Kennyrogers
Joined: Jul 22, 2012
• Posts: 2
July 22nd, 2012 at 10:17:45 AM permalink
Just want to gather some ideas from the board. I have 650 dollars in free play available at a casino. To be specific I can use this as coupons in any amount from 10 to 250. This is not match play, it is genuine free play. So...when the bet wins the house takes the coupon, replaces it with chips and then pays the bet!! So a 10 dollar coupon win is really 20 bucks in my pocket, as I have zero risk of losing.

My first instinct is to play a game that pays odds (forgot to mention I can use them on ANY table game).

So, I know the odds in roulette are crappy, but given this literally free scenario I am considering doing 10 dollar coupon bets for the entire 650 worth on one row in roulette that pays 2 to 1. Giving my 650 dollar coupons a potential 1950 dollar value (in theory of I won every bet).

All opinios are welcome.
wernerw
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
• Posts: 33
July 22nd, 2012 at 10:22:11 AM permalink
Well, I think your calculation is a little bit wrong. Not considering the house edge, your 10\$ coupon is really 10 bucks in your pocket. If you use ist on even money games, you win 50% of the games and lose 50%. Which gives you back 10\$ per coupon on average.

(as I said not considering the house edge)
ChesterDog
Joined: Jul 26, 2010
• Posts: 758
July 22nd, 2012 at 10:42:59 AM permalink
Quote: Kennyrogers

...So, I know the odds in roulette are crappy, but given this literally free scenario I am considering doing 10 dollar coupon bets for the entire 650 worth on one row in roulette that pays 2 to 1. Giving my 650 dollar coupons a potential 1950 dollar value (in theory of I won every bet)...

Take a look at this Wizard's page about coupons. You'll see from the table that if you wish to achieve the highest value for your coupons, making 1-way roulette bets is best. For a double-zero wheel, your EV is \$650 x 92.11% = \$599. (From that same table, you can see that betting on a double-zero roulette column, which pays 2 to 1, would have an EV of \$650 x 63.16% = \$411.)

Edit: As pointed out by 24Bingo, below, my comments are only for a coupon that is taken by the casino after a win or loss. However, Kennyrogers's coupons are paid AND replaced with chips, so they are like non-negotiable chips, or even cash.
24Bingo
Joined: Jul 4, 2012
• Posts: 1348
July 22nd, 2012 at 11:03:01 AM permalink
ChesterDog: The OP's situation differs from that described in any part of that article, in that the chip's cash value is paid on a win. In that way, it's closest to a "non-neg."

Quote: Kennyrogers

Just want to gather some ideas from the board. I have 650 dollars in free play available at a casino. To be specific I can use this as coupons in any amount from 10 to 250. This is not match play, it is genuine free play. So...when the bet wins the house takes the coupon, replaces it with chips and then pays the bet!! So a 10 dollar coupon win is really 20 bucks in my pocket, as I have zero risk of losing.

My first instinct is to play a game that pays odds (forgot to mention I can use them on ANY table game).

So, I know the odds in roulette are crappy, but given this literally free scenario I am considering doing 10 dollar coupon bets for the entire 650 worth on one row in roulette that pays 2 to 1. Giving my 650 dollar coupons a potential 1950 dollar value (in theory of I won every bet).

All opinios are welcome.

My instinct would be just to make some cash from them and move on to the cardroom, for which the best strategy would be either darksiding with full odds or blackjack, either at \$10 a pop. If what you want is to win big, though, your best bet is to go big - if you're going to play roulette rows, I recommend you play them 250-250-150 (in sequence, that is, not hedged). That way, you have a 1 in 30 or so chance of hitting all three (of course, you also have a 1 in 3 chance of losing all three).

Or another way, if you just want the possibility of a big win - try craps, putting \$50 on the pass line (pass, not don't pass, because the possible wins are bigger) at first, taking full odds. When your remaining free play is in the \$60 to \$300 range, bet 1/6, rounded down. When you're below \$60, just put it all on the field. Best-case scenario you'll almost triple your money, and if you do finish somewhere in the middle it will probably be a better-looking middle, especially if the roulette wheel is double-zero.

