Camouflage counting
what should i consider drinking that looks heavy but its light? hehe
Quote: KerkebetNot much. When the other players quickly notice what you're doing, point it out or leave the table to not become involved by (scared of casino) suspicion... I think the casino knows.
Play someplace that doesn't care.
Quote: GeorgePaneany ideas on how to camouflage ? i know not to spread much and chat with pitboss
what should i consider drinking that looks heavy but its light? hehe
If you're playing double deck you might consider coming in for 2 units off the top. If a PB is watching intently, perhaps make a slightly wrong BS play to throw them off. There's also a lot of other cover that doesn't cost money... Cover/camo is just things to disguise what you're doing, and that starts from the moment you walk in the door. They look how you're dressed, how you buy in, etc. Basically you want to look like a degenerate gambler so they write you off and don't even pay attention to you after they've made their decision that that's what you are. This has been discussed in previous threads. Dress down, buy in cheap, etc... i.e. if you're going to buy in for $500 at one table, don't buy in for $500 up front... buy in for $100 and keep re-buying as needed... more buy-ins makes you look like a gambler chasing losses and would also explain bigger bets to try to 'get back to even.' To further this it was discussed to buy in with $20 bills, not $100's as well.
From the moment you walk in it's the PB's job to decide if you're a threat or not. If you give him every reason in the book to think you're just another degenerate gambler and he takes that bait, you'll be able to play your session no problem.
That being said, I personally don't think you should ever compromise your spread. If you change your spread you're NOT earning your projected EV. Part of what makes a great counter great is the ability to "get the money out there" (as was said in the MIT documentary and by many other APs). If you're afraid to bet your big bet, then you shouldn't be playing at that place. Either the heat is too great to keep playing, or you play with 100% gusto (i.e. don't short your big bet). Don't ever compromise your spread/EV.
Quote: DieterPlay someplace that doesn't care.
Best advice. There really are some places that don't care that much, if at all. At least at the level I play. Now if you are playing a single or double deck game and spreading 1-20 units of black chips, then yeah you're going to be noticed, and probably backed off. But a 6 deck shoe game with decent rules is still playable, and draws much less heat. Additionally, if you keep your spread down some not only do you reduce the variance, but you get some cover without making any bad plays on purpose. Too much cover cuts your +EV situation down so much it's not worth playing at all. Most of all blend in. Be forgettable. Dress nice but not flashy. Have a drink or two, but don't get all tanked up at the table. Chat with other players and the dealer, but not so much that it's obvious you know "too much". Just use common sense. If you want to play the same casinos a lot. You've got to keep a low profile.
Quote: GeorgePaneany ideas on how to camouflage ? i know not to spread much and chat with pitboss
what should i consider drinking that looks heavy but its light? hehe
If your top bet is below two hands of $200 you should not worry about camouflage. The best camouflage is to stash about $200 an hour in red and green chips in your pocket (secretly) so that your losses are bigger than they seem or that your win is smaller than it seems.
If your top bet is bigger than two hands of $200 the best cover is limiting your exposure in any single session and moving around the casino (from pit to pit). Figure out what kind of spread you need to get the desired win rate and you've got to spread at least that amount. If you want to build in cover (like off the top bigger bets or gradual bet increases or decreases) you'll need to use a bigger spread to get the desired win rate and that will be accomplished with either a lower bottom bet or a bigger top bet (or a combination of the two). Nothing is free and anytime you bet sub-optimally you cost yourself EV and increase fluctuation. Either way, if you win big and play too long the amount of cover you use will never be enough. Too much cover is vastly overrated and if you use enough cover so that you're never getting backed off I'd suggest you're not playing with an edge. (or an edge useful for making a living).
For example, spreading quarters in downtown Vegas will give you more attention than spreading quarters on the Strip.
If you're new to counting, you shouldn't worry about camouflage yet, especially not at the nickel or quarter level -- just make sure your plays are accurate and you can keep a conversation without seeming too interested in the cards.
Some floors don't know the difference between correct and incorrect plays, so just play perfect basic strategy with correct index plays for the time being.
