Where does thr Strip end?
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32 members have voted
So, mostly we can agree that the Strip begins with Mandalay Bay on the South end and goes on North. But where does it end?
My take is that from MB all the way to the Wynncore you have a continious series of casinos on either side of Las Vegas Blvd. Past the Wynncore there's empty space, rpetty much, for a stratch until you reach the Riviera and Circus Circus, then more empty space until you get to the Stratosphere. Therefore I put the end of the Strip at Wynncore.
If/when Vegas grows again and the stalled projects along the route from Wynncore to the former Sahara get going, I'd be willing to say the Strip ends at the Strat. Til then, if ever, the Wynncore it is.
For all intensive purposes, I'll vote for Wynn/Encore, since that's where most high-end properties end.
Quote: rdw4potusI went with the Strat. My logic is basically the opposite of yours - I don't think it shrunk when they leveled the strip casinos that formerly occupied the abyss north of Wynncore.
My thinking is from a pedestrian point of view. You can easily walk from MB to Wynncore, taking refuge from time to time in a casino, mall or shop along the way. There are people around and it feels safe. Past that, the streets are empty, it feels unsafe and there's no respite from the heat for a long while.
Quote: TiltpoulI would like to place my vote for the now defunct Sahara, because that's where the monorail ends. Of course, under this logic, the LV Hilton would be considered a strip property. My feeling is the Strat is just way too far from Sahara to really be considered a strip property.
Acording to the official site, the Sahara monorail station is still open. You have to exit on the street, though, as the passage to the Sahara is now closed. But as I recall, the Ace, or whatever that's called now, stopped right there, too, and I think there's an exit to Paradise Rd.
BTW speaking of the dead, the NASCAR cafe and associated attractions are being liquidated. That's the end of the Burrito Challenge.
Since Nareed is assuming we'll agree that the strip starts at Mandalay Bay, it can be inferred that we're talking about the tourist / resort district of what is commonly called "The Strip" as opposed to LV Blvd.Quote: Nareed... mostly we can agree that the Strip begins with Mandalay Bay on the South end and goes on North. But where does it end?
Just how dead is the no-man's-land between Wynncore and Riv/Circus? Isn't it still fairly packed with small retail establishments? If so, I'd say the end is at Circus/Riv. Beyond there is 1/2 mile of empty lots and abandoned construction to the Sahara and another 1/4 mile to Strat. When Sahara was open, it was a tough call. But now? And particularly considering that so many people exclude the Strat because it's within city limits, I voted Riv/Circus.
Of course, there are still plenty of people that like to remind us that the Strat is the only strip casino within city limits, so maybe the north end should always be the Strat.
Then again, since so many people that visit Vegas never even make it to Las Vegas (city) . . . .
Quote: NareedMy thinking is from a pedestrian point of view. You can easily walk from MB to Wynncore, taking refuge from time to time in a casino, mall or shop along the way. There are people around and it feels safe. Past that, the streets are empty, it feels unsafe and there's no respite from the heat for a long while.
You walk to the Riv to Mandalay Bay. Done it myself a couple of times, and always feel like you are on the strip. The Stratosphere only thinks it's on the strip. It's a not bad little pub crawl if your into such things (you can find decent drinking establishments all the way down if you like craft beers... though you might as well stop at NYNY's 32 taps, not found anywhere outstanding in the MB or Luxor, and the Excalibur can go whistle after my last couple of visits).
Quote: thecesspitnot found anywhere outstanding in the MB or Luxor
Burger Bar between MB and Luxor.
Quote: DJTeddyBearSince Nareed is assuming we'll agree that the strip starts at Mandalay Bay, it can be inferred that we're talking about the tourist / resort district of what is commonly called "The Strip" as opposed to LV Blvd.
Yes, that's what I mean. The LVB goes on for a really long stretch.
