Split 10s? (For Card Counters)

Split 10s vs dealer 6,5,4 when the count calls for it?

Worried about heat at all?

Is it a big or small loss of opportunity if you chose not to?

I'd say do it! I never felt any heat doing it, and redoing it. Actually it's more like cover, but where I play sometimes people split 10s, but they are the opposite of an AP if you know what I mean... so that's what the dealer/pit thinks of you when you do that. I haven't met anybody there that actually knows it is the best play in certain circumstances!
It depends on where you play. Your spread will get you heat not splitting 10s. I think it's a pretty considerable loss of opportunity!
Sure those counts don't happen often but when they do you got your max bets out, and when it comes it comes in groups, meaning if you have 10s vs 4,5,6 and you split, there is a good chance you will get to split again.

It REALLY depends on your situation... If you're not a pro, on a trip, etc, etc (i.e. you don't care much about the place you're at) then split away. When you are a pro, it gets even more situational... EV vs Longevity has been long discussed and there are cases for both sides. In the end you have to take the potential rewards and weigh them against the potential risks and see if it's right for you. There is no straight answer of yes or no always, in my opinion.

There are only two types of players that split 10s; stupid people and card counters. If the pit looks like they're on to you yet tolerating you it is probably best to avoid the move. If you do it, and after the play the suit is looking at you like he knows your soul, it is probably best to avoid the play again. It all depends on the temprature, if you know what I mean.

I only split tens when the guy next to me is smoking a cigar. Under those conditions , I also tend to stand on fours and pass gas as much as possible.

I regretfully have never split tens in over 500 hours of card-counting blackjack play. I have never been at a place where heat wasn't a concern. If I ever take a trip to the East Coast or Europe where I don't plan on making a trip back anytime soon I think I will make it my goal to try to split tens. I must say that my favorite play in blackjack is staying on a 15 v 10 and winning when hitting would have busted me. I can't imagine how much I will enjoy splitting tens at a TC of 8 or 9 :)

I'm not afraid to split 10's when called for, but only if the floor is distracted elsewhere. I'll even double on it if an Ace hits one of them and the count is right!

Quote: Ibeatyouraces

I'm not afraid to split 10's when called for, but only if the floor is distracted elsewhere. I'll even double on it if an Ace hits one of them and the count is right!

what count is that??

Quote: tyler498

what count is that??

It's been a long while (I don't count anymore), but if memory servers me right, it's either +7 or +8 TC Hi Lo. I'm sure someone will give the exact number.

The heat you get for doubling blackjack though...

There are definitely situations where I will split tens. It's not really as big a heat trigger as you might think. Chances are if this play gets you backed off they were already most of the way there already. The thing is that 95% of the time nobody is really paying attention anyway. Surveillance is mostly monitoring payouts and looking for dealer errors. Card counters are so paranoid but usually they are a very small fish in a very big pond and if you don't give away any obvious tells you will slip through the cracks. The most important thing is to keep your mouth shut. Anyway, I always split tens but I do so at a higher index. I use a risk averse index. the thing is at TC +7 and higher there is simply too much gain to abstain from splitting. You are talking about EV that is 20% higher and of course like anything the higher you go in the true count the more value you gain from making the play. So what I do is split tens (and double soft twenty), vs 4, 5 and 6 at TC +7 or higher. And resplit as well of course. It also depends on how aggressively you are betting. If you were playing at a small joint with a low table max and your max bet in this location left you with a 500+ max bet bankroll then you would want to start splitting right at the EV maximizing index or before +7 anyway. But if you were betting full kelly it would be wiser to wait a few TCs before splitting tens or making a close double like 9 v 7.

What about resplitting 10s and doubling after splitting if you got an Ace for your split 10? will you do it? or it receives attention because i have seen dealers calling for pit boss when anyone splits 10s.

I saw an extreme video on a guy doing this last year...was it linked from here? He was playing 3 hands for a good amount (black chip or higher) and the dealer had a 6 and he split. Might have been playing 20 hands by the time the dealer took a hit. I won't spoil it by saying whether he won or lost if you haven't seen it, but the count must have been huge. I'll see if I can find it.

Edit: this is it.



The felt says "Abu Dhabi : the place to win".

He was hitting 12's and 13's against the 6......

Quote: MaxPen

He was hitting 12's and 13's against the 6......

Yeah, I saw that. Lost one of those towards the beginning. The narrative on YouTube says there were 17 hands.

That excitement with the "OTRA VEZ PAPAAAA!" was priceless.

The dealer isn't really calling for pit boss. When they call out a strange play it is so you can't argue that you chose that option because the dealer shouted it out for everyone to hear moments ago. Blackjack losers like to take shots. There is an index for doubling down on a soft 21 but it's pretty high.

Ok. Thanks for the reply. I am still learning a lot about card counting, reading a lot of online resources. A free online book by norman wattenberger says REKO technique works better than hi lo and its more easier. Any one tried that and had more success?

Quote: fearlessdragon

Ok. Thanks for the reply. I am still learning a lot about card counting, reading a lot of online resources. A free online book by norman wattenberger says REKO technique works better than hi lo and its more easier. Any one tried that and had more success?

There are many metrics with which to calculate the performance of a card counting system... Playing Efficiency (PE), Betting Efficiency (BE), and Insurance Correlation (IC) are a few. After that you have raw EV via simulations... In the end what some people do with statistics is they use whichever one of those measuring correlations best fits their point and case. Thus, I could make a case for one system being better than another using PE, but then turn around and make the opposite statement by measuring using BE. So long as you're using a "main stream" count and not something like A-5 or speed count, the count you make the least amount of mistakes with is the right count for you. Often times the higher level counts that are "slightly better" in EV (or any one particular category above) comes with some complexity that causes more mistakes and actually ends up COSTING the counter money because they don't play as perfectly as their simulation does. There really is no right answer when it comes to a counting system. I have students that would tell you from experience REKO is not easier than Hi/Low. Then again I'm sure you could find others that say it is... it's all subjective to YOUR training and how YOU interact with the counting system.

However, one thing I can say at the end of the day... you'll have a lot more trouble finding good information/help with other systems than Hi/Low. Not saying it can't be done, but since that's what the massive bulk of card counters use that's what everyone is best educated on and best suited to help one another with. Try looking up a problem you're having in regards to REKO then Hi/Low. You'll find a lot more information in regards to Hi/Low that will help you understand and overcome your problem. I think there's definitely a time and knowledge factor that goes unaccounted for there as well.

*Full Disclaimer: I support counters using Hi/Low. That doesn't mean it's the best because as said above you can prove every single system is the best with some form of measurement or another. From my experience it's the best for a lot of reasons... I talk about them in the articles I wrote and linked you to in another thread =).