Quote: RomesIf you're playing double deck you might consider coming in for 2 units off the top. If a PB is watching intently, perhaps make a slightly wrong BS play to throw them off. There's also a lot of other cover that doesn't cost money... Cover/camo is just things to disguise what you're doing, and that starts from the moment you walk in the door. They look how you're dressed, how you buy in, etc. Basically you want to look like a degenerate gambler so they write you off and don't even pay attention to you after they've made their decision that that's what you are. This has been discussed in previous threads. Dress down, buy in cheap, etc... i.e. if you're going to buy in for $500 at one table, don't buy in for $500 up front... buy in for $100 and keep re-buying as needed... more buy-ins makes you look like a gambler chasing losses and would also explain bigger bets to try to 'get back to even.' To further this it was discussed to buy in with $20 bills, not $100's as well.
From the moment you walk in it's the PB's job to decide if you're a threat or not. If you give him every reason in the book to think you're just another degenerate gambler and he takes that bait, you'll be able to play your session no problem.
Romes - I agree with about 90% of what you say about the "degenerate gambler" look, but have a question: buying in for, say 3k playing min bets of $50 or even $100 while being in your mid twenties does not fit the stereotype you describe. What do you think of the "rich spoilt brat" look? that means, jacket & slacks, high charisma, vocal (obnoxious?), loud but not rude, possibly with attractive arm candy nearby?
http://www.amazon.com/Burning-Tables-Las-Vegas-Blackjack/dp/0929712846
There are some things that you can do that fall under camouflage or cover which have no or minimal cost. At the top of that list is the previously mentioned short sessions, exiting after showing your spread. You can wager optimally, but exit before enough information has been given for anyone, man or software to make a determination. In the 'exit after showing spread' scenario, they will only see you increase your wagers, one cycle, and not see the retreat back to smaller or minimum wagers which is such a huge "tell". If they only see you increase, it is hard to distinguish between increasing wagers with the count and progressive players who parlay, or players who increase wagers chasing losses. Just not enough data.
Another trick which cost almost nothing are small buy-ins. And I mean small. At a $25 tables where your minimum wager is $25, buy in for $100 or $200, not $500 or $1000. You can always buy-in for more if more is needed for splits/double downs or the count increases and actually those re-buyins have further value as it looks like you are chasing losses, which casinos love. In the meantime, that first small buy-in sends a message that you have little money and are no threat before you have ever placed a bet. First impressions are huge. For effect buy-in with 20's even a couple 10's. :)
If it is a place you play regularly, you might consider keeping a chip inventory. This allows you to bypass the buy-in altogether. You just walk up with a minimum amount of chips in hand (more in pocket) and begin playing. No need for the dealer to stop the game, which draws attention to you and/or call the pit guy for approval. If the pit is busy, you can get in without them even realizing you are there. Sometimes you can get in and OUT, without them ever having known you are there. And speaking of getting out, obviously you don't need to color up, which is another vulnerable time when you attract attention. You also can avoid that trip to the cage, which is one of the most vulnerable moments for a counter. It is at the cage that they often get the best photo opportunity of you. :/
Now back to the single and double deck games. With these games, you have a little more 'wiggle' room, because your profit margin is not quite so razor thin. You can employ a little bit of wagering cover and absorb the cost. One of the things I like to do is something Romes mentioned. Play 2 units off the top and spread both ways. This can make your total spread look half as big, as anyone watching will need to see your full spread in each direction to observe your total spread. Again, there is a cost to this, but I am willing to pay that cost in exchange for some longevity at these better opportunities.
Finally, since someone mentioned "Burning the Tables", I just want to say that the methods that Ian Anderson used is pretty outdated for today's game. I cringe whenever someone, brings up Anderson's name. These camo techniques come at a very high cost. They were designed for high stakes play, in which you can afford to give up some EV in exchange for cover. They also were designed for the much better games of yesteryear. If you attempt to employ these techniques on Today's games at anything but high stakes levels, you are giving away a huge chunk of your profit margin.
Quote: DieterPlay someplace that doesn't care.
Yes, in the sense that winning is easy when it's only for a little and no one, including yourself, cares much or then has much fun either.
But, try to make it for a reasonable amount relative to your worth and abilities. When things go south.