(Although hang on - what do you mean "zero risk of losing"? Why can't you lose? Don't they take the free play if you lose the bet, just like real money?)
The trick to poker is learning not to beat yourself up for your mistakes too much, and certainly not too little, but just the right amount.
Kennyrogers
Joined: Jul 22, 2012
• Posts: 2
July 22nd, 2012 at 11:30:41 AM permalink
I say zero risk Of losing as in actual cash. I can't do anything with these coupons except bet them, and I consider it not losing because no cash is coming out of my pocket.
ChesterDog
Joined: Jul 26, 2010
• Posts: 758
July 22nd, 2012 at 11:46:15 AM permalink
Quote: 24Bingo

ChesterDog: The OP's situation differs from that described in any part of that article, in that the chip's cash value is paid on a win. In that way, it's closest to a "non-neg."...

Thanks! You're right; I missed that point.
1BB
Joined: Oct 10, 2011
• Posts: 5339
July 22nd, 2012 at 2:45:59 PM permalink
Quote: wernerw

Well, I think your calculation is a little bit wrong. Not considering the house edge, your 10\$ coupon is really 10 bucks in your pocket. If you use ist on even money games, you win 50% of the games and lose 50%. Which gives you back 10\$ per coupon on average.

(as I said not considering the house edge)

Wow! I just noticed your join date. You've been here longer than most of our top posters....very cool!
Many people, especially ignorant people, want to punish you for speaking the truth. - Mahatma Ghandi
Ayecarumba
Joined: Nov 17, 2009
• Posts: 6497
July 24th, 2012 at 1:12:14 PM permalink
The Wizard's coupon page also has a link to this article by James Grosjean regarding free play coupons. In essence, he recommends playing high variance wagers to maximize the value of the free play. The best bet? A single number straight up on a single zero roulette wheel.

One questions though... What happens if you use it on blackjack and need to split two aces? Can you use a second coupon for the split? Also, what if a wager results in a push? Do you get to play it again, or do they convert it to chips?
Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication - Leonardo da Vinci
24Bingo
Joined: Jul 4, 2012
• Posts: 1348
July 24th, 2012 at 2:29:51 PM permalink
Quote: Ayecarumba

The Wizard's coupon page also has a link to this article by James Grosjean regarding free play coupons. In essence, he recommends playing high variance wagers to maximize the value of the free play. The best bet? A single number straight up on a single zero roulette wheel.

Again, that only applies if they confiscate the coupon on a win, since treating the original wager as already lost, free play gets 1/2 the prize on an even money wager, but 35/36 the prize on a single number. Since the coupon's value is paid out on a win in this case, that doesn't matter.
The trick to poker is learning not to beat yourself up for your mistakes too much, and certainly not too little, but just the right amount.
Ayecarumba
Joined: Nov 17, 2009
• Posts: 6497
July 24th, 2012 at 3:47:54 PM permalink
Quote: 24Bingo

Quote: Ayecarumba

The Wizard's coupon page also has a link to this article by James Grosjean regarding free play coupons. In essence, he recommends playing high variance wagers to maximize the value of the free play. The best bet? A single number straight up on a single zero roulette wheel.

Again, that only applies if they confiscate the coupon on a win, since treating the original wager as already lost, free play gets 1/2 the prize on an even money wager, but 35/36 the prize on a single number. Since the coupon's value is paid out on a win in this case, that doesn't matter.

I think it does matter if the coupon holder's goal is to maximize the value of their free play. The OP has the opportunity to risk nothing out of pocket to walk away with as much as \$23,400 on a series of single number straight up bets (or course there is also a good chance he could walk away with nothing). Alternately, he could guarantee ~\$630 on money wagers with hedges. What he chooses depends on his goal: maximum value or maximum guaranteed win.
Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication - Leonardo da Vinci