Quote:Just how dead is the no-man's-land between Wynncore and Riv/Circus? Isn't it still fairly packed with small retail establishments? If so, I'd say the end is at Circus/Riv. Beyond there is 1/2 mile of empty lots and abandoned construction to the Sahara and another 1/4 mile to Strat. When Sahara was open, it was a tough call. But now? And particularly considering that so many people exclude the Strat because it's within city limits, I voted Riv/Circus.
As I recall there's more in the way of shops, bars and restaurants past the Sahara towards the Strat, than past the Wynncore towards the Riv. But my memory for such things isn't excellent and my sense of direction barely deserves the name.
Most people new to vegas know about the Strip, and think that's where everythign is. Many figure if something's not on the Strip it's just not worth looking at, much less visiting. And, truthfully, when relying on the bus system, it's more convenient to stick to the Strip and Downtown almost exclusively. So all casinos that can claim to be on-Strip will do so.
This bring sup other considerations. The Rio or the Palms claim to be "just off-Strip." I'd say it's more than that, particularly as you ahve to cross the freeway to get there, but they do run free shuttles to and from the Strip propper. Anyway, "just off the Strip" is about as far as most tourists are willing to venture. But all such palces are to the sides of the Strip. Where does that leave the Strat?
Calling it "just off strip" seems ridiculous as it is int eh same street. So I guess I'd say it's "just past the Strip."
I didn't look for evidence of this, but I gotta believe that when the Strat was built, there was the belief that eventually there would be more casinos between it and Circus on that side of the road.Quote: NareedThe Rio or the Palms claim to be "just off-Strip." ... Where does that leave the Strat?
Calling it "just off strip" seems ridiculous as it is int eh same street. So I guess I'd say it's "just past the Strip."
Or was it 5? I forget.
I say that Hooters, hard Rock, Orleans, Ellis Island, Tuscany, that tiny little casino near the Ellis Island under the nice hotel, Gold Coast Palms and Rio are all "just off strip". I'm probably stretching a point on the Orleans, as I've never walked there from the strip, but have to all the others, but there is a shuttle at the Orleans to Bill's, and I normally stay there, so there we go. You can argue with me on it, and I'll concede :)
Quote: WizardI voted for Riv/Circus. You still see pedestrian traffic between the Encore and Riv, but hardly any between the Riv and Stratosphere. Granted it is a slippery slope, but sometimes you just have to draw a line in the sand. Otherwise, one might argue it should extend from the M to Jerry's Nugget.
Now if the vast wasteland around the Stratosphere was suddenly filled with mega-structures and throngs of people milling about you would clearly say that strip extended to and encompassed the Stratosphere but ended at the Stratosphere. Its beginning of course is at the bottom of the map which usually means Mandalay Bay. Alot of this is dependent on the Chamber of Commerce distributed tourist maps.
In reality of course the strip started in Las Vegas because it was all the people there who marveled at the upstart who built a casino out in nowheresville and started getting vehicular traffic before the vehicles even arrived in Las Vegas. So the Stratosphere should be the start of the strip. Its not.
The M is actually on the same named road (except for that "North" "South" thing) but no one thinks of the M as being on the strip any more than they think of arriving at the M by a flying crow.
Where would a landlord advertising property stop using the name Strip? Or "strip view"?
What places are in Henderson and what places are located in Hendertucky? Would a person from Kentucky have a different opinion on that matter? Or would a person who lived in a trailer park have a different opinion?
Quote: DJTeddyBearI didn't look for evidence of this, but I gotta believe that when the Strat was built, there was the belief that eventually there would be more casinos between it and Circus on that side of the road.
Without knowing the dates invovled I can say without hesitation: hell yes!
Vegas had been growing since the early 90s. Old hotels were imploded and new ones spruted like mushrooms. Deals were made, properties bought and sold, etc etc. besides, there are lots of unfinished and unstarted projects all over the area: Fountainbleau, Echelon, the Plaza (after the NY Plaza)... Which still elaves the Strat in a peculiar location, unless it was meant to have a good view of both the Strip and Downtown.