No, far better to be the soft spoken one holding the stick. Best to not be thus involved at all, unless you're the one in 10,000 who really knows what you're doing.
Quote: arcticfunRomes - I agree with about 90% of what you say about the "degenerate gambler" look, but have a question: buying in for, say 3k playing min bets of $50 or even $100 while being in your mid twenties does not fit the stereotype you describe. What do you think of the "rich spoilt brat" look? that means, jacket & slacks, high charisma, vocal (obnoxious?), loud but not rude, possibly with attractive arm candy nearby?
Good observation... This clearly depends on what level you're playing at. You can't play reds/low greens with $10k and try to dress like a "degenerate gambler." At that point they'll just assume you're a drug dealer or something and probably flag your transactions for other reasons. Anything that brings you additional attention is not good.
I love the "rich kid" getup and persona. Although with my level I don't have the opportunity to do that very often, it's something different, can be fun, and makes me feel a lot less awkward about asking for comps =P. Unlike the "degenerate gambler" approach at lower limits, where one can often just not even talk because you're just there to gamble gamble gamble, at the higher limits even with a rich kid persona you need a bit more story. People will often naturally wonder what a mid twenty something does that he can afford to come in, buy in with $3k and fire away. Now I wouldn't go in there playing and just start blabbing about "oh hey btw my dad is like a super amazing lawyer, etc, etc." But I would come up with a couple comments like "Wow that last hand had me sweating more than my last cross examination!" Something to clearly let them know why you have money, without you having to look like you're 'trying' to say it.
Guess I could have summed that last paragraph up with: Love the rich kid persona, but make sure you have supporting back story/details. Just like the degenerate gambler, it's all about the little details that really sells them on your persona, and then you're off their radar ;)
Quote: Romes
I love the "rich kid" getup and persona.
I don't like this approach at all. With any kind of character type act (Semyon D used an arms dealer), you are first drawing attention and then attempting to re-direct it. You are inviting them to examine your character and story and it is very possible, even probable there are some holes or discrepancies.
I much prefer to avoid attention than draw it and attempt to deflect it.
Quote: kewljI don't like this approach at all. With any kind of character type act (Semyon D used an arms dealer), you are first drawing attention and then attempting to re-direct it. You are inviting them to examine your character and story and it is very possible, even probable there are some holes or discrepancies.
I much prefer to avoid attention than draw it and attempt to deflect it.
From a professional perspective I'd expect you to say exactly that, and don't blame you. For someone on a trip just trying to squeak out hours and have fun doing so, I've personally made it work before. Like I said though, it does take more effort in that you must have responses ready to the typical questions you might get.
Edit: when you're mid 20's and you look early 20's it's a lot harder to stay under the radar when you're playing higher limits and forced to buy in with larger chunks. Not to say it can't be done, just that it is indeed harder, so either way you're forced to make extra effort.
Quote: GeorgePaneso by wearing a shirt and jeans where should it fit? downtown or strip?
With casual clothes you can fit in anywhere except a few of the very high end places like Bellagio
Quote: kewljOn camouflage: I don't like any kind of camouflage involving wagering. Any time you deviate from optimal wagering there is a cost in EV and for most games and the very razor thin margin that you can gain, the cost is just too much, IMO. The exception would be some single and double deck games (more on that in a moment). In addition to cost, wagering camouflage has become less effective as many places now use software as part of the evaluation process. The software will conclude that you are wagering more money in positive count (and EV) situations, despite your best efforts at camouflage. The way to beat the software evaluation is by not giving enough time and data to determine anything...in other words...short sessions.
There are some things that you can do that fall under camouflage or cover which have no or minimal cost. At the top of that list is the previously mentioned short sessions, exiting after showing your spread. You can wager optimally, but exit before enough information has been given for anyone, man or software to make a determination. In the 'exit after showing spread' scenario, they will only see you increase your wagers, one cycle, and not see the retreat back to smaller or minimum wagers which is such a huge "tell". If they only see you increase, it is hard to distinguish between increasing wagers with the count and progressive players who parlay, or players who increase wagers chasing losses. Just not enough data.
