troopscott
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May 5th, 2018 at 6:45:45 AM permalink
Wife and I are pretty likely to be moving to vegas in July. Want to go to dealer school.

Want to do Craps, Pai Gow, Roulette, and BJ thoughts on any other games?

Which school in Vegas is best? Was looking at PCI
GlenG
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May 6th, 2018 at 3:29:59 AM permalink
There might be casinos that offers in house training(some pay some do not)..I would look into that first


Blackjack and possibly paigow can definitely be self taught. I'm sure theres a guide somewhere on the internet for basic procedures..buy BJ felt and a shoe on Ebay.

The others, idk...I self taught roulette and the casino offered a class for craps
FleaStiff
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May 6th, 2018 at 3:42:01 AM permalink
Sure watch videos on youtube and stuff but you will probably need a live class not only for the 'diploma' but for learning various techniques that are not covered such as how to tap in, etc.

Watch out for some of those "schools" in Vegas that are jokes and mainly for foreign language speakers.

There is a FREE school operated by one of the Wizards friends Vegas Vixen or something like that. I'll try to find the link and post her correct name here later. (Coffee has not yet taken effect).

Craps is the longest and hardest. You not only learn math but how to handle chips, pay certain players with your left hand and pay other players with your right hand so as to avoid your arm or hand blocking a clear view of the chips you are pushing out. The Box and the cameras want to see what stacks you are pushing out.

Its generally recommended that you know BlackJack and at least one other game. There are cheap schools in Biloxi I understand. And in Vegas, don't overlook the community college courses.

LATE FLASH: Her name is Heather Ferris and her website is vegas hyphen aces dot com.
Last edited by: FleaStiff on May 6, 2018
RS
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May 6th, 2018 at 4:15:24 AM permalink
Quote: troopscott

Wife and I are pretty likely to be moving to vegas in July. Want to go to dealer school.

Want to do Craps, Pai Gow, Roulette, and BJ thoughts on any other games?

Which school in Vegas is best? Was looking at PCI


PCI is a great dealer school.

If you're already familiar with the different games, then you should be able to pick it up rather quickly. They have a thing where you can pay $400 for 4 weeks of class, which is about how long it should take to learn the games you want to learn. If you want to take your time and/or aren't super familiar with the games, then the $499 deal is probably best to learn 3 games.

When I went to dealer school, many people there didn't even know anything about gambling....like, at all.


IME, you just need to know blackjack, guaranteed, to get a dealing job. Knowing craps makes you a LOT more hire-able, plus, it's the funnest game to deal, IMO. Roulette isn't particularly difficult to deal, once you figure out how to spin the ball, it's easy, all you gotta do is learn the payouts. But the payouts is just memorization, which you can do when you're not at school, but at home and whatnot. It's also kinda hard to learn to push a few stacks, but once you get the form down, you can pretty much push any number of stacks.


PaiGow and Baccarat, you don't really need to learn, and IMO should be the last games to learn. PaiGow you just gotta know how to set the cards house way, again, that's just memorization. In baccarat you just need to learn the drawing rules, which are confusing AF, but again, that's just memorization. Whichever casino you initially apply for, they're very likely not going to care if you can deal PGP or bacc, since those games aren't super common in break-in houses (el cortez, jokers wild, eastside cannery, etc.). Plus, they'll "teach" you those games at the job....which basically means they'll just give you a piece of paper that has the rules of the game, you memorize the rules and practice on your own time, then a little while later when you're comfortable, they'll put you on a game and someone will "shadow" you, where they just watch you to make sure you aren't messing everything up.


Don't bother learning carny games until you actually get a job. But even then, chances are, they'll just put you on a game and say "deal it, learn it while you deal" and you'll be on your own from there. I haven't dealt any of those games, other than TCP, but they're easy, assuming you can see a flush, straight, pairs, etc. and know which hands beat which hands.


Toughest thing with blackjack is hodling a double deck, dealing with just 1 hand, since they're not going to want you doing stuff with your left hand (which holds the cards). Definitely get two decks of cards and just practice holding them in your hand when you're doing something like watching TV, so it's not all awkward feeling holding them.

Craps is kind of a b**** to learn because you gotta remember the different payouts, which isn't terribly hard, but a lot of information. The harder part is remembering the order of everything you gotta do and remembering everything you gotta do. Then later on, being able to do everything in the correct order, with the correct payout, relatively quickly. But anyone who auditions for a job at a break-in house isn't going to be dealing quickly. Any craps dealer I've asked said they still didn't feel "completely comfortable" on a craps game for several years.

