LostWages
LostWages
  • Threads: 38
  • Posts: 386
Joined: May 6, 2013
August 22nd, 2016 at 12:12:18 PM permalink
I've been able to memorize the simple basic strategy (21 cells of WOO), so I'm ready to "graduate" and start learning the full Basic Strategy (200+ cells). However, I'm not quite ready to plunge into card-counting until I get my feet wet playing at my first live BJ table. I've made quite a collection of tips from the forum responders already! Thanks, everyone!

We'll be at the Cal for 4 nights, and will likely play there more often than anywhere else.

My question is specifically for use at any of the Cal's 15 tables of 2-deck Blackjack with the flwg stats copied from the WOO's Jan 16 Blackjack Survey list.

Min $5, Dealer hits on S17, DA, no DAS, no RSA, no SURR, and house edge of 0.60225

If I will be able to play perfect basic strategy (but not yet card counting), is the HE still 0.60225?

The WOO has a 2-deck strategy card for Dealer HITS on S17 - I just wanted confirmation from the forum frequenters if this is indeed the card I should try to memorize and/or bring with me.

https://wizardofodds.com/games/blackjack/strategy/2-decks/

I'm using 3 different trainers, but welcome suggestions from the forum:

https://wizardofodds.com/play/blackjack/ (to match the 2-deck strategy card I'm trying to memorize)

https://www.blackjackapprenticeship.com/basic-strategy-training-drill/ (I use this to test my "speed" so I won't slow down table play)

http://www.blackjack-trainer.net/ (found by accident, but I like the layout and comments)
Eat real food . . . and you won't need medicine (or a lot less!)
Romes
Romes
  • Threads: 29
  • Posts: 5612
Joined: Jul 22, 2014
August 23rd, 2016 at 9:03:14 AM permalink
Hey LostWages, sounds like you're well on your way. The tasks of memorizing full basic strategy isn't as difficult as it appears to be. A lot of the rows, specifically 8 and below (so 8x13), are simply just HIT. That's 94 of them right there =P.

I'd suggest if you really want to learn to print out a BLANK basic strategy sheet. Go through it and write H, S, D, P, for the squares that you are 100% sure of. After that, you'll be left with probably like 20 squares or so... and that's all you need to really "study" or practice. Couple flash cards and you'll have those memorized by tomorrow evening =).

Basic strategy does "slightly" change with the number of decks and rules. For example: You don't double 11vA in S17 game, but you do double 11vA in H17 game for 6 decks.

You do appear to have the correct 2 deck strategy card... Which I'm not sure if it's offered on the Wizards main site, but there are plenty of sites that you can actually purchase a set of these cards for 1D, 2D, and 6D/8D (strategy is the same). This way whenever you go to a casino you can pull out your BS card and always play perfectly... Which yes will enable you to play at the house edge calculated from the Wizards house edge calculator. Remember to look at the "House Edge with Cut Card" number since you're hopefully avoiding CSM's ;-).

When you're ready to take on the task of counting, I'd highly recommend you check out the articles I have posted in the Articles section of this site. They'll take you from A to Z =P:

https://wizardofvegas.com/articles/A-to-Z-Counting-Cards-in-Blackjack/
https://wizardofvegas.com/articles/A-to-Z-Counting-Cards-In-Blackjack-2/
https://wizardofvegas.com/articles/A-to-Z-Counting-Cards-in-Blackjack-3/
Playing it correctly means you've already won.
Ayecarumba
Ayecarumba
  • Threads: 236
  • Posts: 6763
Joined: Nov 17, 2009
August 23rd, 2016 at 10:47:27 AM permalink
I don't recall seeing a $5 min. double deck game at the Cal. I thought the double deck game was at least $15, and possibly at least $25, but I could be mistaken.
Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication - Leonardo da Vinci
Romes
Romes
  • Threads: 29
  • Posts: 5612
Joined: Jul 22, 2014
August 23rd, 2016 at 11:13:39 AM permalink
Quote: Ayecarumba

I don't recall seeing a $5 min. double deck game at the Cal...

If he's referring to downtown it's litered with $5 DD (NDAS).
Playing it correctly means you've already won.
LostWages
LostWages
  • Threads: 38
  • Posts: 386
Joined: May 6, 2013
August 23rd, 2016 at 11:14:49 AM permalink
Hey, Romes - Tks for your time and suggestions and comments about my upcoming visit to the Cal.

My biggest take from your posting has reduced my trepidation thinking about memorizing full basic strategy with 200+ cells. It took me about 2 months to get the Simple Strategy down PAT.

With your commentary, I now realize there IS quite a lot of duplication in the BS card. I particularly like your suggestion to print out a BLANK BS sheet and try to fill it in from memory - that, and the flash cards.