Unless I can write in "Gold and Silver Pawn."
Quote: FleaStiffIn reality of course the strip started in Las Vegas because it was all the people there who marveled at the upstart who built a casino out in nowheresville and started getting vehicular traffic before the vehicles even arrived in Las Vegas. So the Stratosphere should be the start of the strip.
Just the opposite, for the same reason. The vehicle traffic is coming in from California, so Mandalay Bay is where they "start" entering the strip at the "Welcome to Las Vegas" sign. So the welcome sign is the start.
The end, for my travels, is Wynn, but I voted Riv/CC as the current end as they are on the strip. If The Sahara were still around I probably would have gone with the Stratosphere.
Quote: WizardI voted for Riv/Circus. You still see pedestrian traffic between the Encore and Riv, but hardly any between the Riv and Stratosphere. Granted it is a slippery slope, but sometimes you just have to draw a line in the sand. Otherwise, one might argue it should extend from the M to Jerry's Nugget.
The only official legislative body that weighs in on this matter is the Nevada Gaming Commission. They have stated that the Stratosphere is not in the Las Vegas Strip Area (their phrase), but Palace Station, the former Sahara, Riviera, Hilton, Circus Circus, ... (including Palms, Gold Coast, Rio) ... (including Terrible's and Hard Rock)... down to Mandalay Bay are "strip area" properties. The slot club at the airport is also included.
There are 43 gaming licenses in the Las Vegas Strip Area with 39 that make over $1 million per year, and 3 that make $1-$12m, 7 that make $12-$36m, 7 that make $36m-$72m, and 22 that make over $72m (latest month reported May 2011).
Venetian/Palazzo, Wynn/Encore, Circus Circus/Slots-A-Fun, and Flamingo/O'Shea's are single licenses.
Most people choose a narrower definition, but it is purely subjective. The term "North Strip" as everything north of the Encore and Trump's Hotel is almost universally understood.
That's what I remember from my early trips to Vegas. I'd go "there it is" in my head.
Quote: pacomartinThe only official legislative body that weighs in on this matter is the Nevada Gaming Commission. They have stated that the Stratosphere is not in the Las Vegas Strip Area (their phrase), but Palace Station, the former Sahara, Riviera, Hilton, Circus Circus, ... (including Palms, Gold Coast, Rio) ... (including Terrible's and Hard Rock)... down to Mandalay Bay are "strip area" properties. The slot club at the airport is also included.
Officially doesn't matter in this case. I doubt the gaming commission would say anything if the Strat advertised itself as being "on the Las Vegas Strip," as that pertains to attracting customers. In any case it's whether or not people think it's on the Strip.
If you're going to stay in a hotel anywhere, but want to get easily to the Strip using public transportation, then the Start is more "on" the Strip than Terrible's or Hard Rock. The Ace and Deuce boths top there, at different parts of the property, and face little traffic heading into Wynncore territory. From Terrible's the wait for a bus on Flamingo can be quite long. I walked all the way to the Strip before a bus even came by, for instance.
One corner of the airport actually borders LV Blvd.Quote: pacomartinThe slot club at the airport is also included.
But nobody except the NGC considers it to be a part of The Strip.
What we're looking for is what any reasonable person would define as "The Strip."
FYI: Technically, the airport is not on "The Strip" as we're defining it. The Northern edge of the corner that borders LV Blvd is just a couple feet South of the point adjacent to the location of the famous Las Vegas sign.
A fair conclusion. However, many people do drive. And if its very hot, a great many people wouldn't be walking as far as Circus/Riviera anyway. So its a flexible location.Quote: MarkAbeNow I'd put the end at Circus/Riviera, because those are the farthest north of what were always thought of as strip properties and nobody walks north of them any more.
Quote: NareedOfficially doesn't matter in this case. I doubt the gaming commission would say anything if the Strat advertised itself as being "on the Las Vegas Strip," as that pertains to attracting customers. In any case it's whether or not people think it's on the Strip.
When you read a news article like:
Las Vegas on track for third place among world’s gambling meccas which says According to an estimate this month from Royal Bank of Scotland, Singapore’s two casino resorts are on track to generate gambling revenue of $6.4 billion this year, higher than the Las Vegas Strip’s anticipated $6.2 billion. Both Las Vegas Sands-owned Marina Bay Sands and Genting-owned Resorts World Sentosa opened last year.
Dropping to third place, the 42 casinos on the Las Vegas Strip reported $5.8 billion in gambling revenue last year. That’s a 15 percent decline from the market peak in 2007, when there were 38 casinos on and around the Strip.
it is helpful to know what they are officially defining as the Las Vegas Strip. The two areas are pretty much neck and neck right now.
However, if you were to modify the official definition of the strip to not include: Airport Slot club, Terrible's, Hard Rock, Wild Wild West, Palms, Gold Coast, Rio, Palace Station, Hilton, Riviera, Circus Circus to meet your personal definition, then Singapore would almost certainly win.
But the NGC doesn't care who advertises themselves as being on the strip. "South Point" implies they are on the extreme southern portion of the strip. They were careful to have a Las Vegas Blvd address.
Quote: pacomartinHowever, if you were to modify the official definition of the strip to not include: Airport Slot club, Terrible's, Hard Rock, Wild Wild West, Palms, Gold Coast, Rio, Palace Station, Hilton, Riviera, Circus Circus to meet your personal definition, then Singapore would almost certainly win.
Fair enough.
But my question then would be: how does the whole of Vegas, including casinos way off Strip, like the Red Rock, M, South Point, Rampart, etc etc, as well as Downtown and Boulder Strip, does in comparison to Singapore? Why is the Strip as a division of the gaming commission relevant by itself?
I mean, is there too little crossover between Strip, Off Strip and Downtown? I've stayed on Strip twice and at the Rio once, yet I've gambled both at the Strip and Downtown. I'd have gone to the Boulder Strip, too, had there been something there to draw me, too.
I know Vegas is a mishmash of administrative zones, but the average well informed tourist, namely me, cares little about that. I play where I like playing. Sometimes I want the Strip ambiance, sometimes Downtown's. As it takes but a few minutes and a little money to get from one to the other, I do it freely.
Ok, as regards out of state tourism, I suppose most people concentrate on the Strip, some off Strip properties like Rio, Hard Rock and Palms, and Downtown. So you may want to exclude the Boulder Strip, Red Rock, Rampart, Henderson, etc for analysis of how well Vegas does drawing tourists. But I don't see any other relevant reason.
Quote: rxwineI think it starts (if you're driving at night) when you see the glow of the city just over whichever mountain is still blocking your view.
That's what I remember from my early trips to Vegas. I'd go "there it is" in my head.
Coming from LA that glow sometimes starts in Barstow and there's no neon involved.
From http://www.cocktaildoll.com/didyouknow.htm:
Quote: Cocktail DollDrinking on the street is legal.
According to Steve Easley, who teaches an alcohol awareness class, it is legal to have an open container on the strip corridor and downtown. The strip corridor is on Las Vegas Blvd. between Russell Rd. and Sahara Ave.
Although I'm not a drinker, getting hammered in public seems to be one of a tourist's requisite goals when visiting The Strip. Therefore, the places where that's legal, seems to be an acceptable definition of The Strip's boundaries.
Note: Cocktail Doll is not known for keeping her website up-to-date. The open container zone still seems like a good definition, but may have changed since Sahara closed.
Quote: DJTeddyBearAlthough I'm not a drinker, getting hammered in public seems to be one of a tourist's requisite goals when visiting The Strip. Therefore, the places where that's legal, seems to be an acceptable definition of The Strip's boundaries.