Another trick which cost almost nothing are small buy-ins. And I mean small. At a $25 tables where your minimum wager is $25, buy in for $100 or $200, not $500 or $1000. You can always buy-in for more if more is needed for splits/double downs or the count increases and actually those re-buyins have further value as it looks like you are chasing losses, which casinos love. In the meantime, that first small buy-in sends a message that you have little money and are no threat before you have ever placed a bet. First impressions are huge. For effect buy-in with 20's even a couple 10's. :)
If it is a place you play regularly, you might consider keeping a chip inventory. This allows you to bypass the buy-in altogether. You just walk up with a minimum amount of chips in hand (more in pocket) and begin playing. No need for the dealer to stop the game, which draws attention to you and/or call the pit guy for approval. If the pit is busy, you can get in without them even realizing you are there. Sometimes you can get in and OUT, without them ever having known you are there. And speaking of getting out, obviously you don't need to color up, which is another vulnerable time when you attract attention. You also can avoid that trip to the cage, which is one of the most vulnerable moments for a counter. It is at the cage that they often get the best photo opportunity of you. :/
Now back to the single and double deck games. With these games, you have a little more 'wiggle' room, because your profit margin is not quite so razor thin. You can employ a little bit of wagering cover and absorb the cost. One of the things I like to do is something Romes mentioned. Play 2 units off the top and spread both ways. This can make your total spread look half as big, as anyone watching will need to see your full spread in each direction to observe your total spread. Again, there is a cost to this, but I am willing to pay that cost in exchange for some longevity at these better opportunities.
Finally, since someone mentioned "Burning the Tables", I just want to say that the methods that Ian Anderson used is pretty outdated for today's game. I cringe whenever someone, brings up Anderson's name. These camo techniques come at a very high cost. They were designed for high stakes play, in which you can afford to give up some EV in exchange for cover. They also were designed for the much better games of yesteryear. If you attempt to employ these techniques on Today's games at anything but high stakes levels, you are giving away a huge chunk of your profit
margin.
Kj, do you know if they actually use that software? Isn't it a pain in the butt to use because the surveillance guy has to input every card and bet? Aren't they only gunna use it when they suspect someone is a counter? So in other words, don't get suspected and you will be fine.
Now this is what I have question about. Is surveillance actively counting cards even if they have no suspicion of a card counter being present? I think not, since the number of card counters are so low. I have never encountered a card counter when I have been counting. I have been suspicious of two people, but I didn't stick around to find out. In other words, probably not worth their time to count down decks. Definitely not worth the time to use the software, only if the pit boss requests skill check.
This is only my assumption from counting for 8 months. I have never been backed off. This leads me to believe no one is watching from upstairs. I'm pretty much betting with the count. I get heat if the pot boss notices my spread as well as winning a lot of money.
Now sometimes I make a wrong bet in double deck, I feel like surveillance may be counting down decks from time to time. Is that a good assumption or should I stop doing those mistakes. A lot of times I can do the 1-8 spread w/ no heat. The problem is that if I am being watched upstairs? But if I make occasional mistake, then they probably won't use software on me, correct?
Quote: Avincow...Now sometimes I make a wrong bet in double deck, I feel like surveillance may be counting down decks from time to time. Is that a good assumption or should I stop doing those mistakes. A lot of times I can do the 1-8 spread w/ no heat. The problem is that if I am being watched upstairs? But if I make occasional mistake, then they probably won't use software on me, correct?
I think this is the costly camo KJ is referring too. If they aren't using the software 100% of the time then your bet is wasted, especially if the PB isn't watching you place it. This could be situationally dependent too. If you go to Cortez, hell I would suggest your first couple raised bets be in negative counts because the PB will come over and count the discards down (has happened to me and others have reported the same). You should be able to find more inexpensive/free ways to get camo than placing a wager no one may see and all it does is effect your bottom line EV.
Quote: RomesI think this is the costly camo KJ is referring too. If they aren't using the software 100% of the time then your bet is wasted, especially if the PB isn't watching you place it. This could be situationally dependent too. If you go to Cortez, hell I would suggest your first couple raised bets be in negative counts because the PB will come over and count the discards down (has happened to me and others have reported the same). You should be able to find more inexpensive/free ways to get camo than placing a wager no one may see and all it does is effect your bottom line EV.
