I forget where, he didn't even get in the front door. lol

In addition, this film/documentary show just what the variance of advantage blackjack play can be like. KC hit 600k, about a third of the way through his year on the road, only to lose 50%, 300k back fairly quickly. He then spent months and months recouping most of that 300k loss. I think one of the most important statements he made was that anyone who plays this game for a living and has done so for awhile, will encounter months long losing periods. Amen to that!

The final thing that was important about this film was it clearly showed just how sleazy casinos and the casino industry can be. The intimidating and rough backoffs and barrings when there is no need for that. The lying at numerous locations stating how it the law says a player has to show ID. AS Mr. Nersesian said, no where is that the law, except maybe Indian Casinos where they make their own laws. One pit woman emphatically told KC "not to argue with her, she knows the law. it is her job".

And several places refusing to cash chips which is flat out illegal, forcing KC to go to gaming for help. I can only hope when gaming showed up to help get the chips that a fine went along with that, but I doubt that occurred.

In conclusion, This film shows exactly why I don't think "slash and burn" is a valid strategy. I mean if you are just out to get what you can for 3-6 month....maybe. But anyone interested in any kind of longevity, needs to figure how to keep your play in the 'tolerated' zone.

Kudos to KC for a realistic look at 'Slash and burn' blackjack. Congrats to Mike on his appearances.

I know there are prominent people in gambling who advocate for this style of play or at least claim it makes more money in the long-term than playing with more cover and less aggressively. Munchkin and Colin Jones being the first two that come to mind. I'm not entirely comfortable with playing till a backoff or barring and think there's a middle ground between longevity and aggressive play.

The documentary was my favorite movie to reference counting in that it's not sensationalized like 21 and it doesn't push the myth that you have to be a genius to do it or that you win all the time. Really well made.

Quote: kewlj

Ok, so I know I am late to the party here, but I wasn't on this forum last year when this was discussed and only fairly recently got around to watching this documentary.

I haven't seen a documentary or movie on blackjack that I liked and thought was realistic until Inside the edge. I call what KC did, the "slash and burn" style of play. It came about in the early.mid 2000;s when new casinos and jurisdiction were exploding's here in the US. The idea was to play super aggressively at higher stakes until you are told "no more". Then just move on to the next place, the idea being there are just too many locations.

KC clearly demonstrated the problem with this approach. Technology and the databases working against you. Your history of heat, backoffs, barrings arrives at the new destination before you do, as evident by a number of very quick backoffs and 86ings (within minutes). One place, I forget where, he didn't even get in the front door. lol

In addition, this film/documentary show just what the variance of advantage blackjack play can be like. KC hit 600k, about a third of the way through his year on the road, only to lose 50%, 300k back fairly quickly. He then spent months and months recouping most of that 300k loss. I think one of the most important statements he made was that anyone who plays this game for a living and has done so for awhile, will encounter months long losing periods. Amen to that!

The final thing that was important about this film was it clearly showed just how sleazy casinos and the casino industry can be. The intimidating and rough backoffs and barrings when there is no need for that. The lying at numerous locations stating how it the law says a player has to show ID. AS Mr. Nersesian said, no where is that the law, except maybe Indian Casinos where they make their own laws. One pit woman emphatically told KC "not to argue with her, she knows the law. it is her job".

And several places refusing to cash chips which is flat out illegal, forcing KC to go to gaming for help. I can only hope when gaming showed up to help get the chips that a fine went along with that, but I doubt that occurred.

In conclusion, This film shows exactly why I don't think "slash and burn" is a valid strategy. I mean if you are just out to get what you can for 3-6 month....maybe. But anyone interested in any kind of longevity, needs to figure how to keep your play in the 'tolerated' zone.

Kudos to KC for a realistic look at 'Slash and burn' blackjack. Congrats to Mike on his appearances.

I still think the crash and burn can work for much longer than 3 to 6 months if you are willing to travel anywhere that there is a game. Too many people limit themselves to the U.S.

I just listened to the GWAE episode with KC and Chris about this movie. Very good interview and I’m looking forward to watching the movie.

KC lost a lot in the upper midwest, makes me think the shuffle is terrible there.

Quote: ChumpChange

KC lost a lot in the upper midwest, makes me think the shuffle is terrible there.

That was a little on the high side but normal variance for the stakes he was betting. He also had better than average positive variance early. Just the nature of pushing a small edge hard with a wide range of bets.

I saw the movie about a few months ago and it was really great. Maybe I'll look at it again :D

Quote: Matox8

I saw the movie about a few months ago and it was really great. Maybe I'll look at it again :D

I think I am one of the few who didn't enjoy it.

Quote: kewlj

Ok, so I know I am late to the party here, but I wasn't on this forum last year when this was discussed and only fairly recently got around to watching this documentary.

I haven't seen a documentary or movie on blackjack that I liked and thought was realistic until Inside the edge. I call what KC did, the "slash and burn" style of play. It came about in the early.mid 2000;s when new casinos and jurisdiction were exploding's here in the US. The idea was to play super aggressively at higher stakes until you are told "no more". Then just move on to the next place, the idea being there are just too many locations.

KC clearly demonstrated the problem with this approach. Technology and the databases working against you. Your history of heat, backoffs, barrings arrives at the new destination before you do, as evident by a number of very quick backoffs and 86ings (within minutes). One place, I forget where, he didn't even get in the front door. lol

In addition, this film/documentary show just what the variance of advantage blackjack play can be like. KC hit 600k, about a third of the way through his year on the road, only to lose 50%, 300k back fairly quickly. He then spent months and months recouping most of that 300k loss. I think one of the most important statements he made was that anyone who plays this game for a living and has done so for awhile, will encounter months long losing periods. Amen to that!