IMO the toughest part is the prop box, because you need to be able to come up with the payouts quickly, and there are going to be many that hit at the same time. On the come out roll, you'll have these idiots that have a $10 horn, $1 yo, and a $15 world bet....the 2 is rolled, then you gotta figure out what all that nonsense pays, then the next guy might have something else that's equally as confusing....PLUS, you gotta remember who has which bet....that's something that just takes time before you can remember who has all the different prop bets. It definitely helps if you try to pro-actively figure out what stuff pays. If someone has a $214 place bet on the eight, try to figure it out ahead of time, BEFORE it hits....especially if you have lots of confusing bets.
aceofspades
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May 6th, 2018 at 4:36:36 AM permalink
My friend owns and operates this free online dealer school and has worked with the Wizard:

Vegas Aces
troopscott
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May 6th, 2018 at 7:28:21 AM permalink
thank you for the responses

I can deal blackjack and pai gow (favorite game) but thought I needed to go through school. Know the rules inside and out and the math is easy

Craps I play a ton of and know all of the payouts. Math is my strong suit so no issues there.

In all honesty my interest in roulette is this. Back around 2000 I was in a casino )argosy) in Indiana and a guy comes to the table and bets quarters on 0-1-10-13-27 then drops a nickel on top of each one for the dealer. Dealer declares boys this is where I am aiming. Proceeded to hit the next 7 spins there. missed the next four when the floor came over then hit the next two when they walked away and said that's it

guys leaves

I have done this a few times as well with my success coming from an Asian guy at the Excalibur on multiple sessions and trips was able to replicate it very well (argosy guy was better) and I am just curious if a roulette dealer can drop a ball in a zone with practice

Craps is what I want to deal (most fun) but it is dishearting tips with the craps guys who appear to do the most work are split with the big 6 wheel girls
FleaStiff
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May 6th, 2018 at 7:31:18 AM permalink
Quote: aceofspades

My friend owns and operates this free online dealer school and has worked with the Wizard:
Vegas Aces

Yeah, I mentioned her web site upthread but failed to emphasize that it was an online school.
Dice dealers have to learn the various stick calls and practice doing things in that order as well as doing them in proper style.

The math is of course beyond me but I am told that dice dealers will often pick a certain bet and then mentally calculate the proper payouts for each and every license plate that they see that day. This gives them practice in quick math but also in weird amounts being bet which is often something that is encountered. Having license plate numbers means it is more of a challenge than memorizing tables or using a deck of random flash cards.

As to knowledge of gambling many dealers are Mormons who grew up in homes that did not even have a deck of cards in it since Mormons often refer to playing cards as "the devil's portraits". They have to start off with the different suits, the number of cards in each suit, etc.
aceofspades
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May 6th, 2018 at 7:36:33 AM permalink
Quote: FleaStiff

Quote: aceofspades

My friend owns and operates this free online dealer school and has worked with the Wizard:
Vegas Aces

Yeah, I mentioned her web site upthread but failed to emphasize that it was an online school.
Dice dealers have to learn the various stick calls and practice doing things in that order as well as doing them in proper style.

The math is of course beyond me but I am told that dice dealers will often pick a certain bet and then mentally calculate the proper payouts for each and every license plate that they see that day. This gives them practice in quick math but also in weird amounts being bet which is often something that is encountered. Having license plate numbers means it is more of a challenge than memorizing tables or using a deck of random flash cards.

As to knowledge of gambling many dealers are Mormons who grew up in homes that did not even have a deck of cards in it since Mormons often refer to playing cards as "the devil's portraits". They have to start off with the different suits, the number of cards in each suit, etc.



I think I was only half-awake when I read this thread so I missed your mention :)
AZDuffman
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May 6th, 2018 at 8:07:36 AM permalink
Learning craps firs will be tough. Really tough if you cannot handle cheques or/and are not used to dealing with players in any way.

Learn cheque handling first, but learn it right. A girl I deal party nights with asked me about dealer school. See my blog for how it went, it is a few years back. Anyhow, when I showed her simple cutting in, she did a jaw-drop. She tried practicing but I stopped her as she was practicing wrong.

HANDS-HANDS-HANDS-HANDS-HANDS

First step is good hands. Watch several YT videos to learn right, just one may be teaching bad.

Learning craps will be 4 hours of class and 2-4 hours of practice, 5 days a week, for a month. Good craps dealers will be harder to find for a casino, but there is a good reason for that.

Learn odds for all the place bets. Then make a "bet of the day." Say 7-6 place bet on the 6/8. Look at the last 2 digits of the license plate of the car in front of you. Then figure the payout. Do it until it is instant. Then do it more.
All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others
billryan
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May 6th, 2018 at 10:29:17 AM permalink
Is what school you attended an influence in getting hired? Do the schools help set up interviews/auditions?
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
Lucca3927
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May 6th, 2018 at 11:39:40 AM permalink
I'm a former crap dealer. Some casinos will recommend a dealer school for you. Something simple, like Yelp or Indeed will word just as well.

FYI, the cardinal rule of dealing craps is to collect the losing bets first and, when you're the stick man, never take your eyes off of the dice.
"I should have bet black." - Winston Churchill .
Nathan
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May 6th, 2018 at 11:42:56 AM permalink
Is it just me or does the idea of a dealer school seem a bit ludicrous? What's wrong with the Casino themselves training you on the spot to become a dealer?
Last edited by: Nathan on May 6, 2018
In both The Hunger Games and in gambling, may the odds be ever in your favor. :D "Man Babes" #AxelFabulous "Olive oil is processed but it only has one ingredient, olive oil."-Even Bob, March 27/28th. :D The 2 year war is over! Woo-hoo! :D I sometimes speak in metaphors. ;) Remember this. ;) Crack the code. :D 8.9.13.25.14.1.13.5.9.19.14.1.20.8.1.14! :D "For about the 4096th time, let me offer a radical idea to those of you who don't like Nathan -- block her and don't visit Nathan's Corner. What is so complicated about it?" Wizard, August 21st. :D
AZDuffman
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May 6th, 2018 at 11:57:27 AM permalink
Quote: Nathan

Is it just me or does the idea of a dealer school seem a bit ludicrous? What's wrong with the Casino themselves training you on the spot to become a dealer? Thanks



In some markets they do due to lack of other options. But most skilled jobs require you to get most of your training on your own. In a market like LV, all the casino would be doing is training for the competition. Put another way, as I once told a co-worker who kept looking for someone to "train him in computers," --why should someone invest in you when you have not invested in yourself first?
All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others
Nathan
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May 6th, 2018 at 12:07:45 PM permalink
Quote: AZDuffman

In some markets they do due to lack of other options. But most skilled jobs require you to get most of your training on your own. In a market like LV, all the casino would be doing is training for the competition. Put another way, as I once told a co-worker who kept looking for someone to "train him in computers," --why should someone invest in you when you have not invested in yourself first?



Oh my God. I don't know how the "Thanks," ended up in my question. Damn auto correct! I have edited out the word "Thanks,"
In both The Hunger Games and in gambling, may the odds be ever in your favor. :D "Man Babes" #AxelFabulous "Olive oil is processed but it only has one ingredient, olive oil."-Even Bob, March 27/28th. :D The 2 year war is over! Woo-hoo! :D I sometimes speak in metaphors. ;) Remember this. ;) Crack the code. :D 8.9.13.25.14.1.13.5.9.19.14.1.20.8.1.14! :D "For about the 4096th time, let me offer a radical idea to those of you who don't like Nathan -- block her and don't visit Nathan's Corner. What is so complicated about it?" Wizard, August 21st. :D
FleaStiff
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May 6th, 2018 at 1:04:27 PM permalink
some casinos hold job fairs and provide training but its in limited markets, not Vegas.

All schools PROMISE to help with auditions/referrals but few can really provide anything more than inviting some break in joint to schedule a group interview or some such nonsense.

An online school might be good but how will they see your hands???
AZDuffman
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May 6th, 2018 at 1:12:40 PM permalink
Quote: FleaStiff


All schools PROMISE to help with auditions/referrals but few can really provide anything more than inviting some break in joint to schedule a group interview or some such nonsense.



Do any community colleges in NV offer classes? Seems that they might have more pull to get someone an audition, though in a market like LV at best it will still be a break-in joint no matter what,

When I was in class part way thru some guy who was a dealer other places showed up as he wanted to be on an opening crew. He said he went to Vegas but soon found out that even today you need serious juice and even cash to get a strip gig.
All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others
RS
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May 6th, 2018 at 3:56:07 PM permalink
You don't need to go to dealer school to get hired, at least in LV. You can do a live audition at many break-in houses, I recommend calling them and asking if and when they do auditions. If you have experience and want to work at a non-break-in house, then put in an application at whichever casino, and list your experience.

But I certainly don't recommend auditioning on a craps game if you don't have any experience dealing craps. Same goes for any other game, for that matter.
AZDuffman
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May 6th, 2018 at 3:58:27 PM permalink
Quote: RS

You don't need to go to dealer school to get hired, at least in LV. You can do a live audition at many break-in houses, I recommend calling them and asking if and when they do auditions. If you have experience and want to work at a non-break-in house, then put in an application at whichever casino, and list your experience.

But I certainly don't recommend auditioning on a craps game if you don't have any experience dealing craps. Same goes for any other game, for that matter.



Gaming control board does not have a requirement?
All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others
GlenG
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May 6th, 2018 at 4:02:51 PM permalink
Quote: RS

You don't need to go to dealer school to get hired, at least in LV. You can do a live audition at many break-in houses, I recommend calling them and asking if and when they do auditions. If you have experience and want to work at a non-break-in house, then put in an application at whichever casino, and list your experience.



The best thing to do in Vegas is showing up to the casino in White Button up & Black Pants with a resume and talk to the Shift Mgr. When i was job hunting out here, thats what I did..got 4 auditions (All Strip Properties), ended up getting the job at the place I wanted. The Low-Mid Tiered MGM Properties and most Non-Ceasers casinos will do auditions on request if the Shift Mgr thinks you qualify and they are hiring.
RS
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May 6th, 2018 at 4:20:04 PM permalink
Quote: AZDuffman

Gaming control board does not have a requirement?


There's no requirement from gaming, no. You could just have someone privately teach you, or if you can figure it out -- teach yourself.

Once you do get hired, you have to pass a background check and get fingerprinted, though.
GlenG
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May 6th, 2018 at 4:23:02 PM permalink
Quote: RS

get fingerprinted, though.



Never had to get fingerprinted..had to do a drug test and background checl
billryan
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May 6th, 2018 at 4:24:49 PM permalink
Quote: GlenG

Never had to get fingerprinted..had to do a drug test and background checl



Don't you need a Sheriff's card? That requires being fingerprinted.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
GlenG
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May 6th, 2018 at 4:30:19 PM permalink
Quote: billryan

Don't you need a Sheriff's card? That requires being fingerprinted.



?
AZDuffman
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May 6th, 2018 at 4:37:53 PM permalink
Quote: RS

There's no requirement from gaming, no. You could just have someone privately teach you, or if you can figure it out -- teach yourself.

Once you do get hired, you have to pass a background check and get fingerprinted, though.



Interesting, I believe there is a requirement here. To supervise you need a year or so on the floor. At least that is what I have seen. I do remember in dealer school the instructor was demonstrating payouts and put up a barber pole. He asked if anyone could read it. He said he new we couldn't, but joked if we could he would "invent" the 1,500 (or whatever) hours we needed for the GCB and sit us in box.
All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others
RS
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May 6th, 2018 at 4:47:45 PM permalink
Quote: billryan

Don't you need a Sheriff's card? That requires being fingerprinted.


I don't think it's called a Sheriff's card, but you need some sort of "license" or approval kind of a thingie. It's just some thing in the system, I never got any actual "card" that I could show as proof that I was a dealer. That requires fingerprint and background check, AFAIK.

I believe the drug test is a company policy, not anything mandated by gaming.

Quote: AZDuffman

Interesting, I believe there is a requirement here. To supervise you need a year or so on the floor. At least that is what I have seen. I do remember in dealer school the instructor was demonstrating payouts and put up a barber pole. He asked if anyone could read it. He said he new we couldn't, but joked if we could he would "invent" the 1,500 (or whatever) hours we needed for the GCB and sit us in box.


I'm not sure if there is any requirement to be on the floor. I believe you have to pass a Title 31 test, maybe, or if that's just company policy. I was going to be promoted to a floor position at my first job (after definitely less than a year), they had me "take the test", which was basically where the shift manager sat next to me and gave me "helpful hints" in filling it out. Not that I needed the help, because I already knew much of the stuff on it. I didn't take the position because I ended up getting hired at another casino.

But I've noticed that many places outside of NV require dealers to have a physical "dealing license", or something like that, on them at all times.
Hunterhill
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May 6th, 2018 at 4:54:54 PM permalink
In Atlantic City dealers had to have a list on
Their badge of all the games they dealt.
They also had to pay a fee every year for each
Game they dealt.
This is no longer required.
The mountain is tall but grass grows on top of the mountain.
Ibeatyouraces
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May 6th, 2018 at 4:56:02 PM permalink
There's less scrutiny to get a job as a bank teller.
DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
Nathan
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May 6th, 2018 at 7:41:03 PM permalink
The fingerprint, drug test, and background check makes absolute sense. Last thing you want as Casino manager\owner is to hire a crooked dealer to work in your property. Of course there is the very real possibility of the dealer becoming a Crook after being employed on your property, kind of like the 19 year old who passed Starbucks background check when they were hiring her but later copied a customers' bank card information and went grocery shopping at Ralph's, using 212 of the stolen bank card information,(She was fired after the irate customer returned like a day or two later to confront her and get her to admit she took a picture of the bank card information and stole from her)but at least you know they came across as clean when you were interviewing\hiring\training them)
In both The Hunger Games and in gambling, may the odds be ever in your favor. :D "Man Babes" #AxelFabulous "Olive oil is processed but it only has one ingredient, olive oil."-Even Bob, March 27/28th. :D The 2 year war is over! Woo-hoo! :D I sometimes speak in metaphors. ;) Remember this. ;) Crack the code. :D 8.9.13.25.14.1.13.5.9.19.14.1.20.8.1.14! :D "For about the 4096th time, let me offer a radical idea to those of you who don't like Nathan -- block her and don't visit Nathan's Corner. What is so complicated about it?" Wizard, August 21st. :D
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