See, that's the problem: you don't know if they are using the software until it's too late. If I'm doing the hit and run, then of course I'm playing perfect blackjack. But if I'm playing rated sometimes I am torn about what I should do.
Quote: KerkebetYes, in the sense that winning is easy when it's only for a little and no one, including yourself, cares much or then has much fun either.
I think you misunderstand. There are places in the hinterlands that don't sweat the action or worry about possible skilled play - they are only on the lookout for game integrity.
So long as you're not marking cards, mucking hands, past-posting, or otherwise cheating, they want you to play.
15 spread on DD? Go for it.
They put their faith in the percentage, and bless them for that.
Quote: AvincowSee, that's the problem: you don't know if they are using the software until it's too late. If I'm doing the hit and run, then of course I'm playing perfect blackjack. But if I'm playing rated sometimes I am torn about what I should do.
Just like in life (at least in my opinion) you should never stress about things that are completely out of your control. If you have no way of getting inside information to find out if a particular shop is using the software, then you should do what you've trained to do and not worry about it. Keep the session short, play your game, and get out. If you get heat, you get heat, just like any other place at any other time.
Quote: GeorgePanewhat if the deck is so hot even after the next shuffle and the next and you have to play there? if i saw + + + counts in front of me i cant resist and leave to try the next casino that MAYBE it will have a positive one when searching
Then lucky you... It's not often you see positive count after positive count. Play 3-4 shoes and take off after the shoe (if it stayed hot all the way through). In order to keep short sessions you don't need to stick around to "check" the beginning of the next shoe. However, I think it's probably one of the biggest sins of card counting to walk away from a positive advantage shoe. Given you're on a trip from another country, I would think it's quite acceptable to use the "burn it down" strategy at properties that aren't part of a group. This means, play until you get backed off if it's that hot and you're winning that much... but this is in reference to properties whom aren't going to flyer you at their sister properties.... As in, be careful at places with the same rewards cards. If you get backed off at one they'll send a picture of you to the others and they won't let you play there. I'd only do the "burn it down" strategy at off the strip shops that I have some level of confidence wouldn't burn me on the strip.
Quote: GeorgePanewhat if the deck is so hot even after the next shuffle and the next and you have to play there? you
How would you know the next shuffle is hot unless you are shuffle tracking? I assume you won't be doing that. If you put out your max bet during a shoe, then consider leaving at the shuffle, it's a very natural thing to do. What are you gunna do, go back down to $10 after you just played $150 a hand? Might look a bit suspicious.
Quote: RomesThen lucky you... It's not often you see positive count after positive count. Play 3-4 shoes and take off after the shoe (if it stayed hot all the way through).
When I learned to count in the early 90's and decks were hand shuffled, I've seen shoes stay positive for a couple of shoes. There was some guy who wrote a book about the phenomenon claiming that a lot of hand shuffles weren't necessarily random. He called the phenomenon "clumping". I think this is why most places use auto shufflers now to get a more random result.
Quote: GeorgePaneWell are most of the downtown considered sisters ? Only a couple are not and so counting is a " no need to worry of heat " there ... However should I use players card at all (alone and sisters) or is my name in barcode when they scan it and I'm an easy target ?
I might defer a bit more to a local, but from my understanding/experiences/readings downtown are considered separate properties for the most part, however they share info with each other since they're in such a close proximity. I wouldn't bother with players cards unless you want to get them for +EV things like a free buffet or $10 free slot play or something. That said I wouldn't use the cards when playing blackjack, just everything else.
So long as you follow the advice that's been said a few times thus far (keep short sessions, walk across the street to another place after showing your max bet, etc) then you should really not have any problems. If you're off the strip and not downtown, then perhaps play the burn it down approach at a place you feel confident doesn't have ties to a strip casino (example: Sam's Town is a fun place but uses MLife, which is MGM, etc, etc, on the strip). You can easily find this out by asking their rewards desk if they have affiliations to strip casinos. Always remember not to get identified as a counter at the casino/hotel you're staying at.