That's actually a good, solid, practical definition. But the Strip still ends at the Wynncore, IMO :)
FYI: Open containers are legal for pedestrians. It's still illegal to have an open container in a car - and that includes the back of a limo.
Quote: DJTeddyBearWell, since Nareed is the original poster, and agrees with my suggestion, we need to find out the official boundries of the open container zone - and see if they jive with what we're thinking.
I don't suppose the ordinance allowing open alcohol containers, or the exception to the ordinance forbidding them, has changed. Government isn't swift.
I also can't see people drinking while ambling past the wastelands of what used to be the Strip. But then I don't drink much or often. Still, on my first trip while waiting for the belalgio fountains to get going, I had a frozen lemonade with vodka at an open-air bar at Caesars. As shwotime neared, I quite casually walked over to the Bellagio drink in hand. I dind't think anythign of it til after the fountains show, and by then I'd finished it.
Quote:FYI: Open containers are legal for pedestrians. It's still illegal to have an open container in a car - and that includes the back of a limo.
Drunk driving is a serious matter. But I don't see why you can't drink in the back of a limo if the limo company doesn't mind. It's not like limo passengers will need to drive it.
Quote: NareedI don't see why you can't drink in the back of a limo if the limo company doesn't mind. It's not like limo passengers will need to drive it.
I think the theory is that by allowing passengers in any motorized vehicle to drink makes it too easy for the driver to be drinking and then pass the drink to a passenger if they are pulled over.
Neither do I. It seems like such a natural.Quote: Gabes22I don't understand the line of thinking with not allowing open containers in a limo.
I'd think that they can't legally do that, unless they have a liquor license.Quote: Gabes22I am getting married in a couple months and we have a fully stocked Limo ordered.
Sure, they can let you stock it yourself, but to provide the booze? Nope.
But then there's still the open container issue. Maybe if they don't care about that, they don't care about the license either.
Quote: NareedFair enough.
But my question then would be: how does the whole of Vegas, including casinos way off Strip, like the Red Rock, M, South Point, Rampart, etc etc, as well as Downtown and Boulder Strip, does in comparison to Singapore? Why is the Strip as a division of the gaming commission relevant by itself?
Some companies report on "tourism zones" which they define as (1)strip, (2)downtown, (3)Mesquite, and (4) Laughlin where the last two are distant from the urban area. The rest of the zones (1)Boulder Strip & Henderson, (2) North Las Vegas, (3) Rest of Clark County are called "locals casinos". All seven of those zones are "Clark County".
Latest numbers for State of Nevada is $10.5 billion, and Clark County is $9.0 billion (which is much greater than Singapore). Clark County has almost 200 casinos, while Singapore has 2.
Commercial gaming in the USA is $34.60 billion as of 2010 down from a peak of $37.52 in 2007. Other sorts of gaming (Indian casinos, bingo, charity, state lotteries, add up about double what the commercial gaming industry makes). Although I have never seen it calculated, I think government gets more than half of the total income from legalized gambling in the USA. I am basing this on my knowledge of tax rates, and what the government makes on lotteries.
Nevada still has by far the biggest share of gaming in the USA. The reason is historical, plus the very low tax rate.
Macau should easily surpass the entire USA commercial gaming total this year.
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The unexpected explosion in revenue in Macau and Singapore means that one or several other Asian countries will introduce casinos. Singapore is probably limited by it's number of hotel rooms, and is not inclined to build thousands more. Vietnam, Phillippines, Korea, Thailand, Malaysia, Indonesia are all possibilities.
Quote: DJTeddyBearNeither do I. It seems like such a natural.
I'd think that they can't legally do that, unless they have a liquor license.
Sure, they can let you stock it yourself, but to provide the booze? Nope.
But then there's still the open container issue. Maybe if they don't care about that, they don't care about the license either.
The Limo company is providing chilled champagne and beer. That is actually part of the wedding package, and they aren't exactly hiding it by providing it on their website.