The final thing that was important about this film was it clearly showed just how sleazy casinos and the casino industry can be. The intimidating and rough backoffs and barrings when there is no need for that. The lying at numerous locations stating how it the law says a player has to show ID. AS Mr. Nersesian said, no where is that the law, except maybe Indian Casinos where they make their own laws. One pit woman emphatically told KC "not to argue with her, she knows the law. it is her job".

And several places refusing to cash chips which is flat out illegal, forcing KC to go to gaming for help. I can only hope when gaming showed up to help get the chips that a fine went along with that, but I doubt that occurred.

In conclusion, This film shows exactly why I don't think "slash and burn" is a valid strategy. I mean if you are just out to get what you can for 3-6 month....maybe. But anyone interested in any kind of longevity, needs to figure how to keep your play in the 'tolerated' zone.

Kudos to KC for a realistic look at 'Slash and burn' blackjack. Congrats to Mike on his appearances.

I thought Inside the edge was an incredible documentary and I shared most of the same conclusions as you, and it definitely shows the level of sleaziness of these Casino's! It's funny though, I personally got the opposite view in that the documentary sort of reinforced my opinion that the 'slash and burn' style can work, but obviously not easy and may not be the road you want to take. But I no longer think of conservative vs aggressive card counting styles as either better or worse than one another, I think it's really just a matter of what makes more sense for the individual player. When I started out I had no intention of being super aggressive, it just sort of happened. At first I wanted to use smaller spreads, avoid certain plays, because I didnt want to deal with frequent backoffs. Then as I started running simulations and understanding more about the game I realized that for me, the only way it could possibly work financially was for me to be incredibly aggressive. That's mostly because I dont live near many good games, my wife and I both love where we live and would not want to relocate. I basically settled on the slash and burn playing style by process of elimination, simply no other way for me to make it work. But for players that live in a certain area it absolutely makes more sense to play on the safe side and not burn out your welcome. Ultimately I think both methods work, I think it's just a matter of what works best for your current situation.

By the way Kewlj, have you been to many Casino's in the Vegas area lately? If so, would you care to give an update on the current conditions? I apologize if you have already done so on another thread and I missed it (if so please direct me to the thread).

I've seen this movie & Shackleford has a part in it! The movie was kinda boring for me only because it didn't break any new ground in card counting. I felt like I had learned nothing in the hour & half of watching it :/

Quote: theOmega623

By the way Kewlj, have you been to many Casino's in the Vegas area lately? If so, would you care to give an update on the current conditions? I apologize if you have already done so on another thread and I missed it (if so please direct me to the thread).

Funny you should ask. I stopped playing blackjack, I thought for the year, late in October because covid cases were rising and in my opinion, casinos and in particular tables games are one of the more riskier situations, especially for someone like me that is at greater risk.

So like I said, I "thought" I was done for the year, but this morning I was in a casino to pick up some free play on machines, and I had a $50 match play and there were no players playing the $25 double deck game, which at this location has nice penetration, so I sat down and ended up staying about 20 minutes and won $2900. Not a particularly big win, but it increased my blackjack win for the year by 35%. That should tell you just how bad a year I have had!! I was actually in the red until early October. So having cracked the 5 figure mark (lol), 2020 is no longer my worst year results wise for my career for blackjack. It is however my worst year in the last 14, years since way back when I was playing much lower limits. I can't wait for this freaking year to be over on so many levels!

So in answer to your question, I am really not up on the current conditions, not having played in almost 6 weeks until today for just a few minutes. Just at a casual glance it SEEMS like there are a lot of empty blackjack tables when I visit casinos to pick up free play, which I am still doing. But, a lot of those visits are during early morning slower hours, intentionally, so I really can't offer much on current conditions.

Quote: kewlj

Funny you should ask. I stopped playing blackjack, I thought for the year, late in October because covid cases were rising and in my opinion, casinos and in particular tables games are one of the more riskier situations, especially for someone like me that is at greater risk.

So like I said, I "thought" I was done for the year, but this morning I was in a casino to pick up some free play on machines, and I had a $50 match play and there were no players playing the $25 double deck game, which at this location has nice penetration, so I sat down and ended up staying about 20 minutes and won $2900. Not a particularly big win, but it increased my blackjack win for the year by 35%. That should tell you just how bad a year I have had!! I was actually in the red until early October. So having cracked the 5 figure mark (lol), 2020 is no longer my worst year results wise for my career for blackjack. It is however my worst year in the last 14, years since way back when I was playing much lower limits. I can't wait for this freaking year to be over on so many levels!

So in answer to your question, I am really not up on the current conditions, not having played in almost 6 weeks until today for just a few minutes. Just at a casual glance it SEEMS like there are a lot of empty blackjack tables when I visit casinos to pick up free play, which I am still doing. But, a lot of those visits are during early morning slower hours, intentionally, so I really can't offer much on current conditions.

Thanks for the info Kewlj! I thought for sure that January would be a proper time for me to resume my BJ career and get back to traveling but at this point I'm no more certain about it then I was 6 months ago. Glad to hear you logged a win though, even if it's a small one. Who knows..could be the start of an epic comeback!