Yes, I posted the link to WOO's 2-deck BS card for when dealer hits on 17; yes, I'm staying away from CSMs. My statements are based on the WOO's BJ Survey dated Jan 2016.

https://wizardofvegas.com/guides/blackjack-survey/https://wizardofvegas.com/guides/blackjack-survey/

I am so stoked to try card-counting because of your posting ; however, I will be patient, as it took me 2 months to get the hang of simple strategy before I even dared to LOOK at the full BS cards (200+cells, now "fewer" thanks to you!). I've only just started to practice with trainers for BS! I will hit my first table on 3 Oct 2016!

BTW, if no one has commented, your expression "playing it correctly means you've already won" is so energizing to me. All that is left for me to do is learn counting and to bombard the casinos with your phrase.

Mahalo (thanks)!
Eat real food . . . and you won't need medicine (or a lot less!)
LostWages
LostWages
  • Threads: 38
  • Posts: 386
Joined: May 6, 2013
August 23rd, 2016 at 11:19:28 AM permalink
Ayecarumba - my info is not based on visual sighting at the Cal, but only based on the WOO's BJ survey posted last 18 Jan 2016.

https://wizardofvegas.com/guides/blackjack-survey/

Having said that, I've also read on the Forum and elsewhere that sometimes the $5min are raised on busy nights or weekends to $10 or even higher.

Either way, thanks - I'll be prepared so I don't set myself up for disappointment, and can concentrate on the fun part!
Eat real food . . . and you won't need medicine (or a lot less!)
Romes
Romes
  • Threads: 29
  • Posts: 5612
Joined: Jul 22, 2014
August 23rd, 2016 at 11:22:14 AM permalink
I'm glad you found my rambling useful =). Have fun on your trip. If you're really looking forward to counting you mustn't be affaid to practice practice practice! After only a month of practicing, counting will be like breathing, and it'll be a skill you'll have for the rest of your life. A very worthwhile investment in my opinion =p. If you come across any questions feel free to PM me or post in the A-Z thread in the blackjack section (might be page 2 or so at this point).

Also, I'm tentively going to be in town the first weekend of October... Maybe we'll have to see if a few others would be in town for a meetup!
Playing it correctly means you've already won.
LostWages
LostWages
  • Threads: 38
  • Posts: 386
Joined: May 6, 2013
August 24th, 2016 at 2:57:22 PM permalink
I printed out a blank BS sheet so I can start practicing later. I'll PM you or post in the A-Z thread in the blackjack section with my additional questions. Thanks for the offer to meetup. I'm not sure of our schedule except I believe it will involve some shopping . . . (hint, hint). OK, on to practice!
Eat real food . . . and you won't need medicine (or a lot less!)
LostWages
LostWages
  • Threads: 38
  • Posts: 386
Joined: May 6, 2013
August 24th, 2016 at 8:45:17 PM permalink
While practicing BS, I came across the WOO's Blackjack Basic Strategy calculator:

https://wizardofodds.com/games/blackjack/strategy/calculator/

Then I plugged in the conditions at The Cal: 2 decks, dealer hits on S17, no DAS, no SURR, and dealer peeks for blackjack. This generates a "customized" BS card.

Can I use this card instead of the "generic" 2-deck BS card of the WOO?
https://wizardofodds.com/games/blackjack/strategy/2-decks/
Eat real food . . . and you won't need medicine (or a lot less!)
Romes
Romes
  • Threads: 29
  • Posts: 5612
Joined: Jul 22, 2014
August 25th, 2016 at 6:27:26 AM permalink
They should be one in the same, unless the "generic" one assumes S17/H17.

If you were to go purchase a "set" of BS cards from any site you should get the following:

- 1D S17
- 1D H17
- 2D S17
- 2D H17
- 4/6/8 D S17
- 4/6/8 D H17

This should be all of the different cards you would ever require.

You'll also find when learning these that they are EXTREMELY SIMILAR. The difference being 3 or 4 decisions pending rules. So hammer whichever one you want 100%, then when you go to learn the others, you'll only have a few things to learn to cover ALL of the differnet game variants (any # of decks/H17 or S17).
Playing it correctly means you've already won.
LostWages
LostWages
  • Threads: 38
  • Posts: 386
Joined: May 6, 2013
August 25th, 2016 at 9:19:31 AM permalink
Thanks, Romes - I should have specified I started working on practicing the specific WOO 2-deck strategy for S17, since the Cal BJ tables I plan to visit are all S17 (at least per the last WOO BJ Survey, Jan 2016). OK, on to filling in my first blank BJ practice sheet!
Eat real food . . . and you won't need medicine (or a lot less!)
  • Jump to: