FrGamble
FrGamble
Joined: Jun 5, 2011
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March 6th, 2012 at 6:13:48 PM permalink
Quote: WongBo

Please provide quotations from a reputable study that links contraceptive use to increases in divorce, STD and unwanted pregnancy.
You cannot. I find your posts incredibly deceptive and dishonest. You know what you are saying is not true.
And yet you call yourself a man of the cloth.
How disappointing.



I'm sorry you feel that way. Maybe we can try to figure out what is causing such increases in divorce, STDs, and unwanted pregnancy. I'm not going to say it is all because of contraception. Contraception could be a symptom of a larger problem concerning our sexual morality. While I don't doubt your honest and I don't think you mean to be deceptive I hope you can see that we have a problem in society. You are so hung up on contraception that you can't see the bigger picture.

Think of this analogy I heard recently. If your kids were doing something dangerous like playing hopscotch on the freeway would you run out there and say, "What are you kids doing? Don't you know how dangerous this is? Here put on a helmet!" or would you grab the kids and get them off the freeway? When we misuse the awesome gift of our sexuality we are doing dangerous stuff and we need to get back on the sidewalk not put on more pads.
FrGamble
FrGamble
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March 6th, 2012 at 6:18:34 PM permalink
Opps, duplicate
EvenBob
EvenBob
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March 6th, 2012 at 6:26:12 PM permalink
Padre, do you honestly believe women are going to
give up the pill and buy a thermometer and devote
a bunch of time they don't have to not having a
baby? You're living is a dream world, only 2% of
married Catholic women do it, the majority of the
rest are on the pill. This discussion is silly.
"It's not enough to succeed, your friends must fail." Gore Vidal
boymimbo
boymimbo
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March 6th, 2012 at 7:17:06 PM permalink
Close, Bob.

2% of Catholics use Natural Family Planning. 31% use the pill. More than that use sterilization (tubal ligation / vasectomy). Other methods are slightly less prevalent than others.

My point exactly -- this discussion is silly! The Catholic Church should be working on so many other things and causes and let the contraception thing go. I think FrGamble's Original Post was timed with the political controversy of last week. Just stay out of it. Church and state are separated and the Catholic church should be a very minor player when it comes to reproductive issues.
----- You want the truth! You can't handle the truth!
FrGamble
FrGamble
Joined: Jun 5, 2011
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March 6th, 2012 at 7:42:54 PM permalink
What could be a bigger or a more important cause for all of society then the problems stemming from sexual immorality? I recognize that people don't want to talk about it and I'm sorry to bring it up. We always want to ignore the issues we find very challenging and we are slow to acknowledge changes that need to happen, especially when it requires what amounts to another revolution in how we think about sex. This is the source of the orginial post. The Catholic Church is the lone voice crying out in the desert calling us to a change of mind and heart, but like the prophets of old they are usually ignored and often persecuted. However because of the importance of this issue we cannot be quiet and must speak out and play a major role in the discussion of reproductive issues. We did not bring up this issue but we cannot stay out of it - it is far too important.
s2dbaker
s2dbaker
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March 6th, 2012 at 7:55:28 PM permalink
Quote: FrGamble

What could be a bigger or a more important cause for all of society then the problems stemming from sexual immorality?

Famine, Slavery, Genocide come to mind off the top of my head.
Someday, joor goin' to see the name of Googie Gomez in lights and joor goin' to say to joorself, "Was that her?" and then joor goin' to answer to joorself, "That was her!" But you know somethin' mister? I was always her yuss nobody knows it! - Googie Gomez
EvenBob
EvenBob
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March 6th, 2012 at 8:05:53 PM permalink
Quote: FrGamble

What could be a bigger or a more important cause for all of society then the problems stemming from sexual immorality?



A bigger question is, why has the Church been obsessed
with sex for 1500 years? Padre, this is what happens when
you tell intelligent adults they can't have sex. They become
obsessed with it. I know you think you have good reasons
for the obsession. You don't...
"It's not enough to succeed, your friends must fail." Gore Vidal
pacomartin
pacomartin
Joined: Jan 14, 2010
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March 6th, 2012 at 8:09:19 PM permalink
Quote: FrGamble

What could be a bigger or a more important cause for all of society then the problems stemming from sexual immorality?



I have to hand it to you father. I imagine that discussing the prohibition against artificial contraception is difficult with a group of married Catholic parishioners, let alone a more general forum. Perhaps I can add some comments in support of your position.


There are now 2 billion people in the world living in countries that have fertility levels that will produce incredible aging populations, little or no families, generations of single children, and very long term the destruction of their society just as surely as overpopulation.

Many of these countries have bought some short term financial stability, that is until most of the population exceeds retirement age. As someone observed, however, single children are not naturally communists, when making his commentary on the little emperor generation.

Within my lifetime, many of these countries were almost stereotyped by their large families; countries such as Greece, Italy, Spain,Portugal, and China. Sometimes it seems as if the mostly Catholic countries adopted to birth control with a zeal that exceeded that of the mostly Protestant countries that had adopted birth control a generation before.

Disasters such as the tsunami in Japan are magnified by video of millions of elderly as the oldest population on the planet struggles with the physical demands of evacuating.

1.54 China
1.54 Guernsey
1.53 Liechtenstein
1.52 Malta
1.50 Monaco
1.50 Montenegro
1.50 Portugal
1.48 Albania
1.47 San Marino
1.47 Spain
1.46 Switzerland
1.45 Cyprus
1.45 Georgia
1.44 Cuba
1.44 Estonia
1.43 Croatia
1.42 Bulgaria
1.42 Russia
1.41 Germany
1.40 Austria
1.40 Hungary
1.40 Serbia
1.39 Italy
1.38 Greece
1.37 Armenia
1.37 Slovakia
1.35 Andorra
1.32 Latvia
1.30 Poland
1.30 Slovenia
1.29 Moldova
1.29 Romania
1.28 Ukraine
1.27 Bosnia and Herzegovina
1.26 Belarus
1.26 Czech Republic
1.26 Montserrat
1.25 Lithuania
1.23 Korea, South
1.21 Japan
1.15 Taiwan
1.11 Singapore
1.07 Hong Kong
0.92 Macau
FrGamble
FrGamble
Joined: Jun 5, 2011
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March 6th, 2012 at 8:14:12 PM permalink
Quote: s2dbaker

Famine, Slavery, Genocide come to mind off the top of my head.



I think even you and I could agree that those are all big problems. The uniqueness of the problem regarding sexual immorality such as contraception, casual sex, pornography, etc. is that people are still bamboozled or brainwashed into thinking these are not serious problems.
reno
reno
Joined: Jan 20, 2010
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March 6th, 2012 at 8:46:00 PM permalink
Quote: MathExtremist

Thus demonstrating that outrage dulls the perception of sarcasm.



:) Yes, my snarky comment was definitely meant as sarcasm. There's a lot of great things about Catholicism, but they simply refuse to accept the fact that God gave humans a sex drive. Contraception prevents abortions, so the Church's opposition to contraception is... uh, weird.

Quote: Humanae Vitae

Another effect that gives cause for alarm is that a man who grows accustomed to the use of contraceptive methods may forget the reverence due to a woman, and, disregarding her physical and emotional equilibrium, reduce her to being a mere instrument for the satisfaction of his own desires, no longer considering her as his partner whom he should surround with care and affection.



Occasionally my wife initiates sex. Yes, she occasionally uses me as a mere instrument to satisfy her own desires, but I don't mind. Why must the Church criticize women for using the clitoris that God gave them?

Asking humans to use sex only for procreation is like asking humans to eat only to prevent starvation. We eat more than we need to, and we have sex more than we need to. Why must the Church criticize humans for being human? Jesus said something about not judging....

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