rhitusc
rhitusc
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November 5th, 2010 at 10:05:15 PM permalink
Hey Wiz, my friend and I love your sites are hoping to get an answer (from you or any other knowledgable person visiting these forums) to something which has been bugging him for quite a while.

First a little disclaimer: we are both engineers (he a six sigma black belt) and understand that for all intents and purposes each hand in mini baccarat is independent, regardless of all the fancy computer displays or counting systems that players use.

GIVEN THAT, HOWEVER, he enjoys the playing the game (even if he doesn't always bet the banker). Many of the mini bac tables (especially at the MGM/Mirage casinos in Vegas) have a computer display which shows the past winning hands with blue and red (filled-in) dots on the top portion of the screen (call this section 1). Then they also have a section just below that which shows hollow red and blue circles (section 2), which we suspect indicates some kind of run length (because the number of circles is less than the number of hands played). Below that they have another section (section 3) with filled in red and blue dots and to the right of that (section 4) they have a series of red and blue hash marks. Finally at the bottom (section 5) they also have red and blue dots which just represent all the played hands serpentined in columns (maybe 8 rows high). They also have a legend to the bottom right with the corresponding hollow circles, slash marks, and B/P which we are guessing helps a little with the decoding.

We have watched these displays for a while and have not been able to figure out the meaning of sections 2-4 and it is really starting to bug him. He has asked virtually all the dealers and pit bosses (including in the high limit areas) what they mean but to no avail. The usual answer is "No, I don't know what they mean". Sometimes the pit boss will say they know what the displays indicate and then when we probe further they resort to "well, it is just another system for counting".
We also also heard them referred to as the macau system, and one pit boss said the section 2-4 are "little man, big man, and cockroach", respectively.

We were hoping you could shed some more light on these systems, so my friend could employ the full use of predictive tools at the table (LOL)


Also there is a game which they used to have at MGM, NYNY called EZ Bac with a "dragon" bet which pays 40 to 1. He liked that variation on the game and was disappointed to find out that they have taken them out of the MGM casinos (now he has to resort to the Hustler in LA). He was wondering that the actual house edge on the dragon bet is?

Thanks again fort he great sites and any insight you can lend.
Wizard
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Wizard
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November 5th, 2010 at 10:29:10 PM permalink
You know more about the information shown on those signs than I do. I've been meaning to find out, maybe I'll come back here with something on that. In Macau the signs have a lot more details than the casinos here. There is a big gaming show in town Nov 16-18, I bet there will be at least one such sign maker there I can annoy with questions.

The answer to the Dragon Bet question can be found on my site.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
7winner
7winner
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November 5th, 2010 at 10:33:24 PM permalink
The Dragon Bet can be found at the Wizard of Odds site also: https://wizardofodds.com/baccarat/baccaratapx5.html#dragonbet
Quote: rhitusc

We have watched these displays for a while and have not been able to figure out the meaning of sections 2-4 and it is really starting to bug him. He has asked virtually all the dealers and pit bosses (including in the high limit areas) what they mean but to no avail. The usual answer is "No, I don't know what they mean". Sometimes the pit boss will say they know what the displays indicate and then when we probe further they resort to "well, it is just another system for counting".
We also also heard them referred to as the macau system, and one pit boss said the section 2-4 are "little man, big man, and cockroach", respectively.


The EZTRAK™: Baccarat Edition
Website: http://www.deq.com/
PDF free: http://www.deq.com/section/products/pdf/EZTrakBaccarat.pdf
7 winner chicken dinner!
rhitusc
rhitusc
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November 5th, 2010 at 10:43:09 PM permalink
That would be great, Wiz, any info would ease my buddy's mind so that he can better concentrate on his own personal system!
rhitusc
rhitusc
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November 5th, 2010 at 10:44:19 PM permalink
also, I should have known, that you would have already covered, EZ Bac, thanks for the link!
Wizard
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Wizard
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November 6th, 2010 at 8:09:07 AM permalink
Quote: 7winner


The EZTRAK™: Baccarat Edition
Website: http://www.deq.com/
PDF free: http://www.deq.com/section/products/pdf/EZTrakBaccarat.pdf



That sign shows a minimum amount of information. There is a color for Banker and a color for Player, and they stack them vertically as long as the streak keeps goes. I think a natural is noted with a number in the middle. I don't know how ties are recorded.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
miplet
miplet
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November 6th, 2010 at 8:46:13 AM permalink
http://www.livedealer.org/blog/2010/09/the-baccarat-roadmap-manual/
That's the best explanation I can find.
“Man Babes” #AxelFabulous
dwheatley
dwheatley
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November 6th, 2010 at 12:13:29 PM permalink
Wow. What esoteric gobbledygook. I'd rather learn how to play go.
Wisdom is the quality that keeps you out of situations where you would otherwise need it
Wizard
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November 6th, 2010 at 4:42:57 PM permalink
Quote: miplet

http://www.livedealer.org/blog/2010/09/the-baccarat-roadmap-manual/
That's the best explanation I can find.



Good link, thanks. In my experience, the "big road" format is the most popular here, which the DEQ sign mentioned earlier follows.

In Macau, side by side on the same sign, they alow have the "bead road" format. I think also post percentage of all three outcomes, and other statistics as well.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
rhitusc
rhitusc
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November 11th, 2010 at 9:48:44 PM permalink
thanks miplet. That link is going to keep my buddy busy for a while!

and if anybody finds out anything else, any info is appreciated.
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