Quote: AvincowKj, do you know if they actually use that software? Isn't it a pain in the butt to use because the surveillance guy has to input every card and bet? Aren't they only gunna use it when they suspect someone is a counter? So in other words, don't get suspected and you will be fine.
Now this is what I have question about. Is surveillance actively counting cards even if they have no suspicion of a card counter being present? I think not, since the number of card counters are so low. I have never encountered a card counter when I have been counting. I have been suspicious of two people, but I didn't stick around to find out. In other words, probably not worth their time to count down decks. Definitely not worth the time to use the software, only if the pit boss requests skill check.
Don't confuse "pain in the butt" with "difficult to do". If you're over the age of 5 and can manage all the complexity of a "paint by number" task, you can use the software. Probably 80% of Surv monkeys are totally qualified for it =p
Suspicion, presence, and this wacky masquerade ball stuff is misleading. Sure, we do get suspicious, and do act on those suspicions. But a vast majority of our skills check come because, well, wtf else are we going to do? You ever try watching roulette for an hour, let alone 8? How long do you think you could handle not playing craps, but just watching it and ensuring proper payouts are made? You gotta switch it up lest your brain run out the side of your head. And blackjack, being as dull and simple as it is, needs something to spice it up. So as you're counting, we're counting right along with you. We can't not do it, both out of habit and as a preventative measure against insanity. Old grandma playing $5 a hand? I'm counting. Hipster DB twirling his 'stache? I'm counting. Rando MAWG with $80k on the table? I'm counting.
Generally I'm just sitting there, being observant. I might have a notepad, but mostly I just watch. Deviations, bet variations, I just let it paint me a picture. If I can't do it in my head, it's far enough out of basic to warrant notes. And a majority of these cases are numbskulls that just don't know how to play. But for those who aren't, we carry on.
Any good operator has a minimum four cameras already on the table anytime he's watching, whether he suspects something or is just phoning it in. And if I get that tickle that goes from killing time to doing work, all your play is already saved and available at my leisure. I can check you right then, after lunch, when I come back the next day, or sometime after Christmas. If it's there and you did it, it's there and I got it. And I'll do a basic check to see if it's a big deal, then (if necessary) do an in depth run down to show how much of a big deal, then (if necessary) toss it to the damnable computer to see what that POS has to say.
I know this isn't Table Personnel stuff. What gets them off, I dunno. What they look for, I don't care. But they have a ton of responsibilities spanning a number tasks. Us? All we're focused on is the weird. If some guy, I dunno, portrays himself as the "young lawyer" offered above, I'm gonna notice calloused hands and ragged fingernails. And that's not gonna fit. And I'm going to be compelled to find out why. And the better you hide, the more incensed I'm going to become. So I'm going to have 7 cameras on your play. I'm going to run down anyone you talk to and follow them around the building. And if you or anyone you're with goes to the cage, I'll be pulling that info. And if you dig into your wallet, I'll be right inside it checking for ID. And if you ran into the community group in the lobby collecting petitions, I'll be searching for a name. If you hit the buffet or the gift shop, I'll be yanking CC receipts. If you drove here, I'll be running your plate. And if you think I'm above watching you leave the property to see if you hit the local gas station, where I might be able to pull the "Dad/brother forgot his receipt, it was the (insert your vehicle) on pump 4" routine to get your name off the resulting credit card receipt, you aren't trying hard enough. And if you make me go that freaking far just to find out who you are, then I must assume you are one of those white whales those in the biz fantasize about. And I'm gonna take the info I got and get into your Facebook, and your Twitter, and your credit reports, and your criminal records, and your LinkedIn, and your Grindr account, until I know more about you than you know about yourself.
Or I'll be too busy trying to beat my peers' record in QWOP and won't do any of that. It's sort of a crapshoot =)
Quote: FaceDon't confuse "pain in the butt" with "difficult to do". If you're over the age of 5 and can manage all the complexity of a "paint by number" task, you can use the software. Probably 80% of Surv monkeys are totally qualified for it =p
Suspicion, presence, and this wacky masquerade ball stuff is misleading. Sure, we do get suspicious, and do act on those suspicions. But a vast majority of our skills check come because, well, wtf else are we going to do? You ever try watching roulette for an hour, let alone 8? How long do you think you could handle not playing craps, but just watching it and ensuring proper payouts are made? You gotta switch it up lest your brain run out the side of your head. And blackjack, being as dull and simple as it is, needs something to spice it up. So as you're counting, we're counting right along with you. We can't not do it, both out of habit and as a preventative measure against insanity. Old grandma playing $5 a hand? I'm counting. Hipster DB twirling his 'stache? I'm counting. Rando MAWG with $80k on the table? I'm counting.
Generally I'm just sitting there, being observant. I might have a notepad, but mostly I just watch. Deviations, bet variations, I just let it paint me a picture. If I can't do it in my head, it's far enough out of basic to warrant notes. And a majority of these cases are numbskulls that just don't know how to play. But for those who aren't, we carry on.
Any good operator has a minimum four cameras already on the table anytime he's watching, whether he suspects something or is just phoning it in. And if I get that tickle that goes from killing time to doing work, all your play is already saved and available at my leisure. I can check you right then, after lunch, when I come back the next day, or sometime after Christmas. If it's there and you did it, it's there and I got it. And I'll do a basic check to see if it's a big deal, then (if necessary) do an in depth run down to show how much of a big deal, then (if necessary) toss it to the damnable computer to see what that POS has to say.
I know this isn't Table Personnel stuff. What gets them off, I dunno. What they look for, I don't care. But they have a ton of responsibilities spanning a number tasks. Us? All we're focused on is the weird. If some guy, I dunno, portrays himself as the "young lawyer" offered above, I'm gonna notice calloused hands and ragged fingernails. And that's not gonna fit. And I'm going to be compelled to find out why. And the better you hide, the more incensed I'm going to become. So I'm going to have 7 cameras on your play. I'm going to run down anyone you talk to and follow them around the building. And if you or anyone you're with goes to the cage, I'll be pulling that info. And if you dig into your wallet, I'll be right inside it checking for ID. And if you ran into the community group in the lobby collecting petitions, I'll be searching for a name. If you hit the buffet or the gift shop, I'll be yanking CC receipts. If you drove here, I'll be running your plate. And if you think I'm above watching you leave the property to see if you hit the local gas station, where I might be able to pull the "Dad/brother forgot his receipt, it was the (insert your vehicle) on pump 4" routine to get your name off the resulting credit card receipt, you aren't trying hard enough. And if you make me go that freaking far just to find out who you are, then I must assume you are one of those white whales those in the biz fantasize about. And I'm gonna take the info I got and get into your Facebook, and your Twitter, and your credit reports, and your criminal records, and your LinkedIn, and your Grindr account, until I know more about you than you know about yourself.
Or I'll be too busy trying to beat my peers' record in QWOP and won't do any of that. It's sort of a crapshoot =)
So you're surveillance? Is everyone counting down the decks like you? If that's the case, I should have been backed off a long time ago....but it hasn't happened yet. That's what leads me to believe that no one is counting upstairs. Unless they are just letting me go at it and don't care....
Quote: Avincow
So you're surveillance? Is everyone counting down the decks like you? If that's the case, I should have been backed off a long time ago....but it hasn't happened yet. That's what leads me to believe that no one is counting upstairs. Unless they are just letting me go at it and don't care....
Former.
Everyone. It's a requirement to be able to do it, and it used to be a requirement to do such rundowns... three times a week? Three a day? I don't remember. The mandatory quota got dropped long ago. But yes, all do it because, as I said, to not do so would just increase the monotony. And really, how good could your game pro be if you can't even count? =p
Of course, I'm not saying we were some great force. Some just aren't good at it. Some only phone it in. And even those who were good at it, often we just ended up counting squares. And further, the ones we did get something on weren't always acted upon. One person left to count unfettered to his or her ability isn't going to bring down the house. Shooting down every suspected AP out of hand would. So the one and only guy we ever backed off in my 6 years there was only done so after over a year and a half of observation (and I still maintain he wasn't a counter =p)
So yeah. I didn't mean to imply that we were some superior force. Just providing info by way of an inside look.
